Questions on a few indy workers

[JoeDirt 0]

I've heard of all these guys, and in some cases (like Messiah) seen them work one match before. But I was wondering if you guys could do a rundown on the following workers - maybe say what style they wrestle, their strengths and weaknesses, etc.

 

Messiah

Matt Sydal

Austin Aries

Emil Sitoci

Chris Cash

Ryan Boz

Nick Gage

Adam Pearce

 

Thanks.

[Guest Jay Z. Hollywood]

Messiah:

 

Traditionally wrestles a hardcore, ECW-type style while doing occassional deathmatches. However, I have seen him tech it up on a couple of occassions.

-Strengths: ECW-style brawling

-Weaknesses: Matches tend to degenerate into garbage with lesser-skilled opponents.

 

Matt Sydal:

 

Highflyer, looks like AJ Styles if you shrunk him a bit more. In terms of wrestling, he's also like AJ Styles Jr.

Strengths: Extremely athletically gifted, can do some awesome spots, starting to learn how to work the "elite indy" style of flying and matwork. Excellent babyface.

Weaknesses: None, really.

 

 

Austin Aries:

Another highflyer, pretty adaptable, had a bunch of really fun matches with Nate Webb, Danny Daniels and Jimmy Jacobs in IWA:MS. Stood out at the 2004 Super 8 apparently. Nothing really standout in terms of strengths and weaknesses...although...

-Strengths: The FLIPPY SHIT ELBOW~!

 

Don't know much about Emil Sitoci, other than Ian Rotten is pushing the hell out of him, and I hear he wrestles far beyond his <1 year of experience.

 

Chris Cash:

The best student of the CZW Wrestling Academy, has tremendous energy and in-ring charisma, trademark match is the ladder match.

-Strengths- nutty bumping, good high flyer, never boring in the ring.

-Weaknesses: Hasn't really shown he can put together something great without a gimmick.

 

Ryan Boz

Older vet of the Midwest indy scene. Good power wrestler, has found a nice niche with Brad Bradley. Looks like Hulk Hogan if Hulk was less orange and had more hair.

-Strengths: nice assortment of power moves.

Weaknesses- very generic hoss outside of a tag team, too old for much upward movement on the scene.

 

Nick Gage:

The upper-midcard mainstay of CZW. Incredible impact moves- chokebreaker, brainbuster...execution is very crisp. Works well as part of the H8 Club tag team.

Strengths: The power moves, generally has very entertaining hardcore matches.

-Weaknesses- more concerned with making himself look good than his opponent. Selling is pretty poor.

 

Adam Pearce:

Made his name in the midwest before making his way to SoCal, working for APW-LA, PWG and other feds. Great at both the old-school Memphis brawl and the new-age hardcore brawl. Cuts a pretty good promo.

-Strengths: probably the best brawler I've seen in a long while on the indys.

-Weaknesses: style means he clashes with most other SoCalers, since quasi-lucha style is predominant there. (this is just from what little I've seen of him.)

 

Hope that helped a little bit.

Edited May 3, 2004 by Jay Z. Hollywood

[JoeDirt 0]

Wow, that was awesome. Thanks a lot!

[Guest Indikator]

Sitoci is from the Netherlands. He wrestled there as Luchadore Sitoci and was appearantly from Mexico *g* . AFAIK he is only for one year in USA and will come back to Europe in a couple of weeks. He´s wrestling since 2001, don´t know when he started training. His mentor is of course Chris Hero. He´ll make his return in Germany in June and even Ian Rotten is making a mini tour through Europe in June. I hope he will use his mask again.

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

He should ditch the Ultimo Dragon/Hayabusa/lame mask getup...

[LucharesuFan619 0]

Messiah: strenghts - very quick learner, natural athlete (did track in high school), great bumper, relatively quick, name value (has been seen on XPW tapes throughout the US and had a feature on America's Most Wanted), experience is on his side (debuted in November 1996 and has since worked with guys like Sabu, Chris Candido, Vampiro, and others); weaknesses - very bland look, tends to lack transitioning skills in connecting moves, very awkward looking strikes (i.e. forearms/chops/elbows), not much natural charisma

 

Chris Cash: strengths - has especially proved as of late that he's a great bumper, tag team experience as a member of The New School with GQ, some natural charisma; weaknesses - little experience, his size will keep him from stepping through to the next level, tends to to work a Japanese style that he's not really accustomed to (as compared to for instance someone like Trent Acid), lack of experience

 

Matt Sydal: strengths - fantastic lightweight, good seller, very quick; weaknesses - lack of experience

 

Ryan Boz (haven't seen much of him, but here's what I know): strengths - physical strength, size, tag team experience with Brad Bradley; weaknesses - unsure

 

Nick Gage: strengths - very over in CZW as a member of The H8 Club, relatively quick for his size, works a Japanese style that he's relatively accustomed to (as opposed to i.e. Cash); weaknesses - has been known to be overly stiff with some opponents, needs to work on his selling, not much natural charisma (although Dewey Donovan serves as a brilliant manager), lack of experience

[Phoenix Fury Legdrop 0]

Using my good pal Jason's style descriptions...

 

Messiah

Traditionally wrestles a hardcore, ECW-type style while doing occassional deathmatches. However, I have seen him tech it up on a couple of occassions.

 

-Strengths: ECW-style brawling, one of the more adaptable indy deathmatch guys in America.

 

-Weaknesses: Haven't really seen him be able to carry anyone.

 

Matt Sydal

Highflyer, looks like AJ Styles if you shrunk him a bit more. In terms of wrestling, he's also like AJ Styles Jr. (Tom's note: he looks more like an Osmond brother from the neck up than AJ, imo)

 

Strengths: Has unreal agility; really inventive worker (not in the Nova way), heck of a babyface; doesn't go back and repeat his (rare) complicated botched spots like a lot of indy guys seem to do

 

Weaknesses: He literally reeks of "babyface", and if he ever turns heel in IWA, ROH, or Wildside, I think he'd have to do a hell of a lot to get the crowd against him...and that's just about it.

 

Austin Aries

Another highflyer, pretty adaptable, had a bunch of really fun matches with Nate Webb, Danny Daniels and Jimmy Jacobs in IWA:MS. Stood out at the 2004 Super 8 apparently. (Tom's note: I think we can say that Sydal is AJ Jr. circa his 2001 work, and Aries is AJ Jr. circa his current work.)

 

-Strengths: Again, very adaptable when it comes to who he works. On two back-to-back shows, I saw him have a pretty good match with Brad Bradley, and then a really good match with Matt Sydal, both matches utilizing a different style (Bradley/Aries being underdog vs. small guy; Sydal/Aries being limbwork and big moves)

 

-Weaknesses: In a way, he works too much like AJ Styles. He doesn't rip off AJ's spots or anything, but he has the same build as AJ, carries himself a lot like AJ, and does a lot of his moves like I would imagine AJ would do them. That might eventually work against him.

 

"The Tremendous" Emil Sitoci

He's very much like Chris Hero, if Hero did a lot more of the high-paced arm-drag/dropkick Southern pretty-boy babyface style. Sitoci's really great at being a face, and you can tell a lot of Hero's influence in him via occasional wacky Euro mat-trips and the ultimate happy. yet underdog babyface style that he works.

 

Strengths: Tremendous babyface, no pun intended; moves around the ring like someone well beyond his experience level (and I'm not trying to stereotype my Dutch friends, but I doubt he's gotten near the type of experience there since 2001 that he's gotten since coming to the US in November 2003); looks like he actually has potential to be something amazing in the near-future, unlike a lot of the other guys who get pimped as having "potential", and then bombing

 

Weaknesses: Like Sydal, I can't see him being too great of a heel due to how good of a babyface he is.

 

Chris Cash:

The best student of the CZW Wrestling Academy, has tremendous energy and in-ring charisma, trademark match is the ladder match.

 

-Strengths: Can bump like a maniac

 

-Weaknesses: I've never seen him have an actual good match, much like the rest of the CZW Training School students (though I heard Joker carried his own and had a good match with Jimmy Rave at "In Da Club").

 

Ryan Boz

Older vet of the Midwest indy scene. Good power wrestler, has found a nice niche with Brad Bradley. Looks like Hulk Hogan if Hulk was less orange and had more hair. (Tom's note: that look encourages the "Hogan!" yells from many people in the crowd, in which Boz will sometimes play into, and do a Hogan mock routine)

 

-Strengths: Seems to be able to put together a regular match better than his partner Bradley; weird charisma about him that I think you can usually pick up live much better than on tape

 

Weaknesses- Boz only looks old in the face, but that's still a big damper when it comes to upward movement on the indy scene; Bradley works better as a monster killer.

 

Nick Gage:

The upper-midcard mainstay of CZW. Incredible impact moves- chokebreaker, brainbuster...execution is very crisp. Works well as part of the H8 Club tag team.

 

Strengths: Like Messiah, a very adaptable deathmatch worker.

 

-Weaknesses: Isn't a great seller; doesn't look like the type of guy to be doing his "monster-style" stuff; not the greatest look

 

Adam Pearce:

 

Made his name in the midwest before making his way to SoCal, working for APW-LA, PWG and other feds. Great at both the old-school Memphis brawl and the new-age hardcore brawl. Cuts a pretty good promo.

 

-Strengths: Really good brawler; great at the legit old-school style (not what Steve Corino wants you to perceive as "old school"); can carry a lesser talent really well

 

-Weaknesses: Like Jay said, he works a style opposite from a lot of SoCal guys, and even indy workers in general, today.

[JoeDirt 0]

Since you guys did so awesome, here are a few more guys I'd like to know more about:

 

Delirious

Scorpio Sky

Super Dragon (I've seen him wrestle once, just want your opinions on him)

Brad Bradley

Babi Slymm

Joey Ryan

Steve Stone

CJ O'Doyle

[Phoenix Fury Legdrop 0]

Going by the ones I've seen...

 

Delirious

 

Character-wise, he's a combination of Sabu, the Missing Link, and a science experiment gone wrong. Work-wise, he can do just about everything. I've seen him have some really awesome spot-based matches with Matt Sydal, and I've also seen him hang on the mat with Chad Collyer and Nigel McGuinness.

 

Strengths: One of the most versatile guys on the indies today, can work any style asked of him; he has enough charisma and a wacky enough gimmick that he doesn't have too many problems getting over in new places.

Weaknesses: No real complaints about his actual work, but the gimmick only seems to work as a face. I haven't seen any of his Gateway stuff, though I am soon; but from what I've seen of him in Wildside and IWA, he's funny and entertaining as a face, and kind of annoying as a heel.

 

Scorpio Sky

 

I've only seen his stuff from Bad Ass Mother 3000 and Are You Adequately Prepared to Rock?, but he seems like a fun lucha-style worker. I haven't seen him work much US-style psychology. It doesn't mean that he can't, just that I haven't seen him do any.

 

Super Dragon

 

He works US-indy strong style, combined with an occasional lucha spot here and there. He's as intimidating as a pudgy, short guy wearing pajamas gets.

 

Strengths: He gets his point across very well when he's on, and is really good at the bully role in a match.

Weaknesses: His stiff strikes and beatings come across like senseless beatings for the sake of senseless beatings sometimes; seems to half-ass a lot.

 

Brad Bradley

 

He works a very large, mean monster-type style. He also has one of the more superstar-like looks on the indies, as he really is quite the large man.

 

Strengths: The more athletic of the two in his tag team; wrestles like a man his size should (sounds silly, but nowadays on the indies, you got a lot of guys Bradley's size wanting to work like they're 5'6 and under 200 pounds, or junior heavyweights wanting to be monsters)

Weaknesses: When in singles matches, he seems more move-based and not necessarily story-based; in-ring personality can be a little bland at times.

 

Never seen Babi Slymm; only seen one Joey Ryan match.

 

Steve Stone

 

He can work the current US-indy style, and has had some really great matches against both Danny Daniels and Chris Hero, but he's more apt for brawling, which he's getting to be excellent at.

 

Strengths: Great at being a face; brings a higher energy to his brawling than a lot of guys

 

Weaknesses: Not too great as a heel; can get carried away with his strikes during offense (just ask Skeeter Frost or Zack Gowan, hehe)

 

Never seen O'Doyle.

[Slingshot Suplex 0]

Going by the ones I've seen...

 

Delirious

 

Character-wise, he's a combination of Sabu, the Missing Link, and a science experiment gone wrong. Work-wise, he can do just about everything. I've seen him have some really awesome spot-based matches with Matt Sydal, and I've also seen him hang on the mat with Chad Collyer and Nigel McGuinness.

 

Strengths: One of the most versatile guys on the indies today, can work any style asked of him; he has enough charisma and a wacky enough gimmick that he doesn't have too many problems getting over in new places.

Weaknesses: No real complaints about his actual work, but the gimmick only seems to work as a face. I haven't seen any of his Gateway stuff, though I am soon; but from what I've seen of him in Wildside and IWA, he's funny and entertaining as a face, and kind of annoying as a heel.

 

.

He and MsChif came into GCW on the same show as heels in July of 2001. They didn't team on that show but I believe they came in as a team dubbed Diabolic Khaos. MsChif did all the talking while Delirious basically uttered noises. The random inserting of phrases really didn't seem to start until maybe about a year ago when he started saying things like "Louis Gossett,Jr" for no apparent reason.

 

He was voted St Louis Wrestler of the Year for 2002 and 2003. He never really turned full face in GCW but got a lot of cheers because of his ring style and his entertaining gimmick. In fact, I can only really remember one blatantly heelish thing he did. He used a spike on Matt's knee to weaken it at one of the Adult's Only shows. Well, and he would interfere on MsChif's behalf.

 

And I finished going through the GCW TV early this morning so I hope to start on your tapes sometime this weekend.

 

 

 

As for a quote regarding Matt......

 

"Weaknesses: He literally reeks of "babyface", and if he ever turns heel in IWA, ROH, or Wildside, I think he'd have to do a hell of a lot to get the crowd against him...and that's just about it."

 

I kinda thought they might try to turn Matt heel in GCW when he started getting booked elsewhere in the country. Then he could have come back as this cocky, little snotty " I'm a big star" guy. But they didn't. And his style would have kept most of the crowd on his side anyway probably.

[Guest SoCalTF]

Scorpio Sky

 

This guy really amazing. He has been wrestling for under 2 years and is already one of the top guys in So Cal wrestling and the people who I've talked to on the east coast feel he is the future of So Cal. I think his main weekness is having to break out of the shadow of Super Dragon who is the top dog in So Cal. Other then that, Sky has nowhere else to go but up.

 

Super Dragon

 

Super Dragon has to be one of the top 10 best guys on the indys. He is the biggest dick heel but the fans still love the guy. The guy also runs his own company and wrestles nearly everyweek and has had so many good matches. The only problem is people always trash him for "beating up on guys smaller then him" and claim "he wouldn't do the shit he does to smaller guys onto big guys". But that is his only weakness in my mind. People will say Dragon "half asses" a lot but that isn't true IMO. I think people base that on his shitty MLW work(When you're working Los Maximos and Juvi, you know that match is going to suck. And he hasn't had a good match with Chris Daniels because can't seem to click for some odd reason). People shit on on his AJPW work but what they fail to realize is the guy had to work the student style and had a head injury when working there. But all his So Cal stuff is awesome along with his match at CZW and a few of his Japanese matches. Get his DVD at www.prowrestlingguerrilla.com because it showcases his style.

 

Brad Bradley

 

This guy is real good from what I've seen. But in some of his matches he doesn't seem like he doesn't have a diverse moveset. His match with American Dragon at PWG was just him throwing chops, elbows, and kicks with a few mat based moves mixed in their.

 

Babi Slymm

 

Slymm has gotten real good. I remember seeing him one year ago and just thinking this guy sucks. But he has proved me wrong. His match with Super Dragon at Rev Pro in March was one of the best matches I've seen this year. He can get a lot of heel heat when he's a heal, and can get a lot of positive crowd reaction when he's a face. He's a real worker for a guy his size.

 

Joey Ryan

 

Joey is one of the best workers in Southern California wrestling right now. He has had some great mat matches, great tags, and his hardcore match with Super Dragon was real good. I'd say him/Dragon was the So Cal Fued of 2003. I don't see any weaknesses in Joey. He has had a lot of great matches. If you want to see more of him, go to www.joeyryan.com and order his best of tapes. It's a great investment. Tape one has his matches with Spanky which where real good and also his second tape features his early 2003 work which was also great.

[Guest JacK]

Since this worked so well for him . . . and the threads already here . . . does anyone know anything about Matrix? Since whenever I search for that in google or yahoo it comes up with either the movie or Smackdown 4.

[PsychoDriver 0]

Since this worked so well for him . . . and the threads already here . . . does anyone know anything about Matrix? Since whenever I search for that in google or yahoo it comes up with either the movie or Smackdown 4.

Check out here for a bio: http://www.upw.com/superstars/Matrix.htm

[Guest JacK]

cool, thanks man; I haven't found anything anywhere . . . and damn, I didn't realise he was so short.

[Guest Corino 1000]

I don't know much about Ace Steel and I have only seen around 2 matches with him. So I was wondering if somebody can give a little biography of him.

[ulfistgut 0]

(though I heard Joker carried his own and had a good match with Jimmy Rave at "In Da Club").

 

I just watched this match and thought of the comment in this thread. And it was probably the most impressive Joker match I've seen in terms of showing that he can work a solid, well thought out and interesting match without the use of props or big bumps.

 

Whilst it was by no means a match that deserves heaps of praise it's been almost entirely overlooked and was a very well thought out match with Joker playing the dominant striker working over Rave's ribs (which until the final 1/6th of the match was done consistently - almost every move targetting that area) whilst Rave tried to use his tech skills to come back. Some of the strikes were fairly nasty but it was a real good match with Joker not relying on headdrops/bumps/anything else to produce an enjoyable match.

[Guest j.o.b. squad]

yeah when not in gimmick matches or matches involving 3+ people joker does tend to work one body part.(for an example watch his match Vs sabien at pain in the rain 2 85-90% of his offence was working over the back to set up the joker driver) but neither of the two were trained by czw they have been working a lot of small time indys in the philly area for the last 4-5 years doing the jacobs/shelly type deal(they either wrestle each other or tag just about everywhere)

 

anyway the hero Vs joker match later this month will probably finaly get me to spend money on a chikara tape

[LucharesuFan619 0]

(though I heard Joker carried his own and had a good match with Jimmy Rave at "In Da Club").

Joker indeed looked pretty good in that match, and pulled out some nice moves. Rave - on the otherhand - really looked out of it, for some reason. I don't know why, but he just wasn't himself.

 

anyway the hero Vs joker match later this month will probably finaly get me to spend money on a chikara tape

 

Joker and Chris Hero have wrestled one-on-one????????

 

I don't know much about Ace Steel and I have only seen around 2 matches with him. So I was wondering if somebody can give a little biography of him.

 

Check out the bio I compiled of him here: http://obsessedwithwrestling.com

 

He toured for NOAH in Japan for a short while. He's had a few TNA shots. He's a very good worker, in my opinion. He's got an awkward kinda look (specifically, the hair), but his workrate makes up for that.

[PsychoDriver 0]

Joker and Chris Hero have wrestled one-on-one????????

Not yet but the match is set.

 

 

"Saturday May 22nd, CHIKARA is back at Emmaus Fire Company and the card is as follows:

 

FIRST TIME EVER!

Chris Hero vs. Joker"

 

Should be good...

[Guest Markingout]

Should be stiff as hell. Joker will learn alot from Hero, and it should be a great match. What are the other matches on that card? The CHIKARA Pro guys always perform well, with their Toryumon esque matches.

[Guest j.o.b. squad]

well you got

mister zero wrestling the now evil ultramantis in a mystery partner tag match

 

Jolly Roger vs. Darkness Crabtree

 

quack & f.i.s.t. Vs jigsaw & the wildcards in a high stakes style 6 man tag

 

quack puting up his 6 titles

akuma puting up his mask

icarus puting up his hair

 

jigsaw puting up his mask

wildcards puting up their hair as a team

 

the person who takes the fall loses what they put up

[Guest Aecas]

Well if you want to talk stiffness I wouldn;t mind seeing another Joker/Dahmer match up. The match those two had at Bring On The Pain was one of the stiffest matches I've ever seen.