The Official Orange Bowl Thread

[Bored 0]

Oh good fucking lord we are not going over last year's controversy again! This goes for everyone. If you desperately want to go over it again search through last year's college football threads.

 

This thread is supposed to be about USC vs. Oklahoma.

[Fökai 0]

There is a double standard going on here.

How'd you feel if Oklahoma got left out with an undefeated record and I responded with "Oh well, Oklahoma wasn't supposed to be there, I guess" and covered my ears?

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I don't understand what's so horrible about just having all the bowl games as usual and just have the BCS Bowls kick off an 8 team playoff.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

I guess we just need to decide what matters most - getting a firm national champion, as happens in every other NCAA sport, or keeping the tradition (and revenue) of the bowls.

 

Academics shouldn't be a consideration, by the way; if every division I-AA or II football team can deal with a playoff extended the season (not to say anything of all the other D-I sports), so can the D-I schools.

 

As for the Orange Bowl, it's easily the most appealing match-up of the bowl season, though Boise and Louisville might crack 100 points. USC to win, probably, but a hell of a game either way.

[Damaramu 0]

There is a double standard going on here.

How'd you feel if Oklahoma got left out with an undefeated record and I responded with "Oh well, Oklahoma wasn't supposed to be there, I guess" and covered my ears?

That's exactly what everyone would do! That's what I'm saying.

You guys are up in arms that Auburn isn't in the game but would be just fine if OU wasn't.

 

Fact is that the pollsters who everyone swore by last year have decided that these are the two teams that should play and that's what is going to happen.

 

As for the game. Of course I think OU will win. But it'll be a good one.

[Secret Agent 0]

OU may have lost the title game last year, but they won as many games as USC played last year. That's what made the differance.

 

After watching Saturday's games go down, I really thought Auburn was more impressive than USC though. BTW, why is nobody bitching about an undefeated Utah getting left out of the national title game? I'm sure they would have liked that shot too.

[Damaramu 0]

Well I've only seen like two predictions so far. What's everyone else think?

[Secret Agent 0]

Do you really need me to make a prediction, Dama? What I'd like to know is who's going to be there?

[Damaramu 0]

Well I did.

 

But you know mine's not like a shocker. I think OU will win. But I don't think they'll handle USC but I think they'll win by a TD.

[MrRant 0]

I have not read this thread.

 

The only thing I care about is OU losing so as to fuck with DamaSault.

 

That is all.

[Damaramu 0]

Them losing this one won't fuck with me that much b/c they at least won the conference this year.....unlike last year.

So I'd be able to live with a loss.....as long as it's not a blowout. Which won't happen anyways.

[Secret Agent 0]

Considering the fact that OSU manhandled UCLA earlier this year and USC barely had a handle on them I'm going with a 10 point margin of victory for OU.

[Damaramu 0]

I'm trying to figure out who's going to be favored in this game. I mean probably SC but I doubt it'd be by much.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Considering the fact that OSU manhandled UCLA earlier this year and USC barely had a handle on them I'm going with a 10 point margin of victory for OU.

The transitive property of victories/performance really doesn't mean a lot in these big games.

 

I'm leaning towards USC simply because Oklahoma's defense has shown itself to be quite fallible, giving up a lot of big plays and big points against both A&M and Oklahoma State, neither of whose attacks are nearly as well-rounded as the Trojans'. Both teams can pretty much score at will when they have to, but USC is a team that was able to hold Cal to 17 and Arizona State to even less. The 28 they they gave up to Stanford is their highest allowance of the season, and the USC of that week has developed into a much, much better team since. OU are no slouches--shutting out Texas is impressive, even if Vince Young pretty much turned himself incompetent after a quarter--but I always take the firm defense over the explosive offense.

 

It'll be close, but I'll still take USC by a touchdown.

[Secret Agent 0]

Not to be a smartass, Lord Macphisto, but...

 

I'm leaning towards USC simply because Oklahoma's defense has shown itself to be quite fallible, giving up a lot of big plays and big points against both A&M and Oklahoma State, neither of whose attacks are nearly as well-rounded as the Trojans'.

 

Doesn't that also apply to the transitive property of victories/performance, which really doesn't mean a lot in these big games as well?

 

I'll bet me and Dama will end up the only one's predicting OU for the win.

 

Edwin, what's your pick on the Sugar Bowl?

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Like I said earlier, I think Oklahoma will win. I'm just completely pissed at USC and Leinart.

[Damaramu 0]

[i'm leaning towards USC simply because Oklahoma's defense has shown itself to be quite fallible, giving up a lot of big plays and big points against both A&M and Oklahoma State, neither of whose attacks are nearly as well-rounded as the Trojans'. Both teams can pretty much score at will when they have to, but USC is a team that was able to hold Cal to 17 and Arizona State to even less. The 28 they they gave up to Stanford is their highest allowance of the season, and the USC of that week has developed into a much, much better team since. OU are no slouches--shutting out Texas is impressive, even if Vince Young pretty much turned himself incompetent after a quarter--but I always take the firm defense over the explosive offense.

 

It'll be close, but I'll still take USC by a touchdown.

Yes well they also gave up those points when they were missing there best secondary player(Antonio Perkins) and had Eric Bassey(who sucks) in there.

Stoops sent that Walker kid in during the A&M game and the defense was better. Perkins came back and surprise they've given up 6 points in 3 games. Hmmm......

 

On top of that OU's offense is better than Cal and ASU's. So I dont' think USC will be holding them to 17.

[iggymcfly 0]

Well, I'll try to stick with the message of the thread here.

 

Looking at the actual football to be played and not the controversy, I think USC matches up extremely well with Oklahoma. Oklahoma has a really strong defensive front and is able to shut down grind-it-out rushing teams well. (see Texas) However, they showed themselves to be vulnerable to the big play when they played more of a passing team in Texas A&M, and even gave up big plays in the secondary to what was traditionally a running team in Oklahoma State. This leads me to believe that USC who hits tons of big plays, but is unable to make a consistent drive running the ball to save their lives will have a field day.

 

As for the other side of the ball, USC has done at least a decent job against balanced offenses, and has if anything shown themselves to be more vulnerable against more west coast offense type schemes than a vertical passing game. They won't be able to completely shut down the combo of Jason White and Adrian Peterson, but they should at least be able to keep them in check.

 

This analysis leads me to believe that while USC will be able to, for the most part play their game on offense, and put up similar numbers to what they usually do, Oklahoma will be slown down somewhat and will not quite reach their usual heights. I'd give USC their usual score of about 38, and then put Oklahoma halfway between the 12 points they scored against Texas and the 42 they run up on Texas A&M. This leads to a 38-27 score, so subtracting a field goal for the fact that national championship games tend to be primarily defensive struggles, we're left with a final score of:

 

USC 35 Oklahoma 24

[Damaramu 0]

Why does nobody understand the OU secondary was vunerable b/c they were missing their best player and had another shitty player out there?

Then when they got back there best secondary player and put in that new kid....wow the secondary was just fine.

Hell the secondary was just fine against Texas A&M after the kid got put in.

I think you people keep forgetting that little fact when you talk about there defense.

Since Perkins came back they've only given up 6 points in 3 games.

 

Leinart's going to be forced to throw pretty much the whole game but he's going to have to do it with Dan Cody in his face. And he's probably going to get driven by Cody a couple times. With Perkins back he's bound to throw at least 1 or 2 INTs.

With OU's offense if the offensive line gives White time which I'm sure they will b/c they're the best in the country he can throw it anywhere he wants. He's proven that all of his recievers are big play recievers. On top of that if White's getting pressure he can just give it to Peterson who's proven that he can break multiple tackles and then put on a huge burst of speed. This team gave up 28 to a shitty Stanford team and 24 to UCLA with none of their secondary injured. And neither of those teams has the offensive power that OU does.

OU by a TD.

[lomasmoney 0]

Why does nobody understand the OU secondary was vunerable b/c they were missing their best player and had another shitty player out there?

Then when they got back there best secondary player and put in that new kid....wow the secondary was just fine.

Hell the secondary was just fine against Texas A&M after the kid got put in.

I think you people keep forgetting that little fact when you talk about there defense.

Since Perkins came back they've only given up 6 points in 3 games.

 

Leinart's going to be forced to throw pretty much the whole game but he's going to have to do it with Dan Cody in his face. And he's probably going to get driven by Cody a couple times. With Perkins back he's bound to throw at least 1 or 2 INTs.

With OU's offense if the offensive line gives White time which I'm sure they will b/c they're the best in the country he can throw it anywhere he wants. He's proven that all of his recievers are big play recievers. On top of that if White's getting pressure he can just give it to Peterson who's proven that he can break multiple tackles and then put on a huge burst of speed. This team gave up 28 to a shitty Stanford team and 24 to UCLA with none of their secondary injured. And neither of those teams has the offensive power that OU does.

OU by a TD.

And they've played almost absolutely outmatched teams in those three games. USC will be the best team OU has seen in the last three seasons and I don't think they will be able to contain all of the weapons, SC has. They have to contend with stopping Bush and Leinart and let's not forget that LenDale White can come in and bruise you all day. USC has multiple playmakers at the skill posititions and I think that will enough to win against OU. The keys for Oklahoma to win are to keep a spy on Bush all game no matter where he lines up, protect Jason White, and have balance on offense. If they can get Peterson the ball 20-25 times and have White throw the ball about 25-35 times to where they can both control the clock but still move the ball they have a good chance of winning the game. I think USC is a bit more talented of a team and in a game where both coaching staffs are so good I don't think coaching will be the winning factor that it will come down to which team has more big plays. Final Score: USC 28 Oklahoma 20

[Damaramu 0]

The best team OU has played in the past 3 years? LSU might have something to say about that. The LSU defense was better than the SC defense at least.

 

OU has proven you can't run on them. Cedric Benson is more talented a running back than LenDale White and probably more talented as just a RB(notice i didn't say anything else) than Reggie Bush. And he was absolutely stuffed against OU.

It's very tough to run the ball against OU. It's nearly impossible to have a huge game running the football. Leinart's going to have to throw it to win this game. And he's going to have that OU defensive line in his face the entire time.

 

USC nearly lost to Cal at home and OU's a better team than Cal. So if USC duplicates their performance that they had against Cal or the one they had against UCLA then they're in for a very long night. USC is going to have to play the best they've played since Carrol becamse coach to win this game.

OU will have to play their best to. But don't act like USC can just do what they want and walk away with a victory. That won't happen.

Not to mention OU has the intensity edge. USC has just been rolling along all season and hearing how they're #1. They're thinking "Let's just go play our game and we'll win!"

OU has heard people say they don't belong here. They're pissed they lost the title last year and they're thinking "We're going to fuck these California boys up!" Hell look what they did to Colorado. I haven't seen OU that fired up in a LONG time. They were thinking about last year's Big XII title game and if they were that fired up after losing just a conference championship imagine how angry they're going to be after losing that national title last year.

OU by a TD.

[Bored 0]

This team gave up 28 to a shitty Stanford team and 24 to UCLA with none of their secondary injured.

Stanford was a completely different team offensively with a healthy Trent Edwards at quarterback so they were far from shitty at that point in the season. UCLA averaged over 30 points a game this year.

[lomasmoney 0]

The best team OU has played in the past 3 years? LSU might have something to say about that. The LSU defense was better than the SC defense at least.

 

OU has proven you can't run on them. Cedric Benson is more talented a running back than LenDale White and probably more talented as just a RB(notice i didn't say anything else) than Reggie Bush. And he was absolutely stuffed against OU.

It's very tough to run the ball against OU. It's nearly impossible to have a huge game running the football. Leinart's going to have to throw it to win this game. And he's going to have that OU defensive line in his face the entire time.

 

USC nearly lost to Cal at home and OU's a better team than Cal. So if USC duplicates their performance that they had against Cal or the one they had against UCLA then they're in for a very long night. USC is going to have to play the best they've played since Carrol becamse coach to win this game.

OU will have to play their best to. But don't act like USC can just do what they want and walk away with a victory. That won't happen.

Not to mention OU has the intensity edge. USC has just been rolling along all season and hearing how they're #1. They're thinking "Let's just go play our game and we'll win!"

OU has heard people say they don't belong here. They're pissed they lost the title last year and they're thinking "We're going to fuck these California boys up!" Hell look what they did to Colorado. I haven't seen OU that fired up in a LONG time. They were thinking about last year's Big XII title game and if they were that fired up after losing just a conference championship imagine how angry they're going to be after losing that national title last year.

OU by a TD.

the point that OU is better than Cal means pretty much nothing. By the same token, USC beat Virgina Tech who is better than anyone Oklahoma has seen sans maybe Texas, and USC's best near loss is against a team that is both better than anyone OU has played and better than both of OU's near losses.

[Damaramu 0]

The point still is that people are saying OU can't handle USC's offense b/c they gave up big plays when everyone chooses to forget that they didn't have there best player in there plus they had a shitty player in there. Once they took Bassey out everything was fine against A&M. And once Perkins came back the defense was on fire again.

So don't point to the A&M and OSU games as an example that OU's secondary isn't up to snuff when they didn't even have their best player out there.

On top of that OU isn't going to see a better running back from USC than Cedric Benson. Yeah Bush may be better all around but as pure running backs Lendale White and Reggie Bush are not better than Cedric Benson who OU shut down.

Not to mention USC hasn't seen a QB with a big play weapon at every wide out position like Jason White nor have they seen a running back like Adrian Peterson.

USC seems to get stunned when someone comes out of the gates and punches them in the mouth. I think OU will hit em' hard early like they did against Colorado and USC will be stunned for a quarter or so. And by then OU will probably have the game in hand.

OU by a TD.

[Damaramu 0]

Trev Alberts who spent all season saying OU should be #3 just ran back and said he thinks OU will be favored over USC. Man these ESPN guys change position really quick.

[Secret Agent 0]

I just have one thing to say in regards to the OU Vs USC thoughts; Jan 4 will show whos better. Until them everything is nothing more than speculation.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Not to be a smartass, Lord Macphisto, but...

 

I'm leaning towards USC simply because Oklahoma's defense has shown itself to be quite fallible, giving up a lot of big plays and big points against both A&M and Oklahoma State, neither of whose attacks are nearly as well-rounded as the Trojans'.

 

Doesn't that also apply to the transitive property of victories/performance, which really doesn't mean a lot in these big games as well?

Not really. When I say transitive property, I mean "OU beat Oklahoma State who beat UCLA by more than USC beat UCLA by, so OU should be able to beat USC cause they already beat a team that beat UCLA by more." Looking at how Oklahoma performs against good offenses is more of an evaluative criteria of how their defenses hold up than a direct comparison involving UCLA. Notre Dame beat Stanford by 8 points, but no one's going to say that they're better than USC because of that.

 

Edwin, what's your pick for the Sugar Bowl?

 

I'm leaning towards Auburn by a fucking lot. I've seen Virginia Tech play a lot this year, and they're good, but Auburn is great, and they match up against Tech's strong points extremely well.

 

Also, I pretty much agree exactly with Iggy's analysis of the Orange Bowl match-up.

[ANKLELOCK 0]

Why doesn't anyone understand that OU.............?

 

Why can't you just accept people's predictions instead of making up long excuses as to why they're wrong to each one?

 

Anyway here's my worthless predictions:

 

Orange: USC 31- OU 21

 

Sugar: Auburn 28- Va Tech 24

 

Fiesta: Utah 35- Pittsburgh 31

 

Rose: Michigan 21- Texas 13

[Damaramu 0]

Because people are ignoring things when it comes to OU's defense. They're saying that the secondary is weak but forgetting what was going on during those games. The secondary tightened up against A&M when Bassey was taken out. And now that Perkins is in the game on the other corner as opposed to Oynegecha who spent last year on the bench with an injury at a Junior College in San Fransisco they haven't given up any long plays.

The A&M and OSU games are not a good represenative of OU's pass defense b/c they've got totally different players in there now that have tightened it up and made it better.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

And now that Perkins is in the game on the other corner as opposed to Oynegecha who spent last year on the bench with an injury at a Junior College in San Fransisco they haven't given up any long plays.

The games since OSU and A&M have been against Baylor, Nebraska, and Colorado. Telling someone that you didn't give up long plays against Baylor and Nebraska is like telling someone that you managed to get your pants on right today.

 

OU's good, but their secondary has appeared to be their one defensive bend point this season. If Jarrett and Smith can get behind the defensive backs, Leinart will make the secondary pay. The DBs may be improved, but Donovan Woods smoked the lineup he faced for over 200 yards on eight completions. And he's not even that good. Some of those are going to get through, and I imagine that's where the Trojans will be able to do the most damage. Neither of these teams are invincible, and I expect that with offenses this good it's going to be the defenses that give.