The one and only California recall thread

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Arnold wouldn't be recalled even if they had another election. People don't like a change in government in general. This was an extreme case, simply because Davis's popularity is on par with Louis XVI.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I think he's discussing the fact that he got pretty sick and really didn't run the show much after the 44 election.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

I'm not denying that FDR was a great president. He was. Just that the New Deal itself wasn't effective. He tried, it just didn't work.

 

Other geat 20th Century presidents include Teddy Roosevelt & Eisenhower. LBJ could have been good, but he was left with the mess JFK created.

 

Worst 20th Century presidents were Hoover, JFK, Carter & Truman. Truman was probably the worst of the bunch.

[NoCalMike 0]

Arnold wouldn't be recalled even if they had another election. People don't like a change in government in general. This was an extreme case, simply because Davis's popularity is on par with Louis XVI.

Ermm, NO. The Recall effort came about 2 months into Gray Davis's second term. This was 2 months after the majority put him in office. There is no way possible in 2 months that things went that downhill that fast. It was all about a guy with 2 million dollars to spend on spewing bullshit who wanted to be governor. Remember, originally this recall had nothing to do with policy or Arnold, it was about Issa, a guy who no one gave two shits about a few years ago, pouring 2 million dollars into a scheme to get Davis out of office. People were paid to sign the petition in many cases, and the thing just took off. There was a massive campaign to just blame anything and everything on Gray Davis, and after watching it day in and day out on tv for 6 months, people finally started to buy into the bullshit.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Okay, this is stupid. CNN is saying Arnold wins, but their page shows the recall losing with only 47% support.

 

Good thing there isn't any time zones involved, or we'd have a Florida.

 

I was SO going to vote No on the recall until Davis gave illegals licenses. I wound up voting rather conservative, although I *CRINGE* at the idea of Arnold in office fiscally because he seems to be a flaming idiot, let's hope he listens to all these money guys he hired. 54 makes me cringe even harder, but I'm sure it'll lose anyway.

 

Me: Recall Yes, Arnold, 53 No, 54 No

Dad: Recall Yes, Arnold, 53 No, 54 Yes

Mom: Recall No, Bustamante, 53 No, 54 Yes

 

I made a mark in the ® box. Someone give me a drink or something.

[Guest MikeSC]

Actually FDR didn't break the 2-term "limit" in 44, he did it in 40 when he ran for a 3rd term.

True, but in '44, he knew he was dying and ran anyway.

-=Mike

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Arnold wouldn't be recalled even if they had another election.  People don't like a change in government in general.  This was an extreme case, simply because Davis's popularity is on par with Louis XVI.

Ermm, NO. The Recall effort came about 2 months into Gray Davis's second term. This was 2 months after the majority put him in office. There is no way possible in 2 months that things went that downhill that fast. It was all about a guy with 2 million dollars to spend on spewing bullshit who wanted to be governor. Remember, originally this recall had nothing to do with policy or Arnold, it was about Issa, a guy who no one gave two shits about a few years ago, pouring 2 million dollars into a scheme to get Davis out of office. People were paid to sign the petition in many cases, and the thing just took off. There was a massive campaign to just blame anything and everything on Gray Davis, and after watching it day in and day out on tv for 6 months, people finally started to buy into the bullshit.

He has an approval rating of approx. 27%. That is not a good thing. And he just got voted out of office. Getting a recall election is one thing, but actually losing it means that it he does deserve to get booted. The people have spoken.

[teke184 0]

At least it looks like Arnold WILL have a solid majority of the vote in this election, which will at least counter most of the arguments that someone could win the recall with a very small percentage of the vote.

 

While I think that Cali is in serious trouble, it's not like Arnold could screw things up too much as long as he CUTS spending instead of reorganizing where the borrowed money is going.

[Guest Cerebus]

Actually try 11 months NoCal first of all. Also, I guess there are no problems in California and that it is all a right wing conspiracy when all is really well.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Actually FDR didn't break the 2-term "limit" in 44, he did it in 40 when he ran for a 3rd term.

True, but in '44, he knew he was dying and ran anyway.

-=Mike

I'm glad he did. Had Truman been president before VE Day we would probably be speaking German now (more realistically Russian, but still).

[NoCalMike 0]

Actually try 11 months NoCal first of all. Also, I guess there are no problems in California and that it is all a right wing conspiracy when all is really well.

11 months what? What are you talking about? I never said everything was a right wing conspiracy. Christ, I never said Davis was a good govenor. Stop putting words in my mouth.

[NoCalMike 0]

Jesse Venture just schooled Chris Matthews on every question on Hardball talking about whether Arnold would ring in some indepdent movement(bwahahaha). So what does he get for his effort, well he gets cut off early, that's what.

[Cran Da Maniac 0]

CNN's reporting that Davis has been recalled, and Arnold is shown winning the election.

 

 

LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) -- CNN projects that California's electorate will recall Democratic Gov. Gray Davis and choose actor-turned-politician, Republican Arnold Schwarzenegger as the Golden State's next governor, based on statewide exit polls.

 

Davis, re-elected to a second term less than a year ago, would become the first governor recalled from office since 1921, when North Dakota voters ousted Gov. Lynn Frazier.

 

The race -- borne out of voter discontent with the California economy and dissatisfaction with the incumbent Democrat's leadership -- tightened in the closing days, marked by accusations against front-running replacement candidate Schwarzenegger, and charges of ugly politics.

 

Polls closed at 8 p.m. (11 p.m. EDT).

 

"So far, at least, we've been hearing that turnout is on a par with what we've seen in some record-breaking years for governor's elections," Secretary of State Kevin Shelley said.

 

The respected Field Poll predicted as many as 10 million voters would cast ballots -- 30 percent more than the 7.7 million who elected the 60-year-old Democrat to a second term in November 2002 and a record in the state for a non-presidential contest.

 

The secretary of state's office said that based on turnout in Los Angeles and some other indicator counties, the statewide vote could be as high as 60 percent -- comparable to that of 1998, the year Davis first won election as governor. That would amount to 9.24 million of California's 15.4 registered voters this year -- about 385,000 more than were registered in 2002.

 

Shelley said more than 2.2 million absentee ballots have already been cast -- votes that could be critical in a close race. (Gallery: Scenes from the vote; CNN's The Morning Grind: It all comes down to voter turnout)

 

Tuesday's election was the climax of one of the most bizarre episodes in recent U.S. political history. Voters decided to recall Davis and chose Schwarzenegger from among 135 names on the ballot. (Genesis of recall rooted in energy crisis; Interactive: Recall petition signature counts)

 

Under the recall rules, a majority of votes were necessary to oust Davis, but his replacement only needed a plurality of votes. (Interactive: What happens if Davis is recalled?)

 

Davis said he felt "absolutely terrific" as he cast his ballot Tuesday in West Hollywood.

 

"I'm proud of the campaign we've run," he said.

 

He urged his supporters to turn out at the polls and said the state is in good shape despite the economic problems that helped trigger the recall. He also touted his record on health care, education and the environment.

 

"All these things have moved this state forward, and we've moved forward together," Davis said. "That's what I want to continue to do if the people are good enough to let me do it." (Biography: Gray Davis)

 

Recent polls showed a majority of likely voters favor the recall and Schwarzenegger atop the field of replacement candidates, followed by Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante, a Democrat; and another Republican, state Sen. Tom McClintock.

 

"It's up to God what the decision is," Schwarzenegger told a crush of reporters after voting near his Pacific Palisades home with his wife, Maria Shriver. "We've done all the work, and we've worked hard and campaigned hard and tried to get the message out there."

[Arlo Gates of Long Beach, California, rode his skateboard to vote in the recall election.]

Arlo Gates of Long Beach, California, rode his skateboard to vote in the recall election.

 

McClintock, a veteran conservative, predicted an upset as he cast his ballot at a Los Angeles community center, urging voters to follow their consciences rather than last-minute handicapping. (GOP candidates vote)

 

"People think that by voting for me, they might elect someone they don't want," he said. "My message is simply, if you vote your conscience, we'll be elected on election night."

 

Schwarzenegger's campaign has been rocked over the past five days by allegations from at least 15 women that he groped and sexually harassed them in incidents stretching back three decades. (On the Scene: CNN's Kelly Wallace)

 

Schwarzenegger has both apologized for behaving badly and disputed some of the accusations, but he has not been specific.(Full story)

 

Women were featured prominently on the rostrum at his speeches Monday. Both Shriver and her mother, Eunice Kennedy Shriver, sister of the late President John F. Kennedy, were on hand to offer very public support.

 

He has also been dogged by allegations that he expressed admiration for Nazi dictator Adolf Hitler in a 1975 interview, though those charges largely dissipated after two figures involved in the interview discounted them. Schwarzenegger, who, like Hitler, is a native of Austria, has vehemently denied that he ever had Nazi sympathies. (Full story)

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

It looks like it is going to be a landslide. The Democrats should have bailed on Davis and put their efforts solidly behind another D candidate like Bustamante. They probably would have done better then. I know I couldn't figure out whether Dems wanted Bustmante or Davis as governor. They can't both be governor and confusion doesn't get votes.

[Guest Cerebus]

Sorry, I misunderstood what you meant, I thought you were saying it is currently 2 months after Davis got elected but I understand what you mean after rereading you.

 

There was a massive campaign to just blame anything and everything on Gray Davis, and after watching it day in and day out on tv for 6 months, people finally started to buy into the bullshit.

 

It seemed to me that your implication that this "massive campiagn" invented problems and convinced people that there were problems that weren't really there.

[Guest Boo_Bradley]

Flame me for being ignorant, but why did WW2 spring us out of the depression, but our recent wars in Afgahanistan and Iraq failed to yield a similar result with our sagging economy?

[NoCalMike 0]

Sorry, I misunderstood what you meant, I thought you were saying it is currently 2 months after Davis got elected but I understand what you mean after rereading you.

 

There was a massive campaign to just blame anything and everything on Gray Davis, and after watching it day in and day out on tv for 6 months, people finally started to buy into the bullshit.

 

It seemed to me that your implication that this "massive campiagn" invented problems and convinced people that there were problems that weren't really there.

Ok. I don't think Davis is any kind of angel in this whole mess. Hell I didn't vote for him in the last election. I just think that Republicans took very complicated issues and just used a mass campaign to say, "got a problem, see Gray Davis" it has been this day in and day out, without ANY discussion of how these problems came about.

 

I also feel that Arnold won because the general population really felt they were getting an idepedent thinking mind in him, which I really disagree with.

[chaosrage 0]

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! IT WAS ALL A TRICK! SKYNET HAS WON!

[Guest Cerebus]

just before we entered WW2, the US was "the Great Arsenal for Democracy" as FDR called us. We sent just about everything to allies in the USSR and UK. This meant contracts by the ton for just about everything needed which skyrockted after Pearl Harbor because the entire nation was mobalized to fight abroad. For our war in Afghanistan & Iraq, there is no enormous effort to increase the military anywhere close to the extent in 1942, just money needed to keep them abroad. Basically, we're not mobalizeing the ENTIRE nation to war, just a few specialized areas at best.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

3) He ran for office in 1944 when he knew he shouldn't. He also killed off the unspoken 2-term rule that people like Washington, who could've been President PERMANENTLY had he wished, followed.

So? He was under no obligation to NOT run again. None whatsoever.

 

The stupid thing is that the Republicans were so scared about this that they implemented the 2 term rule into law. Every President we've had since then that we like so much we'd probably keep them around for more than 2 terms has been Republican.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

How long until theres a Recall Arnold drive?

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

just before we entered WW2, the US was "the Great Arsenal for Democracy" as FDR called us. We sent just about everything to allies in the USSR and UK. This meant contracts by the ton for just about everything needed which skyrockted after Pearl Harbor because the entire nation was mobalized to fight abroad. For our war in Afghanistan & Iraq, there is no enormous effort to increase the military anywhere close to the extent in 1942, just money needed to keep them abroad. Basically, we're not mobalizeing the ENTIRE nation to war, just a few specialized areas at best.

For example, the auto industry was hit really hard in the Depression because nobody could afford cars and this led to even more layoffs. Once these plants opened up again to make tanks, it created loads of jobs, which meant that people now had money to spend in the economy.

 

Two things you need to keep in mind. The Great Depression was 1000x worse than the current recession and WW2 was 1000x bigger than the current wars. That's why it made such an impact. WW1 had a similar affect on Canada. WW2 wasn't as important since we were pretty much out of the Depression by around 1936 or so (things had been improving since the lowpoint in 1931). It took the Americans longer to recover, and would have certainly taken longer if not for the war.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

3) He ran for office in 1944 when he knew he shouldn't. He also killed off the unspoken 2-term rule that people like Washington, who could've been President PERMANENTLY had he wished, followed.

So? He was under no obligation to NOT run again. None whatsoever.

 

The stupid thing is that the Republicans were so scared about this that they implemented the 2 term rule into law. Every President we've had since then that we like so much we'd probably keep them around for more than 2 terms has been Republican.

Clinton is the one exception. He would have been re-elected in 2000.

[Guest Boo_Bradley]

Arnold should tear off his mask at his acceptence speech, just as the borgs march in the room....

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

How long until theres a Recall Arnold drive?

Doesn't matter. He wouldn't get recalled. I know people expect this to happen often now, but trust me, this was an extreme case.

[Guest Cerebus]

How long until theres a Recall Arnold drive?

 

As much as we joke about it, i wouldn't hold my breath on it. It will be much harder for the Democrats to organize a recall that has better than a snowball's chance of being successful.

 

1. Since the amount of voters in this election were much higher than the one in 2002, the Democrats will need more signatures to get a recall going. This means more time and more money.

 

2. Most Californians hate the recall provision despite the fact that they were voting in it. The fact of the matter is, voters hate the idea of recall but took advantage of it while available. Basically, after this race they are sick of recalls. I don't think they'd be too keen on another one in the near future.

 

3. The Democrats really doesn't have anyone to hold a candle to Arnold, especially if a new recall suffers a huge backlash from your average Californian.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Prop 54 is defeated.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

I only ask because I think things will end up worse in California with him as governor.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I also feel that Arnold won because the general population really felt they were getting an idepedent thinking mind in him, which I really disagree with.

Maybe, maybe not, but I do hope this gives the pro-choice, pro-gay rights people in the party the "I told ya so" that they need to break the fundies' power grip on the party.

 

I know as a Democrat that's a bad thing since it makes Republicans more electable, but at the same time if it keeps fundies' candidates from running, it means they don't risk winning and fucking us up even more.

[NoCalMike 0]

Prop 54 is defeated.

thank goodness.