JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 IIRC, 190,000 buys would be a .47, while 170,000 should be just under that. I don't think so, because Armageddon 2003 got a .40 buyrate, and there's no way that did fewer buys than No Mercy or Taboo Tuesday. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
what 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I mean honestly, at this rate how many buys will Armageddon and that RAW Puerto Rico PPV do? And will that reduce the number of buys the Rumble gets? Armageddon: 195,000 Puerto Rican PPV: 165,000 Royal Rumble: 235,000 The Rumble will get WAYYYY more than 235,000 buys. Probably 100-150 thousand more. Armageddon, if well built, could break 200,000 and that's a good estimate for the Puerto Rican PPV considering it's on a fuckin Wednesday. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fökai 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 So as far as I can see, WWE is way better off now then they were 2 or 3 years ago. Then I guess you don't keep up with their finances. Considering the XFL (2001-2002) and World (2002-2003) are off the books, in addition to Wrestlemania XX bringing nearly $30 million (shady on the figure) to the company, they're going to turn a higher profit than either year. Just a shame that those were one-off occurances. Wrestling revenue is down. But the bottom line is the profit, which Linda and Vince will turn a blind eye to until they go into the red for a calendar year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 WTF is it on a Wednesday for? Are they going to show it taped on a Sunday here? Every PPV on 2000 got over a 1.0 buyrate...man, those were the days... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 30, 2004 The big problem with this is that it'll probably kill the Survivor Series buyrate as well. Doubt it. Care to actually explain? They just gouged the fanbase for $70 in a short period of time. It's going to hurt the buyrate of the next show because it's so crammed together. The same thing happened in the summer when they did this. The PPV following did a sub-par rate because they've oversaturated the market. People will only pay so much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 The big problem with this is that it'll probably kill the Survivor Series buyrate as well. Doubt it. Care to actually explain? They just gouged the fanbase for $70 in a short period of time. It's going to hurt the buyrate of the next show because it's so crammed together. The same thing happened in the summer when they did this. The PPV following did a sub-par rate because they've oversaturated the market. People will only pay so much. Plus, people are going to be spending their money on TNA Victory Road on 11/7! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hunter's Torn Quad 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I mean honestly, at this rate how many buys will Armageddon and that RAW Puerto Rico PPV do? And will that reduce the number of buys the Rumble gets? Armageddon: 195,000 Puerto Rican PPV: 165,000 Royal Rumble: 235,000 The Rumble will get WAYYYY more than 235,000 buys. Probably 100-150 thousand more. Armageddon, if well built, could break 200,000 and that's a good estimate for the Puerto Rican PPV considering it's on a fuckin Wednesday. You think the Rumble will get 335,000 to 385,000 buys ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I'm actually kind of worried about Survivor Series' buyrate...we may only have one major title match, JBL vs. Booker T...I just don't see anything on this card yet that will draw, unless they bring back Wargames and give the match some stakes like last year's Team Bischoff vs. Team Austin match where something was on the line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hunter's Torn Quad 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I think SSeries will get maybe 275,000 at the most, with it probably hitting the 240-260,000 range. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I guess you could say the WWE is going through a "rebuilding" stage... At least we don't have Roddy Piper, Hulk Hogan, and Kevin Nash getting pushed now, I guess... And hey, just a little over a year ago the big feud was Vince vs. Steph. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
what 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 The big problem with this is that it'll probably kill the Survivor Series buyrate as well. Doubt it. Care to actually explain? They just gouged the fanbase for $70 in a short period of time. It's going to hurt the buyrate of the next show because it's so crammed together. The same thing happened in the summer when they did this. The PPV following did a sub-par rate because they've oversaturated the market. People will only pay so much. I don't think many people would've bought Vengeance regardless of the two PPVs before it but I guess we'll see. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
what 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I mean honestly, at this rate how many buys will Armageddon and that RAW Puerto Rico PPV do? And will that reduce the number of buys the Rumble gets? Armageddon: 195,000 Puerto Rican PPV: 165,000 Royal Rumble: 235,000 The Rumble will get WAYYYY more than 235,000 buys. Probably 100-150 thousand more. Armageddon, if well built, could break 200,000 and that's a good estimate for the Puerto Rican PPV considering it's on a fuckin Wednesday. You think the Rumble will get 335,000 to 385,000 buys ? It will. Last year's got almost 400,000. The Rumble always draws well because of the stipulation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 I not as excited about this year's Rumble since it seems certain Orton will win. But you're right, the Rumble is probably their second best draw of the year, after Wrestlemania. Don't know if it'll get close to 400,000, this year though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Quik Report post Posted October 30, 2004 Ha ha. "We'd like to thank you for making Taboo Tuesday one of our best Pay-Per-Views ever." Good old JR. I guess they assumed that everyone who voted would order it. This makes the constant pimping of this damn PPV on Raw even funnier. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 You mean they got over 4 MILLION VOTES and only 170,000 buys? That can's POSSIBLY be true!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2004 those 170,000 people all voted 35-40 times each. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Tjhe CyNick Report post Posted October 30, 2004 The whole buyrate as a percentage thing changes every year based on the number of homes that have PPV capabilities. I believe a 1.0 buyrate at this point is about 540,000 buys. Meltzer always has this info in the Observer, so if you really want to know order his newsletter. Anyway, people are throwing that average buyrate number and its a little high. The way I see it, the new average for single brand shows is more like 225,000 buys, not 240K and its sure as hell not 260K. Based on last year's numbers from the Observer, if Taboo Tuesday did 170,000 buys that would be about $2.55 Million in revenues (not profit) and No Mercy would be about $2.85 Million in revenues. If they had done the same 225,000 buys they did for the Sept show, that would have been around $3.4 Million in revenues. There's no reason to think a single show in October would have done more than the 225K number, so as long as the second show didn't cost $2 Million to run they came out ahead by adding the second show. Ive heard the 100,000 buy number as a B-E point, but I dont know how that breaks down exactly (ie monies to PPV companies, for the show itself, talent and so on). I would also agree that we've seen the effects of oversaturation. The June PPVs did pretty good, but then the July PPV went down, and Summerslam was down from last year by a decent amount. And the numbers have only continued to go down since then. I dont think its about money, rather I just think people dont see the PPVs as being special anymore. This is in part because of the number of shows, but also I believe its because of how the TV is set up, which Ive discussed on another thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
humongous2002 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 190,000 buys + 170,000 buys = a successful month. How is that successful when WWE is still wasting a lot of money on producing these p.p.v.s? They could just do one p.p.v. per month and get those 2 buyrates combined. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lil' Bitch 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 Once again JBL proves to be a better draw than HHH. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ISportsFan 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 190,000 buys + 170,000 buys = a successful month. How is that successful when WWE is still wasting a lot of money on producing these p.p.v.s? They could just do one p.p.v. per month and get those 2 buyrates combined. Let's say that the average single-brand show is about 225,000 buys, and at the most 250,000 (which is way high). If they did one PPV in October, they would not have gotten 360,000 combined buys. If, for instance, 100,000 is the break even point (as mentioned by CyNick as being the possible number), then a single one-brand PPV with the 225,000 "average" is 125,000 over the break even point. With the two shows, they are 160,000 over the break even point, thus making more money. Therefore, it's a successful month. Even if the average is 250,000 (which it isn't), they still came out ahead this month by 10,000. Also, consider one of these shows was an experimental Tuesday night show where the main event wasn't known until after the show started (the main reason why I didn't buy a ticket and go to Milwaukee from Champaign that night for the PPV), and you realize that 170,000 is really good considering the self-imposed circumstances. In all, not a bad month for them. Jason Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RavishingRickRudo 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 The problem that no one is considering is that the WWE put so much hype on this show. Like every second of RAW was "REVOLUTIONARY!" this and "YOU CHOOSE" that. For weeks they relentless promoted this show and THAT is the (estimated) number they're getting. They honestly gave Taboo Tuesday Wrestlemania hype and they couldn't break 200,000. That's bad. I suspected at least that given the amount of promotion they dedicated to it. And the internet will get the blame here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ISportsFan 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 They may have hyped Taboo Tuesday more than almost any other pay-per-view, but it's really hard to plunk down $35 to watch something where you don't know what will be shown. I know I didn't want to watch the show unless Benoit won the voting, but I wouldn't have known until I bought the show. So, I didn't buy the show or buy a ticket to the show. There are probably a lot of people like me that didn't want to buy a show where they didn't know what will take place. For this reason tournaments almost always do poorly on PPV for pro wrestling, if I am correct in my memory. Jason Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Tjhe CyNick Report post Posted October 31, 2004 I wouldn't say it got Mania hype, but it did get much more than the average single brand show. I think it was a combination of a bad night for PPVs and the fact that the WWE cant seem to get people very interested in any of these single brand shows. They've been on a downward trend basically since Mania, and show no signs of coming back. Perhaps if they got back to one per month, they could make them seem special again, and more people would order. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
J.B. Buzzkill 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 And the internet will get the blame here. Yep. "That there intraweb is a cancer to the bidness! They don't know what they want!" That and the show being on a Tuesday are my guesses for the most likely excuses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
what 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 190,000 buys + 170,000 buys = a successful month. How is that successful when WWE is still wasting a lot of money on producing these p.p.v.s? They could just do one p.p.v. per month and get those 2 buyrates combined. No, they really couldn't have. No Mercy might have gotten 30,000 more buys had there not been two PPVs this month but I even doubt that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest krazykat72 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 190,000 is about a 0.34. If you think the Rumble will do "300,000 easy", you're in fantasy land. It might get close, but no way will it do 300,000. The Rumble did over 500,000 buys this year.....it'll probably do around that again....it's traditionally the 2nd highest of the year..hell SummerSlam did like 380,000 this year and that was after the 6 weeks of PPVs in June/July -Paul Jacobi- Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 To be fair, the decision to put it on Tuesday was pretty dumb, but it wasn't the only problem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
what 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 190,000 is about a 0.34. If you think the Rumble will do "300,000 easy", you're in fantasy land. It might get close, but no way will it do 300,000. The Rumble did over 500,000 buys this year.....it'll probably do around that again....it's traditionally the 2nd highest of the year..hell SummerSlam did like 380,000 this year and that was after the 6 weeks of PPVs in June/July -Paul Jacobi- Yep. Torn Quad seems to like talking out of his ass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Tjhe CyNick Report post Posted October 31, 2004 If I were to guess, unless they come up with something huge for the show, I think it will get around 425K-450,000 buys. I dont think they will top the 500,000 mark, only because every PPV this year (since Mania I mean) has been down from the previous year. And I dont see any huge angles where people will be beating down the doors to see the show. However, since it should beat Summerslam, I thinkt he 450K range is a safe bet. I also believe, and this is stupid to say so far out, but I think Mania will do about the same number it did in '03 and maybe even a little less. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarvinisaLunatic 0 Report post Posted October 31, 2004 On the months with 2 PPVs, they should offer some sort of package where you can rent both for like $59.95 instead of the close to $70 that it would cost to order both seperately. They would probably be able to get more people to rent both this way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
