Guest wildpegasus Report post Posted August 30, 2004 For Vince, he is the only guy ever to put over every wrestler who wrestled. Anyone from Mantaur to HBK was important according to Vince. Yah he was over the top, but so was Ross. Plus, Ross never made u care about the midcard. Fuck that. Ross was the ONLY guy to ever make Russo's angles ever seem sensical logical. Plus, he made people care about the midcard tremendously. Look at him calling the TLC matches for example. I've been listening to Ross since about 1989. He constantly doesn't care about certain matches even if it's a good/great match. Like Foley said and I believe it too -- Ross can make a fair match good and a good match great to the fans but you know what? I've seen him make great matches good and good matches bad. And not just 1 or two matches. Tons of them. Than a domino effect happens and what we get from that is it makes it even harder for midcarders to get to the top because the fans won't care about them as much. It also cements the upper tier in their main event places so he's actually the midcarders worse nightmare. I'm no fan of Vince has done with the industry but the one thing I always admired about him is that he would be excited for the midcard. He gave them the same respect that he did the main eventers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Lawler is a bad influence on JR. Lawler: Man, school sucked today, huh Jim? JR: Yeah I'll say. I hate climbing the ropes in gym. Lawler: I can't wait to get to 5th grade. JR: Me too. Lawler: Hey. Hey, Jim. Look what I got in my backpack. JR: ....Jerry! No way! Lawler: Don't worry, man, my brother bought them, you only have to be 18 to buy 'em, they can't do nothin! JR: What if my folks find out? Lawler: Don't worry don't worry, we'll just say we walked past some guys in the park. But we gotta go to my house afterwards! JR: But, but I'm not allowed at your house anymore! Lawler: Wah wah wah! My dad ain't home, and I know where he keeps his tapes! JR: ....you do? Lawler! I do, I do! (20 minutes later) JR: I don't shink I like thish beer shtuff. Lawler: Whasyour problem? Doncha wanna be a big kid? Uh? HUH? JR: Whuzzat girl doin to that guy on there? Zit inner mouth? Lawler: Yeah! Yeah! JR: I've never seen....those....thingies...that big before. Naheven my...mama. Lawler: I call em puppies!! JR: Whoaa.....is...ishi shtill doin that to him? Muss feel pretty good... Lawler: Ya....ya wanna try it? JR: Whauf someone finds out, Jerry? Lawler: Nobody's...ever gonna know Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Granted, but it can't be too gradual. It should be noticable change, but not startling change. Within 6 months, the shows should be completely different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 GOOD LORD! Czech with the POST OF THE WEEK~! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChick 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Another thing: I'm not a Cole fan, but at least he's paying attention to the match while shilling the main event program. It always seems to me that JR can't multi-task and just shills. It really isn't uncommon for JR and Lawler to be completely ignoring a match while talking about what Triple H is doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Yeah, that's one of Coles more "admirable" traits - focusing on the match. He doesn't do it all the time - probably like 80% of a match he does - but that's more than any other announcer in the WWE. To again reference the UFC, watching one of their shows yesterday, the only time they shilled was when there was a lull in the action - which did 2 things: Shilled and tried to build interest in other future programs, AND, filled the gap when something uninteresting was on the screen. Oftentimes WWE announcers are too busy shilling and ignore something interesting going on in the ring. Priorities are messed up. I will say this, I'd be a rather bad announcer if sent out there right now to call a match. But I at least know I'd be bad; I don't think the WWE guys know or care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Quik Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Lawler is a bad influence on JR. Lawler: Man, school sucked today, huh Jim? JR: Yeah I'll say. I hate climbing the ropes in gym. Lawler: I can't wait to get to 5th grade. JR: Me too. Lawler: Hey. Hey, Jim. Look what I got in my backpack. JR: ....Jerry! No way! Lawler: Don't worry, man, my brother bought them, you only have to be 18 to buy 'em, they can't do nothin! JR: What if my folks find out? Lawler: Don't worry don't worry, we'll just say we walked past some guys in the park. But we gotta go to my house afterwards! JR: But, but I'm not allowed at your house anymore! Lawler: Wah wah wah! My dad ain't home, and I know where he keeps his tapes! JR: ....you do? Lawler! I do, I do! (20 minutes later) JR: I don't shink I like thish beer shtuff. Lawler: Whasyour problem? Doncha wanna be a big kid? Uh? HUH? JR: Whuzzat girl doin to that guy on there? Zit inner mouth? Lawler: Yeah! Yeah! JR: I've never seen....those....thingies...that big before. Naheven my...mama. Lawler: I call em puppies!! JR: Whoaa.....is...ishi shtill doin that to him? Muss feel pretty good... Lawler: Ya....ya wanna try it? JR: Whauf someone finds out, Jerry? Lawler: Nobody's...ever gonna know Greatest... post... ever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alfdogg 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Man, it HAS been too long since I've watched WWE... are you guys saying that Michael Cole doesn't suck anymore? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Niggardly King 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Man, it HAS been too long since I've watched WWE... are you guys saying that Michael Cole doesn't suck anymore? No, it's just that everyone has gone down in quality Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 He sucks, just he sucks the least out of all the PBP guys in the WWE. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I thought Todd Grisham was supposed to be the Next Big Thing because he brought notes on the wrestlers for his tryout match. Where did he go wrong? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Niggardly King 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Statement: Todd Grisham has to be the worst PBP guy since the WWE era Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Well Chris Leary and Mark Loyd were WWFers so they get a free pass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Rrrsh Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Yeah, that's one of Coles more "admirable" traits - focusing on the match. He doesn't do it all the time - probably like 80% of a match he does - but that's more than any other announcer in the WWE. To again reference the UFC, watching one of their shows yesterday, the only time they shilled was when there was a lull in the action - which did 2 things: Shilled and tried to build interest in other future programs, AND, filled the gap when something uninteresting was on the screen. Oftentimes WWE announcers are too busy shilling and ignore something interesting going on in the ring. Priorities are messed up. I will say this, I'd be a rather bad announcer if sent out there right now to call a match. But I at least know I'd be bad; I don't think the WWE guys know or care. That was one of the main downfalls to WCW, IMO. I just got this SWANK comp tape with random awesome matches from Nitro in the 96 to 98 period. And uneless Tenay is their, the commentary is JUST AWFUL in regards to focusing on the match (well, its awful all-around, but thats neitehr here nor there) JR isn't as bad as Tony. However, he is like Tony and that is not good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Rrrsh Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Statement: Todd Grisham has to be the worst PBP guy since the WWE era Rebuttal: Yah, but its such a short period that its not that big of a deal. There have been far worse in the past 20 years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I actually think Tony was a better announcer then than JR is now and doesn't deserve the harsh criticism that he tends to get. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Coffey Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I agree with RRR. I thought Schivone, even during his lowest point in WCW was better than Ross is now or has been for the past...oh...three to four years or so. I think the EXACT moment that I started hating Ross was after the Austin/Michaels match at Wrestlemania XIV. "Tyson, Tyson, Tyson!" That was it. STATEMENT: A three man commentary team could be beneficial to Raw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Grishams performance on the Benoit dvd was a fucking disgrace. The man should be ashamed for his blatent disregard and disrespect for Benoits career. Unless they just said "Hey Todd, come over here and help Chris and Dean on PBP", the guy deserves any and all of the criticism he gets and then some - even, and especially, if it is "worst announcer ever". Completely unprofessional. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Agreed: A 3 man announce team would be a temporary -though well welcomed- fix to the tired Lawler/Ross team. Infact, when I said JR hasn't been good for 7 years, his "good" work I harken back to is during the 3 man days with Lawler and Vince. The WCW 3 man team, particularly Tony, Brain, and Tenay, were especially effective IMO, with Tony being "the host", the guy who sets things up and helps pace out the broadcast, Brain being the "entertainment" or colour, and putting a different spin on whats going on in the ring, and Tenay being the backstory and info guy who would add to the match and build on things being established in them. The WWE tried the 3 man team for a short period earlier this year when the Coach joined the RAW team, but that was totally the wrong approach as it took focus away from the match and put it on the conflicting announcers. The announcers shouldn't upstage a match, they should compliment and enhance it for the viewers. Hearing Coach be a jackass and Ross and King arguing with him serves no real purpose and simply takes time away from the actual bread and butter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Grishams performance on the Benoit dvd was a fucking disgrace. The man should be ashamed for his blatent disregard and disrespect for Benoits career. Unless they just said "Hey Todd, come over here and help Chris and Dean on PBP", the guy deserves any and all of the criticism he gets and then some - even, and especially, if it is "worst announcer ever". Completely unprofessional. What did/does he do that's so bad? I've never encountered Todd in a non-backstage role. I agree that Schiavone does get too much crap for the overuse of "Biggest Nitro" and "sidewalk slam" and when motivated, could call a damn fine match. If it was WCWSN and didn't have to hype up the night, he could focus on the match quite well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Simply put, he knew nothing at all about what he was watching. If I were asked to do commentary on, say, a dog show, and I know nothing about dogs, I'd at least attempt to put in some effort researching the history of the show, the breeds of dogs, and some of the favourites. It would take 2 days to do. 1 to research and make notes, 1 to organize it. If, as in this case, it was 10 year old footage, then I'd actually WATCH IT before dubbing over it. It's not only professionalism, but its self-respect and respect for what you're doing. He showed Benoit no respect in what he did, which -while not unexpected-, is still unacceptable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I'm envisioning the old Sportscenter commercial where the kid "comes up too early" and just says "how old is that guy anyway? Isn't he old, Jack? He sucks! He sucks!" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lt. Al Giardello 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Michael Cole has an annoying voice, and is too much of a dork for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TheZsaszHorsemen Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I actually think Tony was a better announcer then than JR is now and doesn't deserve the harsh criticism that he tends to get. He gets it because his mistakes were just inexcusably stupid. Calling a kick to the balls a punch, for example. Couple that with a tendancy for calling EVERYTHING a sidewalk slam, and a respect for his audience that was roughly equal to the Chinese brainwashers in the original Manchurian Candidate and that's why Tony gets shit from everyone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I actually think Tony was a better announcer then than JR is now and doesn't deserve the harsh criticism that he tends to get. He gets it because his mistakes were just inexcusably stupid. Calling a kick to the balls a punch, for example. Couple that with a tendancy for calling EVERYTHING a sidewalk slam, and a respect for his audience that was roughly equal to the Chinese brainwashers in the original Manchurian Candidate and that's why Tony gets shit from everyone. Yeah but see like Ross, Schiavone also had a giant decline. Once upon a time, Tony could call quite a match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TheZsaszHorsemen Report post Posted August 30, 2004 I actually think Tony was a better announcer then than JR is now and doesn't deserve the harsh criticism that he tends to get. He gets it because his mistakes were just inexcusably stupid. Calling a kick to the balls a punch, for example. Couple that with a tendancy for calling EVERYTHING a sidewalk slam, and a respect for his audience that was roughly equal to the Chinese brainwashers in the original Manchurian Candidate and that's why Tony gets shit from everyone. Yeah but see like Ross, Schiavone also had a giant decline. Once upon a time, Tony could call quite a match. Agreed. He did tremendous work in the Vader/Flair match at Starrcade '93. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 But like you said, towards the end when he was working with Mark Madden, hell, before that, the man was unlistenable, sort of like another rotund play-by-play guy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Highland 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Statement: WWE needs to return to the heel vs face commentary teams. Enough with the on air friendships and tweeners. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Rebuttal: The aforementioned Tony/Bobby/Tenay model is the optimal way to go. Not so much face vs. heel but just different approaches. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Highland 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2004 Different works, as long as it's something better than the current setup. Also, a more professional demeanor by the announcers would be nice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
