justcoz
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I think the whole point of having him on Raw was because the character was the baby of Brian Gerwitz. There is nothing wrong with the gimmick but it's time has passed and the only reason to not drop it is because he's still moderately over and produces merchandise sells. I just don't see the point in having a comic book super hero gimmick when he spends his time mostly doing jobs and he's never been booked into a feud with an "evil arch nemesis". Creative "didn't have anything" for Raven, Kanyon aka Mortis or more recently Nova (which would have been perfect and ten times better than Simon Dean) when they could have all been used as a villain to Hurricane. Hell, bring back Doink. Just do something. Hurricane hasn't had one fun or meaningful program barring the skits with The Rock. I see a good talent that could be groomed for a main event position minus the gimmick. Helms is a hip hop freak supposedly, that could transcend into a feud with Cena and possibly getting good matches from Cena. I don't hate the gimmick, it's just the fact that if creative isn't going to do anything with it, just let the talent move on.
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This was way too good to be a work, created by WWE creative as it was done masterfully until Hardy's first attack on Edge. Once it went from real-life/net gossip to the hands of WWE creative, the interesting aspects of it have gradually decreased, despite the legit back story. They simply couldn't follow it up. There was no way creative could have done things this good, only to drop the ball so badly within the past three weeks. That's the only reason that I doubt it was a work. I remember thinking that after the first attack on Edge. How masterfully it was played out, with that attack coming on the day his WWE contract expired. I was thinking... 'wow, maybe creative isn't as bad as we thought'. Perhaps they just worked the net! Then it became obvious that they couldn't follow that up with anything substantial so we had the two week repeat attacks and then the disappointment that was tonight. Now, that's WWE creative!
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I can't believe how badly they killed Matt Hardy's return to RAWL tonight. Any edge that his character had, that Pillman-like energy, was killed tonight. Some of it was his bad delivery. Some just due to a dead crowd. But for the most part it was just the wrong type of promo. It was important for Hardy to be anti-establishment, even after being hired and they had the perfect opportunity for him to cut a great promo on Vince McMahon. "Thank you Mr. McMahon for bringing me back to RAWL. Your writers have scripted out a promo for me to explain to everyone what I've gone through in recent months. Granted, I had to explain to them exactly what a wrestling promo was. However, since you were kind enough to give me a live mic, I'd like to handle this without the assistance of creative services, thank you. Adam Copeland - Edge - you are a piece of (beep). Amy Dumas - Lita - you are a skank and a whore. Vince McMahon, you've only brought me back for the opportunity to make a dollar off of my misery. You proved when you fired me that you do not care about my well being regardless of the sacrifices that I've put my body through for your company and for WWE fans. If it wasn't for the fans... those who were too "smart" and realized what a crock of (beep) it was to fire me and push my ex girlfriend and ex best friend in a top storyline, their chants in support of Matt Hardy in arenas across the country, you wouldn't have brought me back. I'd be wrestling for Ring of Honor or in TNA - did you ever hear of them? - rather than standing across the ring from Edge at Summerslam. But thank you for that opportunity. And you won't be disappointed. Since you like cutting your payroll, firing just married couples and pregnant women to clear up roster spots and lessen the payroll, you'll be happy to know that you won't have to pay one cent that you contractually owe Adam Copeland - for his contract and life will effectively end... at Summerslam... And tell Johnny Ace and your "writers" to stay clear of me because this is the Matt Hardy Movement and anyone in my face telling me what to do will just piss me off." Was that so difficult? You don't tell your television audience that kane and lita were just a TV storyline but you let them know that Matt Hardy was really wronged in some way by Edge, Lita and Vince McMahon. Let them research the specifics on their own. Hardy maintains his credibility with the net fans and the smarts plus tips his hat to the indies.
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What would be the best creative team possible?
justcoz replied to Downhome's topic in The WWE Folder
What does the fact that Triple H will run the company someday have to do with coming up with the best creative team possible? I hate to break it to you, but he will never stop putting himself in the star role as long as he's wrestling. If he had a good wrestling mind, he would know how to keep his own character interesting. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The fact that he will one day run the company is EXACTLY the reason why he needs to be on the creative team and learning the creative process. That is the only reason why Stephanie still has her job in creative. And I think it's blatantly obvious right now that Stephanie is not the member of the McMahon family to creatively take over for Vince some day. Shane isn't interested from most reports so this leaves only HHH unless you want to wait 21 years for Shane's son. I've made it fairly clear that I'm including him on creative as the end of his active wrestling career, or at least limited wrestling, although I'm sure he'll have a Mr. McMahon type on camera role. Okay, so he's not part of your best creative team. Well then.... that solves it! He will have absolutely no say in the direction of the creative process, including his character. He won't be sitting in on creative meetings and neither he, Steph, Vince or Linda McMahon will want his character pushed. He won't touch a title or a main event. Just like now, you know, since he's not currently on the creative team!!!!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Few points here..... 1) Just because he is going to likely be a sigificant part of the operations in the future doesnt by default mean he should be on the creative team. By that same token, all of the McMahon family then should be a part of it also. As the guy before you said, the fact that he holds stroke in the company does not mean he should be on creative. It makes no sense. 2) Do you honestly think that if it was Stephanie out and HHH in a creative team process, the result would be different? They're one of the same. 3) Regardless of his future stature within the company, the fact of the matter is he's always held a bias toward certain guys and how do you think that will change with him just being out of an active spot on the roster? This is similar to Vince having a hard-on for big men - he has his biases, and clearly so does HHH. Neither Vince or HHH being creatively involved is, when it comes down to it, really good for business if they hold those biases above what the general public want, etc. 4) Do you know HHH basically IS in all of the creative meetings anyway and has been for some time now? I wasnt sure if you were being sarcastic with the last comment that he's currently not on the creative team meetings, because rest assured, taking time off or not, your bet your ass he probably is in some way, shape, or form. As long as Stephanie is a part of them, so is he inversily as, natually, he probably knows everything about what is going on THROUGH her. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, I know that HHH currently sits in on creative meetings and that entire last paragraph was sarcasm. And no the entire McMahon family doesn't sit in on creative but look at your options for the future. Stephanie has had about six years on creative and hasn't generated one big money or ratings producing angle. She's again best served learning Linda's role. Shane has no interest in creative. Vince is aging, very much out of touch and someone has to fill his spot and it's a given that they'd want someone from the family. We can sit here and name fantasy creative teams but the bottom line, whether that list includes HHH's name or not (and I'm the only one including him I believe) is that he will have direct involvement with whatever creative team there is. It's a given due to his position with the company. So you can sit here and act like I'm out of my mind for including him on my creative team list, not to mention other members of the Clique, but he's already on the creative team as it is and as long as he's married to a McMahon, he always will have at least a filtering role in the process. The difference maker is because of his knowledge of the wrestling business and it's history, because of his fascination with the "art", that he's more qualified to oversee or be a legitimate part of a creative team than Stephanie. This is the point I've been trying to make all along. It would be wiser to have someone that looks at the business as Flair vs. Funk or Steamboat, the Horsemen and Harley Race as opposed to Steve Austin beer baths and Sexual Chocalate Mark Henry. You can have Barry Blaustein on creative, and I'd actually very much like to see that, but HHH is going to have a role. Right now, the primary focus of that role is his own agenda. His own main event positioning. For all we know, he can have A LOT to contribute to character development and the undercard, if there was a change in focus from his own agenda to that of the company of itself. And at some point this will come to be. He can't wrestle forever and his role in the family guarantees the likelihood of him being an important part of the creative process in the future. -
What would be the best creative team possible?
justcoz replied to Downhome's topic in The WWE Folder
What does the fact that Triple H will run the company someday have to do with coming up with the best creative team possible? I hate to break it to you, but he will never stop putting himself in the star role as long as he's wrestling. If he had a good wrestling mind, he would know how to keep his own character interesting. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The fact that he will one day run the company is EXACTLY the reason why he needs to be on the creative team and learning the creative process. That is the only reason why Stephanie still has her job in creative. And I think it's blatantly obvious right now that Stephanie is not the member of the McMahon family to creatively take over for Vince some day. Shane isn't interested from most reports so this leaves only HHH unless you want to wait 21 years for Shane's son. I've made it fairly clear that I'm including him on creative as the end of his active wrestling career, or at least limited wrestling, although I'm sure he'll have a Mr. McMahon type on camera role. Okay, so he's not part of your best creative team. Well then.... that solves it! He will have absolutely no say in the direction of the creative process, including his character. He won't be sitting in on creative meetings and neither he, Steph, Vince or Linda McMahon will want his character pushed. He won't touch a title or a main event. Just like now, you know, since he's not currently on the creative team!!!!! -
What would be the best creative team possible?
justcoz replied to Downhome's topic in The WWE Folder
I think he would work just fine in the creative structure when he stops seeing himself as a performer and worrying about his own agenda or main event positioning. You may think that is unlikely to happen but I think it will happen once he realizes that due to his positioning he will likely spend the remainder of his life as one of the leaders of this company, inheriting part of the operations with his wife. Now, I don't know what type of business man HHH is. I don't know what his credentials are like with office work. I do however know from what I've read that he lives and breathes the business. He watches tape after tape and seeks out more tapes. So I'm assuming, with all of the wrestling he's consumed, that he's learned a thing or two on the booking/creative aspect and this would be his niche with the company as years go on. And I think, for the most part, HHH's programs, specifically with Batista and Orton, were successful because he knows what he's doing - not Brian Gerwitz, Michael Hayes or Stephanie McMahon - he knew how to get heel heat and he knew how to make those two guys look better than they actually were. Batista looked like the next Hogan or Goldberg when programmed opposite HHH. Now he looks like a metrosexual Warlord. Let's put it this way, when it comes to the McMahon family, I'd rather see HHH in a creative capacity as opposed to Stephanie McMahon, who I think they should be grooming for Linda's current role. Don't get me wrong, I'd question Nash's involvement in the creative team as well but I'd still like to see what he's capable of. Especially working with HHH and Vince McMahon. Specifically Vince because Kevin Nash didn't exactly have Vince McMahon when he was booking WCW. I think there is a potential for him in a booking/creative role that hasn't been tapped yet. As far as the "guys want to be them/girls want to fuck them" analogy that he shared in the Torch Talks, if you look beneath the surface of the apparent absurdity of the statement to a smart fan, there is truth to what he's saying. Rey Mysterio has a coolness factor - to adults, children, men and women. Chris Benoit is cool to smart fans and the casual fan that likes there wrestlers to be gritty, that's all. Chris Benoit will be over to an extent for being Chris Benoit and having the matches that he does but he will never be over in the same way that an Austin, Rock or even Mysterio is. There won't be a mass demand for Chris Benoit merchandise. He's just a good wrestler and there is a spot for him on the card, a spot for him and wrestlers like him to entertain, a world title reign out of respect but does that draw money? That's all Nash was saying. I don't necessarily like the fact that Nash is obsessed with big guys in top spots but I think even he realizes that cruisers and that style were part of the reason for Nitro's success and Shawn Michaels was a little guy that had the "it" factor. I missed the part with his proposed Wrestlemania finish but if his line of thinking was that Batista wasn't ready and needed more time to work with HHH to get to the next level, I'm okay with it. Wrestlemania, the show itself, with HBK/Angle, Hogan, Cena winning the title, etc. wouldn't have been any less with one world title DQ finish. I agree with you in regards to Foley/Heyman working together and I'd also add Court Bauer to that list. Dreamer is there only because he works closely with Heyman and I don't think you can fully judge him on being hurridly rushed into a creative substitute role in OVW. The Bischoff/Cornette combo is intriguing but I think Cornette in any main creative capacity in WWE is entirely unlikely. Not only due to recent events but also the fact that he doesn't like to fly and prefers travelling by car. I believe Bischoff has a creative mind that Vince could definitely use, despite his past faults in WCW in regards to losing guys like Austin, Jericho, Benoit, Eddie. I think he was just a victim of arrogance and success at that point but the fact that Jericho, Benoit, Eddie, the luchas, etc. had spots in the top U.S. company, tells me that he had a good vision of what he wanted his product to be. -
What would be the best creative team possible?
justcoz replied to Downhome's topic in The WWE Folder
That was me and I hate to break this news to you but this company is going to be HHH's at some point within the next ten to fifteen years, barring a Stephanie break-up scandal, which I think HHH is wise enough to avoid. He has a good wrestling mind and I'd be interested in seeing what he could do creatively when he isn't worried about putting himself over in the star role. I'd like to see him, with his admiration and respect for old school booking, work creatively with other talent, beyond his own storylines and feuds. I think you may see some good stuff. I can understand your criticism of Kevin Nash based on his WCW tenure but if you read any Kevin Nash interview, especially the recent Torch Talks, this man has a pretty damn good mind and understanding of the business. He's friend with HHH, HHH would be doing old school style booking and Nash would be injecting a coolness factor with the characters, humor, semi-shoots, etc. I think it would work and it would be a nice rival to a Heyman led team. I understand that Chris Kreski wasn't a fan of wrestling but he is thus far, in about five or six years, the only outside writer that had any level of success. I would look at him as an exception to that idea. And by paying attention to details like he did with the flow charts and boards - he was learning elements of the business and how it worked. These other writers, even Gerwitz and Lagana, who have been there for years, don't follow this method which is why we see such terrible loopholes in stories. This should be something that a "wrestling guy" the likes of Heyman or Cornette needs to show these guys. Nobody is arguing that a good writer can't produce a good wrestling product but wrestling isn't Deadwood or The Shield and they obviously don't seek out that caliber of writer for the company. It's also questionable as to whether that caliber of a writer would want involved with WWE. Also booking wrestling is a thing of it's own, it doesn't have the same pacing as any other weekly series. So even if there was good storytelling and character development there still has to be an understanding of traditional wrestling booking. Unless you just completely change the structure of the business. As long as it's building this feud, leading into this match, moving onto this feud, leading into this match, there has to be a wrestling guy involved IMO. -
What would be the best creative team possible?
justcoz replied to Downhome's topic in The WWE Folder
I do think there needs to be a few "Hollywood/TV" writers on staff but they must have some knowledge of the business. I'd have them work closely with someone like Jim Cornette, Paul Heyman or even HHH and watch videos of legendary angles/storylines from the past. They can almost cover any territory with their tape collection. I think tv writers are fine, especially if they are fans of the business, but they need to be educated as to the pacing of storylines, what has drawn money in the past, how to play off of someone's strengths, hide their weakness, etc. There has to be a wrestling mind leading them and this is what's lacking right now. Smackdown: Paul Heyman, Court Bauer, Vince Russo, Tommy Dreamer, Mick Foley Hollywood/TV writer Raw: HHH, Kevin Nash, Eric Bischoff, Jim Cornette, Ric Flair and Hollywood/TV writer Put an end to scripted promos. Just have creative outline points that they must address. I think they have some good agents right now and although they are part of creative, I'm not including them here. The guys that I listed are scripting the weekly shows and booking the next few months of business. The Smackdown team is of interest. Russo may be the odd man out in this scenario but really... is he? He loved the shoot elements, just as Heyman did and much of Attitude was lifted from ECW, whether either of the Vince's acknowledge watching or paying attention to ECW at the time. The Raw team is even more intriguing as you would think Kevin Nash, Cornette, Bischoff and Flair just wouldn't mix. HHH is the common thread here however. Nash is his buddy. Flair is his idol. Cornette is old school. Bischoff and Nash had to work closely together with the NWO. Cornette should really just be assigned to the development territory since he doesn't like to fly, etc. They need his input and old school philosophies though. -
Update on Hassan (Insider Spoilers, Info)
justcoz replied to Stephen Joseph's topic in The WWE Folder
I'm in agreement that it was WWE's creative that f'd up this character and I do sympathize with the man because he took a huge risk in even agreeing to work as the character. He pretty much put his career into the company's hands, this isn't him being a red rooster or a brooklyn brawler, this is someone in the middle of a war and terrorism, coming out to arab music, wearing a turban and berating the United States. This could have been a really unique character and it could have got them press for the right reasons. He could have just been angry about post 9/11's prejudice and judgement towards arab americans and they could have downplayed the cheap "evil foreign wrestler" and left it up to the audience to determine if there was truth to his words. He didn't have to be anti-U.S. - just pissed - and there wouldn't have been a need to resort to comments about the war or suggest that he and Davari were terrorists. But this writing team sucks.... they suck bad... they suck so bad that I can't for the life of me see how Vince McMahon doesn't understand that he's lost good talent, legendary talent, great wrestling minds and viewers because these guys suck so bad!!!! So instead they went the unimaginative route with the characterization and had it not been for Hassan's very convincing mic work, his playing up to the he is an Arab and and American and he's a victim angle, they would have run into trouble a lot earlier. It was almost to the point where if someone complained about the character, they could just thumb noses and point out the fact that anyone with a brain can see that there is logic to his words and labelling him a terrorist because he's an arab wrestler is exactly what his character is pissed about. They tried to go that route with his internet interview but there was one problem.... one week earlier, the genius that is WWE creative, decided to dress guys up as terrorist, attack a man with piano wire, give the impression that davari served as a sacrifice for the cause, while having 'the arab american' pray. I'm curious as to how much they allowed Hassan to improvise during his mic work - if they did - I sympathize for him all the more because he tried to take the character one route while creative did a 180 and took him in a different direction. Those interviews seemed too intelligent to come from any of the writers. The very least they can do is give him an intelligent exit interview on Raw. Blame the company for advising him to use his arab american bloodline so they can profit on the existing racism towards his race (the dumbest thing is for him to deny being arab american and confess that he's italian). Say that he was advised by "creative services" in the WWE to find some friends to dress up as a terrorists to out psych the Undertaker and sell the PPV on Taker's revenge, to rally the troops with their free PPV showing to the armed forces. And now dropping him and Davari from television because of the bad press their so called creativity spawned. Have him say something like he has friends and family, fighting for the United States of America and he's had to look them in the eye, throughout this whole angle, not to mention his arab friends, and tell them how he can justify portraying WWE's character. He and Davari announce that they will be at some indie shows as WWE producers cut them off, possibly setting up their involvement in the Matt Hardy 'realism' storyline. -
An Arab American version of Shelton Benjamin minus the in-ring ability but maybe that will come. He's young, good on the mic and has the look. Don't have him say that this was a 'character' he was playing. Say that he's arab american but he took things too far. He wanted to become a star and used recent events and emotions negatively to achieve that. He's a good talker, this would sound convincing coming from. He wanted to educate people to not be racist and instead he gave them a reason to be racist and hateful. Drop the turban. Downplay the arab american stereotypical look that they've created for him. Maybe at some point adapt an American name like Mark Magnus. And let him beat the living shit out of the first Carlito-like heel who makes a reference to him opening up a 7-11. Or he just acknowledges the UPN ban and does a Chavo and denounces his Arabian descent to appease the United States press and 'the network'. Maybe team him with Kerwin White. Announcing that he's now "Blue Chipper" Mark Magnus. Or he asks the FBI if he can pass for Italian and they adopt him into da famlee and he's renamed Guido the Hero. I think the point is that they can have fun with this without taking this guy into unemployment.
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Keep Davari on Smackdown for the cruiserweight division, if it still exists. Keep Hassan off of television for a few weeks after the Great American Bash. Perhaps have him shake Taker's hand after the match or something out of the ordinary leading into his disappearance. A month of so later, have Sgt. Slaughter make an appearance on Raw when he is attacked by Renee Dupree. Dupree can be cutting down on America as he's beating on Slaughter, Hassan's music hits and he comes to the ring. Dupree stops beating on Slaughter and invites Hassan to join in. Hassan instead jumps Dupree. The following week, Slaughter goes to the ring and cuts a promo saying that he'd like to introduce everyone to an American. An American who had to face a lot of adversity and racism following September 11th. Hassan comes to the ring and states that when he first addressed WWE audiences, all that he wanted was to let the injustices that arab americans face on a day to day basis be known. His words became more and more venemous towards the USA with the crowd's boos. When he moved to Smackdown, he was to face the Undertaker and did not want to be out psyched by Taker's presence so he orchestrated a very ill advised attack that made national headlines and had him banned from UPN. When he first read the words, "terrorist wrestler", he was angry but he then realized that the press, the network and everyone was right. He was a terrorist because terrorist are people who act out of desperation and most of all they are cowards. The reason that he is a professional wrestler is because he grew up in the land of opportunity. He was free to do what he wanted with his life. His arab heritage will always be important to him and people need to educate themselves that anyone can be a victim of terrorism. Even arab americans as there were plenty that never lived to see the next day due to acts of terrorism. He grew up watching Sgt Slaughter, Hulk Hogan and the American Dream Dusty Rhodes and those were his heroes. Those were the men who made him proud to be an American and want to be a professional wrestler. He then pleads for the forgiveness of American wrestling crowds. In the following weeks, they can do Confidential style profile pieces on his Magnus' legit background. The end...
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Is there anything wrong with doing a replay on Monday nights at 11pm? Spike hasn't really found a good 11pm show to follow Raw as it is, although I liked some of the Lance Krall skits. I imagine they will stick to running CSI or whatever, I'm just saying, is it wrong to experiment with running the show prior to or after Raw. You have to tap the largest wrestling audience and I think Saturday nights is just doomed for 1.0 (if that) land. I can't see why something like TNA at 8pm and Ultimate Fighter at 9pm, just to f*ck with WWE is impossible. Or Ultimate Fighter at 10pm and TNA at 11pm with a movie from 8 to 10.
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Roddy Piper wasn't a great scientific wrestler, had no aerial skills and wasn't a tremendous brawler. He looked scrawny and didn't have the look of a star. He was good on the mic but also had a delivery which annoyed a lot of people. I'm not saying Carlito is the next Roddy Piper but I think all of you are looking at this way too seriously. WWE isn't asking you to take him serious. They aren't asking that you believe that he's better in the ring than Shelton Benjamin. That's the joke. He's not better than Shelton and he's doing whatever he can to escape every match with the title. Do I think that Charlie Haas deserves to be in Carlito's spot, opposing Shelton, right now? Yes. But Charlie Haas wasn't getting the pops that Carlito has been getting since his debut. Obviously, even smart cities like NY, are able to look beyond the negatives and just enjoy the character.
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I'm not overly impressed with him but I do see a lot of potential and I don't consider him terrible. I've liked his matches with Shelton and the cheap endings really make you laugh at his character. His look makes people look at the television and it's refreshing to see someone his size get a push even if though they don't look like Chris Masters. Prior to his debut, Meltzer had acted like there was no way that he would have the personality to pull off this type of character. Well, he did. So I'm not ruling out that he can't improve in the ring either. I'd rather see him working with people the caliber of Shelton Benjamin at this point in his career then Cena or Big Show. Crowds seem to take to him, if MSG and NY are popping for you, you are ok.
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The Heyman thing is very intriguing but will probably be short lived. December is going to be interesting as to whether or not they re-sign Heyman or if he is left to pursue his own interest. I'm almost thinking that with their intent to have future ECW PPV's and to avoid the possibility of Heyman working with something like TNA - they will have to re-sign Paul. The ECW crowd would shit on any attempt to do another PPV knowing that Heyman has no involvement. I'm doubting he'll sign on again with no creative role. As much as I think Heyman would benefit WWE's creative team, maybe having him in the role of developing young green talent may be beneficial to the company and Heyman's long term future with the company. Let's face it, ECW was pretty much the company that fed talent to WWF and WCW. Heyman had a way of showcasing strengths and covering up weaknesses and getting the best use of his talent. If I were Vince McMahon, I'd give Heyman 6 months in total control of OVW. This would mean writing the shows, working with talent and also selecting talent to work in the company. Allow him the opportunity to select some ROH or indie talent to work in OVW and possibly sign on to WWE developmental. Make CM Punk and Kid Kash pet projects for him. Put forth some money to stream the OVW television shows on either WWE's website or OVW's. We should be able to see the developmental productions in some form on the net. You obviously don't want to put green talent on cable television but there would undoubtedly be an interest from people online to stream an OVW show or perhaps add it to WWE 24-7. See how much interest the net fans have in OVW's television and their reactions to developing talent. If Heyman is able to get select talent ready for WWE then bring them into the company with his creative input as this would gradually get him involved in WWE creative again without the stress of involving him in preparing an entire Raw or Smackdown.
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I see your point with Long/Bischoff but I thought the original point of the whole brand GM thing, going back to Vince/Flair, Steph/Bischoff and Bischoff/Heyman was for the head of the brand to want to out do the other for a better show. You're right, Bischoff and Long don't have any real heat, which is one of the reasons this draft didn't compare to last year's with Bischoff and Heyman wwe.com just acknowledged the JBL/Meanie thing on their website this week, a website which is designed towards the marks, they have a DVD to push with JBL doing alternative commentary, they could have easily played into the angle for a one shot trade explanation, and this could have been the perfect opportunity to rid Simon Dean of the Richard Simmons gimmick moving to Smackdown. Even if their arrival to SD only resulted in JBL squashing both of them, it makes more sense than a trade without any explanation.
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Yeah, I was really hoping we'd get Charlie Haas and Jackie on Raw too. What amazes me is that WWE creative is so uncreative that they couldn't have made an interesting weeks worth of television out of these trades. This would have added some storyline logic to the talent switching brands. With all of the talent in one arena this past weekend, they could have played on backstage segments with each of the GM's maneuvering for certain stars. Simple things like Teddy Long approaching Simon Dean and Stevie Richards about the JBL/ONS incident and asking if they'd like retribution for their friend - then dealing one of the Bashams and Jindrak. Bischoff approaching Chavo Guerrerro and reminding him that he was responsible for making Chavo a name on Nitro and he'd like an opportunity to do it again on Monday Night Raw, getting him out of Eddie's shadow. Bischoff dealing Regal, out of spite for his work with Eugene. Bischoff telling Renee Dupree how he hated losing him in last year's draft and dealing away Sylvan and Candice to get Renee back. I didn't like the draft setup at all this year. Last year they had a way of making each talent exchange a big deal. Making it feel like Smackdown acquiring Renee Dupree was a huge deal. I loved the exchanges with Bischoff and Heyman again and would really like that GM rivalry again, especially considering how it could play off of the ECW PPV. This year, there wasn't any direct play between the GM's and the lower card talent were treated like.... well, lower card talent jumping to another show...
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It can't be based on nostalgia alone, that's the key. There would have to be new talent thrown into the mix. The key focus of a reborn ECW would be the more intimate setting, keeping the show in a venue like the Manhatten Center/Hammerstein Ballroom, a smarter more adult influenced style of booking, the brand name, Joey Styles and Paul Heyman involved with the creative process. Perhaps a stiffer style, offense that allows the use of chairs, in an RVD or Sabu way, but isn't people getting cracked over the skull a dozen times a night with a chair. Yes, you would have guys like Sandman, Tommy Dreamer, The Dudleys, Sabu, RVD, Stevie and other past ECW names like Tajiri, Little Guido, Rhyno, Super Crazy, etc. but I think the whole focus of bringing back this brand of wrestling is for Heyman influenced booking to take guys like Paul London, CM Punk, Akio, Jamie Noble, Juvi, Bryan Danielson, Lo Ki, maybe even a Shane Helms or Shannon Moore etc. - guys that you know would get over with an ECW crowd - and make them stars, showcase their strengths, minimize their weaknesses and do those little things that WWE creative fail to do on a routine basis. It's like NoCalMike said, their is no point to a brand extension with two products that are formatted exactly the same, with the same creative teams, etc. Even this years draft is flat because wrestler A that gets drafted to Smackdown or Raw is just going to be booked the same as they were on the other show. It's the same people writing the shows. The name ECW doesn't necessarily have to be brought back just to create an alternative looking product but judging from the DVD sales and the PPV buy estimates, the name obviously doesn't hurt and still holds some sort of attachment with fans from the last boom period of wrestling. Ultimately, I think Vince is faced with this when it comes to responding to One Night Stand. Creative Paul Heyman vs. creative Stephanie and Brian Gerwitz. Steph and Gerwitz hate Heyman while others on WWE creative like Dava Lagana and Ed Koskie were fans of ECW. Heyman has been demoted twice at the urging of Steph and Gerwtiz. If Vince was a good business man and wanted to do what's right for the business, he would put Heyman back in a creative position, ECW or not, with no restraints and an open mind, just like he had for this PPV, and let the audience determine who produces the better product. Heyman's contract is up at the end of the year and I'm sure any potential competitor would welcome his input.
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I'd like to see Sabu get some acknowledgment for what he's given to the business. I think there is still a few years of marketability in him and that his background is such that they could at least get him on Mick Foley hardcore credibility status level with fans. They own his footage from ECW, could probably easily get other international and indie footage, etc. for a DVD and he could work some decent series in WWE with guys like RVD.
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If it's in this week's Observer, this would be the second time that an "insider" has made reference to this incident. Wade Keller mentioned something like this on one of his audio reports. His version was that HHH tries to act like one of the boys whenever he is around talent, rather than a company guy. They couldn't find RVD one night when creative was going over the show with talent and HHH found RVD outside "smoking" with a few other guys. HHH put his arm around Van Dam and RVD told him to stop pretendiing like he's one of the boys, nobody buys it and people know he'll just bury them behind his back to Vince. The talent respected RVD for being up front with HHH. So this would be the second time a story like this was referenced, once by Keller and now apparently by Meltzer.
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that would be a real good storyline if done creatively, not in a Heartbreakers kind of way... now that Orton is on Smackdown, they can even do it with Jindrak, and just subsitute another Diva in Rochelle's place and recreate the whole thing - they seem to enjoy doing that afterall....
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If anything, I hope that the PPV's success will wake Vince up to the fact that people want a different type of product than Steph, Gerwitz, etc. are delivering. There is an audience out there that WWE's current product does not appeal to and that audience by early estimates it seems, ordered ONS. In even just talking to people, I know for a fact that so many of my friends ordered this PPV when they don't even watch wrestling any more. Not because it was there last opportunity to see ECW but because they wanted to see a product like ECW. I'm torn as to what the future holds. One part of me would like to see Vince reflect on the ECW PPV and utilize them in his current product. For instance, giving Heyman and Dreamer bigger creative roles, bringing in Joey Styles as an announcer, etc. I don't think this is enough however and I think it would ultimately get ruined by Steph and HHH. Styles on commentary will just remind people of ECW and they need to do television from a smaller more intimate setting, like the Manhatten Center/Hammerstein Ballroom, for a more energized product. This is why I think they should just bring the ECW brand back as a whole. Let it be Heyman and Dreamer's baby with Shane having some involvement as well. Shane had a lot to do with Vince letting Russo make needed changes to the product, perhaps he can have the same type of pull in this situation. Let Gerwitz and Steph do what they do on Monday nights and let Heyman/Dreamer do their thing on another night. Vince makes money regardless of who does better. But when I say bring ECW back, I'm not saying just keep it at the past roster. Bring guys like CM Punk, Samoa Joe, Brian Danielson, Kid Kash, Jamie Noble, Teddy Hart and essentially create a new generation of ECW to go along with The Sandman, Dreamer, etc. Eliminate the cruiser division and just use that talent in ECW's roster. It's not a one trick pony, centered on nostalgia, if you allow them to build a current product. I say, fuck UPN, put ECW on Friday nights just to spite the network for making such a move. Then, when the UPN deal expires, good riddence to Viacom and all of their networks. Ask USA to give them a Friday night slot with no censors, like Comedy Central does late at night.
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Why can't anyone just acknowledge that the Pittsburgh Pirates have a pretty decent team developing right now? It's early in the season and I still don't think they will be anywhere near a wild card race but something special is definitely developing here and the media seems obsessed with these up and coming Brewers. It's annoying.
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Sabin has the right look. His matches are the only wrestling that my girlfriend will actually stop whatever she's doing to watch. That has to mean something.
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This is the first time that I've ever said they should just end the brand split right now. It's the most logical thing to do. USA/Universal will be putting out a lot of $$$ towards hyping the return of Raw to USA this fall. It would make sense to have the bulk of the talent and big names present on Raw. They only have one weekend time slot in the new USA deal so it's being assumed that there will no longer be any more Velocity which would leave Smackdown without a B-show. Smackdown on Friday nights may not necessarily be ratings death but they would be hitting a far different demographic compared to Raw. More than likely an older audience. I'd pretty much screw UPN by taping the show in a smaller venue, like the Hammerstein Ballroom or something, and featuring a more mat based program, a lot of cruisers, smaller guys. Not so much storyline as we've come to know it from WWE with backstage skits, etc. Or just bring back ECW and go total raunch to the point that they piss off UPN.