Xbox 360

[Invictus 0]

Invictus: I see you have EDF2017. I've been meaning to play it, but the price is steep for a "budget" release.

 

However, the concept and stuff intrigues me.

 

Plus this quote has piqued my interest:

 

Originally Posted by 1upshow's Kathleen Sanders

 

... but I've been playing Earth Defense Force. Just past level 10 it starts not sucking. And I was thinking that and I was thinking about Crackdown... Crackdown 2. And about how great it'd be if as an agent ... I could destroy giant bugs and jitter monsters (?). And how if you took Earth Defense Force ... and you took Crackdown ... and made them have sex ... and made them have a game baby ... and the baby would be like Jesus.

 

 

It's a hard game to describe. If you have a hankering for some arcadey, low-budget but fun B-movie style gameplay, give it a try. I would personally only recommend a rental on it, as that's what I did, because after level 30 the game becomes incredibly repetitive and starts rehashing levels to extend the game time, and I'd say the replayability factor, for me at least, was low after 51 levels. The dialogue the soldiers you fight with say is almost worth the rental price alone, though.

 

*When facing a horde of hundreds of giant ants coming towards you*

EDF Soldier: "All I need is one shot."

 

*After clearing out a level of every last enemy, the EDF General comes on the radio*

General: "Abort the mission, it's too dangerous!"

[Broward83 0]

Heh..not surprisingly, there are problems downloading the Halo3 beta...

 

Customers are reporting problems downloading the Halo 3 Multiplayer Beta via Crackdown. The Xbox team is well aware of this issue and working diligently to resolve it. Please check back for more information as it becomes available.

[AndrewTS 0]

Does anyone else have serious, serious doubts that digital distribution is teh furture for major releases?

[AlexPuma 0]

Invictus: I see you have EDF2017. I've been meaning to play it, but the price is steep for a "budget" release.

 

However, the concept and stuff intrigues me.

 

Plus this quote has piqued my interest:

 

Originally Posted by 1upshow's Kathleen Sanders

 

... but I've been playing Earth Defense Force. Just past level 10 it starts not sucking. And I was thinking that and I was thinking about Crackdown... Crackdown 2. And about how great it'd be if as an agent ... I could destroy giant bugs and jitter monsters (?). And how if you took Earth Defense Force ... and you took Crackdown ... and made them have sex ... and made them have a game baby ... and the baby would be like Jesus.

 

Hmm... that combination sounds an awful like Body Harvest, one of my favorite games of all time.

[MrRant 0]

Does anyone else have serious, serious doubts that digital distribution is teh furture for major releases?

 

No, the issue will come though with authentication such as with XBOX Live Arcade titles. If you buy one, and say your XBOX needs to be repaired and you send it in, you can download the game with no charge but you are unable to play it offline. You have to be connected to Live. Supposedly MS is exploring a fix for this.

[World's Worst Man 0]

I've seen Vice City on it, and it sucks; washed out colors, framerate issues, and a ridiculous overall blurriness that makes playing it quite unpleasant.

 

Are you sure it wasn't just the game's fault? I know Vice City on PS2 had that awful blur effect, and I'm not sure if you could turn it off. GTA3 for PC had a similar effect, but there was an option to turn it off thankfully.

[AndrewTS 0]

A minor inconvenience I'd like to see MS correct in a future dashboard update: you can only eject the tray with the controller if it is empty, otherwise you have to manually press the button the system.

 

Does anyone else have serious, serious doubts that digital distribution is teh furture for major releases?

 

No, the issue will come though with authentication such as with XBOX Live Arcade titles. If you buy one, and say your XBOX needs to be repaired and you send it in, you can download the game with no charge but you are unable to play it offline. You have to be connected to Live. Supposedly MS is exploring a fix for this.

 

I meant more because of firmwares, jury-rigged console OSes, expansion downloads and glitchy installers. But that was at the back of my mind, too.

 

DRM--the gigantic cockblock of the digital age.

 

Are you sure it wasn't just the game's fault? I know Vice City on PS2 had that awful blur effect, and I'm not sure if you could turn it off. GTA3 for PC had a similar effect, but there was an option to turn it off thankfully.

 

I never played Vice City on PS2, so I dunno. I know PS2 GTA3 and San Andreas didn't look like that, though.

 

Are you saying it was a R* design decision to make the game look like you were playing it through a thick cloud of pot smoke?

[DrVenkman PhD 0]

When it rains in Vice City AND you're driving really fast at night through a mission, you're just as well off to fail the mission on purpose and try again, though I'm pretty sure you turn some effects off.

[World's Worst Man 0]

Yes, assuming the blur effect is what you're seeing. I guess they thought it cinematically enchanced~! the game.

[AndrewTS 0]

Hmm... that combination sounds an awful like Body Harvest, one of my favorite games of all time.

 

So it comes full circle! Body Harvest was made by a lot of the GTA3 staff. Who of course went on to make the other 3D GTAs. Then one of the main guys behind those left, and, fed up with all of the excesses of the GTAs, made Crackdown.

 

I'm pretty much sold on Crackdown 2 no matter what weird stuff they add, as long as the juicy core goodness remains.

 

Just include all the cool bonus modes in the DLC, but on the disc and bugtest everything a little better.

 

Yes, assuming the blur effect is what you're seeing. I guess they thought it cinematically enchanced~! the game.

 

Bah, it's really annoying. Especially considering the game is "Point A ---- Point B ---- Cutscene ---- Point C ---- Cutscene" so far.

[MrRant 0]

A minor inconvenience I'd like to see MS correct in a future dashboard update: you can only eject the tray with the controller if it is empty, otherwise you have to manually press the button the system.

 

Does anyone else have serious, serious doubts that digital distribution is teh furture for major releases?

 

No, the issue will come though with authentication such as with XBOX Live Arcade titles. If you buy one, and say your XBOX needs to be repaired and you send it in, you can download the game with no charge but you are unable to play it offline. You have to be connected to Live. Supposedly MS is exploring a fix for this.

 

I meant more because of firmwares, jury-rigged console OSes, expansion downloads and glitchy installers. But that was at the back of my mind, too.

 

DRM--the gigantic cockblock of the digital age.

 

 

Well, MS's patch updater/install works just fine. Most expansion downloads work fine as well as the Live Arcade, Marketplace and other downloads. There can always be an unforseen glitch even if you buy a PC game down and download a patch. Look what happened with the Shivering Isles expansion for both the PC and 360! If you've ever been much of a PC gamer (like myself), then you are well aware of what patches can do to boink something up.

 

It is particularly worse with a PC because a patch can break anything from saves, to your specifc computer configuration and it is frustruating to all hell. With a console you have a limited set of components and configurations to deal so there is less room for error much like Apple has with the Mac when a patch comes through.

[AndrewTS 0]

It is particularly worse with a PC because a patch can break anything from saves, to your specifc computer configuration and it is frustruating to all hell. With a console you have a limited set of components and configurations to deal so there is less room for error much like Apple has with the Mac when a patch comes through.

 

True, but on the Mac, when an OS X update screws things up, it's Archive and Install, DiskWarrior, or Erase and Install (and hopefully you backed up anything important).

 

On a 360, yeah you might lose those saves (although you can buy a memory card to back *just* the saves up), but you also might get Red Ringed, and have to *mail in your 360 to Microsoft*. There's no re-install/restore disc for it.

 

Although, it seems you're saying pretty much "Stuff breaks. Get used to it." I think that something, somewhere is fundamentally flawed in MS' system that allows this to happen. Something like a power outage or hard-booting a computer off while an OS update is in progress? Or never ever using the Disk Utility? Well, no duh. However, MS refuses to publish any preventative measures to perhaps help people avoid this. They also never tell you what the title updates are for. You can either accept it or refuse it, that's it.

[Matt Young 0]

So, I won a copy of Crackdown via the Wired energy drink contest. They are giving away 61 copies throughout the end of the year.

[In Credible 0]

Tell me how to also do this!

[MrRant 0]

It is particularly worse with a PC because a patch can break anything from saves, to your specifc computer configuration and it is frustruating to all hell. With a console you have a limited set of components and configurations to deal so there is less room for error much like Apple has with the Mac when a patch comes through.

 

True, but on the Mac, when an OS X update screws things up, it's Archive and Install, DiskWarrior, or Erase and Install (and hopefully you backed up anything important).

 

On a 360, yeah you might lose those saves (although you can buy a memory card to back *just* the saves up), but you also might get Red Ringed, and have to *mail in your 360 to Microsoft*. There's no re-install/restore disc for it.

 

Although, it seems you're saying pretty much "Stuff breaks. Get used to it." I think that something, somewhere is fundamentally flawed in MS' system that allows this to happen. Something like a power outage or hard-booting a computer off while an OS update is in progress? Or never ever using the Disk Utility? Well, no duh. However, MS refuses to publish any preventative measures to perhaps help people avoid this. They also never tell you what the title updates are for. You can either accept it or refuse it, that's it.

 

Well, you can usually find the information via publisher websites as that is normally where it is coming from. The 3 rings of death? Most of those don't appear to come from a software update for a game and you are right, there doesn't appear to be a way to just wipe the drive to a "out of the box" state if that is what it would take to fix it. From what I've seen the 3Rs have shown up from various things such as launching an HDDVD and it just borks or after 2 years of good playing. I also personally know people who have had to get 3 coffins from MS to send back various 360s, but unfortunately we don't know if it's a software related or hardware related issue since they get refurbs back. The only software updates that will have the most potential to screw up your system is going to be something like the Spring Update but I have not heard of any 3Rs relating to that.

 

If it's hardware, then even the most perfect software update process would not help and it does indeed suck that you have to be out your system for 2 weeks between shipping the coffin to them and receiving it back. MS does offer a good warranty program I will give them that. I bought my 360 in Nov 2006 and got the 2 year extended warranty for $50 right before they extended the original to a year so instead of it ending in Nov 2008, my 360 is covered till Nov 2009.

 

You also have to remember that in general you will see more posts of issues with a game/console on certain message boards rather than ones stating that nothing has borked their system. How many people here have had to get a coffin from MS? I haven't heard of any. On another site I frequent with approximately 50 or so active 360 players, I know of 5. I'm sure if you go to GameFAQs or even the XBOX forums you will see more posts due to people searching out a solution to their problem.

 

I will agree though that it is odd that you see more 360/PS3 post about having to send it back to their respective companies compared to the Wii.

 

As a final note, I will say that the online distribution of patches, firmware upgrades, expansions and such is better for gamers overall providing that there is good QA.

[AndrewTS 0]

"I also personally know people who have had to get 3 coffins from MS to send back various 360s, but unfortunately we don't know if it's a software related or hardware related issue since they get refurbs back."

 

Currently MS has stated that, if at all possible, they'll try to send you your original 360 back.

 

Lots of Red Ringers have reported they have and they were. That points to lots of SW issues to me. Or more accurately, firmware.

 

"The only software updates that will have the most potential to screw up your system is going to be something like the Spring Update but I have not heard of any 3Rs relating to that."

 

The Guitar Hero patch has bricked systems. Somebody on the Crackdown official forums has reported that the DLC RedRinged his system, not just erased his save.

 

"How many people here have had to get a coffin from MS? I haven't heard of any."

 

Anya's on her 3rd 360. Matt Young I think has had to send his in. I'm fairly sure there were others.

 

I'd like to note that there is a known bug in the Wii Zelda: TP that will prevent you from leaving the cannon room if you save there. Nintendo took care of it by sending out new discs to the folks who reported it. A backasswards, stone-age way of handling it? Maybe. However, I guarantee you that they not only had their issue resolved 100%, but that the new discs didn't **** their Wiis up.

[Matt Young 0]

Tell me how to also do this!

 

I just happened to see the contest advertised on one of my cans. I don't believe you need to purchase anything. Just go to http://www.wiredcrackdown.com to enter.

 

Also, I just heard that Halo 3 is being released on September 25th. Awesome. I figured we'd have to wait til November.

[MrRant 0]

Currently MS has stated that, if at all possible, they'll try to send you your original 360 back.

 

That points to lots of SW issues to me. Or more accurately, firmware.

 

That could be debated easily. It could be something that is hardware related that isn't easy enough to fix and then ship back. I'm aware that they try to send the original back, I'm just saying what the people I know have gotten.

 

The Guitar Hero patch has bricked systems. Somebody on the Crackdown official forums has reported that the DLC RedRinged his system, not just erased his save.

 

Ok, that's one person for Crackdown and from Guitar Hero I remember it being very few (in the grand scheme of things). I never debated that the title updates can brick a system, however the most likely causes are usually system related updates. The patch for the HD DVD drive probably gave someone out there a 3R too.

 

Anya's on her 3rd 360. Matt Young I think has had to send his in. I'm fairly sure there were others.

 

Again, that's 2 people out of how many that we know? I'm not arguing the issues but like we have determined together, we don't know if they are software related. Did they just stop responding? Did they download an update to a game and then it took a shit?

 

I think you are losing the point of my assertion that while the software updates have caused issues, they have been few and usually aren't widespread like say a WOW patch borking people that you are forced to download and causes problems for various people everytime. It may not bring the computer to it's knees since you can still do other things but until an updated patch comes out, those people are unable to run the game.

 

Unfortunately we are arguing something we have no real knowledge of because like you said, MS doesn't say what exactly causing the 3Rs but from what I generally see, the title/system updates cause very few in relation to the install base and generally enhance the gamers experience. Would you deny that?

[World's Worst Man 0]

The Red Ring (Rico) problem with the XBox 360 is apparently linked to a flaw in the heatsink. Or at least, that's what supposedly causes the majority of those problems. It's also something that was apparently fixed by MS in later versions of the console. I say nothing concrete because this is what I've read at various hacking/modding sites, and people have said they've had success fixing the heatsink issue themselves. I really don't know anything other than it's brutal for people who aren't covered by warranty.

[Matt Young 0]

I never had to send my 360 in. It has always worked fine. I have only had problems connecting to Live since switching ISPs.

[AndrewTS 0]

Ok, must have been somebody else then. Anya's first one just crapped out--no updates done. Her replacement 360 was DOA.

 

"Ok, that's one person for Crackdown and from Guitar Hero I remember it being very few (in the grand scheme of things). I never debated that the title updates can brick a system, however the most likely causes are usually system related updates. The patch for the HD DVD drive probably gave someone out there a 3R too.

....

I think you are losing the point of my assertion that while the software updates have caused issues, they have been few and usually aren't widespread like say a WOW patch borking people that you are forced to download and causes problems for various people everytime. It may not bring the computer to it's knees since you can still do other things but until an updated patch comes out, those people are unable to run the game.

 

Unfortunately we are arguing something we have no real knowledge of because like you said, MS doesn't say what exactly causing the 3Rs but from what I generally see, the title/system updates cause very few in relation to the install base and generally enhance the gamers experience. Would you deny that?"

 

I'm a console gamer that has gotten used to the fact that, by and large, console games will *work right every time*, so I'm a bit grumpy about the way things are being done this gen.

 

I don't have concrete numbers, naturally. That doesn't mean there's no problems. It's not even how many people for a particular update have a problem (and for the Crackdown save erasing--it was a *lot*, but that doesn't affect the system's functionality). It's just that these "software updates", "title updates," "downloadable content" etc. *themselves* are very, very frequently produced and released. And nearly every single one of them has the potential to cause problems (and tends to do just that).

 

However, MS doesn't seem to actually care. They don't seem to be investigating why. They don't provide steps/tips for preventing the problems. They don't specify what an update does or what it can affect. It seems like every time an exciting new update! comes out for the 360 / a game, you're risking your game data and/or your system to get it. And that sucks.

[AndrewTS 0]

EDIT: NM

[World's Worst Man 0]

Heh, my XBox 360 decided to start freezing anytime I closed an open message in the XBL dashboard. Fun times.

 

Might have been because XBL was buggered for a while, I don't know. I say that because marketplace wasn't loading either, but it just loaded now.

 

Oh nevermind, it's probably slow and shitty because of the fucking Halo 3 beta.

[AndrewTS 0]

I was having dashboard issues too, WWM. I had to keep re-pairing my wireless pad to the system as well.

 

**** a Halo 3 Beta.

[MrRant 0]

I'm a console gamer that has gotten used to the fact that, by and large, console games will *work right every time*, so I'm a bit grumpy about the way things are being done this gen.

 

Work right every time? There have always been a number of bugs in games that were released. Some major, some minor. Being able to download a patch helps solve those issues.

 

I don't have concrete numbers, naturally. That doesn't mean there's no problems. It's not even how many people for a particular update have a problem (and for the Crackdown save erasing--it was a *lot*, but that doesn't affect the system's functionality). It's just that these "software updates", "title updates," "downloadable content" etc. *themselves* are very, very frequently produced and released. And nearly every single one of them has the potential to cause problems (and tends to do just that).

 

Well, your version of *a lot* may be different than mine. Most updates DO NOT cause problems. And by problems I mean ones that are affecting a good number of the people who downloaded the update. Take the Rainbow 6 update. No one started getting hosed up. GOW? I don't recall anyone having an issue. COD3? There was a minor issue with a map pack that was fixed the next day and it was taken off of Live VERY quickly but only was an issue when you loaded those maps. Oblivion? Just the bug within Shattered Isles that was an expansion pack which Bethseda still hasn't fixed (that I know of). I haven't heard anything happening with the Lost Planet, GRAW 2 updates. Have you? Besides scattered reports. The Guitar Hero update did brick/affect some people but again, most people were fine. So, where is the "tend"? The Halo issue isn't really anything that is bricking people or anything of that nature, they just didn't unlock it right. Not a big deal.

 

However, MS doesn't seem to actually care. They don't seem to be investigating why. They don't provide steps/tips for preventing the problems. They don't specify what an update does or what it can affect. It seems like every time an exciting new update! comes out for the 360 / a game, you're risking your game data and/or your system to get it. And that sucks.

 

Everytime you download an update for your computer OS you are risking having to reinstall your OS. And if you aren't backing up your system before every update, you're up a creek. How is MS supposed to provide a step/tip for something that the game producer has supposedly QAed, they have QAed and has worked but then screws up 1 out of every 10,000 boxes for example? They do investigate it and usually remove the download and replace it with a correct one or update a patch that may have caused unwanted bugs to happen in the game. Microsoft is not the one doing the updates, the publishers are and to think that they don't get on bad updates is asinine. If they brick your system under warranty then it costs them money. You have an option to not download the update and wait a week or so to see what shakes out. No company on earth would guarantee their software will not cause something to "potentially" happen. Look at the EULAs for software that you download now. Most of them say they have no responsibility if installing their chat program decides to hose your computer.

 

Shit happens and luckily it doesn't happen to many when you look at the amount of installed base vs. issues.

[MrRant 0]

Halo is up for download.

[AndrewTS 0]

Work right every time? There have always been a number of bugs in games that were released. Some major, some minor. Being able to download a patch helps solve those issues.

 

Which is why I said "by and large." With optical disc games that have no DLC/expansions, the most that can go wrong is a game breaking glitch that might make you have to restart your game or get a new disc. i.e. the Zelda example I cited earlier, or PoP: Warrior Within's problem with warps.

 

However, when the cure is worse than the disease (the Guitar Hero whammy bar patch), it causes you to lose faith in the system and the publisher. It doesn't matter if it's "rare" or "it affected a small number of users." What if you should happen the win the "Your 360 is ****ed" Lottery? Oh well, sucks for you.

 

Everytime you download an update for your computer OS you are risking having to reinstall your OS. And if you aren't backing up your system before every update, you're up a creek. How is MS supposed to provide a step/tip for something that the game producer has supposedly QAed, they have QAed and has worked but then screws up 1 out of every 10,000 boxes for example?

 

I can backup and restore my computer OS myself. With my install discs. I *can't* with my 360.

 

However, what if something like that would happen if I were out of warranty? MS warrants the hardware, not the software, so they should provide a method of recovery to avoid this crap. They don't. I'd really like to know just how the hell it actually works, though. I assume since the Core has no HDD that the OS is built into a separate area of the memory, as naturally the firmware would be. Maybe, as it stands, such a disc isn't possible. So find a way, MS.

 

"Shit breaks" isn't a justification. It's a lame excuse. Unless the hardware itself breaks, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to restore a 360 to working condition if it's just borked SW. I'd have to back up my saves on my own--that's my responsibility. But in a worst case scenario, I should be able to A) wipe my 360 clean, then clean-install the software and update it. B) use purchased XBLA / DLC that's linked to my gamertag/MSN passport, if by some chance my HDD became corrupted. C) Restore my saves to my console D) Have it in 100% working condition again.

 

That's not the way it works, now. I don't care why, just fix it, MS. If I can do it with my computer, I should be able to do it with a 360. Software updates are being put out that, should they screw your system up, the problems cannot by remedied by a user-accessible restore method. That's retarded.

 

Shit happens and luckily it doesn't happen to many when you look at the amount of installed base vs. issues.

 

Hi, Mr. Moore!

[MrRant 0]

Well, the purchased content and achievements are tied to your gamertag so you are already covered there.

[World's Worst Man 0]

Patching is a security blanket for game developers. They know they can get their buggy/unstable software out early, without causing a huge problem as long as they patch in a timely manner. Console devs never had that luxury until recently. The only problem is the people who don't have internet connections for their consoles, which I would imagine is a much, much larger percentage than those who don't have an internet connection on their PC.

[AndrewTS 0]

Patching is a security blanket for game developers. They know they can get their buggy/unstable software out early, without causing a huge problem as long as they patch in a timely manner. Console devs never had that luxury until recently. The only problem is the people who don't have internet connections for their consoles, which I would imagine is a much, much larger percentage than those who don't have an internet connection on their PC.

 

 

Mark your calendars--I agree with WWM.