Coach, Trips, and Goldberg

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

It is being said that Jonathan Coachman will remain an announcer, keeping his spot as the co-host of Heat and will not become a manager. Turning Coachman heel was the sole idea of Vince McMahon, who felt that he needed an "edge" to get rid of the blandness which was evident when he was the lead announcer for RAW for several weeks. Coachman is said to be excited about the angle but also feels slightly sceptical, as he, among others, are not too sure how it will play out.

 

It appears that since the return of both Kevin Nash and Shawn Michaels, Triple H has alienated himself from other talent by reforming a clique with the two. Another member of the RAW roster who isn't currently popular with co-workers is Bill Goldberg, who is said to be antisocial backstage. Goldberg believes that he is above everyone, while being oblivious to the fact that he is a sloppy, unsafe worker.

 

The Cilque making a comeback! That's just great!

[OldSchoolWrestling 0]

Maybe Coach will take the ball and run with it. If he does well enough on Heat, they could eventually move him to Raw. If he fumbles with it, then expect TNA to have a new backstage interviewer in a couple months.

[Downhome 0]

As I predicted, the Coach bullshit (I was entertained with it,but it took up too much time and went over actual WORKERS) is doing nothing more than to put more focus on Coach.

 

Way to go WWE, way to waste our time.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

Maybe they'll realize how great Coach is going over and take another direction with it.

[Ultra Violence 0]

Maybe Coach will take the ball and run with it. If he does well enough on Heat, they could eventually move him to Raw. If he fumbles with it, then expect TNA to have a new backstage interviewer in a couple months.

I think the WWE need to deal with king/JR NOW!

[Lil' Bitch 0]

HHH Vs. Goldberg = The Battle of the Arrogant Pricks

 

I was at SummerSlam and I thought Shane / Eric was going to suck like really bad, but when Coach SHOCKED just about everybody making his heel turn, I mean COACH of all people, I got into it.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

I hope The Clique really starts taking control of RAW. Fuck Evolution. I mean I like them and all but I would much rather see "The Boys" running shit.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

You know what would make Coach's heel stuff even better? If they allowed him to make shoot-like comments. Allow him to say stuff like:

 

"JR you're sitting here whining about not calling a match. I'd like to see you say that to Lawler! How come you never get onto him about that huh?"

 

Or have him point out JR's obvious stupid analogies.

 

"JR you idiot. You just said that Kane urinated on the crowd. Do you even think about this stuff before you say it?"

[notJames 0]

The fact that those three crippled pricks still have jobs, let alone clog up the main event with their stale act, is proof positive that the Clique is running shit.

 

How anyone can like any of those three cockbites, not to mention collectively, speaks volumes about how fans are willing to settle for shitty wrestling.

[geniusMoment 0]

JR gets on Lawler for not calling the match a lot.

[Steviekick 0]

I did like the Coach/Christian interaction on Raw. Maybe he could be his publicist.

[Downhome 0]

Maybe they'll realize how great Coach is going over and take another direction with it.

Tell me again how this is helping a Pro. Wrestler, how this will lead to an actual WORKING being put over. Please, I'd love for you to explain that one again. Well, not so much as explain but rather, tiptoe around it as you did before. Just face it, it's just ANOTHER angle to shit on the wrestlers, in which they play pawns, ONCE AGAIN, in the overall scheme and angles of the non workers.

 

I still want an example of how this is commonplace, I'm still waiting.

[Cherry Blossom Viscount 0]

Maybe they'll realize how great Coach is going over and take another direction with it.

Tell me again how this is helping a Pro. Wrestler, how this will lead to an actual WORKING being put over. Please, I'd love for you to explain that one again. Well, not so much as explain but rather, tiptoe around it as you did before. Just face it, it's just ANOTHER angle to shit on the wrestlers, in which they play pawns, ONCE AGAIN, in the overall scheme and angles of the non workers.

 

I still want an example of how this is commonplace, I'm still waiting.

Maybe they'll see that Coach is a pretty good talker and can draw some good heel heat and put him with somebody that needs it. I think that's what Johnson was getting at. How hard was it to see that? This isn't fucking rocket science DH.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

Maybe they'll realize how great Coach is going over and take another direction with it.

Tell me again how this is helping a Pro. Wrestler, how this will lead to an actual WORKING being put over. Please, I'd love for you to explain that one again. Well, not so much as explain but rather, tiptoe around it as you did before. Just face it, it's just ANOTHER angle to shit on the wrestlers, in which they play pawns, ONCE AGAIN, in the overall scheme and angles of the non workers.

 

I still want an example of how this is commonplace, I'm still waiting.

There are plenty of directions they could take the Coach angle. I was thinking of maybe having him join Teedy Long and then have him be the third man at the table.

 

It's just an idea though.

 

By the way DH, who pissed in your Cheerios for the past week?

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

They could go with a three man commentating team, but JR and King would drown him out probably because he would be bombarded from both sides. But if it works it would help get the focus back on the ring maybe and would provide a heel commentator finally.

 

Coach could join Teddy Long and be a manager.

 

This could help out the wrestlers if done right.

[Guest Polish_Rifle]

they should be working on angles that will add to the depth of the characters of WRESTLERS! All of a sudden people care about Coach because he turned heel and made fun on JR. Now why couldn't the "powers that be" do the same for the WRESTLERS?

[Downhome 0]

Maybe they'll realize how great Coach is going over and take another direction with it.

Tell me again how this is helping a Pro. Wrestler, how this will lead to an actual WORKING being put over. Please, I'd love for you to explain that one again. Well, not so much as explain but rather, tiptoe around it as you did before. Just face it, it's just ANOTHER angle to shit on the wrestlers, in which they play pawns, ONCE AGAIN, in the overall scheme and angles of the non workers.

 

I still want an example of how this is commonplace, I'm still waiting.

Maybe they'll see that Coach is a pretty good talker and can draw some good heel heat and put him with somebody that needs it. I think that's what Johnson was getting at. How hard was it to see that? This isn't fucking rocket science DH.

Are you blind, or are you just slow?

 

It is being said that Jonathan Coachman will remain an announcer, keeping his spot as the co-host of Heat and will not become a manager.

 

The guy isn't going to be a manager, he's just an ANNOUNCER, period. They could have made it known that he was a heel now any number of ways without making talent look stupid, without using the wrestlers as pawns, and without taking up TV time which could have been used to actuall focus on the guys who matter.

 

I like that Coach is a heel, but it should NOT be done at the expense of talent.

[notJames 0]

Amen. (To both Polish and DH)

 

People are falling all over themselves doing 180s about the Coach now that he's an on-air personality with personality (according to some people... my jury is still out on that), yet that does nothing to make me care about the guys who actually wrestle. After all, I tune in for the wrestling, not for the squabbles of desk jockeys who couldn't call a match if Gordon Solie possessed them.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

What talent has it been at the expense of? Shane? Why are we caring about the expense of Shane all of the sudden? He was made to look pretty strong the next night that's for sure.

 

I like Heel Coach because it's a step to fix one of WWE's problems (the commentary) It's a start.

[notJames 0]

I don't consider Shane talent any more than I consider weekend warriors like Nash and HBK talent.

 

And the real cost to talent is airtime. Guys can't get over if they don't get exposed to the fans. They also can't get over if they're not given anything meaningful to do. So to say that there's no expense to talent is overlooking how much energy is being put into Coach's new "push" and how that could have been used to get a wrestler over.

Edited August 28, 2003 by notJames

[Downhome 0]

There are plenty of directions they could take the Coach angle. I was thinking of maybe having him join Teedy Long and then have him be the third man at the table.

 

It's just an idea though.

I want you to give me, yet again, another example. Give men an example this time of a few of the good things that could come from this, other than having a pretty cool heel announcer now.

 

I hate to break it to you, but by having him join the Teddy Long stable is NOT worth the trouble of making the actual workers look like shit, and taking TV time from them. What in the fuck would be a reason for him to even be with Teddy? Just to stand there and be "heelish" as he goes over and makes actual wrestlers look bad? It's not worth it, period.

 

I'm also STILL waiting on an example of that other issue that you have ignored so far. Like I said, if you can't do so, then just say so and it'll be forgotten.

 

By the way DH, who pissed in your Cheerios for the past week?

 

When someone says something stupid and says they can back it up and then refuses to do so, that pisses me off. All you have to do is back up what you say, it isn't that hard to do if you have any idea what you are talking about.

 

*waiting*

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

And once again I ask what talent besides Shane has this been done at the expense of? I guess you could say it's taking up time that could be used otherwise, but it's gotten people's attention so far so it needs to have it's time.

 

I think a heel announcer if used properly could help put over the wrestlers in the ring. Because right now no one is in the booth to put over the heels.

[Downhome 0]

What talent has it been at the expense of? Shane? Why are we caring about the expense of Shane all of the sudden? He was made to look pretty strong the next night that's for sure.

 

I like Heel Coach because it's a step to fix one of WWE's problems (the commentary) It's a start.

First of all, it was at the expense of ALL of the talent when it gets down to it. It took away time from everyone else on the roster, and that in itself is enough to piss me off. It's time to END this era of non-workers dominating TV so much, it's time to END the pratice of allowing the Pro. Wrestlers simply being used as pawns in the storylines of those involving and centering around non-workers.

 

The Coach angle made a pawn of Christian. Say what you will about the guy, but at least he's an actual Pro. Wrestler. It made him look like a moron that he couldn't beat, yes you called it, ANOTHER ANNOUNCER in Jerry "The King" Lawler, without having Coach run in to cause the distraction.

 

It's little things like that which should happen. Had Christian had a larger part in the storyline, then I could accept it. The fact, is that he was only involved because they needed a wrestler to actually get in there with the non-worker. They not only used a Pro. Wrestler as a PAWN, oh no.

 

They used the f'n IC champion. Hell, it not only hurts Christian, it also makes the IC title look like shit, once again.

 

That's just that one angle, there were other Pro. Wrestlers that were used badly because of this past RAW including Jericho and Kane. It just makes me sick to see the McMahons and the f'n ANNOUNCERS being pushed harder, and more time being spent on them, then other actual Pro. Wrestlers.

 

If it doesn't make you sick also, then you are much to accepting of the current state of Pro. Wrestling.

 

That means a lot coming from me, if you know my history here at all.

[Downhome 0]

I guess you could say it's taking up time that could be used otherwise, but it's gotten people's attention so far so it needs to have it's time.

 

I think a heel announcer if used properly could help put over the wrestlers in the ring. Because right now no one is in the booth to put over the heels.

I agree 100%. My entire point is that it's being done the wrong way.

 

I could sit here and toss out endless ways using some "armchair booking" that Coach could have become a very over heel announcer.

 

It was done in the past without hurting the talent that matters, and it could be done today if they just wanted to put their heads together for a split second and to think something up.

[notJames 0]

But it's not like this is something that came out of the blue. If the evil Coach thing was just some accident they stumbled on and it took off, then I might be inclined to agree. But if you think about how this has been built up over the past few weeks (King's negative reaction to having Coach at the booth, his lackluster dismissal upon JR's return, the amount of time he was given on the PPV and the subsequent RAW), you can see this was mapped out quite carefully. That attention to detail could so easily have gone to any number of wrestlers, in terms of presentation, proper build-up, etc.

 

And I'm not just talking about now. This is stuff that should be laid out weeks before a new guy is slated to debut on TV, or when an established wrestler is primed for a renewed push. Now think about how many guys on RAW are placed on TV without a real sense of purpose or an interesting gimmick, or the guys who are wasted on the sidelines, brought out only when F.G.B. needs someone to squash or when something else on Trips breaks down and they need to fill 10 minutes.

 

It's haphazard planning and misplaced energy like this that killed many a promotion before WW_, and as far as I'm concerned, it may be a slow crawl for Vince and Co., but they're heading there too.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

There are plenty of directions they could take the Coach angle.  I was thinking of maybe having him join Teedy Long and then have him be the third man at the table. 

 

It's just an idea though.

I want you to give me, yet again, another example. Give men an example this time of a few of the good things that could come from this, other than having a pretty cool heel announcer now.

 

I hate to break it to you, but by having him join the Teddy Long stable is NOT worth the trouble of making the actual workers look like shit, and taking TV time from them. What in the fuck would be a reason for him to even be with Teddy? Just to stand there and be "heelish" as he goes over and makes actual wrestlers look bad? It's not worth it, period.

 

I'm also STILL waiting on an example of that other issue that you have ignored so far. Like I said, if you can't do so, then just say so and it'll be forgotten.

 

By the way DH, who pissed in your Cheerios for the past week?

 

When someone says something stupid and says they can back it up and then refuses to do so, that pisses me off. All you have to do is back up what you say, it isn't that hard to do if you have any idea what you are talking about.

 

*waiting*

I have already stated some examples but people said they weren't good examples. So like I said before I am not some wrestling geek who knows every detail of every show and angle for the past twenty years. So, if that means I am wrong, then so be it.

 

But what I do know is when someone is overreacting to shitty writing.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

Maybe I'm just grasping for whatever seems interesting in these bad times.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

Maybe I'm just grasping for whatever seems interesting in these bad times.

I was not reffering to you LaParka. You actually are one of the few here who share my optimism.

[Downhome 0]

I have already stated some examples but people said they weren't good examples. So like I said before I am not some wrestling geek who knows every detail of every show and angle for the past twenty years. So, if that means I am wrong, then so be it.

 

But what I do know is when someone is overreacting to shitty writing.

Your examples were wrong, and didn't have anything to do with what is happening today. If you have been a Pro. Wrestling fan for as long as you have been, then you would be able to cite an example if you could even come up with one, of what is happening today, ie, non-workers dominating the industry most of the time.

 

The fact, is that it hasn't ever happened before, and the reason is simply that the McMahons have changed how this industry is presented.

 

That doesn't make it right, as it is WRONG.

 

The wrestlers should never play PAWN in any angle with non-workers, period. That is all there is to it. Pro. Wrestling isn't about the announcers, the managers, or the owners and GM's. It's about the wrestlers, and when ANY promoter forgets this, then they have lost their way.

 

It's very noble of you to admit that you were wrong, that's all I wanted. Just, in the future, only claim something when you can back it up. That's all I, and others here, ask for.

[Guest The Grand Pubah of 1620]

I have already stated some examples but people said they weren't good examples.  So like I said before I am not some wrestling geek who knows every detail of every show and angle for the past twenty years.  So, if that means I am wrong, then so be it.

 

But what I do know is when someone is overreacting to shitty writing.

Your examples were wrong, and didn't have anything to do with what is happening today. If you have been a Pro. Wrestling fan for as long as you have been, then you would be able to cite an example if you could even come up with one, of what is happening today, ie, non-workers dominating the industry most of the time.

 

The fact, is that it hasn't ever happened before, and the reason is simply that the McMahons have changed how this industry is presented.

 

That doesn't make it right, as it is WRONG.

 

The wrestlers should never play PAWN in any angle with non-workers, period. That is all there is to it. Pro. Wrestling isn't about the announcers, the managers, or the owners and GM's. It's about the wrestlers, and when ANY promoter forgets this, then they have lost their way.

 

It's very noble of you to admit that you were wrong, that's all I wanted. Just, in the future, only claim something when you can back it up. That's all I, and others here, ask for.

The thing is DH that is where the problem is. I don't think that they were dominating the show. With that being said there is no reason for this discussion to go on any further.