California recall debate

[NoCalMike 0]

Yes on 54!

And your reasoning is?

 

I don't want you and Mike sidetracking this into a 54 arguement (and I'm letting both you and him know in advance), but I might as well get both sides.

 

 

And Mike, Davis is only 10 months into this term. It took Bush 9 months before he got viewed as something more substantial than "harmless idiot", so I don't think the new Gov won't have enough time to get anything done.

In case you missed it, I just explained why I think people should vote NO on 54.

[NoCalMike 0]

Yes on 54!

And your reasoning is?

 

I don't want you and Mike sidetracking this into a 54 arguement (and I'm letting both you and him know in advance), but I might as well get both sides.

 

 

And Mike, Davis is only 10 months into this term. It took Bush 9 months before he got viewed as something more substantial than "harmless idiot", so I don't think the new Gov won't have enough time to get anything done.

I understand this Jotw, however there is more to it then a new governor getting in there pressing a bunch of "make good things happen" buttons. The legislature is all screwed up, and I would imagine it would still be the same for awhile no matter who wins.

 

Also, if you didn't know already there is already people organizing ANOTHER recall if a republican gets the job. Now I am not for this and think it is even more lame than this recall, but honestly in a state with this type of population, how hard is it to get 900,000 signatures, which is all it takes. So this could really just be the beginning.....

[Vyce 0]

Simon just endorsed Arnold.

 

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

[NoCalMike 0]

Simon just endorsed Arnold.

 

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

probably makes no difference. No listened to Simon last time, but hey consolodation of the GOP is probably good for their chances.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

In case you missed it, I just explained why I think people should vote NO on 54.

Yeah, I was asking Spicy for his take. And then I was requesting that the two of you don't tear into each other as sometimes can happen in these issues.

 

Also, if you didn't know already there is already people organizing ANOTHER recall if a republican gets the job.

 

It took big bucks to get the signatures the first time, and the GOP can just barely get a majority of the state to agree for one recall. I doubt the Democrats could convince them to do it again.

[NoCalMike 0]

In case you missed it, I just explained why I think people should vote NO on 54.

Yeah, I was asking Spicy for his take. And then I was requesting that the two of you don't tear into each other as sometimes can happen in these issues.

 

Also, if you didn't know already there is already people organizing ANOTHER recall if a republican gets the job.

 

It took big bucks to get the signatures the first time, and the GOP can just barely get a majority of the state to agree for one recall. I doubt the Democrats could convince them to do it again.

Ok, well I was just wondering how you felt about the position I took and my opinion on it.

 

Oh and as far as taking a lot of money, sure it did, but it's not like there aren't a bunch of rich liberals in this state. Remember the entire recall was suggested and started by some guy that WANTED TO BE Governor.....I was just saying that if people standing outside shopping centers with petitions could probably collect 900,000 signatures over time, no problem.

[Firestarter 0]

Ok I will tell you why.  From the description alone it sounds like a good thing.  However you have to understand what it is banning.  Research.  That alone should make you want to vote no.

It is research on where people's ancestors came from. Fifty years ago some white people "researched" the ancestry of tanned men to make sure their daughters weren't marrying anyone with nigger blood. Want to justify that next?

 

How can BANNING research on ANYTHING be a good thing?  It is eliminating knowledge or potential knowledge about a messed up system.  To be more specific:  Basically what Prop 54 is going to do if passed is, it will get rid of information that tells us where funding for schools is going and not going based on the race of the kids going to the schools.  Therefore, if there is a pattern that is developing showing that prodominetly minority schools recieving less funding over rural schools that are mostly caucasian, the whole process of knowing this would be taken away.

(emphasis added)

 

Good. Funding should be based on need. Race is irrelevant. We have laws against racial discrimination. Anyone who feels that his race affected a decision to fire him can file suit for wrongful dismissal. A predominantly black public school which is refused funding by a white legislator on the basis of racism can file suit against the state, and as a political analyst I can tell you that the accusation wouldn't even have to be true for white legislators all over the country to fall over themselves begging to give tens of millions and fighting each other for the privilege. There are no grand racist conspiracies in this country. There are incompetent bureaucracies, noncompetitive wage structures, and unacceptable standards, all of which are established, fed, and nurtured by the teachers' unions. It comes as no surprise to me that they are among the most vicious opponents of the dream of Dr King.

 

This has NOTHING to do with "dividing the nation" don't listen to that rhetorical tripe that means nothing.

It means everything. It is central to the issue. Do you want a colourblind society or not? Do you want an America in which your skin colour means nothing? In which your ancestors' origins mean nothing? In which we don't think of our friends and neighbours as black, white, Latino, Asian, Oriental, but simply American? Yes or no?

 

How do you think tracking and "researching" our most superficial differences, rather than our fundamental needs, will make that dream a reality?

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Fifty years ago some white people "researched" the ancestry of tanned men to make sure their daughters weren't marrying anyone with nigger blood. Want to justify that next?

If that's not a straw man, it's damned close.

 

Look, I'm trying NOT to turn this into an arguement here. If you want to provide your opinions on the measure Marney, then I wouldn't even attempt to stop you, but this kind of statement is just trolling for flames and you know it.

[NoCalMike 0]

Ok I will tell you why.  From the description alone it sounds like a good thing.  However you have to understand what it is banning.  Research.  That alone should make you want to vote no.

It is research on where people's ancestors came from. Fifty years ago some white people "researched" the ancestry of tanned men to make sure their daughters weren't marrying anyone with nigger blood. Want to justify that next?

 

How can BANNING research on ANYTHING be a good thing?  It is eliminating knowledge or potential knowledge about a messed up system.  To be more specific:  Basically what Prop 54 is going to do if passed is, it will get rid of information that tells us where funding for schools is going and not going based on the race of the kids going to the schools.  Therefore, if there is a pattern that is developing showing that prodominetly minority schools recieving less funding over rural schools that are mostly caucasian, the whole process of knowing this would be taken away.

(emphasis added)

 

Good. Funding should be based on need. Race is irrelevant. We have laws against racial discrimination. Anyone who feels that his race affected a decision to fire him can file suit for wrongful dismissal. A predominantly black public school which is refused funding by a white legislator on the basis of racism can file suit against the state, and as a political analyst I can tell you that the accusation wouldn't even have to be true for white legislators all over the country to fall over themselves begging to give tens of millions and fighting each other for the privilege. There are no grand racist conspiracies in this country. There are incompetent bureaucracies, noncompetitive wage structures, and unacceptable standards, all of which are established, fed, and nurtured by the teachers' unions. It comes as no surprise to me that they are among the most vicious opponents of the dream of Dr King.

 

This has NOTHING to do with "dividing the nation" don't listen to that rhetorical tripe that means nothing.

It means everything. It is central to the issue. Do you want a colourblind society or not? Do you want an America in which your skin colour means nothing? In which your ancestors' origins mean nothing? In which we don't think of our friends and neighbours as black, white, Latino, Asian, Oriental, but simply American? Yes or no?

 

How do you think tracking and "researching" our most superficial differences, rather than our fundamental needs, will make that dream a reality?

"some white people" huh? WTF does that mean? Great, because I am sure the same types of people are doing research on funding for schools!?! Seriously, what in the fuck type of comparison is that?

 

 

"A predominantly black public school which is refused funding by a white legislator on the basis of racism can file suit against the state, and as a political analyst I can tell you that the accusation wouldn't even have to be true for white legislators all over the country to fall over themselves begging to give tens of millions and fighting each other for the privilege. There are no grand racist conspiracies in this country"

 

Oh well that is really golden isn't it, and where exactly would you find the facts and figures to support such claims? That is the whole point of why research is necessary, thank you for helping my argument. Unless you feel no research is necessary and everyone can just cry wolf.

 

 

No one said funding should be based on race alone Marney. However we do need to research where the the funding is going and where it isn't and we need to find out why. If race has something to do with the crooked system of school funding distribution, then shouldn't that in fact be made known to the public? That fact of the matter is schools in inner cities, are being severely underfunded and so far there has been no explanation as to why. If you just want to pretend it has nothing to do with race then fine.

[Firestarter 0]

Fifty years ago some white people "researched" the ancestry of tanned men to make sure their daughters weren't marrying anyone with nigger blood. Want to justify that next?

If that's not a straw man, it's damned close... this kind of statement is just trolling for flames and you know it.

It's nothing of the sort. It is a direct parallel.

 

In the past, black people were considered unworthy of marriage to whites. There were laws against it. Mixed people were called mulattos and mongrels who had disgraced their heritage. It was discrimination based on race, pure and simple. Do you deny that?

Now, in the present, we have white people denied admission to universities for which they are eminently qualified, on the basis that their race has had advantages over other races in the past. It is discrimination based on race, pure and simple. Do you deny that?

What we have in the future is a choice. We can either stop punishing and rewarding people for the colour of their skin or we can continue. We can be racists or we can be Americans. We can assess people's needs based on economic status or we can assume they need help based on their skin colour. I'm not a racist, and I know which side I'm on. Do you?

[NoCalMike 0]

Do you want a colourblind society or not? Do you want an America in which your skin colour means nothing? In which your ancestors' origins mean nothing? In which we don't think of our friends and neighbours as black, white, Latino, Asian, Oriental, but simply American? Yes or no?

 

How do you think tracking and "researching" our most superficial differences, rather than our fundamental needs, will make that dream a reality?

Actually, NO, I don't want the color of people's skin to mean NOTHING. I do want everyone to be treated equally though IN SPITE of the color of their skin, not because we all are wearing blinders that makes us all see the same "american" skin.

 

It would be rather dull if everyone in the country shared one exact culture and custom. Instead I like the fact that people can be considered american and still integrate their own culture into american culture at the same time. It works rather easily.

[NoCalMike 0]

Fifty years ago some white people "researched" the ancestry of tanned men to make sure their daughters weren't marrying anyone with nigger blood. Want to justify that next?

If that's not a straw man, it's damned close... this kind of statement is just trolling for flames and you know it.

It's nothing of the sort. It is a direct parallel.

 

In the past, black people were considered unworthy of marriage to whites. There were laws against it. Mixed people were called mulattos and mongrels who had disgraced their heritage. It was discrimination based on race, pure and simple. Do you deny that?

Now, in the present, we have white people denied admission to universities for which they are eminently qualified, on the basis that their race has had advantages over other races in the past. It is discrimination based on race, pure and simple. Do you deny that?

What we have in the future is a choice. We can either stop punishing and rewarding people for the colour of their skin or we can continue. We can be racists or we can be Americans. We can assess people's needs based on economic status or we can assume they need help based on their skin colour. I'm not a racist, and I know which side I'm on. Do you?

Yes Marney and STILL TODAY, some schools are deemed unworthy of proper funding. A lot of them by "coinicidence" happen to be located in the inner city and filled with minorities. See I am not sure what you are getting at, are you honestly trying to suggest that there is no longer racist practices going on at the grade school level as far as funding goes? Oh and as far as college emissions go, I have not talked to one white kid that has not recieved a quality education due to affirmative action.

[Firestarter 0]

"some white people" huh? WTF does that mean? Great, because I am sure the same types of people are doing research on funding for schools!?! Seriously, what in the fuck type of comparison is that?

A very pertinent one. See my last post.

 

Oh well that is really golden isn't it, and where exactly would you find the facts and figures to support such claims?

Two words: Trent Lott.

 

we do need to research where the the funding is going and where it isn't and we need to find out why

Not if it's based on race. We absolutely do not need to know that.

 

If race has something to do with the crooked system of school funding distribution, then shouldn't that in fact be made known to the public?

Absolutely. And there are private citizens, hypothetical victims, investigative reporters, law enforcement agencies, and courts to do exactly that.

 

That fact of the matter is schools in inner cities, are being severely underfunded and so far there has been no explanation as to why.

All the factors cited in my first post on this subject: incompetent bureaucracies, noncompetitive wage structures, and unacceptable standards. DC is over 61% black and overwhelmingly urban, and it has some of the worst schools in the country. Yet it spends some of the highest amounts on its abysmal educational system. It has nothing to do with funding. It has everything to do with the unions. They are the root of the evil, and until they are uprooted and their stranglehold on the nation's children broken once and for all, no amount of money will make any difference whatsoever.

[Firestarter 0]

Actually, NO, I don't want the color of people's skin to mean NOTHING. I do want everyone to be treated equally though IN SPITE of the color of their skin, not because we all are wearing blinders that makes us all see the same "american" skin.

 

It would be rather dull if everyone in the country shared one exact culture and custom. Instead I like the fact that people can be considered american and still integrate their own culture into american culture at the same time. It works rather easily.

Now, this is a straw man. Nowhere did I say that we should abandon cultures wholesale and deny history. Yet saying that you want people to be treated the same "IN SPITE" of the colour of their skin is rather telling. It means you think we're innately inclined to treat people differently based on their race, and we can only overcome it through taught principle. I don't think that's true.

[NoCalMike 0]

Actually, NO, I don't want the color of people's skin to mean NOTHING.  I do want everyone to be treated equally though IN SPITE of the color of their skin, not because we all are wearing blinders that makes us all see the same "american" skin. 

 

It would be rather dull if everyone in the country shared one exact culture and custom.  Instead I like the fact that people can be considered american and still integrate their own culture into american culture at the same time.  It works rather easily.

Now, this is a straw man. Nowhere did I say that we should abandon cultures wholesale and deny history. Yet saying that you want people to be treated the same "IN SPITE" of the colour of their skin is rather telling. It means you think we're innately inclined to treat people differently based on their race, and we can only overcome it through taught principle. I don't think that's true.

"in spite" was the wrong word usage.

[NoCalMike 0]

Oh well that is really golden isn't it, and where exactly would you find the facts and figures to support such claims?

Two words: Trent Lott.

 

Thereby meaning GOVERNMENT RESEARCH? I mean I am sure he didn't just read it in PEOPLE or something.

[Firestarter 0]

Oh well that is really golden isn't it, and where exactly would you find the facts and figures to support such claims?

Two words: Trent Lott.

Thereby meaning GOVERNMENT RESEARCH? I mean I am sure he didn't just read it in PEOPLE or something.

Thereby meaning that even implicit praise for blatant institutionalised racism, let alone its reality, is tolerated nowhere in this country at all.

[NoCalMike 0]

lack of research breeds ignorance and ignorance is one of the leading causes of racism.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

EDIT: Forget it. I don't want to argue about that anymore.

 

Yes Marney and STILL TODAY, some schools are deemed unworthy of proper funding. A lot of them by "coinicidence" happen to be located in the inner city and filled with minorities.

 

Okay Mike, so here's part 2 of my question: If they couldn't record this info and thus wouldn't know which schools are filled with minorities, how could they imbalance it against them. My best guess is by location (such as the inner city, as you suggested) but there's no ban against labeling schools that way either.

 

 

It seems like this accomplishes a great big deal of nothing in these regards. I could see an arguement about medical research, but the state doesn't run hospitals either.

Edited September 26, 2003 by Jobber of the Week

[NoCalMike 0]

Well Jotw, the thing is.....doing the research alone still doesn't guarantee anything will change. That is the tricky part. Shooting down prop 54 doesn't mean, HOORAY EQUALITY FOR ALL, but it does mean research will be taken and patterns of racism and injustice will be available for everyone to see. Or you can vote for 54 and hope all of this is covered up and never explored or looked at, and we can keep the cycle of affirmative action going. See killing this prop and getting the info out there could be the first step into ending affirmative action all togther. It will take awhile though.

 

And yes, location could be a primary example, or just schools with lower performance in general would not get looked into to see why this might be happening.

 

This issue is bigger than my soundbites elude to. It is all very indicative of the evil nature of some people.

[Firestarter 0]

By basically painting his side with the indefensible position of supporting some retarded tradition from many decades ago, you have built a straw man.

Both his side and the "retarded tradition from many decades ago" are based on the exact same principles. There is no straw man here. If you deny the one, you deny the other. If you accept the one, you have no logical argument against the other. There is a parallel.

 

Ultimately, this is about one question: how do you determine a human being's worth? I, for one, refuse to make any determination whatsoever based on skin colour.

[NoCalMike 0]

By basically painting his side with the indefensible position of supporting some retarded tradition from many decades ago, you have built a straw man.

Both his side and the "retarded tradition from many decades ago" are based on the exact same principles. There is no straw man here. If you deny the one, you deny the other. If you accept the one, you have no logical argument against the other. There is a parallel.

 

Ultimately, this is about one question: how do you determine a human being's worth? I, for one, refuse to make any determination whatsoever based on skin colour.

Nor Do I. Never once did I say inner city schools should get extra or MORE funding then any other school because they are minorities. EQUAL, yes. What you are trying to do is ban research that will cause the racism currently going on to continue. Like I said before, if you want to put a blindfold on right now and pretend that certain schools aren't being underfunded because of race and/or location, then ok that is your opinion, however I disagree and feel all possibilities must be explored as to why the disproportinate funding is going on. Race is just ONE of them, not the only one. I am very happy that YOU don't determine a human being's worth by the color of their skin, however some people in charge of funding obviously do and it needs to be corrected. Once again, how is RESEARCH on this a bad thing?

[Firestarter 0]

if you want to put a blindfold on right now and pretend that certain schools aren't being underfunded because of race and/or location, then ok that is your opinion, however I disagree

That's nice. Can you explain Washington, DC yet? You know, the nation's capital?

[NoCalMike 0]

if you want to put a blindfold on right now and pretend that certain schools aren't being underfunded because of race and/or location, then ok that is your opinion, however I disagree

That's nice. Can you explain Washington, DC yet? You know, the nation's capital?

I thought this was about California.

[Firestarter 0]

You said black and urban schools were underfunded because of some vast racist conspiracy. Do you mean that only Californian schools are affected by your hypothetical conspiracy of racist legislators, bureaucrats, and educators? Spiffy. What happened, did they just glance over the state line and say "Oh no, we can't discriminate in that direction, that's Nevada?"

[Guest Sagrada3099]

I, personally, see no reason for there to be any type of research based on race. This is something I just DO NOT get, where for some reason the nation as a whole wants more equality, but then shit like "Well, we need to give more money to minority charities" seems like a good idea to some. I mean, isnt the point of "equality" to be that we treat people of different races the same as we would treat people of our own race? Hell, isnt the point that we dont even make that distinction? That everyone are just regarded as, you know, Human Beings? Wasnt that the point of the Civil Rights Movement?

 

I mean, that's just my take on the matter.

[Firestarter 0]

And Dr King's. Funny how the views of the man who did so much to destroy racism are called racist now.

 

I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal." I have a dream that one day on the red hills of Georgia the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slaveowners will be able to sit down together at a table of brotherhood. I have a dream that one day even the state of Mississippi, a desert state, sweltering with the heat of injustice and oppression, will be transformed into an oasis of freedom and justice. I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today.

 

I have a dream that one day the state of Alabama, whose governor's lips are presently dripping with the words of interposition and nullification, will be transformed into a situation where little black boys and black girls will be able to join hands with little white boys and white girls and walk together as sisters and brothers. I have a dream today. I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight, and the glory of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together. This is our hope. This is the faith with which I return to the South. With this faith we will be able to hew out of the mountain of despair a stone of hope. With this faith we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood. With this faith we will be able to work together, to pray together, to struggle together, to go to jail together, to stand up for freedom together, knowing that we will be free one day.

 

This will be the day when all of God's children will be able to sing with a new meaning, "My country, 'tis of thee, sweet land of liberty, of thee I sing. Land where my fathers died, land of the pilgrim's pride, from every mountainside, let freedom ring." And if America is to be a great nation, this must become true. So let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of New Hampshire. Let freedom ring from the mighty mountains of New York. Let freedom ring from the heightening Alleghenies of Pennsylvania! Let freedom ring from the snowcapped Rockies of Colorado! Let freedom ring from the curvaceous peaks of California! But not only that; let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of Georgia! Let freedom ring from Lookout Mountain of Tennessee! Let freedom ring from every hill and every molehill of Mississippi. From every mountainside, let freedom ring.

 

When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last! free at last! thank God Almighty, we are free at last!"

 

"I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

 

I wish they did, sir. I wish they did.

Edited September 26, 2003 by Cancer Marney

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

This has nothing to do with California, or research, but it does have a tingle of Affirmative Action to it, and I found the story funny as hell...

 

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/na...0,5341103.story

 

Texas University Shuts Down Bake Sale

 

DALLAS -- Southern Methodist University shut down a bake sale Wednesday in which cookies were offered for sale at different prices, depending on the buyer's race or gender.

 

The sale was organized by the Young Conservatives of Texas, who said it was intended as a protest of affirmative action.

 

A sign said white males had to pay $1 for a cookie. The price was 75 cents for white women, 50 cents for Hispanics and 25 cents for blacks.

 

Members of the conservative group said they meant no offense and were only trying to protest the use of race or gender as a factor in college admissions.

 

Similar sales have been held by College Republican chapters at colleges in at least five other states since February.

 

A black student filed a complaint with SMU, saying the sale was offensive. SMU officials said they halted the event after 45 minutes because it created a potentially unsafe situation.

 

"This was not an issue about free speech," Tim Moore, director of the SMU student center, said in a story for Thursday's edition of The Dallas Morning News. "It was really an issue where we had a hostile environment being created."

 

The sale drew a crowd outside the student center and several students engaged in a shouting match, Moore said.

 

David C. Rushing, 23, a law student and chairman of Young Conservatives of Texas at SMU and for the state, said the event didn't get out of hand. At most, a dozen students gathered around the table of cookies and Rice Krispies treats, he said.

 

"We copied what's been done at multiple campuses around the country to illustrate our opinion of affirmative action and how we think it's unfair," he said.

 

Matt Houston, a 19-year-old sophomore, called the group's price list offensive.

 

"My reaction was disgust because of the ignorance of some SMU students," said Houston, who is black. "They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."

 

The group sold three cookies during its protest, raising $1.50.

 

In June, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled universities could use race as a factor in admissions under limited conditions. In Texas, universities had been banned from using race as a factor under a 1996 decision by a lower court.

[NoCalMike 0]

You said black and urban schools were underfunded because of some vast racist conspiracy. Do you mean that only Californian schools are affected by your hypothetical conspiracy of racist legislators, bureaucrats, and educators? Spiffy. What happened, did they just glance over the state line and say "Oh no, we can't discriminate in that direction, that's Nevada?"

"vast racist conspiracy" "hypothetical conspiracy of racist legislators"

 

Funny, I don't remember ever saying any of that, hmmmmm.

[NoCalMike 0]

And Dr King's. Funny how the views of the man who did so much to destroy racism are called racist now.

 

I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal." I have a dream that one day on the red hills of Georgia the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slaveowners will be able to sit down together at a table of brotherhood. I have a dream that one day even the state of Mississippi, a desert state, sweltering with the heat of injustice and oppression, will be transformed into an oasis of freedom and justice. I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today.

 

I have a dream that one day the state of Alabama, whose governor's lips are presently dripping with the words of interposition and nullification, will be transformed into a situation where little black boys and black girls will be able to join hands with little white boys and white girls and walk together as sisters and brothers. I have a dream today. I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight, and the glory of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together. This is our hope. This is the faith with which I return to the South. With this faith we will be able to hew out of the mountain of despair a stone of hope. With this faith we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood. With this faith we will be able to work together, to pray together, to struggle together, to go to jail together, to stand up for freedom together, knowing that we will be free one day.

 

This will be the day when all of God's children will be able to sing with a new meaning, "My country, 'tis of thee, sweet land of liberty, of thee I sing. Land where my fathers died, land of the pilgrim's pride, from every mountainside, let freedom ring." And if America is to be a great nation, this must become true. So let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of New Hampshire. Let freedom ring from the mighty mountains of New York. Let freedom ring from the heightening Alleghenies of Pennsylvania! Let freedom ring from the snowcapped Rockies of Colorado! Let freedom ring from the curvaceous peaks of California! But not only that; let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of Georgia! Let freedom ring from Lookout Mountain of Tennessee! Let freedom ring from every hill and every molehill of Mississippi. From every mountainside, let freedom ring.

 

When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last! free at last! thank God Almighty, we are free at last!"

 

"I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

 

I wish they did, sir. I wish they did.

Wow, another pasting of the King speech. Well done, I am so schooled now!?!