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An open question

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Relating to the person who said that they had a hard time not seeing Eddie or Benoit as champs:

 

It may be that I don't watch Smackdown nearly as often as Raw (every week for the latter, maybe once a month for the former), but I still don't see Eddie as a champ on the same level as Benoit. I would point to his treatment after losing the belt, that being of going on to something different and ignoring any potential reclaimation of the title, but the same was done with Benoit. I can't put my finger on why, but I see Eddie on a lower level than Benoit, and have since the beginning of the year.

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Re: Raven's popularity

If it weren't for the usual suspects, Raven would have headlined in WCW. He was just as over as the main eventers, if not even more so, and WCW missed the boat BIG TIME when they didn't give him any sort of major program following the DDP feud.

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You know what's weird? It's like Jericho knows all that. He always states in his interviews that winning and losing don't matter to his character anymore because he is bulletproof. I think him, RVD and Rey are about the only guys who can say that.

Rock, even though he isn't around anymore, is more bulletproof than anyone.

Ah yes, that's right. Rock is totally bulletproof, which was why he could put over Jericho in 2001 without blinking. Good call.

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Guest JerichosHi-Lite

WWE dropped the ball with RVD in 2001. He's the first one to spring to mind with questions like these. Booker T in 2003 is another one.

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Another problem with WWE besides the political BS is the fact that they are looking for the next Austin or Rock (just like they did in the early 90's by looking for a Hogan clone) instead of creating a completely brand new character. Cena and Orton are the Austin/Rocky clones of this generation.

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Guest Thrashist

Much of what we're talking about today is a result of WWE's arrogance when business was hot.

 

I remember the mentality at the time was to 1. not let a wrestler from another company come in and just take over and 2. slowly develop both young and incoming wrestlers over time in the midcard because supposedly they weren't at the level of these men: Austin, Rock, Foley, Taker, Triple H.

 

That meant that they wouldn't push Jericho to the top, even though clearly he was credible and popular enough at the time. Benoit had all the credibility in the world as a heel. A year later, Rob Van Dam and Booker T were popular enough that just putting them over for a title win once would have been enough.

 

And they're paying for it now, because with the exception of Benoit, all of these men plus more are damaged goods. In the past two years they've been panicking by overpushing people like Lesnar, Orton, Bradshaw, Heidenreich, when right under the noses during the boom they could have ran with the crowd reaction given to people like RVD and Jericho and have a much more credible main event crowd.

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Guest Coffey

Tough question to answer with a straight forward reply. I'd like to think that if the company was, well, I don't want to say "ran proper" but for the lack of a better phrase, I will.

 

Anyway, if everyone was used at their full potential, I'd like to think that there wouldn't be ONE top guy. I'd like to think that each fan would have multiple favorites. Like during the Hogan/Warrior days.

 

I'd say Val Venis, The Hurricane, Chris Jericho and John Cena would be up there. Possibly Edge & Christian as well.

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Chris Jericho would have been a 5 time champ, had he been pushed right, and probably the biggest star in the company today. The thing is, unlike Eddie and Benoit, and even RVD, his debut was on his own, and was hyped up for weeks. It seemed like the WWF was going in that direction with Y2J, but for some reason, they blew it.

 

And right now, if they really are going with Angle/Taker at WM for the title, they are in the midst of doing the same with John Cena, someone who should have had the strap months ago.

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Guest LooneyTune

Is it me, or should WWE stop reffering to Jericho as Y2J? seems to me like that nickname is a little dated now.

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Is it me, or should WWE stop reffering to Jericho as Y2J? seems to me like that nickname is a little dated now.

JR says it every week.

 

And this week, Eric even busted out the ol' 'Eyeotolla (however you fucking spell taht lol) of Rockin rolla, Y2J, Chris Jericho' etc.

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Guest JerichosHi-Lite
John Cena, someone who should have had the strap months ago.

..... how do you figure that?

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Is it me, or should WWE stop reffering to Jericho as Y2J? seems to me like that nickname is a little dated now.

JR says it every week.

 

And this week, Eric even busted out the ol' 'Eyeotolla (however you fucking spell taht lol) of Rockin rolla, Y2J, Chris Jericho' etc.

He'll be referred to as King of the World next week.

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The Ayatollah of Rock and Rolla is a good nickname though. So is King of the World.

 

But Y2J really is outdated.

 

He should use King of Bling Bling more, but i'm guessing he onky does that as a heel.

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John Cena, someone who should have had the strap months ago.

..... how do you figure that?

The most over wrestler in the company, had solid matches with Angle, Taker, Eddie, and Benoit, and at the time, was still coming up with new catchphrases and better promos.

 

He's still arguably the 2nd or 3rd most over wrestler in the company behind Taker and The Rock.

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Yeah they do. And his ringwork has declined in the last 12 months too. But the fact remains that he's so over it's worth giving him a run with the belt now while he's hot. Will he draw? Probably not, but no-one is drawing much right now, and we'll never know unless he's given the opportunity.

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Yeah they do. And his ringwork has declined in the last 12 months too. But the fact remains that he's so over it's worth giving him a run with the belt now while he's hot. Will he draw? Probably not, but no-one is drawing much right now, and we'll never know unless he's given the opportunity.

You could tell he's stopped trying since they started to depush him for whatever reason. It's probably because he knew they weren't going to do anything with him. Sort of like RVD.

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I wonder what would happen if HHH died in a car crash tomorrow. Do you think Vince would put the company on hiatus (at least RAW side) because they wouldnt have a main event and someone to carry the brand.....well in Upper-management eyes anyway?

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I wish they would do something with Charlie Haas...I was pissed when TWGTT was split up and even though Sheltons got the IC belt(until Maven takes it from him) I would still rather see them together as opposed to what Haas is doing now...they've got him stuck with F'n Holly and he keeps losing! I can't stand watching them ruin these guys who could actually go out there and put on great matches. Cena is stale right now but I don't see him losing the US title anytime soon so why not give him a fresh opponent like Haas who can help carry Cena...they could have a great feud..and then give Haas the belt so that Cena can get the strap from JBL at Mania although I think that there's no time to do it right but with the WWE they don't care about time so who knows...but at this rate Haas will never be anything more than a jobber

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Guest BDC

Well, I'm pleased that one of my favorites is doing well, in Benjamin. I always thought he'd be the breakout guy of TWGTT. Haas has always seemed a bit too vanilla to me.

 

When Rey debuted, he had incredible momentum and went through terrific matches with Angle and Benoit. If they have just kept him rolling, he could be considered a main eventer. But, damn, he's short.

 

Jericho? Already covered, but did you hear the POP for the guy on Monday? I'm a Benoit fan, but Y2J just had him beat.

 

Well, let me put it this way: they turned Nova into a fitness guru. Thank you, WWE, for making sure he won't succeed. Crap like that just blows my mind.

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Well, let me put it this way: they turned Nova into a fitness guru. Thank you, WWE, for making sure he won't succeed. Crap like that just blows my mind.

 

I was thinking the same thing this past Monday night. Nova is getting reactions from the crowd because of his obnoxious mic work. Not the fitness guru gimmick. Vince and company probably think it's the gimmick. Instead of having this guy be a living, breathing, walking flashback to 1996 why couldn't they do something innovative with him. What was wrong with him being the innovator of wrestling?

 

I feel the same way about Eugene. Actually it's a running theme in WWE right now. Gimmicks that have the potential to be interesting if done correctly, done the opposite of correct. See the arab-american gimmick

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Guest LooneyTune

Val Venis is wasted because his gimmick sucks, and anything else they try with him sucks more or just doesn't click.

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Guest LooneyTune

I think the gimmick was ruined for me because of the stupid "Chief" gimmick he played and just hate autority figures in wrestling now.

 

Let's not forget the bright idea of calling him the Big Valbowski in 2002... did that make any sense?

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Guest CronoT
You know what's weird? It's like Jericho knows all that. He always states in his interviews that winning and losing don't matter to his character anymore because he is bulletproof. I think him, RVD and Rey are about the only guys who can say that.

Rock, even though he isn't around anymore, is more bulletproof than anyone.

Ah yes, that's right. Rock is totally bulletproof, which was why he could put over Jericho in 2001 without blinking. Good call.

He also put over Shane "Hurricane" Helms in a great match. Too bad Triple H came out and shit all over him less than a month after.

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Guest BDC
You know what's weird? It's like Jericho knows all that. He always states in his interviews that winning and losing don't matter to his character anymore because he is bulletproof. I think him, RVD and Rey are about the only guys who can say that.

Rock, even though he isn't around anymore, is more bulletproof than anyone.

Ah yes, that's right. Rock is totally bulletproof, which was why he could put over Jericho in 2001 without blinking. Good call.

He also put over Shane "Hurricane" Helms in a great match. Too bad Triple H came out and shit all over him less than a month after.

That drove me batty. Okay, the Rock had a fluke loss to Hurricane and people reacted to a character they loved. Is HHH so insecure he has to go out and squash even a novelty character?

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Guest LooneyTune

Hunter squashing him didn't mean a thing. The fact they IGNORED Hurricane won with the Austin/Rock shit was what pisses me off. Hurricane wins... but AUSTIN IS HERE! OH MY GOD STONE COLD!

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Guest CronoT
You know what's weird? It's like Jericho knows all that. He always states in his interviews that winning and losing don't matter to his character anymore because he is bulletproof. I think him, RVD and Rey are about the only guys who can say that.

Rock, even though he isn't around anymore, is more bulletproof than anyone.

Ah yes, that's right. Rock is totally bulletproof, which was why he could put over Jericho in 2001 without blinking. Good call.

He also put over Shane "Hurricane" Helms in a great match. Too bad Triple H came out and shit all over him less than a month after.

That drove me batty. Okay, the Rock had a fluke loss to Hurricane and people reacted to a character they loved. Is HHH so insecure he has to go out and squash even a novelty character?

That became the standard for how to kill a lower-mid carder's heat. Hurricane gets a super-fluke win over The Rock, due to interference from Steve Austin. Then, he starts building some heat over the next week or so. Finally, he's in a match with Ric Flair, where Flair, as the great wrestler he is; love him or hate him, especially with the way he's allowed himself to fall, makes Hurricane look like a credible threat, all the way through the match, until he finally beats him. Then, immediately after the match ends, Triple H, who's not even in the fucking match, comes down, in his street clothes, and Pedigree's Shane "Hurricane" Helms.

 

I know it's probably been said half-a-gazillion times, but the only thing bigger than Levesque's nose is his ego.

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