Guest Big_Jay101 Report post Posted February 9, 2005 I dont think Ken Griffey Jr. is under the microscope, he seems to have been the same size throughout his career and not overly buff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2005 But also take into account how many freak injuries he's had. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Mindless_Aggression Report post Posted February 9, 2005 Griffey is who popped into my head too when I heard Greenburg say that this morning, but he certainly doesn't fit the typical roided look. Then again, what the hell do I know about steroids? I suppose it's possible he just didn't use enough to get the jacked figure that Canseco and other's had. But yeah, it's Jose Canseco, I would'n't put it past him to lie about his own use of roids just to sell some books really. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Big_Jay101 Report post Posted February 9, 2005 Yeah most of Griffey's injuries in the 90's were due to running into the wall to make a catch weren't they? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2005 Actually most where hamstring injuries he got running the bases. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2005 Hamstring, running...quadricep, walking...don't rule it out Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted February 9, 2005 I think it's reasonable that anyone could have cycled on steroids, either for a quick gain(s) or to work off an injury. Who knows if creatine or andro don't lead to similar problems at this point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted February 11, 2005 Reportedly Canseco mentions more names in the 60 Minutes interview on Sunday including Miguel Tejada. Edit: Here's an excellent article on the steroid fiasco. http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/...teroids-column/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Reportedly Canseco mentions more names in the 60 Minutes interview on Sunday including Miguel Tejada. Geez, play 26 games with Canseco as a rookie shortstop and you're branded for life. Is there an ex-teammate of Canseco's who DIDN'T take steroids? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Damaramu 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 I heard on the radio that people in the clubhouse called Canseco "The Chemist". Yeah I know he's got the roids and everything but this guy is too stupid to even complete elementary chemistry. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Geez, play 26 games with Canseco as a rookie shortstop and you're branded for life. Is there an ex-teammate of Canseco's who DIDN'T take steroids? Although he wasn't a teammate of Canseco's, remember THIS guy was once caught with steroids, so I guess literally anyone could have been. As for actual teammates, Canseco had 537 in his career. So every guy on this list is a suspect! Steve Fireovid Benji Gil Chris Singleton Vaughn Eshelman Allen Watson Orlando Mercado Mark Brandenburg Paul Wilson Pat Hentgen Mark Acre Bill Dawley Roberto Hernandez Robb Nen Rick Reed Richie Lewis Wilson Alvarez Jamie Quirk Fernando Arroyo David Justice Mike Mohler Curt Young Geronimo Berroa Sean Lowe Jimmy Haynes Ron Mahay Reggie Jackson Kevin Witt Doug Strange Kerry Lacy Toby Hall Jason Grimsley Bubba Trammell Felix Jose Edwin Nunez Brian Looney Mike Warren Derek Jeter Mike Bordick Steve Ontiveros Kenny Kelly Scott Sanderson Dick Scott Bill Bathe Travis Harper Rich Bordi Benito Santiago Rick Peters Ruben Sierra Mark Dalesandro Juan Bell David Lamb Julio Ramirez Alex Delgado Keith Foulke Jeff Shaver Alex Cole Joaquin Andujar Mariano Rivera Jeff Sparks Matt Stairs Alex Gonzalez Troy Neel Vinny Castilla Ryan Thompson Jack Daugherty Cory Lidle Matt Whiteside Mike Campbell Dave Otto Russ McGinnis Eric Plunk Glenn Hubbard Kevin Reimer Miguel Tejada Jake Westbrook Bruce Walton Stan Javier Brent Mayne Charlie O'Brien Rich Gossage Jose Guillen Dave Stieb Jeff Huson Ernest Riles Tom Evans Dean Palmer Jose Valentin Wilson Delgado Mike Kingery Steve Kiefer Rich Garces John Dettmer Bobby Howry Jack Armstrong Carney Lansford Rusty Tillman John Russell Jose Cruz Jr. Tony Saunders Scott Chiamparino Craig Grebeck Dave Collins Juan Samuel Dickie Thon Jason Giambi Troy Afenir Roy Halladay Damian Rolls Darren Lewis Buddy Groom Gary Redus Manuel Lee Brent Knackert Alejandro Pena Ed Yarnall Mike Macfarlane Terry Steinbach Josh Paul Dave Hollins Dave Telgheder Norm Charlton Donnie Hill Gary Lavelle Steve Rodriguez Greg Cadaret Terry Shumpert Kirk Dressendorfer Roger Clemens Zane Smith Steve Karsay Dusty Baker Paul Sorrento Rafael Bournigal Roberto Kelly Rob Ducey Shawn Green Shannon Stewart Bill Caudill Kevin Brown Darren Bragg Gene Nelson Monty Fariss Jose Guzman Shane Spencer Dan Meyer Rick Rodriguez Shawn Hillegas Tino Martinez Roger Pavlik Woody Williams Frank Rodriguez Rusty Greer David Hulse Mark Guthrie Steve Chitren Dan Peltier George Williams Brad Rigby Chris Codiroli Tomas Perez Erik Hanson Wil Cordero Kevin Brown Butch Davis Kevin Stocker Luis Andujar Alan Newman Lance Johnson Mark Whiten Jeff Russell Lance Blankenship Trevor Enders Doug Dascenzo Danilo Leon Andy Hawkins Heathcliff Slocumb Scott Brosius Brad Pennington Ozzie Guillen Carlos Rodriguez Brad Komminsk Tony Fernandez Jim Parque Tony Phillips Tim Kubinski Mike Duvall Willie McGee Chris Carpenter Stan Belinda Ken Ryan Jeff Manto Mike Jeffcoat Mike Maddux Matt Young Mickey Callaway Bill Pulsipher Chris James Wayne Rosenthal Dave Stewart James Baldwin Duff Brumley Joe Hudson Bill Haselman Rick Aguilera Clay Bellinger Ken Vining Dan Wright Dane Johnson Damon Mashore Jose Rijo Lenn Sakata Mario Diaz Vince Horsman Bill Mooneyham Sandy Alomar Jr. Mo Vaughn Scott Aldred Mike Difelice Craig Lefferts Ron Witmeyer Ed Sprague Geno Petralli Jose Malave Doug Creek Johnny Guzman Ken Phelps Dave Martinez Charlie Leibrandt Kevin Campbell Steve McCatty Dave Leiper Brian Lesher Tim Naehring Esteban Beltre Nolan Ryan Chris Turner Doug Davis Ozzie Timmons Mike Heath Joel Johnston Lorenzo Barcelo Izzy Molina Keith Atherton Aaron Sele Juan Gonzalez Julio Santana Steve Trachsel Chris Donnels Billy Brewer Esteban Yan Mark L. Johnson Oddibe McDowell Bruce Hurst Ron Darling Dave Von Ohlen Cal Eldred Billy Taylor Brian Harper Tim Van Egmond Joe Slusarski Tilson Brito Larry Arndt Felipe Crespo Tommy John Mike Raczka Hector Fajardo Kelly Downs Aaron Small Jeff Pierce Derek Lilliquist Steve Wojciechowski Jeff Parrett Mike Stanton Miguel Cairo Darrin Fletcher Willie Adams Don Baylor Gary Glover Darren Oliver Ariel Prieto Mickey Tettleton Kelly Wunsch Milt Cuyler Rick Helling Walt McKeel Patrick Lennon Doug Jennings Henry Mercedes Todd Burns Reggie Jefferson McKay Christensen Steve Mura Bill Krueger Aaron Rowand Russ Johnson Paul Quantrill Rick White Brian Snyder Rich Rowland Rob Maurer Gary Haught Ryan Rupe Tony Fiore Ron Cey Steve Howard Jay Tessmer Darrel Akerfelds Brook Jacoby Carlos Lee Danny Clyburn Carlos Almanzar Dwayne Murphy Steve Balboni Dave Kingman Chuck Knoblauch Chris Bando Bob Welch Felix Martinez Mark Bellhorn Dave Parker Dan Smith Jason Tyner Jeff Frye Rudy Pemberton Tanyon Sturtze Rheal Cormier Darrell Einertson Joe Klink Billy Beane Fred Manrique Frank Thomas John Doherty Ramiro Mendoza Daniel Wheeler Brian Bark Rickey Henderson Tim Leary Jay Witasick Vance Law Scott Hemond Gerald Alexander Junior Ortiz Doug Bair John Valentin Mike Schooler Matt Murray Jeff Kaiser Bruce Bochte Steve Sinclair Andrew Lorraine Edit: I C&P'd this off of baseball-reference...and Mark McGwire isn't on it. Strange. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Styles 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Reportedly Canseco mentions more names in the 60 Minutes interview on Sunday including Miguel Tejada. bangs head on table Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Edit: I C&P'd this off of baseball-reference...and Mark McGwire isn't on it. Strange. Alex and Wilson Delgado are on there, but not Carlos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Baseball-reference.com only allows 350 on a list. Thus quite a few are cut off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Whoops. Hey Billy Beane was a teammate of Canseco's longer than Tejada... Here's a little fun fact, Canseco's last game of 1997 with the A's was August 26th. Tejada's MLB debut was August 27th. THE PLOT THICKENS! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Styles 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Whoops. Hey Billy Beane was a teammate of Canseco's longer than Tejada... Here's a little fun fact, Canseco's last game of 1997 with the A's was August 26th. Tejada's MLB debut was August 27th. THE PLOT THICKENS! So their only meeting apparently went like this: Tejada: Hi, I'm Miguel. Jose, would you inject me with steroids? Canseco: Sure! And then they parted ways.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 On 60 Minutes, Jose says that not only did steroids increase McGwire's already substantial strength, but also improved his demeanor and personality. In a related story, Scott Steiner asked "then what did I stick in MY ass?" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Styles 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 On 60 Minutes, Jose says that not only did steroids increase McGwire's already substantial strength, but also improved his demeanor and personality. But did it make McGwire a better, more sensitive lover when Jose was injecting him from behind? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 For better or worse? I remember McGwire being prickish during the '98 HR chase. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Czech Republic 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 I had always seen McGwire as the "bad guy" in the home run chase, but he was a Cardinal and I'm a Cubs fan, so duh. Then I looked back years later and realized both of them weren't so bad after all compared to Barry Bonds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 It has nothing to with being a Cubs fan. McGwire wasn't the most media friendly during the run, until Sosa became involved. The entire baseball spotlight wasn't on McGwire and he seemed to have more fun with the chase. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Styles 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 OK, so apparently he doesn't know for sure if Tejada takes steroids, but he did "council" him about it as a rookie. What a jackass Canseco is. Apparently he also names Sosa (who he says he doesn't know for sure but "its obvious", what a douchebag), Brett Boone, Clemens, and some others. From the Baltimore Sun: Canseco's allegations on steroids growing Report: Ex-player's book implicates Sosa, Tejada, Clemens, Bonds, others By Joe Christensen Sun Staff February 12, 2005 With Jose Canseco's controversial new book about to reach stores, a new set of allegations surfaced yesterday that continued to tarnish Major League Baseball, and the Orioles in particular. According to the New York Daily News, Canseco's book implicates Roger Clemens, Barry Bonds, Bret Boone and at least four Orioles, among other players, with suspicions of steroid use. Besides Rafael Palmeiro, who called Canseco's claims "ludicrous" earlier this week, the book goes on to name three Orioles who will join Palmeiro at spring training this month: Sammy Sosa, Miguel Tejada and former Glen Burnie High standout Tony Saunders. This week, Palmeiro drew the backing of Orioles owner Peter Angelos, who questioned Canseco's credibility and offered to represent Palmeiro in a potential lawsuit. Last night, the Orioles responded in tune. "Mr. Angelos' statement earlier this week speaks volumes about Canseco's credibility, or lack of it," team spokesman Bill Stetka said in an e-mail. "We'll reserve further comment until we see if Canseco names Babe Ruth, Abner Doubleday or anyone else." Canseco says Saunders abused steroids before breaking his arm while throwing a pitch for the Tampa Bay Devil Rays in 1999. Reached by The Sun last night, Saunders initially laughed. "Consider the source," Saunders said. "Here's a player who had a good career but could not make a mark to get into the Hall of Fame, and I guess he wants to mark everybody else." The book, Juiced: Wild Times, Rampant 'Roids, Smash Hits, and How Baseball Got Big, was scheduled for a Feb. 21 release but was pushed up to Monday. Canseco, an admitted steroid user, will be featured on a 60 Minutes segment tomorrow. Canseco says he personally took steroids with Mark McGwire, Jason Giambi, Palmeiro, Ivan Rodriguez and Juan Gonzalez. He also suggests President Bush must have known his players took steroids when he was managing general partner of the Texas Rangers in the early 1990s. Canseco doesn't say he saw Tejada, Sosa or Saunders take steroids personally, as he does with Palmeiro, but he gives special mention to each, the Daily News reported. Of Sosa, who came to the Orioles in a trade with the Chicago Cubs last week, Canseco writes, "I don't know Sammy Sosa personally, so I can't say for a fact he ever took steroids." But Canseco notes how Sosa's body changed more dramatically than Mark McGwire's before 1998, when those two had their historic home run race. "It seemed so obvious, it was a joke," Canseco writes about Sosa. "No comment," Sosa's agent, Adam Katz, told the Daily News. For Canseco, the book is less a confessional than an ode to steroids. He says he personally injected McGwire with steroids in a bathroom stall at the Oakland Coliseum when they were teammates with the Oakland Athletics. He says he introduced Palmeiro, Rodriguez and Gonzalez to steroids and injected those substances with them after being traded from Oakland to Texas in 1992. Canseco returned to Oakland for one season, in 1997, the year Tejada broke into the big leagues with that team. "I started giving [Tejada] advice about steroids, and he seemed interested in what I was saying," Canseco says. Canseco goes on to write that he "can't say for sure" Tejada cheated, but says Tejada would have been justified in doing so. Tejada's agents, Fernando Cuza and Diego Bentz, did not return calls last night. Saunders, who signed a minor league contract with the Orioles last month in hopes of making a remarkable comeback, teamed with Canseco for about six weeks with Tampa Bay in 1999. "What gets me," Saunders said, "is that he made it sound, from what other people told me today, that we were best friends, and he tried to console me. What a joke. Are you kidding me?" Saunders, who pitched for the Florida Marlins in the 1997 World Series, said he was told Canseco intimated that Saunders gained weight before breaking his arm in 1999. Fifteen months later, Saunders tried making a comeback but fractured his left humerus bone again while delivering a pitch in a minor-league game. "What about the second time when I broke it?" Saunders said. "I was 25 pounds less. What I went through in therapy and all the things I had to do to make my comeback? I was being tested all the time. There is no way that if I had been using the stuff he said I was using it wouldn't have been picked up." As for Clemens, the seven-time Cy Young Award winner, Canseco picks his words carefully. He says he has never seen Clemens do steroids, but he says Clemens said he took "B-12 shots," and Canseco calls that clubhouse code for steroids. According to the Daily News, Canseco writes that he thought Clemens showed classic signs of steroid use, including a sudden improvement late in his career. "Neither Roger nor I have seen the book, but any such suggestion is absurd on its face," Randy Hendricks, one of Clemens' agents, told the Daily News. "It's a wonder Canseco didn't name the pope, given he named President Bush. "Roger has not taken any illegal drugs or substances. He has passed all tests and will continue to do so in 2005. In 2004, with stricter testing, he passed the tests and won a record seventh Cy Young Award." With Bonds, who admitted in grand jury testimony that he unknowingly used steroids, Canseco doesn't mince words. He writes, "The simple fact is Barry Bonds was definitely using steroids." With Boone, Canseco notes how the second baseman grew noticeably bigger before the 2001 season. Canseco says he asked Boone what he had done, and Boone said, "Shhh, don't tell anybody." Canseco figured Boone meant he was "part of the club." Sun staff writer Pat O'Malley contributed to this article. Copyright © 2005, The Baltimore Sun Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Precious Roy 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 I think this effort by the enitrety of MLB to discredit Canseco is pretty funny in-itself, and speaks volumes about the issue. MLB is so afraid of roids that they're trying to paint him as a lone conspiracy nut. Anyone who's willing to look at things logically has suspected most of the guys Canseco's named for years. Is it a shock that Palmeiro or Boone or Clemens or Tejada may have juiced? Not to me. If anyone can spot the signs of use it's a guy like Canseco. McGwire and Sosa? We know they were on the shit, there's no mystery there. I just think the whole thing is a joke, especially when MLB is the one trying to spin and lie and cover everything up, yet Canseco is the big bad villian trying to slander our heroes. Yeah, Canseco is a scumbag, he's just doing this for a quick buck, but he's no worse than anyone else involved. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Yeah, Canseco is a scumbag, he's just doing this for a quick buck, but he's no worse than anyone else involved. Sure he is. And he's worse than many of the people he names precisely because he's doing it for a quick buck. Canseco is a miscreant, a malcontent, and someone who's obviously willing to tell tales for money. What has Rafeal Palmeiro ever done? Miguel Tejada? They haven't beaten their wives. They haven't been a distraction and a cancer for their teams. Ok, maybe they took steroids. But considering that steroids is an overblown issue to begin with, I think Canseco's dubious position in the hierarchy of sins is more important. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted February 12, 2005 One thing should be said: Pres. Bush was unbelievably spot-on when he called on baseball to clean up steroids during his SOTU speech a few years back. Nobody could figure out why he even brought it up --- but man, has that not been the biggest story for a while? And I heard a radio host ask last night --- if EVERYBODY uses steroids, is it actually cheating? -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 One thing should be said: Pres. Bush was unbelievably spot-on when he called on baseball to clean up steroids during his SOTU speech a few years back. Nobody could figure out why he even brought it up --- but man, has that not been the biggest story for a while? He brought it up in the 2004 SOTU, just a couple of months after the BALCO story broke so it was already a big story at that point. Really the Canseco book is going to amount to nothing as he can't prove all these players were on steroids and none of the players can prove they weren't. The only players we know were on steroids are those who were associated with BALCO and even then the extent of their use is unknown outside of Giambi. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted February 12, 2005 One thing should be said: Pres. Bush was unbelievably spot-on when he called on baseball to clean up steroids during his SOTU speech a few years back. Nobody could figure out why he even brought it up --- but man, has that not been the biggest story for a while? He brought it up in the 2004 SOTU, just a couple of months after the BALCO story broke so it was already a big story at that point. Thought it was 2003. I remember thinking it was the fuck out of left field. And I still don't see why they're illegal. If some musclehead wishes to shrink his testes the size of peas, more power to him. -=Mike ...And I'd kill for a roid rage baseball brawl... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Precious Roy 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2005 if EVERYBODY uses steroids, is it actually cheating? That's the thing, I don't even care if anyone has or hasn't used at this point, because between steroids and amphetamines and painkillers and everything else, it just doesn't matter, it's part of the game. It's been part of the game since way back when guys were popping pills and chewing tobacco for an added rush, the science is just more evolved these days. Personally, I'm just sick of all these guys claiming total innocence and blatantly lying to the public in the process, that to me is worse than using drugs to aid performance. If you get called on it, own up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest pinnacleofallthingsmanly Report post Posted February 12, 2005 Whether he's telling the truth or not, Jose Canseco is proving that he can't be trusted. You don't snitch on your teammates for a quick buck. That's totally dishonorable. Also, he's pointing fingers at people who he has no proof against and has basically said he's talking out of his ass. Fuck him. I don't think that steroids should be made legal and I don't think it should be part of any sport. What if someone wants to make a living playing baseball but doesn't want to be dead before he's 50? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted February 14, 2005 I like how a lot of ESPN guys are treating him as instantly credible because he's saying something they want to be true. I don't really believe anything he says. It kills what little credibility that he has when he's naming names for guys he nevered played with. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
