Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But God knows what you are going to do with that free will before you even know what to do with it. Gives you it anyways, and sets up circumstances where it will be tested. That's not Free Will, that's manipulation. He knows what you will do whichever road you choose to walk down. It's up to man to decide what you do, we all have that choice to make. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 Where in the world did SP run off to? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But he condemns man for that choice.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But he condemns man for that choice.. Exactly, he gives man a choice, and depending on that choice he either rewards, or punishes, just like any father. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But he also creates the road and selection of choices. Again, Manipulation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But he also creates the road and selection of choices. Again, Manipulation. This will never end. Â He creates all of this in order for man to have a choice, I can't say anything else. What man decides to do they decide to do. God has it set up so we decide where we end up, that's all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 That's sadistic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 That's sadistic. It's free will. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 If he didn't then neither choice would be labled good or bad. Both would be fine and it would give no reason to choose one over the other. Â We get what we deserve for our actions. If our actions are good we are rewarded if our actions are bad we are punished. It's a truth that everyone knows regardless. Choice is a conscious thing that you do. You know that making that choice will have effects. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 And he decides that we end up in hell. It's simple. If he didn't want us to end up in hell he wouldn't have a)Created the Tree of Knowledge, b)Created Satan to "tempt" Man, c)Told man to "never eat from the tree" and d)Gave man Curiosity (which "never eat from the tree" panders to) Â But he did, man chose exactly what God expected, and God casts man out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 In order for free will to work there needs to be a set right and wrong and reward and punishment. Â Good or Evil. You choose one or the other. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Juice Report post Posted June 18, 2003 That's sadistic. I already said that. Seriously though RRR, these guys will tell you that shit smells good if the bible said it did. I used to be one of these guys and I can tell you that Christanity is just a hop, skip, and a jump away from Cultism. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 And he decides that we end up in hell. It's simple. If he didn't want us to end up in hell he wouldn't have a)Created the Tree of Knowledge, b)Created Satan to "tempt" Man, c)Told man to "never eat from the tree" and d)Gave man Curiosity (which "never eat from the tree" panders to) Â But he did, man chose exactly what God expected, and God casts man out. You aren't getting this. Man mad the choice, it was up to man as to what he did or not. Â Can we not move on, this is just beating a dead horse. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 And he decides that we end up in hell. It's simple. If he didn't want us to end up in hell he wouldn't have a)Created the Tree of Knowledge, b)Created Satan to "tempt" Man, c)Told man to "never eat from the tree" and d)Gave man Curiosity (which "never eat from the tree" panders to) Â But he did, man chose exactly what God expected, and God casts man out. If he didn't do any of those things then we would be mindless. We would do whatever we were told to do and we would have no choice. Â I'll take having a choice over mindless robot any day. Isn't that what's been stressed by today's society? The Freedom of Choice? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 How is it Free Will? Â If I told you "don't look behind you, whatever you do, don't look behind you" are you going to wonder "what is behind me"? And what if you do look? Does the fact that I told you "don't look behind you" made you turn around? Had I not told you that, would you have looked around? Is that Free Choice? ...Don't worry about the cookies. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 That's sadistic. I already said that. Seriously though RRR, these guys will tell you that shit smells good if the bible said it did. I used to be one of these guys and I can tell you that Christanity is just a hop, skip, and a jump away from Cultism. Don't get smart-assy over something like this, come on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 I still have the choice whether or not to do it. If you had never told me not to look behind me and I did anyway and was blasted with something then I would be mad that you didn't warn me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 I don't mind Christianity, like I said before "if it works for ya, great", I'm not against the notion of God and whatnot, though I find worshoping him to be rather goofy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Downhome Report post Posted June 18, 2003 I don't mind Christianity, like I said before "if it works for ya, great", I'm not against the notion of God and whatnot, though I find worshoping him to be rather goofy. I don't expect you to be into it, like we said before it's about faith. You either choose to do so, or do not. If you do not, you can NEVER understand why those who do...do so. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 Why would you turn around though? There is no reason to do so. You are oblivious to the notion that there is something behind you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Juice Report post Posted June 18, 2003 That's sadistic. I already said that. Seriously though RRR, these guys will tell you that shit smells good if the bible said it did. I used to be one of these guys and I can tell you that Christanity is just a hop, skip, and a jump away from Cultism. Don't get smart-assy over something like this, come on. I'm not trying to smart-assy, I just used to be you and LaParka and Spider. I just can't get the whole "it's faith" thing when there is so much evidence to the contrarary. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Czech Republic Report post Posted June 18, 2003 Question: how do you guys feel about Deism? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 God told Adam and Eve about the tree as a warning. Â It would have been worse if he never told them at all about it and they ate of it and were punished. Â It was put there so that they had the choice to live the life of evil if they wanted to. God had the decency to warn them about it so they knew what their choice was plain and simple. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 I "understand" perfectly why those who do so, do so. But I guess I'm not allowed to "think like a Christian" like you are allowed to "think like a non-christian" eh? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaYourCar 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 Why would you turn around though? There is no reason to do so. You are oblivious to the notion that there is something behind you. There is still the possibility that I might turn around. And if I'm not warned that there's something there then I get punished without knowledge of my choice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rising up out of the back seat-nuh 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 Damn, you started a good thread without me. Â My views on Christianity is that it's bullshit. However, that does not stop me from seing the good in it, but it does allow me to see the evil in it. Christianity has ruined as many lives as it has saved, allbeit mainly by the manipulation of those who chose to use it's doctrine for evil. Â Also anyone who needs the promise of heaven to lead a decent life is a dick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Czech Republic Report post Posted June 18, 2003 It's a pleasure to take part in an NHB thread more profound than "You like-a the juice, eh?" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 But they ate it La Park, and he knew they would, so there goes that argument. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted June 18, 2003 So what we have is "the possibility of turning around and being punished" and "the guarantee of turning around and being punished" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rising up out of the back seat-nuh 0 Report post Posted June 18, 2003 So, creationists, why is man imperfect if God had the power to create a Utopian world? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
