Vader's jump from WCW to the WWF

[JN News 0]

What was the story on Vader jumping ship to the WWF in the mid-90's? He was in the middle of a face turn in this angle with Hogan & The Dungeon of Doom. But, then he was soon gone from WCW and then he jumped over to the WWF in 1996. What really happened there?

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

He got into a backstage fight with Paul Orndorff, where he not only got his ass handed to him, but lost his job as well. He took the next few months off, worked Japan a little and then signed with the WWF.

[EdwardKnoxII 0]

And Orndorff had only one good arm at the time.

[JN News 0]

And Orndorff had only one good arm at the time.

 

 

 

I guess Orndorff was obviously needing that neck surgey for quite some time, and thus, the incident with him & The Horsemen happened, and that was it. But, getting back to the main story, I'm surprised that Bischoff fired Vader just for getting into a fight with someone.

[EdwardKnoxII 0]

And Orndorff had only one good arm at the time.

 

 

 

I guess Orndorff was obviously needing that neck surgey for quite some time, and thus, the incident with him & The Horsemen happened, and that was it. But, getting back to the main story, I'm surprised that Bischoff fired Vader just for getting into a fight with someone.

 

It's also been said that Vader being an asshole/hard to work with for quite some time so that when some wrestlers saw Orndorff beating up Vader they just watched it.

 

Edit. http://www.armpitwrestling.com/Backstage%20Fights.htm

 

Paul Orndorff vs. Big Van Vader

Vader cornered Paul in an office backstage at a WCW show and picked this fight, which he soundly lost. Paul knocked him right down and kicked him in the face repeatedly. Vader had showed up late for the Center Stage tapings and Orndorff started yelling at him to hurry up and do his promos. There had been previous heat between the two. Both got face to face and Orndorff begged Vader, who outweighed him by 200 pounds, to start something. Vader shoved him down with a palm blow and Orndorff came back fighting, flooring Vader and knocking him for a loop with a punch from his bad left arm. Orndorff proceeded to kick at Vader?s face with his sandals until all the wrestlers broke it up. Amazingly, everyone just left Vader on the floor in a fetal position and went back to doing their thing. If you didn’t think Paul was tough before this, you knew after this one. Also, as a sidenote, Vader has said in his shoot video that he declined to strike Orndorff back in fear of losing his job. Orndorff later said on Wrestling Observer Live that he attacked Vade from behind. (thanks to Asa Taylor, Tom Hogan, "Jesus Christ" and an unknown website where this info came from). WINNER: Orndorff. Does this guy ever lose a fight?

[EdwardKnoxII 0]

And here's another one about it.

 

http://www.bigvancrush.com/fights.htm

 

VADER VS. PAUL ORNDORFF

Background: The most famous of the Vader backstage fights, and the fight which ultimately led to Vader's release from WCW. Here I will look at Vader and Orndorff's version of the story, plus comments by Terry Taylor and "Bullet" Bob Armstrong (two of WCW's road agents) and Dave Meltzer in the following Wrestling Observer Newsletter.

The Fight: Vader, at the time injured, was called at his hotel room by Bischoff to do some photo's at Center Stage. "Leon, get your ass up, get over, and wait to photograph you at 2 o'clock. If you're not there, I'm gonna fine you." Vader went to the photo shoot, thus arriving late at Center Stage. Orndorff had no knowledge of the photo shoot, likewise, Vader had no knowledge of doing any promos.

At Center Stage, Meng asked "Where you been? You're never late." Vader replied, "Eric told me to do the photo shoot." Paul Orndorff burst in, wanting Vader for interviews with Gene Okerlund, showing no interest in why Vader was late, "Where the hell you been, you're late." Vader pointed out that Orndorff wasn't his boss. Orndorff lost his temper at Vader, "Goddamn you, you fat ass." Vader fired back, "Hey Paul, go fuck yourself, if you're gonna treat me like this, get out of the room." Terry Taylor walked in and he and Vader talked through the situation, "Leon, why are you late? They wanna go for lunch, and you'll have to do some promos." "Terry, Eric told me I had to do some photo's." "Look, do that, Let's go do it." Vader took his shirt off, put his mask back on, and went to do the promos.

In the hallway, Paul flung at Vader again. Orndorff and Vader, with their faces two inches apart, continued yelling, with Orndorff telling Vader to make his move, "Go ahead, take your best shot, 'cos I'm gonna kick your fat ass." Vader (complete with separated chest and torn rotator cuff from the Hogan match) then went onto knock Orndorff down with a solitary palm blow to Orndorff's chest/neck area. Vader went to check on Paul (whose head hit the floor), "Paul, are you alright?" Orndorff shoved Vader's hand away. Vader never followed up on the blow, instead going against the wall, looking at Sting, with both hands behind his back. Orndorff got up, and hit Vader three times, after missing the fourth; Vader hooked Orndorff in a front face lock before Hogan's clique broke it up. Orndorff finally knocked Vader down with a left, before continuing with several kicks to the face.

A little while later, in the executive's room (Bischoff wasn't there, but Tony Schiavone was among the guys that were), Vader and Orndorff came to blows again with Vader having both eyes puffed up and a bloody lip, Orndorff; a black eye and bloody lip. "Paul, I'll tell you what, I've not thrown a punch yet, you've hit me three times," Vader growled, "Let's go outside and finish it Paul, now I wanna fight." Orndorff at first resisted, but then went outside the building to fight. Vader began hitting Orndorff several times, before Meng (who was out to buy a hot dog) grabbed Vader and pulled the two apart. After being separated for the final time, Bischoff came down and Vader was sent home, Orndorff (with black eye clearly visible) worked the taping to defeat jobber, Barry Houston.

Vader: Vader considered Eric his boss, and Orndorff a 'gopher' or assistant assistant.' If Orndorff had given Vader the opportunity to tell him why he was late, he'd have told him. Vader said he was "mad as hell" and Orndorff was "way out-of-line." "If I'd have meant to hurt the man, he'd never have got up."

"I take full responsibility for putting my hands on Paul," an apologetic Vader said, "In today's society; you cannot put your hands on somebody. That's probably my mistake; maybe I could've shoved him, or let him hit me first." It was this incident (and the Hogan-Flair politics) that led to his leaving WCW and a four-and-a-half-year contract. Initially, Bischoff offered Vader a six month suspension and $250,000 fine, Vader told Eric to 'stick it.'

Paul Orndorff: Orndorff's version of events is predictably one-sided, "I was doing my job, one thing led to another, we had words. It was like David and Goliath. I hurt my foot, I kicked him so many times in the head, it hurt my foot. I had flip-flops on. He had to do an interview. Three or four other guys, Dave Penzer and Kevin Sullivan asked him to do an interview, because we had fifteen minutes to do the interview, and if we didn't, we wouldn't be able to do it for a week. I just said, "Leon, could you please do this interview, it'll take you five minutes and you're done." He just said some bad words, and it got to the point where I was shooting right back at him, and I said "I'll go and talk to Eric Bischoff," and as I walked out, he came out, and one thing led to another, and he sucker punched me. He made a bad mistake, I got up."

Terry Taylor: Taylor describes the events as Vader agreeing to the interview; "I was close to Vader and Paul Orndorff when they had their brawl. After a match, Vader was asked to do an interview and he said "Sure, just wait until I've changed". Around this time, Paul Orndorff, the guy Paxil was invented for, started talking shit to Vader. Paul walked away, Vader slow-burned, and Vader ended up getting into Paul's face shortly thereafter. Vader hit Paul first and it turned into a brawl from there, which was broken up once Orndorff miraculously got Vader onto the ground."

"Bullet" Bob Armstrong: Armstrong reveals himself as the guy who ordered Orndorff to fetch Vader, "I sent Paul Orndorff down there to get him, tell him to come on, we had to do interviews, we had to get him over. And they got into the darndest fight you ever saw." Armstrong was there first hand when Orndorff knocked Vader down and laid into him with kicks, "And Paul just beat his big fat... I mean he beat him til he was bleeding... it was a mess... we were always separating these guys."

Dave Meltzer: Meltzer told that there was prior heat between the two (Vader claims that "Orndorff and I always considered us friends"). Meltzer also reported that Orndorff came out of the fight something of 'a John Wayne type hero' in the front office. Vader was reported as the villain, and Orndorff, the hero, although Meltzer recognized that both wrestlers needed to be reprimanded. "A supervisor shouldn't be telling a guy to make your move, particularly with other wrestlers watching thus the macho image would be hurt if either backed down. It invited rather than diffused a situation where either or both could have been seriously injured."

Real Winner: Hulk Hogan (for keeping his number one spot), Ric Flair (for keeping his Hulk Hogan job-boy spot), and Lex Luger (for his new $400,000 contract, paid for with Vader's wages)

[Dobbs 3K 0]

I remember the start of Vader's face turn being really bizarre. Something about Kevin Sullivan trying to recruit Vader to the Dungeon of Doom, offering him special powers and Vader being insulted by it, or something to that affect.

[Guest NYankees]

It's Time, It's Time, It's Jobber TIME!

[Jericholic82 0]

I remember the start of Vader's face turn being really bizarre. Something about Kevin Sullivan trying to recruit Vader to the Dungeon of Doom, offering him special powers and Vader being insulted by it, or something to that affect.

I thought it was mostly cuz Flair had cost vader the title match at BATB 95? this lead to arn and flair vs vader handicap match at the august 95 clash that Vader won. Then Hogan picked Vader for his Wargames team (later replaced b y Luger)

[Hasbeen1 0]

Orndorff was legit tough, but Vader could have put him down permanently if he'd wanted.

[FroGG_NeaL 0]

I've read several times from several people backstage at the time that said Vader wouldn't really fight back, because he didn't want to hurt Orndorff.

[death_by_burrito 0]

Ordorff seems like a tough dude, but I doubt that if Vader really went after him, he wouldn't have been able to fuck him up for good.

[Black Lushus 0]

did Orndorff have the thin arm at the time?

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

I loved how Bischoff explained Vader's firing.

 

During the "War Games" '95 hype video, in which Vader was to have teamed with Hogan, Sting, & Savage against The Dungeon of Doom, they showed a still frame graphic of Vader, which over top of it in gigantic letters said:

 

"A.W.O.L."

 

And then, later on when Luger was brought into the team during a promo, Hogan's all "So that Vader dude has gone A.W.O.L.!"

[DrVenkman PhD 0]

I recall a Nitro in 1996 where either Tony or Eric had to remind fans on commentary that Vader and Johnny B. Badd no longer are "where the big boys play" - I guess there had been an erroneous advertisement for a noverseas tour or something.

[World's Worst Man 0]

Vader clearly wasn't a big boy.

[Jericholic82 0]

I recall a Nitro in 1996 where either Tony or Eric had to remind fans on commentary that Vader and Johnny B. Badd no longer are "where the big boys play" - I guess there had been an erroneous advertisement for a noverseas tour or something.

yea and at uncensored 96 during DDP-Booty Man Tony reminded us that it was supposed to be Johhny B Badd

in the match instead of BM, but Johnny decided he didnt want to be where the big boys play anymore

[Dobbs 3K 0]

Yeah. It was pretty soon after that they started airing those "Where the Big Boys Play" commercials that would show current WCW guys beating guys who had jumped to WWF and ECW.