Parents fight over gang ties...

[Firestarter 0]

Whatever. A deviant.

[Guest Vitamin X]

Just to be clear on some things that have come up here (and I actually got a reported post about this, although I'm not sure if it was serious or not), as acceptable as it may seem to a great majority of TSMers to make fun of Annie's gender identity issue, it'd be just as personally offensive if someone here were to start personally judging Marney for being a lesbian, or any other "unique" character trait that anyone here has. It has no place in the discussion, and I won't tolerate that any more that I'll tolerate blatant and off-topic homophobia, racism, and other assorted forms of bigotry. I don't care if you're (rightfully) assaulting her for her opinions on licensing child birth, but there's been entirely way too much focus on something that's not only irrelevant to the topic but personally degrading as well.

 

I'm giving Marney a warning since she seems to have an issue distinguishing between aggressively debating and blatant trolling for a response, even though I understand it seems like the message-board equivalent to a slap on the wrist. Although it'll serve her and the other posters here well to know that that kind of behavior, even in the Current Events folder (and I'm letting all the "you ignorant twit"s and likewise cute "snarky" lines go) is not conducive to discussion and won't be tolerated.

 

That is all. Now back to your regularly scheduled pointless CE thread.

[Guest Danny Dubya v 2.0]

Nor are they accurate - Jamie Lee Curtis was born with (and presumably still has) a Y chromosome, although born female. No offense taken, just lettin' you know.

Evidence of this "fact"? All I've found so far is an unsubstantiated rumor.

[AnnieEclectic 0]

So you use a wired article to tell someone their argument that includes free will doesn't hold up but then use a Hollywood urban legend to support yours.

 

Not really a strong argument, eh?

 

 

*sigh*

 

http://www.snopes.com/movies/actors/jamie.asp

 

 

Jamie Lee Curtis was born with a Y chromosome - she's even stated such in interviews. Was she born with both male and female sex organs? No.

 

Does she have a Y chromosome? Yes.

 

Is she a woman? From where I sit - yes.

 

 

 

I'll get to Marney's replies as soon as I read them because after the above post I had to re-check myself. I've been known to be wrong about stuff... OH MAN have I been wrong before. Not this one though, thankfully as that would have been a rather large egg on my face.

 

 

EDIT: WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA.

 

Marney's a lesbian?

 

(stealth ultra edit: rereading this made it sound way angry when in fact I'm trying not to laugh so hard this class realizes I'm looking at something odd. Just clarifying, don't want anyone thinking I'm pissed when I'm not)

 

I'm getting fucking static about being Transsexual from A LESBIAN?

 

No replies needed anymore. Hate to say it 'sister' but we're in the same god damn problematic pool according to society.

 

 

 

 

However - gotta say one thing though. I don't oppose my own politics, I just realize they'd never gain traction and I'd lose any election. Society doesn't like my beliefs. And now that I know you better, they don't like yours either. At least I'm self aware enough to realize as such. Wow.

 

A lesbian giving a tranny grief. Wow. Can we revoke your GLBT member's card now? I mean, when we're in our secret meetings coming up with "The Agenda" it's all well in good for us all to backstab each other. But c'mon, rule 28 - don't punch a girl in the face in public. I know a small group of lesbians out there that flat out discriminate against bisexuals and trans-folk as they aren't "Real Womyn". Do you feel that way too?

[Guest Danny Dubya v 2.0]

I'd like to state for the record that as a friend of someone who is going through transgender dysphoria, I am on your side and only pressing this because it's been bugging me all morning.

 

LATE EDIT : I meant "on your side" as far as the current subject's concerned, not the rest of the thread. Now that I've actually read the first 2 or so pages, all I've got to say is, I'm more than happy for your decision to forego being a parent. You're crazy.

 

Does she have a Y chromosome? Yes.

That's what I'm specifically asking for evidence of. Not whether or not she's "really male", whatever that means to you. I admit that my reading comprehension fails hard and I'm probably wasting both of our time, but nowhere in your reference, or my other one, does it say that this person was born with an extra chromosome as you say. The closest thing to evidence was this :

 

The only document that has ever been offered as "proof" was a 1996 op-ed piece in the Baltimore Sun written by William O. Beeman, associate professor of anthropology at Brown University, entitled "What Are You: Male, Merm, Herm, Ferm or Female?" The relevant passage reads as follows:

 

"As a result, there are perhaps millions of XX males and XY females living in the United States today. These are cultural males with male genitalia who are genetically female, and cultural females with female genitalia who are genetically male. The film star Jamie Lee Curtis is one well-known individual who is genetically male, but phenotypically female."

 

And there we have it in black and white, it would seem, except for two tiny caveats. First, according to Professor Beeman the pertinent sentence was deleted from the published article. Second, the reason it was deleted was that Beeman's attempts to track down the plastic surgeons to whom intermediate sources had attributed the statement were "totally unsuccessful." In other words, Professor Beeman had simply repeated an item of scurrilous gossip.

[AnnieEclectic 0]

It's amazing how we go off topic so quick (I'm sure I'm not helping...)

 

When I get home I'll try to find the interview of her I saw where she clears it up. Now, let me put this next part down since it's kind of important -

 

I am now not fully sure how true my previous statement about Ms. Curtis is, save for interviews and the snopes article

 

However for clarity - I am of the position that I think she was born with a Y chromosome (I seem to remember her saying she actually has XXY, not just XY, but again, my memory sucks) but that she was born fully female (aka no 'corrective surgery' or anything) and remained as such. This is how I remember it being described in said interview.

 

Hopefully I can find it, because otherwise I'm hallucinating. And since I'm not into hallucinogens, obviously someone's spiking my pepsi max. Work will be more fun though.

 

 

edit: btw - "Rejected" and all of Don Hertzfeldt's work are awesome. I used to have the bleeding cloud as my desktop

[Vyce 0]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, Annie's a trap?

 

Now I'm interested.

 

Pics, or it didn't happen.

[AnnieEclectic 0]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, Annie's a trap?

 

Now I'm interested.

 

Pics, or it didn't happen.

 

Yay, I'm not the only /d/tard here!

 

 

 

[Vyce 0]

Shhhh......keep that under your hat.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

EDIT: WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA.

 

Marney's a lesbian?

 

(stealth ultra edit: rereading this made it sound way angry when in fact I'm trying not to laugh so hard this class realizes I'm looking at something odd. Just clarifying, don't want anyone thinking I'm pissed when I'm not)

 

I'm getting fucking static about being Transsexual from A LESBIAN?

 

No replies needed anymore. Hate to say it 'sister' but we're in the same god damn problematic pool according to society.

No, you aren't.

 

As a liberal gay man with a socialist bent it is typically a cold day in hell when I support Marney (and I don't think I actually am as she sees homosexual women as somehow less deviant than homosexual men,) but this is one of those times. I don't know where the whole co-opting of the movement and 'GLBT' thing came from. I've known lifestyle crossdressers and people who were wish they were of another gender, and while I do not have the moral authority to think that is right or wrong (so do not think I am judging you), there is no connection between your desires to be a woman and my desires to suck on a cock.

 

I realize that society and "the community" (as fuckwittedly retarded as it is) does this all the time, but I have no idea why. I have no idea why your issues are on my issues' bandwagon, but the brain chemistry going on behind the scenes is very different and I don't consider them to be the same issue at all.

[Vyce 0]

"Many colors in the homo rainbow....."

[teke184 0]

"Many colors in the homo rainbow....."

"... don't be afraid to let your colors shiiiiiiine...."

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Well, if Marney comes back I do believe it has officially reached the level of a fag fight.

[EricMM 0]

Woooooow.

 

I just don't think Marney has a LGBT card.

 

Considering she's an apparent subscriber of the theory that:

 

Girl/guy kissing: fine

Girl/girl kissing: hawt

Guy/guy kissing: abomination

 

I wouldn't go looking for much support for the LGBT.

[NYU 0]

Seeing as how I've gotten yet another PM complaint about this thread...

 

This has gotten far, far off-topic from the original "Parents Fight Over Gang Ties" topic and seeing as it has now shifted to a conversation about Annie being a transsexual, Marney being a lesbian, and Jamie Lee Curtis's chromosomes -- and let's be honest, considering how enticing the first two are as topics, it's going to be damn near impossible to change this back into the original subject -- I'm moving it to The Chocolate Socket. Argue till your heart's content.

[The Thread Killer 0]

Seeing as how I've gotten yet another PM complaint about this thread...

 

This has gotten far, far off-topic from the original "Parents Fight Over Gang Ties" topic and seeing as it has now shifted to a conversation about Annie being a transsexual, Marney being a lesbian, and Jamie Lee Curtis's chromosomes -- and let's be honest, considering how enticing the first two are as topics, it's going to be damn near impossible to change this back into the original subject -- I'm moving it to The Chocolate Socket. Argue till your heart's content.

With all due respect, this is the problem with the Current Events folder here, and the reason that a lot people would rather post in the CE folder at The Pit. Why do people need to go running to the mods with complaints every time their damn feelings get hurt by something they read on the internet? At least 2 of the 4 pages of this thread contain actual discussions/arguing, but that's not okay with some people because words that they don't like were used...so better report it!

 

I'm not even accusing anybody in particular, I'm just saying that being so ridiculously thin-skinned that you need to whine like a little girl every time somebody says something you don't agree with is beyond lame. If you don't agree with it, then make a compelling argument against it. If you get flamed, flame them back, and do it better. Having to look at every thread and second guess every word you're going to write because you don't want to offend anybody, or because you're worried about getting "warned" or banned? That's just stupid.

 

On top of that, it's pretty easy to tell who the rookie mods/admins are, coming in here and waving their e-dicks around for everybody to see and be real impressed with. "I got a complaint, so I'm issuing a WARNING!" "I got a complaint, so I'm MOVING this thread!" "Let this be your FINAL WARNING or I shall use the full extent of my mod powers to show you how powerful I really am! Tremble in fear at my awesome powers, puny mortals!"

 

You can say what you want about The Pit, but at least there, you can SAY WHAT YOU WANT ABOUT THE PIT. In all the time I've been there, we've banned all of about 4 people, and that was for blatant trolling...not for hurting people's feelings. I heard that some of the mods or posters here wanted to see more activity or discussion in the TSM CE folder, so I ventured back to check it out...but what the hell is the point if people are going to spaz over every little thing? Grow some thick skin...honestly...words really can't hurt you.

[Thoth 0]

I don't see the point in trying to bag on trans issues.

 

As far as I'm concerned, if there is confusion to gender identity based on a transition, the gender should default to whatever gender is being transitioned into.

 

I haven't spoken to Annie in a long time regarding the status of her transition, but I know she is probably knocking a good 10 years off her life if she completes it.

 

/d/ sucks.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

I endorse everything the Thread Killer said except this:

 

If you get flamed, flame them back, and do it better.

 

Let's not have contests to see who can come up with the best way to call someone a doo doo head. It usually just leads to posters sounding like British comic book villains and calling each other oh-so-creative names like "twit", "mongoloid", "cretin" and the like. I don't want to ban people for being a dumbass like this, but I would like to see it frowned upon by the general posting community, not encouraged.

[This Thread Is Ghey 0]

<-------------------------------------------

[Twisted Intestine 0]

Seeing as how I've gotten yet another PM complaint about this thread...

 

This has gotten far, far off-topic from the original "Parents Fight Over Gang Ties" topic and seeing as it has now shifted to a conversation about Annie being a transsexual, Marney being a lesbian, and Jamie Lee Curtis's chromosomes -- and let's be honest, considering how enticing the first two are as topics, it's going to be damn near impossible to change this back into the original subject -- I'm moving it to The Chocolate Socket. Argue till your heart's content.

With all due respect, this is the problem with the Current Events folder here, and the reason that a lot people would rather post in the CE folder at The Pit. Why do people need to go running to the mods with complaints every time their damn feelings get hurt by something they read on the internet? At least 2 of the 4 pages of this thread contain actual discussions/arguing, but that's not okay with some people because words that they don't like were used...so better report it!

 

I'm not even accusing anybody in particular, I'm just saying that being so ridiculously thin-skinned that you need to whine like a little girl every time somebody says something you don't agree with is beyond lame. If you don't agree with it, then make a compelling argument against it. If you get flamed, flame them back, and do it better. Having to look at every thread and second guess every word you're going to write because you don't want to offend anybody, or because you're worried about getting "warned" or banned? That's just stupid.

 

On top of that, it's pretty easy to tell who the rookie mods/admins are, coming in here and waving their e-dicks around for everybody to see and be real impressed with. "I got a complaint, so I'm issuing a WARNING!" "I got a complaint, so I'm MOVING this thread!" "Let this be your FINAL WARNING or I shall use the full extent of my mod powers to show you how powerful I really am! Tremble in fear at my awesome powers, puny mortals!"

 

You can say what you want about The Pit, but at least there, you can SAY WHAT YOU WANT ABOUT THE PIT. In all the time I've been there, we've banned all of about 4 people, and that was for blatant trolling...not for hurting people's feelings. I heard that some of the mods or posters here wanted to see more activity or discussion in the TSM CE folder, so I ventured back to check it out...but what the hell is the point if people are going to spaz over every little thing? Grow some thick skin...honestly...words really can't hurt you.

 

I was one of the people who reported Marney's post. I don't think I went "crying to the mods" though, I just hit the report button and wrote "I'm offended" in a half joking manner, because she was giving Annie Grief for being a tranny and last I checked throwing personal insults at people is only acceptable in The shit socket. Argue your points all you want, you think it's wrong to be transexual? Go ahead and argue that... but when you take shots at somebody for what they are it's different.

 

I didn't care that much, I just felt in the mood to repot something at the time, and well, I don't have any plants in my apartment. If we want an "anything goes" mentality all across the board, where you can take shots and flame, thats fine let's change the rules... But I don't see why it's needed in any current events arguements.

 

Besides all that, I got a message back from two of the mods telling me not to use the report feature for things like that. So it's not like they encourage people to be thin-skinned pussies.

[BUTT 0]

I am proud to be one of four people ever banned at the Pit.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

Now it's in the CS... Fuck you Marney you nasty dyke bitch.

[Copper Feel 0]

I think I was banned due to inactivity, having only ever made one post. It was regarding my desire to read In Cold Blood, something that I never quite got around to doing.

[The Niggardly King 0]

what a shame...

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I was one of the people who reported Marney's post. I don't think I went "crying to the mods" though, I just hit the report button and wrote "I'm offended" in a half joking manner, because she was giving Annie Grief for being a tranny and last I checked throwing personal insults at people is only acceptable in The shit socket. Argue your points all you want, you think it's wrong to be transexual? Go ahead and argue that... but when you take shots at somebody for what they are it's different.

 

I didn't care that much, I just felt in the mood to repot something at the time, and well, I don't have any plants in my apartment. If we want an "anything goes" mentality all across the board, where you can take shots and flame, thats fine let's change the rules... But I don't see why it's needed in any current events arguements.

Would you not say AE's post about Marney's lesbianism was more of the same?

 

People can take care of themselves, there's no need to get butthurt over a personal argument between other people except to suggest that they take it to PM if that seems the appropriate avenue for it.

[FroGG_NeaL 0]

Parents fighting over which gang their kid will claim isn't any stupider then the hundreds of other stupid shit that parents put their kids through.

 

Every generation gets worse then the last, because each generation has more control of their lives at a younger age.

 

 

I'm just tryin to ride this bitch til the wheels fall off. Fuck it.

[Copper Feel 0]

You're insinuating that Morrissey's a homosexual, aren't you?

[The Niggardly King 0]

Not at all

[Guest Vitamin X]

I'm not even accusing anybody in particular, I'm just saying that being so ridiculously thin-skinned that you need to whine like a little girl every time somebody says something you don't agree with is beyond lame. If you don't agree with it, then make a compelling argument against it. If you get flamed, flame them back, and do it better. Having to look at every thread and second guess every word you're going to write because you don't want to offend anybody, or because you're worried about getting "warned" or banned? That's just stupid.

 

On top of that, it's pretty easy to tell who the rookie mods/admins are, coming in here and waving their e-dicks around for everybody to see and be real impressed with. "I got a complaint, so I'm issuing a WARNING!" "I got a complaint, so I'm MOVING this thread!" "Let this be your FINAL WARNING or I shall use the full extent of my mod powers to show you how powerful I really am! Tremble in fear at my awesome powers, puny mortals!"

 

You can say what you want about The Pit, but at least there, you can SAY WHAT YOU WANT ABOUT THE PIT. In all the time I've been there, we've banned all of about 4 people, and that was for blatant trolling...not for hurting people's feelings. I heard that some of the mods or posters here wanted to see more activity or discussion in the TSM CE folder, so I ventured back to check it out...but what the hell is the point if people are going to spaz over every little thing? Grow some thick skin...honestly...words really can't hurt you.

 

You know, if you like the Pit's CE Folder so much better.. then go ahead and post there. No one here is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to post at the TSM CE folder. I'm not standing around here waving my so-called e-prick around to impress anyone, I'm only doing my job as a moderator to, you know, MODERATE discussion. And the only reason I issued a warning instead of anything more severe was because a. I was establishing a guideline or, if you will, re-stating the rules that weren't being followed and was taken advantage of, and b. I am not making any severe penalties unless I talk it over with the rest of the moderating team, as they would/should do the same thing as I would.

 

Considering that a considerable amount of leeway was given for most of the posts made there as in many of the other folders at TSM, there's no need to second guess whatever you're going to post, unless you're just being an asshole who is trying to drive the topic off-course and/or make ignorant, bigoted statements that are considerably (and not even just a little, but considerably) homophobic, racist, or otherwise prejudiced and made to be a judgment of someone's character and not their argument. If you're talking about GROWING UP AND GETTING A PAIR OF BALLS, for fuck's sake, all we ask is that you argue things like an adult and set aside the immature name-calling and teasing bullshit. Thank you.

 

Now it's in the CS... Fuck you Marney you nasty dyke bitch.

Fuck, even this guy knows the rules.

[AnnieEclectic 0]

No, you aren't.

 

As a liberal gay man with a socialist bent it is typically a cold day in hell when I support Marney (and I don't think I actually am as she sees homosexual women as somehow less deviant than homosexual men,) but this is one of those times. I don't know where the whole co-opting of the movement and 'GLBT' thing came from. I've known lifestyle crossdressers and people who were wish they were of another gender, and while I do not have the moral authority to think that is right or wrong (so do not think I am judging you), there is no connection between your desires to be a woman and my desires to suck on a cock.

 

I realize that society and "the community" (as fuckwittedly retarded as it is) does this all the time, but I have no idea why. I have no idea why your issues are on my issues' bandwagon, but the brain chemistry going on behind the scenes is very different and I don't consider them to be the same issue at all.

 

You know what, I totally agree with you - and while I similarly don't have the moral authority to judge you either - they're totally separate issues. I can't tell you how we got lumped together either, but the brain chemistry is nowhere similar. It's sexuality (on your hand) and physical gender (on mine).

 

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're supporting Marney's side either. It is, however, a good point that deserves stressing, so thanks.

 

... I'll catch up to the rest later and edit in.

 

 

 

edit: aaaand we're in the CS now. why are people bitching about that? Admittedly Marney and I made posts that pretty much threw this one right off track so it should be here. Maybe it's 'cause I used to be a mod at a different board, but I don't see the problem.

 

thanks for the backup, Thoth. We should talk sometime - especially when I get a 360. I've finally caved on my hatred of halo