Brock to compete in New Japan

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Masahiro Chono said this morning at the Narita Airport that Brock Lesnar would be coming to New Japan Pro Wrestling for the 10/8 show at the Tokyo Dome. New Japan president Simon Inoki has not made the official announcement regarding Lesnar.

 

From the Observer site.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Doesn't he still have that 9-year no-compete clause with Vince that won't let him work any other promotion?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

There is that clause, but the wording of the clause and the way WWE is trying to enforce it, as well as WWE not caring about Ultimo Dragon working in Japan while under contract, mean it's not quite as unbreakable as a lot of people think.

[Guest karlitoapple]

But what about his lawsuit? How can he work for New Japan when it still hasn't been resolved?

[World's Worst Man 0]

According to puroresupower, Chono is still getting the title shot, killing the supposed "super-important foreigner challenge" to the IWGP title. At first I assumed it would be Lesnar getting the shot, and I actually thought he might even win. But I guess he isn't even getting the shot.

[Guest *KNK*]

There is that clause, but the wording of the clause and the way WWE is trying to enforce it, as well as WWE not caring about Ultimo Dragon working in Japan while under contract, mean it's not quite as unbreakable as a lot of people think.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Amazing that Brock Lesnar's future could depend on Ultimo Dragon...

 

It's true though. In a court of law, a Judge isn't going to know jack shit about how the WWE operates and even know the difference between Lesnar and Dragon.

[Bruce Blank 0]

no but the judge will know who signed a no compete clause and who didn't

 

Dragon did no such thing

 

Lesnar did

 

so it's not just that easy to dismiss it - or it would have been done by now I'll betcha

[Carnival 0]

He is coming to the tokyo dome....and he's gonna sit in the crowd.

[TheFranchise 0]

Can he F5 fans?

[Sideburnious 0]

Come on, it's Lesnar. Who Can't he F5!

[DangerousDamon 0]

Come on, it's Lesnar. Who Can't he F5!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Cheeks...

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

no but the judge will know who signed a no compete clause and who didn't

 

Dragon did no such thing

 

Lesnar did

 

so it's not just that easy to dismiss it - or it would have been done by now I'll betcha

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no but the judge will know who signed a no compete clause and who didn't

 

Even if Lesnar signed it, his legal can team can still argue that forcing Brock to be unable to earn a living in wrestling or MMA in the entire world for the next nine years is unfair and restrictive, especially when they show that Brock was willing to come back under his old contract. If they can convince the judge that Brock is willing to come back to work for WWE under his old deal, then the judge might take one look at that insane no-complete clause and tell WWE to hire him back under his old deal or let him work elsewhere because the clause, even though it's in the contract, is unenforceable.

 

Dragon did no such thing

 

Lesnar did

 

The point is that WWE had no problems with Dragon working in Japan while under contract. Dragon was under contract to WWE yet they let him work for a promotion in Japan. Lesnar's legal team could argue that if WWE allowed Dragon to work in Japan while under contract, that they should Lesnar work in Japan because he isn't under contract.

 

so it's not just that easy to dismiss it - or it would have been done by now I'll betcha

 

Do you even know how the legal system works?

[Bruce Blank 0]

Yeah I know how the legal system works - thank you for assuming I'm a tard' preciate that.

 

But what I'm saying is that Brock SIGNED to get out of the WWE, he has a legal document stating what he can and cannot do

 

Ultimo Dragon did and does not have a document that states that what he can or cannot do.

 

Now you can argue that it's too strict and ya-da-ya-da

 

but the fact is right now it stands, it's not been rejected or nullified or suspended in a court of law.

 

And last time Lesnar appeared in NJPW "as a fan" the WWE started legal actions for him breaking his "no compete" clause (Causing Brock to counter sue)

 

that issue has not been resolved either - nothing has been resolved and until it is he's bound by it.

 

But saying "Oh but Dragon was allowed to compete in Japan" doesn't make this the open and shut case some people imply

 

nor does the "it's grossly unfair to Brock" line

 

it was grossly unfair when he signed it - yet he did, cause wrestling was just so horrible and he couldn't wait to get out of it.

 

I say he made his own bed but now bitches cause he doesn't want to sleep in it. Has it coming as far as I'm concerned

 

he can always go play arena football or the CFL or become a minor B-list celebrity on TV - unless he claims that wrestling is the only think he's able to make money from

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

The law changes all the time. I wouldn't be surprised if someday down the road the legal courts declares the WWE's no compete clauses to be unfair practice.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

*snip*

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you always

 

post like

 

that?

 

Read what Meltzer wrote about the lawsuit when it first filed. Then you'll actually know what you're talking about.

 

Brock Lesnar filed suit on 2/4 in U.S. District Court in Bridgeport, CT, in an attempt to get out of his non-compete clause in his contract, which the lawsuit revealed lasts until June 30, 2010.

 

Lesnar signed the non-compete clause in April, attempting to get out of a seven-year contract with the company calling for a $1 million downside guarantee, which went into effect on July 1, 2003. The contract did give WWE several outs, including if he were injured and unable to wrestle for six months, if he was unable to wrestle for reasons due to injury (no-showing dates) he could be fired or if he was habitually late or no-showing appearances, failed a physical or even if the company finds his level of performance to be unsatisfactory. Both sides were also, by terms of that contract, could also have to agree to early termination (as happened) with a written deal signed by both parties.

 

Lesnar's actual contract provided for a one-year non-compete clause in the event of his leaving, which is where that figure came in, or when his contract expired. The only entity specified in the contract he was unable to work for would be a pro wrestling organization that promoted in the United States. His original WWE contract signed in 2000 was even more specific, only prohibiting him from working for a wrestling company owned by Ted Turner. At least two recent WWE contracts have also included UFC in the non-compete, for performers that have a strong amateur wrestling background where they would have the potential to be able to compete in that sport. However, as late as less than two years ago, Lesnar's non-compete clause did not include UFC. When Lesnar asked to get out of his contract to attempt to play in the NFL, WWE put in a clause for his release, which stated that he "shall not appear, participate and/or associate either directly or indirectly in any way throughout the world with any professional wrestling, ultimate fighting and/or sports entertainment companies, associations, joint ventures, sole proprietorships, and/or partnerships, other than the WWE," through the expiration date of the original agreements of June 30, 2010.

 

Publicly. New Japan, K-1 and Pride have expressed interest in Lesnar. There could even be question as to whether Pride or K-1 would constitute "Ultimate Fighting," as many K-1 matches, particularly if they tailored a different style of rule mixed matches like the Bob Sapp vs. Jerome LeBanner match (although Lesnar would be foolish to compete with those specific types of rules) would not qualify under that terminology. Pride and UFC are both MMA organizations, and if Lesnar were to do K-1 matches, it would likely be under MMA rules, but if you describe "Ultimate Fighting" as the caged fighting that takes place within the UFC, there is an argument this is too vague to enforce it with the major Japanese groups. Privately, UFC had also expressed some interest when they learned Lesnar was leaving WWE, although they are careful of not getting on Vince McMahon's bad side, so at this point the interest doesn't seem there. TNA has also expressed interest, although no negotiations have taken place between the two sides.

 

Once the Minnesota Vikings lost interest in Lesnar as a project in October, he began looking to get back into pro wrestling, and began calling WWE. Lesnar's attorney, David Bradley Olson, said WWE would not negotiate with Lesnar regarding a return. WWE sources have indicated that it was unlikely for Lesnar to be brought back because his demands were deemed "outrageous." Both sides concur there have been nothing to any recent rumors of his returning at any point, which this lawsuit clearly confirms.

 

The lawsuit has been inevitable since January. One source with first-hand knowledge of the situation said Olsen spoke with WWE late last year about Lesnar returning. What forced Lesnar's hand was Lesnar agreeing to appear, but not wrestle, on New Japan's 1/4 show at the Tokyo Dome. Both before and after the appearance, WWE wrote threatening legal letters claiming he was violating his non-compete clause. At the New Japan show, Lesnar and fiancée Rena "Sable" Mero were introduced as special guests, and walked to ringside with New Japan representative Brad Rheingans. They sat at ringside for one match, before going backstage. Lesnar never once entered the ring itself. The New Japan television show aired Lesnar walking to his ringside seat.

At that point, it was said Olsen told Lesnar that he had two choices. He could either not participate in pro wrestling or MMA until 2010, or litigate the non-compete clause as being too broad, unreasonable, oppressive and unfair, most notably the term length and geographical terms to be unreasonable.

 

The lawsuit noted that in 2010, Lesnar would be 33 years old, and would have lost out on his prime earning years as an athlete. When it comes to a competitive sport, such as MMA, he may be too old to start a new career, although Dan Severn was 35 and Randy Couture was 34 when they started their UFC careers. But they were also both coming directly from competing at a national level in wrestling, as Severn was a national AAU champion the year he started with UFC, not to mention the standard of competition in UFC was primitive as compared with today. Couture came in right after failing to make the 1996 Olympic team, and after a few months was already heavyweight champion. Lesnar would have been out of competition for ten years or more, and historically, people like that, even with strong college backgrounds (Yuji Nagata and Manabu Nakanishi come immediately to mind) have not fared well.

 

The lawsuits states by not being allowed to perform in his field. Lesnar is losing income at the rate of more than $1 million per year.

 

The suit claims prohibiting Lesnar from participating world wide in non-pro wrestling ventures imposes an excessive restraint on Lesnar's ability to earn a living, and is not a reasonable expectation to protect WWE's legitimate business interests.

 

The suit takes place in Connecticut, which has a broader application of non-compete clauses than many other states and has favored employers far more than in most states, like California. In most states, including Connecticut, if any part of the non-compete clause is declared unreasonable, and the inclusion of non-pro wrestling promotions, the world wide territory and most notably, the 2010 time limit, could be considered unreasonable, then the entire clause is thrown out. Lesnar's lawyer's strategy would be attacking the weaknesses of the clause, and the time frame and inclusion of MMA would be the ones likely attacked, to eliminate the entire clause. Lesnar had no choice, as his WWE contract also specified that any legal action taken in regards to the contract had to be filed in Connecticut. Still. Connecticut law also doesn't allow non-compete clauses to hold up if they are deemed as unreasonable in tenure or geographical consideration. WWE does run weekly television in Japan and will probably run 4-6 shows there in 2005, so it can reasonably consider Japan part of its territory.

 

The irony is that wrestlers with WCW all had 90 day non-compete clauses in their contracts upon expiration. WWF routinely used wrestlers leaving the company and signing WWF contracts without waiting out the non-compete clause, going under the guise that those clauses would not hold up in court.  The key difference is WCW contracts were all executed in Georgia, which is a "right-to-work" state and WCW knew full well it couldn’t enforce those clauses, which is why Chris Benoit in 2000 was able to go from being WCW champion without dropping the title and walking onto Raw a few weeks later. William Regal is just one example of someone who showed up on WWE television before his non-compete period with WCW ended, and WCW did not attempt to go to court to uphold its contract.

 

Lesnar has given up on the NFL, as the Minnesota Vikings showed no interest in him after cutting him in Training camp. No other NFL team has shown interest either and he has given up his dream of trying to play in the NFL. He expressed interest in returning to WWE months ago, but there have been no serious negotiations. If his goal is to return, and it likely is, this suit being filed is more to force WWE's hand in either bringing him back or allowing him to work elsewhere, because they aren’t going to be able to have it both ways without paying him. For many reasons, I'd expect it to be settled before it reaches a judge. WWE wouldn't want to risk an unfavorable precedent ruling when it comes to its non-complete clauses, and if there would be one, this would be the one it would come on because of the broad scope it entails. No doubt, from Lesnar's standpoint, the idea is to get him back and running for Wrestlemania, which is the biggest payday of the year, although from a timing standpoint, it looks to be tough to have it settled in time to properly promote his return on that show. They cant negotiate a deal with Vince right now, because he's refused to negotiate. This lawsuit would allow Vince to save face in the locker room, which generally speaking, doesn’t like Lesnar both for how he left and more, because of what he said about wrestling after leaving, giving McMahon the internal out that settling is the best business decision for a publicly traded company. For all the posturing, I don't believe Lesnar wants to do MMA. In his position, he would be nuts to do it if he had a real money option. MMA in Japan would bring him short-term big money, but would risk his aura and reputation and risk him pro wrestling money long-term if he wasn't successful at it.

 

WWE attorney Jerry McDevitt was quoted in the Connecticut Post as saying, "We put a ton of money and time into promoting him as a star," and noted Lesnar agreed to the lengthy non-compete when signing his release.

 

The case will be heard before U.S. District Judge Christopher Droney in Hartford. As it stands right now, the WWE has 20 days to respond to the complaint, at which time the court will assign a date for Droney to hear the case and make a ruling.

 

It is doubtful the judge would uphold the non-compete provided WWE not agree to bring Lesnar back under the terms approximating those of his contract. WWE spokesperson Gary Davis claimed WWE would likely bring Lesnar back under those terms. WWE has no obligation in any way to bring Lesnar back for a better deal than he signed for. If Lesnar's "unreasonable" demands are his old deal, I would doubt a court would find them unreasonable, being that Vince McMahon had already agreed to them in 2003. It is believed Lesnar is looking for a lighter road schedule, which makes things a little different and does bring a shade of grey to the ruling.

 

Ultimately, by precedent, WWE has shown, with Undertaker, and to a lesser extent HHH, that they will promote someone as a top guy who doesn’t work a fall house show schedule. If Lesnar is to claim chronic injuries prevent him from working a full schedule, there is a precedent for allowing a top star to work a lesser schedule. If WWE is willing to allow him to work a similar schedule as they approve Undertaker for, and in firmness, he is willing to take a slightly pro-rated lessening of downside guarantee because of working fewer dates. The lessening should be fairly minimal because the main places the company makes money off his talents, the TV show, the PPV shows and merchandising, are not affected by a lessening house show schedule. If Lesnar would not agree to it, WWE should also have the right to prevent him from working elsewhere for the term of the contract. But if WWE refuses to use him under the terms of his current contract I would be very surprised if the court would rule he couldn't attempt to earn the best living possible for himself anywhere he chooses.

 

And Simon Inoki has said that he has been told by Lesnar's lawyers that Lesnar can wrestle for New Japan.

[Fökai 0]

And Simon Inoki has said that he has been told by Lesnar's lawyers that Lesnar can wrestle for New Japan.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The lawyers are (paraphrasing) "taking care of it", and should be able to let Lesnar wrestle. Well, I guess that we'll have to wait for the results of that hearing that's coming up in a few days.

[Bruce Blank 0]

Does it matter

 

How I post?

 

Why do you

 

Even care??

 

And the count is now “2 for assuming I’m a retard” just because my opinion differs from yours

 

Nice one *thumbs up*

 

Now I’ve RE-read your Observer material, just to be up on every little comma – since that seems to be your way of dismissing me.

 

And what do I read?

 

His original contract and his subsequent WWE contract had a standard no compete clause – in his case 1 year though.

 

Which is fine and El Dandy

 

But

 

That’s not the contract in question – so to be fair what the previous contracts said or did not say isn’t really the issue. The issue is what the clause he agreed to said – you know the one he agreed to because he was so sick and tired of wrestling that he’d walk away from a million dollar guarantee.

 

They can argue that it’s unreasonable to restrict him from Japan – except they are shown on TV there and run events so it’s likely geographical reasons would be dismissed as a reason to void the contract, it says that right there in the piece!!

 

Then it goes on about the differences between Georgia and Connecticut legislature – which really only explains why Benoit & Regal could do what they did and not really much about Brock’s chances of getting out of it.

 

It doesn’t say much about them attacking the length of the no compete clause – which I found surprising, I’d have thought it’d be their first avenue of attack.

 

But instead it seems to focus on the somewhat weak definition of “ultimate fighting” and hope to void it through that – even though Lesnar probably doesn’t want to go the MMA route anyway but is looking for a cushy deal with NJPW.

 

See I read, I comprehend

 

Does any of that go against what I’ve said?

 

First I said – since Lesnar signed a no compete clause and Dragon did not, it’s not really the same situation and cannot be used as an argument to dismiss the clause (You implied I’m a retard but nothing posted here indicates that I’m wrong – Ultimo Dragon was not mentioned in the legal mumbo’anda’jumbo at all as a point for Lesnar’s side)

 

Then I said that the clause currently stands – it’s not been nullified or voided or whatever

 

Again – that’s true isn’t it?

 

I stated that the WWE were in a snit over him appearing at a NJPW event – your source material supports that as well.

 

The only point I made that you could be sorta, kinda refuting is me saying that “it was grossly unfair when he signed the clause” – but even that’s a swing and a miss as the source material yaks on about the definition of “Ultimate Fighting” and what not as it’s main point.

 

Yes it stated that in Connetticut a clause COULD be dismissed if deemed unfair – but then spent more time talking about definitions of “Ultimate Fighting” - which is legal loopholery, not proving “unfairness” IMO

 

- So please in the future refrain from implying retardation on my part when you’ve twice been up at bat and twice struck out horrendously.

 

The way I see it – he was dumb enough to sign the deal, he should pay his “stupid fine”

 

Which you may or may not agree with, that’s the beauty of opinions isn’t it?

[Carnival 0]

I agree the deal is unfair and I think it shouldn't be legal. But Lesnar signed it...so unless they can get it overturned due to "unfairness" he is screwed. I don't know how they can let him wrestle in Japan? Unless WWE is agreeing or they found some loop-hole in the wording of the clause. Which I agree is too broad, just about anything can fall under the "sport entertainment" category.

 

The Ultimo Dragon example is poor one, first because he didn't sign a long term no compete clause. And because nobody knows the details of his contract. Maybe when he signed with WWE in the first place, he agreed to work for WWE exclusively in the states but was allowed to work in Japan still.

[Gary Floyd 0]

Come on, it's Lesnar. Who Can't he F5!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

King Ghidorah

[Dangerous A 0]

Today, from the world of Meltzer...

 

 

--The tease today in Japan is a three-way for the IWGP title with Kazuyuki Fujita (who is saying he will wrestle on the show) vs. Brock Lesnar vs. Masahiro Chono. Lesnar is not legally cleared and this is not an officially announced match

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Today, from the world of Meltzer...

 

 

--The tease today in Japan is a three-way for the IWGP title with Kazuyuki Fujita (who is saying he will wrestle on the show) vs. Brock Lesnar vs. Masahiro Chono. Lesnar is not legally cleared and this is not an officially announced match

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Ignore feature is great.

 

Anyway, I think debuting Lesnar in such a match, if he is able to wrestle for New Japan, is a bad idea. He needs to debut against Nakamura, Nakamura to give him a good fight, but Lesnar to wind up overpowering Nakamura and laying him to waste with the F5.

[Twisted Intestine 0]

Hey Lesnar, I hear Wal-Mart's hiring.

 

I don't understand how he can use the argument that he can't make a living due to the contract. Just because he was once a celebrity, he can't now go to being an average person?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

I don't understand how he can use the argument that he can't make a living due to the contract. Just because he was once a celebrity, he can't now go to being an average person?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't understand how he can use the argument that he can't make a living due to the contract.

 

Because Lesnar makes his living in professional wrestling, and the contract means he can't make his living in his chosen profession anywhere in the world for the next nine years.

 

Just because he was once a celebrity, he can't now go to being an average person?

 

See above.

[The Buzz 0]

I think this is just a bit rediculous for WWE to ask for someone to sign, and a bit dumb of Lesnar to sign in the the first place. Although for some people I guess money talks.

 

Besides what would WWE lose from Lesnar going to NJPW. I know many wrestling fans that watch the WWE only, and when I have tried to show them Indys or Puro they are constantly impressed and at the same time don't know anyone on the shows and are usually surprised when they see old faces on the shows....my point is? No one that watches the WWE would even know he was in New Japan besides the percentage that reads the net or suscribes to newsletters.

 

Then again common sense and the legal system have never been on good terms.

 

Edit: Furthermore was there any proof that Lesnar was a draw?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Furthermore was there any proof that Lesnar was a draw?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, but a lot of people don't want to accept it.

[The Buzz 0]

So then that's why WWE has Brock by the balls.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

So then that's why WWE has Brock by the balls.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Not really.

 

In most states, including Connecticut, if any part of the non-compete clause is declared unreasonable, and the inclusion of non-pro wrestling promotions, the world wide territory and most notably, the 2010 time limit, could be considered unreasonable, then the entire clause is thrown out. Lesnar's lawyer's strategy would be attacking the weaknesses of the clause, and the time frame and inclusion of MMA would be the ones likely attacked, to eliminate the entire clause. Lesnar had no choice, as his WWE contract also specified that any legal action taken in regards to the contract had to be filed in Connecticut. Still. Connecticut law also doesn't allow non-compete clauses to hold up if they are deemed as unreasonable in tenure or geographical consideration. WWE does run weekly television in Japan and will probably run 4-6 shows there in 2005, so it can reasonably consider Japan part of its territory.

 

Brock is the underdog here, but people shouldn't be so quick to assume he has no chance of winning.

[The Buzz 0]

I hope he does win as I think he's one of the better big men that WWE have produced in the last 20 years.

[Austin3164life 0]

Brock is one of the most gifted athletes I've ever seen in any promotion. Anyone who can F-5 and superplex the Big Show, all the while working the mat smoothly with someone like Eddie or Kurt is a phenom. He has unlimited potential and if he does win the lawsuit and ends up in Japan, I think he can make it huge there.

 

Though Brock in NOAH >> everything else.

[Bruce Blank 0]

The Ignore feature is great.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

HA! now that's funny stuff

 

So someone mentioned a hearing - anyone know the date of this hearing? be interesting to see what (if anything) happens

 

Poor Brock - can only make money in wrestling

 

sure can't make it in the NFL