Most overrated films of all time

[Guest El Satanico]

(Damn the last few years in the film industry of really sucked ass).

I hope you meant to say "The Oscars have sucked over the last few years".

 

Just because you haven't liked some of the Oscar winning movies, that doesn't mean it was a bad movie year. The year Gladiator won was the last weak year for Oscar nominated movies. However, that's partly the fault of the Academy who passed on great movies like Requeim of A Dream.

[Guest El Satanico]

ElSatanico I think Hanks is underrated because if you asked someone who the greatest actor ever was they'd inevitably say eother De Niro or Pacino. Hanks most probably wouldn't get a look in even though hes a really excellent actor and has made more good films than certainly De Niro has in recent years.

Well that doesn't mean he's underrated, it just means he hasn't made it to legend status.

 

I'm sure during Deniro's and Pacino's prime they weren't considered to be the greats. They had their own legends they were working in the shadows of.

[Steve J. Rogers 0]

-Gone With The Wind

My God where to start...

You can blame this for all the Danelle Steele crapola fests through the years.

 

-Casablanca

Would be a forgettable B-Flick if not for Bogey and Bergman, and with them its just a good flick, nothing special

 

-Pearl Harbor

They hyped it as if it was going to be a "film record of the events of PH" instead what we got was a Titanic/Gone With The Wind love story, where the historical event is only a backdrop, which would have been fine if it was hyped as such, but it wasn't and that is flat out false advertizing

 

Too many sci-fi/horror genere films to count, especially in the last 15 years or so (really post Batman)

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Off the top of my head, some of the more overrated films pre-1990 include...

 

- Star Wars: Any of them, really, although Empire is a very good movie. Not to say that I don't like them, but the way some people (a lot, actually) base the way they live their lives on what they've learned and be told through the various movies, should just show you how seriously some people take it, when the whole concept is pretty silly when you actually think about it. The movies are good, but aren't so good that I'd apply the things I've "learned" from them to how I live my everyday life. The entire franchise is a perfect example of so many people taking it so seriously and overly-praising it, that you begin to dislike it in some ways.

 

- E.T.: I may get flamed for this, but if that's the case, then so be it. Personally, I don't even really enjoy this movie. I'll give it credit for being a very good movie, but I've never liked it too much at all, even as a kid. Perhaps to some it's something amazing, but I could never quite get into it. Spielberg is a great director, but I would take a few of his other movies over this one any day of the week.

 

- Animal House: Ok, bring on the flames, but to me, this is a funny movie that has reached a god-like status among many viewers over the years and I can't really see why. I appreciate it for its humor and the influence that it's had on pop culture since its release, but I still have trouble seeing it as the defining teen genre classic of any generation. I'm looking forward to the SE release in a couple of weeks, but that still doesn't change that I see this as a very funny movie and an influential one, as well, but not the king of the teen genre.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

-Pearl Harbor

They hyped it as if it was going to be a "film record of the events of PH" instead what we got was a Titanic/Gone With The Wind love story, where the historical event is only a backdrop, which would have been fine if it was hyped as such, but it wasn't and that is flat out false advertizing

I fail to see how Pearl Harbor is overrated, when it seems like everyone and his brother despises it, or at least acknowledges it as nothing more than average.

[godthedog 0]

Off the top of my head, here are twenty films pre-1970 that I adore and I think most film lovers should see:

 

The Searchers

Cool Hand Luke

An American in Paris

Casablanca

Citizen Kane

She Wore a Yellow Ribbon

Red River

North by Northwest

Wait Until Dark

A Face in the Crowd

Spartacus

Ben-Hur

The Third Man

Touch of Evil

Brining up Baby

Duck Soup

Key Largo

Night of the Hunter

It Happened One Night

Ride the High Country

not a comment about this particular post, but about the discussion in general:

 

since you pulled the "last 5 years" card on mideon, i have to pull the "why are there no non-hollywood studio movies" card. EVERYONE on this board has a limited taste compared the the huge volume of movies that are out there (myself included), and essentially asserting your superiority over him is kind of pointless. you can name 20 great movies he's never heard of, i can name 20 great movies you've never heard of, lethargic can name 20 great movies i've never heard of, corey can name 20 great movies lethargic's never heard of...it goes round and round. this discussion so far has pretty much amounted to a dick-waving of connaisseurship, and it leans towards elitism.

 

back on topic...i saw it "reduxed" about a month ago on bravo, and my opinion on it hasn't changed much: 'apocalypse now'. i can't even muster up the strength to go on about how much i hate it, like i normally do.

 

i'm not a huge fan of 'casablanca' either. 'rashomon' might have been great 50 years ago, but it hasn't aged well, and i wouldn't even put it in kurosawa's top 5, much less an all-time top 10. i'll also jump on the 'titanic' bandwagon: i'll admit that i bought into it when i first saw it in a crowded theater, but in retrospect it didn't deserve half of what it got.

 

and 'chicago' is awesome. best pure showmanship i've seen from a movie in a LONG time (especially in an era where musicals are trying to downplay their "musicality" and be less showy about it).

[Steve J. Rogers 0]

-Pearl Harbor

They hyped it as if it was going to be a "film record of the events of PH" instead what we got was a Titanic/Gone With The Wind love story, where the historical event is only a backdrop, which would have been fine if it was hyped as such, but it wasn't and that is flat out false advertizing

I fail to see how Pearl Harbor is overrated, when it seems like everyone and his brother despises it, or at least acknowledges it as nothing more than average.

Every one HERE hates it, but if you asked "movie marks" especially those of the female variety, they love it (especially those who are fans of Affleck, Hartnett or Faith Hill)

 

Also I am bashing it because of how it was promoted, and that is part of overrating a movie, when it gets overly-promoted, especially in the wrong vein

[godthedog 0]

Animal House: Ok, bring on the flames, but to me, this is a funny movie that has reached a god-like status among many viewers over the years and I can't really see why. I appreciate it for its humor and the influence that it's had on pop culture since its release, but I still have trouble seeing it as the defining teen genre classic of any generation. I'm looking forward to the SE release in a couple of weeks, but that still doesn't change that I see this as a very funny movie and an influential one, as well, but not the king of the teen genre.

amen, brother. i don't even find this movie all that funny, and i never saw what was so "defining" about it.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Every one HERE hates it, but if you asked "movie marks" especially those of the female variety

Yeah and what the hell do they know? These were the same women falling in love with Titanic and seeing it nine times in the theater. Throw a mushy love story out there and most women can't resist.

[Nighthawk 0]

Let's see...

 

Star Wars - some bad acting, kinda corny, nothing unforgivable if it hadn't become literally a religion to some people.

 

Army of Darkness - kinda the same deal as Star Wars, it's good, but it's not the be all end all it gets lauded as. The weakest of the series, in my opinion.

 

Independence Day - not so much anymore, but I'm mentioning it because when it first came out the overration was through the roof. People were saying they were blown away and it was the most amazing thing ever. It was pretty stupid and Will Smith had not fully come into his own as an actor (and he's still not that great)

 

Woody Allen movies as a general rule - I realize a lot of it may be personal opinion, but the guy churns out crap, and lots of it, yet people act like he's some kind of god.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

1. Matrix

2. Matrix

3. Matrix

4. Matrix

5. Tie between Matrix and Matrix 2

[Guest Crucifixio Jones]

I don't even know where to begin.

 

I agree that everyone should see Cool Hand Luke, The Searchers, Spartacus & Ben-Hur and a few others on Deke's list. I think anyone who's a film fan will have seen North By Northwest at some point, however, so you can add Cat On A Hot Tin Roof instead.

 

I agree with what's been said about Casablanca, Animal House and the like (in chats I've also mentioned Fast Times at Ridgemont High as being WAY overrated, especially by the teens of THIS generation, who are mostly just lemmings and repeat whatever they heard the previous generation laud).

 

Pearl Harbor isn't overrated, it was just overhyped pre-release. I've never been able to sit through all of Gone With the Wind but I can usually sit through things of that length, etc with no problem.

 

Lastly, Bruiser's already down, but I'd love to see Deke (WrestlingDeacon) and gTd (godthedog) at SNKTII when it finally opens its doors. You'll have a HOME there, trust me.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

godthedog: I said in an earlier post that I could stick with just American films, post the silent era and come up with stuff that should be seen and that probably a good many of the posters on here have never heard of. I wanted to keep suggestions mainstream and accessible. Granted, I have not seen every film ever made or am well versed on foreign films and the smaller U.S. independents, but I have seen a good many outside of that and could have as easily made up a list of movies like Greed and Grand Illusion.

 

And trust me, I think it would be very hard for you to name 20 good and significant films I have not at least heard of. Not seen, probably, but not at least aware of. This is kind of my beef that I was expressing earlier. People are not aware of what has come before the past ten years, even as far as mainstream Hollywood is concerned, and yet will still throw up stupid notions like Robert De Niro is the greatest actor to have have walked the earth when they haven't seen thirty seconds of Spencer Tracy or James Cagney on screen. Or that Titanic is the most overrated movie of all time when they just write off Gone with the Wind as some old sucky movie that their grandma likes. And yes, I am being elite and yes I am waving my dick, because I have always concerned myself with educating the younger generations on popular culture and have time and again posted not only lists and opinions, but have encouraged people to post replies or pm me asking questions and getting suggestions. Pop culture ignorance is a pet peeve of mine and it gets me steamed and gets me in a bit of a snobbish mode.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

CJ: Your ideas are intriguing to me and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

 

Be sure to let me know when your new boards are up and running.

[Guest Crucifixio Jones]

I think pop culture ignorance is a common pet peeve. It always frustrates an older person to know that someone younger than themselves doesn't respect their history or care to know about certain things and seem as if they'd rather blindly follow their moronic friends and watch what we consider to be substandard fare as compared to our era.

 

But the truth is, those kids will grow up just like you and I did. And just like we appreciate things that occured or were made long before we were born, they eventually will, too.

 

As for TSM, look at the median age. You should expect to see threads like, "Robert Deniro is like...Whoa!" and "Pacino I Want To Have Your Baby...But Only After You See My Cock in the LSD Folder." When they REGULARLY make topic starters like that, I don't expect their attention spans to allow them to sit through the greatness that is Guess Who's Coming To Dinner? or The Public Enemy.

 

Nothing wrong with being an elitist, you just chose the wrong forum to do it and the easiest messageboard to be an elitist on.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

Hey, I came for the wrestling and the e-fed and strayed into much more.

 

And it actually scares me that one day we'll have former TSM posters in their seventies trying to tell young whipper snappers how great Saved by the Bell and Kylie Minouge were.

[Youth N Asia 0]

Citizen Kane

 

Schindler's List

 

Apocalypse Now

 

Taxi Driver

 

Fargo

[Guest Crucifixio Jones]

You have just started such a MAJOR shitstorm for yourself with EACH of those selections, YNA, whether that was your intention or not.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Wow, it might be a good idea to actually explain why you think they're overrated. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but hey, at least back them up with something.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

Yeah, I could make an argument for each one of the films on YNA's list, but that doesn't mean I actually believe what I would come up with. Let us know what you think. But please don't give the circular logic argument for Citizen Kane, "everyone says it's the greatest movie off all time so it has to be overrated."

[Nighthawk 0]

There's a major problem with old comedy. Comedy usually doesn't lend itself well to age, and pretending stuff like The Court Jester and Auntie Mame is still great comedy is wrong. You just had to be there, I guess. There are, of course, exceptions. I enjoy old films as much as the next guy, I can even appreciate the kind of comedy where you're not supposed to laugh. But it's not 1959 anymore, and those movies aren't as funny today as they were then.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

In regards to Citizen Kane, it's a movie that everyone should at least see and give a chance. We watched it last year in literature class and I was one of the few who didn't give up on it when they saw it wasn't in color. After finishing it, I was the only one who seemed to like it at all. Perhaps it's because I was able to see that it's a great movie and probably one of the most influential movies of all-time, not to mention that it was one of the most innovative ones when it was released. Everyone can have their own opinion, but honestly, I don't see how you couldn't at least appreciate it for being so influential. I can't tell you how many times just the Simpsons alone have made subtle references to it.

[Nighthawk 0]

Citizen Kane is only overrated as the default best movie of all time. It's good, yes. But people don't even think about it anymore, it's just the so called best movie ever because that's what everyone says.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

The main element of Citizen Kane that I don't think holds up is the script, oddly the only thing it won an Oscar for. At times it comes off as way too old Hollywood, stilted and cheesy. Especially the scenes of Leland and Bernstein as old men that feel way too over written.

 

The rest is magnificent, but you really have to understand film making to appreciate it. A casual movie goer, especially of this generation, is going to get bored quick. Citizen Kane is one of the most technically sound films ever made, even today. Welles did things with that movie such as his use of deep focus and reflection that a lot of directors don't or can't figure out how to do today. The acting is superb too and I always peg Everett Sloane and Joseph Cotton as two marvelous actors who get overlooked today. Again, though, a modern audience is going to miss the subtle touches. They're use to Al Pacino's scenery chewing and generic method acting and some of the little flourishes that Welles puts in Kane, especially as he grows more olded, jaded and like Thatcher, will not be noticed.

 

I think Kane's legacy and hype kills it for younger people. They go into it determined not to like it, or thinking it's overhyped and it is such a picture that does't blow you away that they can project those feelings on it without really trying to get into it.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

I think Kane's legacy and hype kills it for younger people. They go into it determined not to like it, or thinking it's overhyped and it is such a picture that does't blow you away that they can project those feelings on it without really trying to get into it.

 

Exactly. Thank you, this is what I was going to say earlier in response to the CK hating. Everyone knows that it's considered one of the best movies of all-time and some people are determined to not like it on the basis of that. One kid in my class even mentioned this saying he thought it was dumb that we praise these movies as great "just because other people say it's the greatest movie ever." He's a bright kid, but I disagreed with him, there. The movie isn't going to seem great if you don't go in with an open mind or are unwilling to like it. Of course you're not going to like it, if you've already made it clear that you aren't going to give it a chance before one second of the movie has been shown.

[Guest Choken One]

My take is this on Citizen Kane...

 

 

The movie is good for what it is but the hype it gets devastated the movie's ability to work for today's level.

 

In 40 years, they are going to look at Star Wars and look at that light we do Citizen Kane...Over Hyped.

 

It doesn't help that Star Wars is pretty much exposed as a weak movie MADE by it's fanboys obsessive devotion to the movie and the series itself already.

 

That's it for the Citizen Kane part.

 

 

Here is another Over Rated Movie(s)...

 

Indiana Jones and the whole series.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

Hmm, I really don't see how you can compare Citizen Kane to Star Wars. They are two completely different movies with two completely different fan bases. Also, they have their reputations and hype for totally different reasons. I don't hear anyone, aside from maybe the most single minded of fanboys, declaring that Star Wars is the greatest movie ever and aside from the special effects there is really not much innovative or groundbreaking with Star Wars as far as storytelling, acting and basic technical specs go. These are the elements Kane's greatness and reputation are based on. Your argument here seems to be that it is overrated because everyone hypes it as being so great, but that has nothing to do with the movie in and of itself. If something lives up to the hype and accolades then it can't be over hyped or overrated.

 

As I did mention above, i can see where the hype on Kane makes it hard to get into for today's audience. But being inaccessible or hard to get the jist of does not make it overrated either.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Here is another Over Rated Movie(s)...

 

Indiana Jones and the whole series.

Star Wars I can agree on, but not this.

 

Raiders and Last Crusade are two of the best pure adventure movies I've ever seen. These two still have the wit and the out-and-out charisma and storytelling to get it done better than almost anything released since. Temple of Doom is wacky, but I don't think that one's really rated that high by the majority of people anyway. Additionally, the Indiana Jones trilogy has kept a pretty low profile in recent history and hasn't had to deal with overexposure. The DVD release this November may change that, though.

[godthedog 0]

my problems with the dick-waving are two:

 

1) there's always someone with a bigger dick than you. if you're in 3rd grade and telling a kindergartener you can beat him up, your point is moot if there's a 5th grader right behind you waiting to kick your ass. no, i'm not the 5th grader in this analogy, but what's the point in going on & on about how much more educated you are when you don't know one tenth of one percent of anything? someone can turn around and make an example out of you, just as you can make an example of some of the kids here. and when you can be chided for the same thing you're chiding someone else for, it's pointless.

 

2) it's off-putting. when it's done excessively, we turn into a clone of the puro board.

 

about 'kane': i did a little half-assed review of it once as a tryout column that never really got off the ground. and, though it could use a rewrite, it explains at least why I think it's so great:

 

...Of course, not everyone thinks it’s the “greatest movie of all time.” Its reputation as the “greatest movie of all time” has garnered the usual backlash, especially from young people. Of all the movies in this “greatest” pantheon (The Godfather, The Rules of the Game, The Bicycle Thief, etc.), Kane is by far the most hated. And it’s easy to see why: in some ways, its appeal just hasn’t aged too well. Modern audiences tend to have a lot of trouble sitting through a movie that, when all is said and done, is just about a bunch of rich white people. On the surface, nothing much happens: the movie’s entirely driven by visual tricks and dialogue (in fact, if there weren’t so many camera tricks, it could very well have been a filmed play). Much of the first half is supposed to be light-hearted and comedic, but writer-director-producer-actor Orson Welles’s attempts at comedy seem flat and forced today. These make the movie seem pretty trite and boring at first. But if one digs past all this, the rewards are incredible.

 

The story in a nutshell is this: newspaper tycoon Charles Foster Kane dies, and his last word is “rosebud.” A reporter seeks to find out what this word meant by asking the people who knew him best, and he’s left with a handful of conflicting stories of Kane’s life, told from various people’s points of view. This is not the kind of story structure that allows for lots of things to happen, but it’s the perfect format to build themes, motifs and character studies from. Each person’s story of Kane reveals new things about his character, but each story also seems to be describing a slightly different man every time. Some of the stories are flattering, most aren’t. We’re left with a portrait of failed idealism, a man who used and pushed away almost everyone who cared about him. And yet, he can’t just be pigeon-holed as an asshole or a bad guy because he’s so complex and fascinating. His motives are good, and Kane follows the arc of how he lost track of them along the way. (Well...kind of. Whether or not he even had those ideals in the first place is itself debatable, but it only adds to the enjoyment of the experience.) The film begins and ends as a mystery, and becomes a tragedy inbetween.

 

The tragedy and the mystery are what make Kane one of my favorite movies, and they tend to get lost in the fray when critics and other filmmakers speak about it. (This is another thing that makes the movie seem less accessible to the audience: Kane is always praised for its technical virtues and groundbreaking methods, never for the story or the characters.) Scores of books have been written about the techniques Welles and his cinematographer Gregg Toland used: putting ceilings in shots, deep focus photography, overlapping dialogue, long takes, invisible edits, etc. And these are the things that help make the movie so great: it still looks like no other movie ever made, and from a technical standpoint it is a ton of fun to watch. But it is often forgotten that all the bells and whistles are done in aid of the story, and at heart Kane really is a great story. It creates its own universe of sharply drawn characters that think and feel react and ebb and learn and change. Kane himself is one of the most sharply-drawn characters I've seen in a movie, with dozens of contradictory pieces that still somehow add up into a complete person. The viewer's changes in attitude towards him are the key to what makes it all work. He has a whole cluster of emotions, actions and motivations that just can't be sifted through. Scorsese did something very similar with Jake La Motta's character in Raging Bull: an example of a man who threw his own greatness away by his excesses and the way he treated the people who loved him, but someone impossible not to feel sorry for. It almost becomes a kind of pathetic anti-tragedy, and it shouldn't even work dramatically (how am I supposed to care about what this guy does for 2 hours if I don't even know if I like him?), but it works beautifully. When Kane asks Susan in that great, soft Orson Welles voice, "Please don't go," it's impossible to just sit back and hate him (even though he almost drove her to suicide less than a reel ago); the kind of complicated emotional payoff that comes when you react to this is one of the few perfect moments I've seen in movies.

 

There are hundreds of engrossing details in the film (in the acting, the writing, the sets, the lighting…everything) that draw one further into the story, create little eurekas in the heads of the viewer that discovers them for the first time, and combine to give a sense of total awe in anyone who tries to take it all in at once. The little things are so subtle, and there are so many of them coming at once (Welles did have a tendency to bombard the viewer with information, making it almost impossible to easily follow the story), that most of them go right over the first-time viewer’s head. The film seems to be totally chaotic and go in a million different directions at once: now it’s just the story of a newspaper man, now it’s a political epic, now there’s a love story, now there’s just a lot of opera, and how the hell did that fireplace get so big? The subtleties are what hold the entire movie together, and the first time around they’re invariably lost. I can’t think of anyone I know who thought Kane was a great movie after seeing it for the first time (myself included). However, I don’t know anyone who’s taken a second or third look at it and hasn’t thought it was great. One’s enjoyment of the movie relies on one’s ability to pay close attention to the motifs: notice how the little things are repeated (like Kane’s empty promises), changed (like Kane’s relationship to his best friend or his second wife) or contrasted (like Kane’s total lack of journalistic integrity coupled with his ability to sincerely create a “declaration of principles” for his paper). The more one watches, the more one picks up on, and this is easily one of the most re-watchable movies ever made.

 

More likely than not, everyone who watches Kane will constantly be asking himself, “Is this the greatest movie ever made?” throughout the 119 minutes. When I first saw Kane at 14, I thought, “No way in hell.” Now I watch it and think, “Well, why shouldn’t it be?”

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

Temple of Doom is fun for me in a very campy way. The Last Crusade really hasn't worn well with me and I've only been able to watch pieces of it when I run across it on t.v. the past few years.

 

Raiders of the Lost Ark is a great adventure film that manages to combine modern sensibilities, film making and stunt work with a feel and tribute to the old adventure serials and films like Gunga Din. I think Raiders has such a following among the younger set because it is a type of movie that studios just don't make anymore, while still being accessible to them and a good film. A big problem is stigma. If they can get over the fact that something like Gunga Din or Beau Gueste was made in 1939 and is in black and white, they might be pleasently surprised to find a movie with a lot of the same elements they liked in Indiana Jones movies.