Guest Markingout Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Hey drug supplements can change that TPWW Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corey_Lazarus 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 The Stroke would be good as a set-up move, or if he applied a full-nelson...but NOOOOOOOO... Aside from all those uber-dangerous head-dropping maneuvers, I can't think of any cool finishers that Jarrett could replace The Stroke with. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Raven/Sandman/Watts vs. RSS and Legend next week...and so I ask...why? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corey_Lazarus 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Hey drug supplements can change that TPWW You mean "the right vitamins, minerals, and amount of exercise." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Coffey Report post Posted November 13, 2003 The Stroke would be good as a set-up move, or if he applied a full-nelson...but NOOOOOOOO... Aside from all those uber-dangerous head-dropping maneuvers, I can't think of any cool finishers that Jarrett could replace The Stroke with. Why can't the Figurefour Leglock just be his finisher? I mean, how hard could it be to legitmize the move again? Work over someone's leg for away, possible after a chair attack to the leg or something (like a "Pillmanizer") and then when the match happens, get the victory, via 3 count, from the Figurefour. It's not like Tenay couldn't put it over. He could talk about former NWA World Champion Ric Flair using the move to win countless titles, etc. Instead of getting the whole show, I'll just get Ki/Daniels I guess. Arm psychology is fun to watch. Did Ki pull off any single arm DDT's? I used to love watching Little Guido work an arm in ECW. Hell, he still does it well as Nuzio. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
{''({o..o})''} 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 The Stroke would be good as a set-up move, or if he applied a full-nelson...but NOOOOOOOO... Aside from all those uber-dangerous head-dropping maneuvers, I can't think of any cool finishers that Jarrett could replace The Stroke with. Airplane Spin? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Markingout Report post Posted November 13, 2003 "You mean "the right vitamins, minerals, and amount of exercise." Exactly what I meant. "Did Ki pull off any single arm DDT's?" Nope Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
{''({o..o})''} 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Well, that could have been worse. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michrome 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 What happened? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corey_Lazarus 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Well...allow me to say, from all of us here at TSM, and those who could not make it tonight due to technical difficulties or whatnot... FUCK YOU, DUTCH MANTEL! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tpww7 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Styles pinned Luger, Got beat-down, Raven ran in, he got beat down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deancoles 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Thank god Styles got the pin. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corey_Lazarus 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 While this certainly wasn't the worst TNA show, it's up there. The main event gets a * rating from me, and that's ALL for AJ. The fact that I'd only give one match over *3/4 is BAD. Dutch, while he may be good at booking solid angles, sucks when it comes to making GOOD MATCHES. And what have TNA fans always preferred, old-school Memphis angles or good matches despite SE booking? The latter, as has been shown since their peak of interest so far was during the SEX feud. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Markingout Report post Posted November 13, 2003 I expected the main event to be pure shit. It was ok. It told a good story actually. Luger is horrible though. He was suppose to catch AJ on that crossbody by the end but he fell. You can tell because he no sold and kicked out right away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Thank god Styles got the pin. Let's not get carried away. Jeff Hardy got more offense against HHH than Styles got against Luger. He only pinned him when Sting hit Luger with a bat three times while Lex (who is definitely not in the best shape) had Styles in the Torture Rack. Styles was made to look absolutely useless when in the ring with Lex. On the plus side, Luger threw a better clothesline than usual for him. The negative side, of course, is that he sucked the meat missile with gusto. Thank God I get free PPV now as I can't imagine PAYING for that. Raven & Sandman v Red Shirt Security was horrible. Don Harris v Abyss was REAL bad. The ME was a whole bunch of nothing, complete with awkward sequences and some of the worst "Ref didn't see the tag" spots I've ever witnessed. Better than RAW (but what isn't) --- but the last hour absolutely killed it. The first hour was actually pretty good. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TDinDC1112 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Thank god Styles got the pin. Let's not get carried away. Jeff Hardy got more offense against HHH than Styles got against Luger. He only pinned him when Sting hit Luger with a bat three times while Lex (who is definitely not in the best shape) had Styles in the Torture Rack. Styles was made to look absolutely useless when in the ring with Lex. On the plus side, Luger threw a better clothesline than usual for him. The negative side, of course, is that he sucked the meat missile with gusto. Thank God I get free PPV now as I can't imagine PAYING for that. Raven & Sandman v Red Shirt Security was horrible. Don Harris v Abyss was REAL bad. The ME was a whole bunch of nothing, complete with awkward sequences and some of the worst "Ref didn't see the tag" spots I've ever witnessed. Better than RAW (but what isn't) --- but the last hour absolutely killed it. The first hour was actually pretty good. -=Mike I'm going to have to agree with you. Styles got the "fluke" pin on Luger after Luger got hit with a baseball bat 3 TIMES!!! Big deal. Why not just have Styles slither out of the rack and roll him up. I still think it was a good idea to bring in Luger for business, but good god he looked very old and was like a combination of Frankenstein and Kurgan in the ring. I knew he'd be bad and I didn't care (and still don't), but for the record - he looked horrible! I thought Sting and Jarrett wrestled a pretty sloppy match as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted November 13, 2003 I'm going to have to agree with you. Styles got the "fluke" pin on Luger after Luger got hit with a baseball bat 3 TIMES!!! Big deal. Why not just have Styles slither out of the rack and roll him up. I still think it was a good idea to bring in Luger for business, but good god he looked very old and was like a combination of Frankenstein and Kurgan in the ring. I knew he'd be bad and I didn't care (and still don't), but for the record - he looked horrible! I thought Sting and Jarrett wrestled a pretty sloppy match as well. Heck, why not let Styles do ANYTHING to Lex? The closest thing to offense he got was a flying bodypress and it looked like Lex wasn't supposed to go down for that. Luger is crap in the ring. If he is brought back, they have real problems. And, guys, if you can't do a legit ref bump --- don't do one at all. It looks cheesy. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro101 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Tonight's show wasn't that bad, it was just there. Ki-Daniels had good psychology and was pretty good, though I was expecting faster paced action. Abyss vs Don Harris turned out ok, seeing as how my expectations were so low. Would've been tons better if a few minutes shorter, though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Corey_Lazarus 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 [email protected] "If you saw the event, let us know what you thought of the event with a 1-10 score and picks for best and worst matches. Also, let us know if you usually order it and if not, whether Luger influenced your decision to order it. Also, if you didn't order the event but usually do, was it because of Luger. Let us know that, also." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Buzz 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 The event was a bit on the boring side, but the main event is actually the only match that kept my interest other then Low Ki vs Daniels. Luger killed the match with his slow methodical....sweating profusely after 5 minutes style. Jarrett, Sting, and Styles all looked solid to me though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Use Your Illusion 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Thank god Styles got the pin. Let's not get carried away. Jeff Hardy got more offense against HHH than Styles got against Luger. He only pinned him when Sting hit Luger with a bat three times while Lex (who is definitely not in the best shape) had Styles in the Torture Rack. Styles was made to look absolutely useless when in the ring with Lex. On the plus side, Luger threw a better clothesline than usual for him. The negative side, of course, is that he sucked the meat missile with gusto. Thank God I get free PPV now as I can't imagine PAYING for that. Raven & Sandman v Red Shirt Security was horrible. Don Harris v Abyss was REAL bad. The ME was a whole bunch of nothing, complete with awkward sequences and some of the worst "Ref didn't see the tag" spots I've ever witnessed. Better than RAW (but what isn't) --- but the last hour absolutely killed it. The first hour was actually pretty good. -=Mike LUGER! LUGER! LUGER! LUGER! LUGER! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deancoles 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 Thank god Styles got the pin. Let's not get carried away. Jeff Hardy got more offense against HHH than Styles got against Luger. He only pinned him when Sting hit Luger with a bat three times while Lex (who is definitely not in the best shape) had Styles in the Torture Rack. Styles was made to look absolutely useless when in the ring with Lex. On the plus side, Luger threw a better clothesline than usual for him. The negative side, of course, is that he sucked the meat missile with gusto. Thank God I get free PPV now as I can't imagine PAYING for that. Raven & Sandman v Red Shirt Security was horrible. Don Harris v Abyss was REAL bad. The ME was a whole bunch of nothing, complete with awkward sequences and some of the worst "Ref didn't see the tag" spots I've ever witnessed. Better than RAW (but what isn't) --- but the last hour absolutely killed it. The first hour was actually pretty good. -=Mike i was saying that without watching the show.When you all were angry first i thought luger pinned styles. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted November 13, 2003 I'm not gonna say much this week, suffice it to I'm not not impressed at how both Raven or Styles were used. I thought I'd pull this off the Observer 6. Sting & A.J. Styles beat Lex Luger & Jeff Jarrett in 10:35. Luger has aged tremendously. He's in better shape than he was in Europe, but couldn't do much of anything. While people were clearly into the star power of the match, this didn't have one-third the heat last week's match had. The whole deal was Jarrett & Luger making fun of Styles, while the announcers tried to push the idea that Styles & Sting are the "dream team." Almost the entire match saw Styles get worked over. Luger, who looks to be 285-290, didn't sell a thing for Styles and fans hated it. You could see the story that Styles' offense wasn't working on :"big" Luger wasn't one that they wanted to see and even though he pinned Luger at the end, he was more buried and the idea he wasn't at their level was verified as opposed to proven wrong in fans' eyes as he couldn't hang and just got a fluke Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Thread Killer 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 I'm not gonna say much this week, suffice it to I'm not not impressed at how both Raven or Styles were used. So you actually SAW the show? The main event put Styles over, since all the announcers did was keep hammering home the fact that Styles belonged in there with Jarrett, Sting, and Luger. Hell, Sting got on his KNEES, and pointed to Styles, and took the mic, and said that Jarrett and Luger WEREN'T in Styles' league...implying that Styles was BETTER than they were. Hart and Sting did nothing but give Styles the rub this week...of course you needed to actually SEE the show to know that. Plus once again, Raven was ALL OVER the show, including a build to another match with him and Jarrett, when he got the pop of the night for calling out Jarrett and got a HUGE "Raven" chant going. It's SO obvious those two are heading for another match...of course, you'd KNOW that if you SAW THE SHOW. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted November 13, 2003 No,I didn't see it (I CAN'T!!!!!!), but I read the Observer's report and I respect their opinion. Btw, although it's leading somewhere, and the story is decent. Raven/Fullington vs Northcutt/Wilson is THRILLING use of Raven, especially since the crowd is apparantly dead for it. Furthermore, the announcers putting Styles over means NOTHING if Luger, who was brought in the make AJ look good, won't help him. As other people have stated, Luger made AJ look like a douche Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TDinDC1112 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 For what it's worth, I thought Lo Ki - Daniels was ***. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bort Report post Posted November 13, 2003 sounds like crap, im not even gonna downloaded it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eirejmcmahon 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 As someone who saw the show, I don't see how anyone could feel that AJ came out of it looking like anything other than a chump. There's no point in talking someone up for an hour and a half if you're not going to pull the bloody trigger when he steps into the ring. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TDinDC1112 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 They made AJ look like a little kid out there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedJed 0 Report post Posted November 13, 2003 The show wasnt too bad, other than the fact that the main event really irked the hell out of me. First off, the match just didnt flow, especially near the end. The ref even seemed to not have an idea to know what was going on, and really made the match look "fake" from what he was doing in not seeing tags, etc. Unless they are planning on turning that ref heel, there is no excuse for that shit. Luger blew his latest and hopefully last chance in wrestling also, plain and simple. He is the same Luger, only older and more aged looking. It amazed me how aged he got in just a few years time. He clearly had the look that signified he had no right to be in the damn ring at all, basically. Not only did he not sell Styles at all, but he (and this could have very well been a power play by Luger or Sting on the finish for them to save face) had to have Sting beat him with a bat to even get a rollup pin by Styles? Fuckin lame! I think the story here was that that Luger threw a stink about having to job to Styles and put them in a position where "this and that" had to happen for him to do the job, and in relaliation of that, guys like Sting and Hart had to do their damndest to try to give Styles a rub by their comments, because they knew how Luger was. Thats just my thought of it. All in all though, it made for, quite honestly, one of the most messed up high profile TNA main events in a long while. You had 3 of the guys working hard in the ring, but the other one screwed it up so bad. Plus the flow when Luger was in there and the mistakes by the ref just blew any chance of it being decent. I did like how Raven came out at the end though, and they seem hard pushed to begin that feud again finally (been wanting to see them come back to this for months). I'm sure it will be a slow build and they will have to find the right direction to get Raven to that position....I think it should be a fast blowoff with the Red Shirts (since it was clear nobody wants to see Raven positioned in with those guys), and then segway to a heel turn by Punk and a feud with them lasting for a couple months. Honestly, I wouldnt mind them even waiting all the way to April of next year to have the match, or maybe do it in January instead and not even worry about Hogan-Jarrett as a world title match, have Raven with the belt instead? Lo-Ki and Daniels I had at about *** 1/2, given the time they had, they did an incredible amount of nice looking spots. Wish Ki could be in here full time but oh well. The tag gauntlet was ok, and Mantel has a sense of knowing the right way to build chases, case in point AMW getting another title shot. Its not there yet but they are inching their way. Dutt and Collyer......eh. I'm not impressed with Collyer AT ALL, if he's the next Malenko, I dont see it. He's a poor man's Malenko, IMO. A ring savvy guy like Daniels could easily be more akin to Malenko than Collyer. Indifferent about Mr. X......I hated the shit last week but as long as they dont have him squash all of the guys and the champ here in a long streak of sorts, then I wont complain. In other words, I'm seeing where its going before I make a judgment call. X is a hard worker and might be able to have some solid matches with some X guys, so as long as they are squashes, whats the biggie? Harris and Abyss was actually ok, looks like they could do Styles v. Abyss pretty easily next week. Regarding Mantel and in comparison to Russo......correct me if I'm wrong but did Russo ever plan out matches, I thought he just wrote? There is a difference between a booker and a writer. So to say Russo paved the way for TNA quality matches isnt really making sense. I dont know exactly what Mantel all does, like if he lays out matches as well. Whatever the case, I still think I would rather see logical coherant booking than some of the stuff Russo threw out there (lots of angles that didnt make sense or didnt even be followed up on the next week, shoving a guy like Disco in a main event position consistently, etc). When I think of shows like the Russo army one, that makes me think of these shows in a completely different negative way. At least we arent having run-in after run-in with no desicions week after week here lately. Things like bringing in Luger should not be put on Mantel's shoulders either as far as a fault since he really had nothing to do with it and the fact that Luger felt the need to no-sell and put over someone the right way, I dont see how that is Dutch's fault either. I think considering who he's got to work with, Mantel is slowly making progress. Russo's work was so up and down that you'd never know what to expect, and it's been documented that the times that the Jarrett's let him completely write a show here and there, it wasnt pretty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
