Pfc. England: "We were only following orders."

[Guest Cerebus]

I knew this would come eventually, but I didn't think it would be this damn predictable.

 

Army Pfc. Lynndie England, seen worldwide in photographs that show her smiling and pointing at naked Iraqi prisoners, said she was ordered to pose for the photos, and felt "kind of weird" in doing so.

 

No wonder. See your basic MOS training, which you apparently never recieved, would tell you that there were more things about what you did that went against regulation (let alone basic human decency) than I can count.

 

In an exclusive interview with Brian Maass of Denver CBS station KCNC-TV, England also confirmed that abuses worse than those depicted in the photos were carried out at the U.S.-run Abu Ghraib prison near Baghdad, but she declined to discuss them.

 

England, 21, repeatedly insisted that her actions were dictated by "persons in my higher chain of command."

 

Apparently you never paid attention to the little word LAWFUL in Article 90 and 91 did you?

 

In the photos, England is seen smiling, cigarette in her mouth, as she leans forward and points at the genitals of a naked, hooded Iraqis. Another photo taken at Abu Ghraib shows her holding a leash that encircles the neck of a naked Iraqi man lying on his side.

 

"I was instructed by persons in higher rank to stand there and hold this leash and look at the camera," she said.

 

You should have taken a tip from William Kimbro. Dumbass.

 

England said the actions depicted in the photos were intended to put psychological pressure on the Iraqi prisoners.

 

"Well, I mean, they [the photos] were for psy-op reasons," she said "And the reasons worked. I mean, so to us, we were doing our job, which meant we were doing what we were told, and the outcome was what they wanted. They'd come back and they'd look at the pictures, and they'd state, 'Oh, that's a good tactic, keep it up. That's working. This is working. Keep doing it. It's getting what we need.'"

 

Allow me to translate: Thanks to us disobeying regulation and obeying unlawful orders, we got information that could have likely been recieved through legal interrogations so we could save the lazy MI clowns some time and frustration. Why aren't we getting a pat on the back?

 

England, an Army reservist from West Virginia who is four months pregnant,

 

To paraphrase a quote from ER, stupid people shouldn't breed.

 

is now stationed at Fort Bragg in North Carolina. The interview was taped Tuesday at Fort Bragg.

 

England is among seven soldiers from the 372nd Military Police Company who face charges for allegedly degrading and humiliating Iraqi prisoners. One soldier, Spc. Jeremy C. Sivits of Hyndman, Pa., will face a court-martial in Baghdad next week.

 

"To all of us who have been charged, we all agree that we don't feel like we were doing things that we weren't supposed to, because we were told to do them. We think everything was justified, because we were instructed to do this and to do that," England said.

 

Wrong.

 

She told KCNC she was looking forward to having her baby and hopefully one day putting the abuse scandal behind her.

 

I hope you never do. I hope your baby gets taken away from you and gets adopted by a couple that has the kindness to never tell the shame his/her mother brought to the United States. You deserve no less.

[Guest CommaderK9]

I agree with you totally. It was only a matter of time before the "I was just following orders" defense came up. In the 8 years I served in the military I was give training multiple times telling us to NEVER follow an unlawful order. If abusing prisoners isn't unlawful, then I don't understand the term. All of the soldiers involved, from the commanding officer on down deserve to have the book thrown at them.

 

If Englund thinks her civilian lawyers will be able to save her, she has another thing coming. The judge in a court martial case will not allow these types of ridiculous defenses to be used.

[Guest Cerebus]

I agree with you totally.  It was only a matter of time before the "I was just following orders" defense came up.  In the 8 years I served in the military I was give training multiple times telling us to NEVER follow an unlawful order.  If abusing prisoners isn't unlawful, then I don't understand the term.  All of the soldiers involved, from the commanding officer on down deserve to have the book thrown at them.

 

If Englund thinks her civilian lawyers will be able to save her, she has another thing coming.  The judge in a court martial case will not allow these types of ridiculous defenses to be used.

What branch were you in CK9?

[Guest CommaderK9]

Army

[Guest Cerebus]

Army

Got a lot of friends in the Army. What was your MOS?

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

But did she say she was sorry? That's the important thing...

[Ripper 0]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable".

 

Jesus.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Perhaps one of her state's U.S. Senators will devote a pork project in her name now (this is the W.Va. chick, right?)...

[Guest MikeSC]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable".

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

 

*sigh*

 

Any chances that the "superior officer" who told her to pose for pictures was her FRIGGIN' BOYFRIEND?

-=Mike

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

Huh?

 

Mike, I thought that was you...

[Guest MikeSC]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

Huh?

 

Mike, I thought that was you...

Heck, I'm not from W. Va. Come on, kkk, you know W. Va is the BUTT of jokes for ALL Southern states.

-=Mike

...West Virginia --- We're All Relative

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

 

*sigh*

 

Any chances that the "superior officer" who told her to pose for pictures was her FRIGGIN' BOYFRIEND?

-=Mike

Not quite, but the guy who got her pregnant is another guard involved (Army Reserve Spec. Charles A. Graner Jr.). He's 35. She's 21.

 

Evidently, Graner is not ashamed of his role in the scandal. An estranged relative, who agreed to be interviewed on the condition of anonymity, said Graner recently sent an e-mail home in which he seemed to revel in the media coverage, writing, "The smile I practiced my whole life I get to see on TV now."

 

Philly Inquirer article about Graner (you have to sign up to read it [free to do so], the above quote is from here, I just didn't feel the need to quote the entire article)

 

Some more about Graner:

He worked from 1990 to 1995 as a corrections officer at the Fayette County Jail, where he was disciplined for frequent tardiness and abuse of sick-leave time, said Warden Larry Medlock.

 

He has worked since 1995 at SCI-Greene. According to state corrections officials, Graner was not implicated in a 1998 prisoner-abuse scandal that resulted in the firing or transfer of 24 employees at the prison.

 

"I hope people do not view this as typical of the state corrections officers," said Sharon D'Eletto, a spokeswoman for SCI-Greene.

 

Graner married Staci Dean in 1990, after she had become pregnant with the first of their two children. Their marriage ended in 2002 in a bitter divorce.

 

Police were called to the home in March 2001, after the couple had separated. In Fayette County court papers, Staci Graner, who has since remarried and declined to be interviewed, reported that her husband came into the room where she was sleeping and yanked her head by the hair, banged her head against a wall, and tried to throw her down the steps. Criminal charges were not filed.

[Guest MikeSC]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

 

*sigh*

 

Any chances that the "superior officer" who told her to pose for pictures was her FRIGGIN' BOYFRIEND?

-=Mike

Not quite, but the guy who got her pregnant is another guard involved (Army Reserve Spec. Charles A. Graner Jr.). He's 35. She's 21.

 

Evidently, Graner is not ashamed of his role in the scandal. An estranged relative, who agreed to be interviewed on the condition of anonymity, said Graner recently sent an e-mail home in which he seemed to revel in the media coverage, writing, "The smile I practiced my whole life I get to see on TV now."

 

Philly Inquirer article about Graner (you have to sign up to read it [free to do so], the above quote is from here, I just didn't feel the need to quote the entire article)

I can't say I'm shocked that the guy was such an idiot.

 

Did you see the woman?

 

You'd have to be damned drunk --- or dumb as an f'n rock --- to tap that.

-=Mike

[JoeDirt 0]

I'd have a lot more respect for her if she just owned up for everything and apologized, etc...but instead we get the old game of pass the blame.

[Hogan Made Wrestling 0]

The funniest thing was that someone from her home town was trying to defend her in a interview and basically said "Well, we were raised to not look at non whites as humans so its understandable". 

 

Jesus.

Oh, please tell me nobody actually SAID that.

Huh?

 

Mike, I thought that was you...

Heck, I'm not from W. Va. Come on, kkk, you know W. Va is the BUTT of jokes for ALL Southern states.

-=Mike

...West Virginia --- We're All Relative

Shouldn't it be something like "The KKK is A-OK" with a picture of Grand Wizard Robert Byrd smiling underneath?

[2GOLD 0]

Hey, not all parts of West VA. are bad. Just 90% of it.

 

It's obvious, she thinks she can save herself and her child by pulling the "I was just following orders" which is a piss poor excuse. Your human, you have a brain so either use it or shut up. I'm sorry, I don't buy the "orders" excuse. So, she was told to SMILE for the camera???

 

Bloody redneck bitch

 

Sorry, I had to say that.

[Guest MikeSC]

Hey, not all parts of West VA. are bad. Just 90% of it.

 

It's obvious, she thinks she can save herself and her child by pulling the "I was just following orders" which is a piss poor excuse. Your human, you have a brain so either use it or shut up. I'm sorry, I don't buy the "orders" excuse. So, she was told to SMILE for the camera???

 

Bloody redneck bitch

 

Sorry, I had to say that.

Maybe she's under orders to come across as mentally deficient.

-=Mike

...If so --- GREAT JOB, PRIVATE!

[Guest MikeSC]

She had some REAL bizarre orders, apparently:

May 13, 2004 -- WASHINGTON - Shocking shots of sexcapades involving Pfc. Lynndie England were among the hundreds of X-rated photos and videos from the Abu Ghraib prison scandal shown to lawmakers in a top-secret Capitol conference room yesterday.

 

"She was having sex with numerous partners. It appeared to be consensual," said a lawmaker who saw the photos.

 

And, videos showed the disgraced soldier - made notorious in a photo showing her holding a leash looped around an Iraqi prisoner's neck - engaged in graphic sex acts with other soldiers in front of Iraqi prisoners, Pentagon officials told NBC Nightly News.

 

"Almost everybody was naked all the time," another lawmaker said.

 

Many members of Congress left the 45-minute viewing session early, thereby missing the porno performance by England, but there were enough other images of torture, humiliation and intimidation to sicken anyone.

 

"It was pretty disgusting, not what you'd expect from Americans," said Sen. Norm Coleman (R-Minn.). "There was lots of sexual stuff - not of the Iraqis, but of our troops."

 

Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.), who also characterized the photos as "disgusting," agreed, noting, "It's hard to believe that this actually is taking place in a military facility."

 

 

 

The shocking photos and videos, provided on computer disks by Pentagon officials, showed attack dogs snarling at cowering prisoners, Iraqi women forced to expose their breasts, and naked prisoners tied together on the floor, senators revealed as they emerged from the heavily guarded conference room.

 

"It was significantly worse than I had anticipated," said Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore). "Take the worst case and multiply it over several times."

 

"I don't know how these people got into our Army," said Sen. Ben Nighthorse Campbell (R-Colo.), who reported seeing "several pictures of Iraqi women who were disrobed or putting their shirts up."

 

Sen. Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) described the images as "more detailed and more graphic than the pictures that have been released publicly," referring to the disturbing photos of Iraqis being abused at Abu Ghraib prison that surfaced two weeks ago, and which Islamic terrorists claim led to this week's revenge beheading of American Nick Berg.

 

"Normally, I side with disclosure and openness, but in this case, these photos are evidence," Schumer said, indicating that he favors keeping the lid on the alarming pictures, as Vice President Dick Cheney and Sen. John Warner (R-Va.) have urged.

 

Rep. Jane Harman (Calif.), ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, said she was most appalled by a video of a handcuffed prisoner beating his head against a wall in an apparent bid to knock himself unconscious to escape abuse.

 

In another video clip, she said, a group of men were shown masturbating.

 

Before the pictures of England's sex romps were shown to Congress, the 21-year-old reservist from West Virginia tried to portray herself as a reluctant participant who was just following orders.

 

"I didn't really, I mean, want to be in any pictures," England told a Denver TV station.

 

"I was instructed by persons in higher rank to 'stand there, hold this leash, look at the camera,' and they took picture for PsyOps [psychological operations]," she told KCNC-TV.

 

England acknowledged "it was kind of weird" when she was photographed smiling, with a cigarette in her mouth, as she leaned forward and pointed at the genitals of a naked, hooded Iraqi at Abu Ghraib prison.

 

England has refused to identify who gave her the orders, saying only that they came from "persons in my chain of command."

 

England faces a military court-martial that includes charges such as conspiracy to maltreat prisoners and assault consummated by battery.

 

She could face punishment ranging from a reprimand to more than 15 years in prison.

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/20802.htm

 

THAT was one happenin' regiment.

-=Mike

[Guest Cerebus]

My god, this just keeps getting better and better...

[Ripper 0]

Wait...did they force the prisoners to have sex with HER! That is a tourture no man should have to go through.

 

If it was just other soldiers having sex with her, then they have been pusnished enough.

 

 

ugh.

[Guest MikeSC]

Wait...did they force the prisoners to have sex with HER! That is a tourture no man should have to go through.

 

If it was just other soldiers having sex with her, then they have been pusnished enough.

 

 

ugh.

Thank God for Ripper. Your sig helped reclaim my heterosexuality after the pic of Englund made me question whether it was worthwhile.

 

You're now the man in my book, too.

-=Mike

[2GOLD 0]

THAT'S HER?!?!

 

I don't know how, but that picture of her just made me serile...

*looks at Ripper's sig*

Ok, it's back now.

 

Jesus, if God makes everyone in their own image then God must be one UGLY creature. I mean, damn.

[Guest Cerebus]

I have to admit, I laughed at this line from today's NY Times:

 

Representative Trent Franks, Republican of Arizona and a member of the House Armed Services Committee, said he was particularly offended by a photograph in which "a prisoner was sodomizing himself," with a banana. "My conclusion is that that was probably coerced somehow," Mr. Franks said.

 

Oh really?

 

P.S. The return of the banana rapist to CE...

[Guest MikeSC]

I have to admit, I laughed at this line from today's NY Times:

 

Representative Trent Franks, Republican of Arizona and a member of the House Armed Services Committee, said he was particularly offended by a photograph in which "a prisoner was sodomizing himself," with a banana. "My conclusion is that that was probably coerced somehow," Mr. Franks said.

 

Oh really?

 

P.S. The return of the banana rapist to CE...

Bah. That banana asked for it. It's such a slut.

-=Mike

[Guest Cerebus]

Wait...did they force the prisoners to have sex with HER!  That is a tourture no man should have to go through.

 

If it was just other soldiers having sex with her, then they have been pusnished enough.

 

 

ugh.

After seeing that picture I remain convinced that someone high above ordered this. After all, who would have willingly have sex with THAT on camera?

 

P.S. Ripper who is that broad on the left part of your sig? DAAAAAAMN!

[Ripper 0]

P.S. Ripper who is that broad on the left part of your sig? DAAAAAAMN!

Melyssa Ford aka "Jessica Rabbit" for her cartoonishly perfect curves.

 

Ripper: Liking cartoons since 1979.

[Guest MikeSC]

P.S. Ripper who is that broad on the left part of your sig? DAAAAAAMN! 

Melyssa Ford aka "Jessica Rabbit" for her cartoonishly perfect curves.

 

Ripper: Liking cartoons since 1979.

Man, you got the good cut of that movie, apparently.

-=Mike

[Lil' Bitch 0]

Well, you can look at it two ways:

 

1.) They just decided to be cruel fucks one day and have some fun and are now trying to blame higher-ups to save their asses since they got busted.

 

Or

 

2.) Conspiracy theory! They were really told to be cruel to them by higher-ups and are now being the scapegoats for the higher0ups wanting to be cruel fucks.

 

Up to you on who to believe.

[Zorin Industries 0]

I think the most likely answer is a combination of the 2

[Guest MikeSC]

I think the most likely answer is a combination of the 2

I'll still go with their commanding officer had ZERO control over her troops.

-=Mike