TheOriginalOrangeGoblin

Lemme add my 2nd fav: Randy Savage vs Ted DiBiase, Wrestlefest 88 vs Bret Hart, SNME Nov.87 vs Ric Flair, Wrestlemania 8 vs Ricky Steamboat, Maple Leaf Gardens 1986 vs Ultimate Warrior, Wrestlemania 7

I'll go for Flair. Better mic worker than Austin, no worse in the ring but didn't draw as much money. Still Flair.

Yah I agree. In what world are those 3 cool?

Other: Curt 'Mr. Perfect' Hennig Hall & Nash were pretty damn cool too in 96/97.

If Acclaim waives a dollar sign in their face they'll agree. Only guys I could not under any circumstance see in a WWE game are Randy Savage and Bruno Sammartino. No one else is under that bad terms with them.

I think he managed to blackball himself from the CFL as well... Yeah. When you manage to get yourself turfed from the 2003 Calgary Stampeders, a team that will stand as one of the most inept on the field and off in the history of the CFL, you know you've had it. Didn't he bail from the Montreal Alouettes as well? Like Teke said, karma's a bitch. Yeah, but Calgary... they had the GM's son play QB in front of Crandell, right? Yeah, just wanted a confirmation if he bombed TWICE, instead of once, in the CFL. And don't get me started on the nepotism thing. Here in Ottawa, the head coach's son is on the practice roster at QB. Speaking of which, don't get me started on last night's God-awful game, either. I was at that game last night. Pissed me off to see such a big crowd and to see the Gades play so damn horribly.

Tully Blanchard, Brutus Beffcake, Lex Luger

Apparently 3 other legends are Piper, Snuka and Brutus Beefcake. Speaking of Beefcake:

29. Team USA vs Hart Foundation - Canadian Stampede (17-6) 11. Steiners vs Bret/Owen Hart - Wrestlefest 94 (17-6)

Who cares who it contains? It's a damn good Wargames and by far the best since 1992. Really good card overall as Brocklock said and one of the forgotten good/great PPV's from WCW's big run.

This sucks. Good luck John.

I'm Canadian and I love Canadian crowds but I agree. NEarly ruined the whole damn PPV for me.

Steve Austin - Bret Hart The Rock - Chris Jericho Shawn Michaels - Scott Hall(not just ladder matches - they worked real well together) HHH - Mick Foley Mick Foley - Shawn Michaels Undertaker - Mick Foley or Shawn Michaels Bret Hart - Owen Hart Owen Hart - Bret Hart Vader - Sting British Bulldog - Bret Hart Randy Savage - Ric Flair Hulk Hogan - Randy Savage Ultimate Warrior - Randy Savage Ric Flair - Barry Windham Kurt Angle - Chris Benoit or Edge Brock Lesnar - Eddie Guerrero Chris Benoit - Eddie Guerrero Eddie Guererro - Rey Mysterio Rey Mysterio - Eddie Guerrero Curt Hennig - Bret Hart Jeff Jarrett - Shawn Michaels Kevin Nash - Bret Hart Scott Hall - Shawn Michaels DDP - Randy Savage Bam Bam Bigelow - Bret Hart(from what I've seen) Jerry Lawler - No clue Rowdy Roddy Piper - Jimmy Snuka or Bret Hart X Pac - Bret Hart Ken Shamrock - The Rock Shane Douglas - Teaming with Steamboat Justin Credible - No clue Sabu - RVD Raven - Chris Benoit Scott Steiner - Anyone who's willing to bump for his suplexes Rick Steiner - See Scott Sid Vicious - Shawn Michaels Scott Norton - No clue Rob Van Dam - Eddie Guerrero Lance Storm - I haven't really liked any of his matches that much

"Brian Pillman you better give your soul to the lord, cause your ass belongs to Stone Cold Steve Austin" - Austin in April 97 "You know I'm screwed at Summerslam cause if I lose well then I'm done in the WWF. But if Shawn screws up he gets to take a few months off to look for his smile again." - Bret before Slam 97 Hogan's entire BATB 96 promo which, in my opinion, is the best promo ever. Those are just off the top of my head.

Jesse Ventura is the best without any doubt in my mind. Only heel commentator who never used his commentary to get himself(most heel commentators) or his comedy(Heenan) over at the expense of the match. No matter what the match Ventura would analyze and put over the people in the ring(instead of just dogging faces like Heenan was notorious for). Don't get me wrong, Heenan was hilarious and possibly more entertaining than anyone but he, often, put his comedy over at the expense of the match going on. Jesse never did that.

Hulk/Hollywood Hogan

Hart Foundation. Only around for a few months but they were so awesome. I love how in the US they were the biggest heels but everywhere else they were heroes. That's not even mentioning how most of the stuff Bret was saying was true(as the idiot fans proved): Bret: You people are a sick, violence based country. You all wanna see me get beat up right now don't you? *crowd erupts* Thank you for proving my point.

Bret Hart vs Owen Hart, Wrestlemania 10 vs Steve Austin, Survivor Series 1996 vs Chris Benoit, Nitro 10/04/99 w/ Hart Foundation vs Steve Austin, Ken Shamrock, LOD & Goldust, IYH 16: Canadian Stampede vs Randy Savage, SNME Nov.87

8. Raven/Saturn vs Malenko/Benoit (Horseman) - Spring Stampede 99 (15-4) 29. Team USA vs Hart Foundation - Canadian Stampede (16-3) 11. Steiners vs Bret/Owen Hart - Wrestlefest 94 (10-9) 2. Edge/Rey vs Benoit/ Angle- No Mercy (13-6)

Luger/Yoko is surprisingly good and, possibly, the ebst Yoko singles match I've seen.

During the nWo's run in June 2002 they met Brock in the locker room. Heyman mouths off to Shawn so Shawn and Brock go nose. Shawn & Brock(crowd pops) Nash walks up to Brock(crowd pops louder) Big Show walks up to Brock(silence)

Andre is the most significant. Bret's was the best executed and most logical.

Fuck, play Madden 05 or watch this. Decisions...decisions...decisions.

Got it. On All-Madden it's way harder than it was before and with the new defensive playmaker I've turned Indy(my franchise team) into a defensive juggernaut. After playing both already I can safely say: Madden >>> ESPN.

The comment (which I thought would be obvious by my use of "shiny" and "raw" and how I put it in relation to "no special effects", but don't let that stop you from making the same comment you've made TWICE BEFORE IN THIS THREAD) was in relation to its visuals, not it's content. But since you seem intent on driving the point home that you did not like the last 20 minutes, I'll bite. You don't get it. Here's what I wrote on another board... You are seeing the plot and are missing the story. Thematically, the subway scene fits perfectly. You don't have to like it, but to say it's cliched when there is rich depth in it just shows your lack of understanding the core of the film. Themes that I picked up on. Eyes. Sight. Visual. We look but we don't see. We're too wrapped up in our own shit to see what's going on around us. The world could be ending - people could be dying around us - but we're too selfish to see it. Vincent cutting out the power, Max on the rooftop looking into the building, the subway scene - all are reflective of this theme. Vincent dying on the subway is definitely part of this theme and it gives weight to everything I'm saying. Vincent knows about sight and Max is starting to see. The fact that he wears eyeglasses and Vincent wears sunglasses is probably no coincidence. That there is a glass wall between Max and Vincent and we saw the wonderful shot of Cruise looking out from behind him is probably no coincidence. That when Foxx and Pinkett were running away and Vincent had to "look" to "see" where they were going and ultimately ended up finding them is probably no coincidence. That Max and Vincent found themselves shooting at each other through the glass and the dark is probably no coincidence. That Vincents eyes told the story of his death was probably no coincidence and that the film ended with a period of darkness is probably no coincidence. But I suppose this is all still very "cliched"; because this depth is normally found in films today. I mistook your raw comment, if you're talking about the visuals then I completely agree. The actual death I have no problem with but the chase leading up to it and the damsel in distress thing is what annoys me. I can see all the subtext you read into it(and I do agree on: "Eyes. Sight. Visual. We look but we don't see. We're too wrapped up in our own shit to see what's going on around us. The world could be ending - people could be dying around us - but we're too selfish to see it." as being a primary theme) but that does not change the fact that once Foxx crashes the cab the a movie which had played out as a character study to that point(with some shooting in it) turns into the Hitcher Redux. I enjoyed the slow burn as Maxx started to finally come out of his shell but no way do I buy, at that point of time, Maxx attacking a cop. His character has evolved but not to that point. Maybe it doesn't compare to some of your subtext but character leaps like that go far in damaging my view on a movie that had been damn near perfect to that point. Some of your subtext I think you're digging too deeply into. I see your point on some of it but other things(the camera view of Vincent behind Maxx) are simply Mann doing what he does best. I don't think the subtext you are suggesting was implied there, nor when Vincent cuts the lights. I was also disappointed to seeing such an typical ending to the Maxx/Vincent relationship. I was hoping to expand upon their eventual confrontation with Maxx's nervousness and fear of action coming more into play since that can't just disappear that fast even with the Felix meeting, then maybe play that into the ending. I'll be interested to read your last part of your review where you talk about the plot and whatever else.