End the Batman Series

[Sass 0]

Either have him get killed in the line of duty or have him retire in peace and go on to have a good life.

 

Let Grayson develop his own identity instead of having him become Batman.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I wouldn't mind a final battle with the Joker where Batman takes him and the Joker out in order to save Gotham. Why not end the greatest comic rivalry with them killing each other?

[Sass 0]

I wouldn't mind a final battle with the Joker where Batman takes him and the Joker out in order to save Gotham.  Why not end the greatest comic rivalry with them killing each other?

The only reason I wouldn't do it would be that by the time they have their final battle, the Joker might have have reached the 7 digit range on the number of people he killed up to that point. That would just make everyone who tried to bring him down look even more inept for not taking him out back and putting a bullet in his head earlier.

 

I'd have Batman put the kibosh on the Joker before he stops being Batman (ala Batman Beyond). If I were to kill off Batman in a story I would have someone new he has never faced do it. It would then soldify Grayson's spot as the heir to the Batman throne where he could carve out his own name afterwards.

[Guest Indy]

Well the reason why Joker has been able to escape death of the police, superheroes or Batman is because he is smart enough to find a loop hole in the Justice System. He's not going to Iron Heights like Weather Master, Grodd, Killer Frost and Bane....he's going to Arkam. He is clearly insane and unfortunetly, since he is mentally ill, he can't go to Jail.

 

And dude, Joker had probebly already reached the 7 digit genocide already. I want to see Batman defeat Joker, even it if means taking the bastard to Hell with him.

[Sass 0]

Well the reason why Joker has been able to escape death of the police, superheroes or Batman is because he is smart enough to find a loop hole in the Justice System.

He's escaped death because none of the super heroes he has encountered were able to kill him (for whatever the reason). He does keep escaping the death penalty because he has been shown to be insane.

 

He's not going to Iron Heights like Weather Master, Grodd, Killer Frost and Bane....he's going to Arkam.

 

I did not know Bane was at Iron Heights. Last I knew he was still on the loose and was nowhere near Keystone which would have brought him into conflict with the Flash (and Iron Heights).

 

Putting the Joker in Iron Heights for a one-shot where he is waiting to be transferred to Arkham could be interesting.

 

He is clearly insane and unfortunetly, since he is mentally ill, he can't go to Jail.

 

Yep.

 

I'm not sure "mentally ill" covers what is inside the Joker's head though.

 

 

And dude, Joker had probebly already reached the 7 digit genocide already.

 

While it's possible, I doubt it.

 

The Joker has killed a *lot* of people but I wouldn't suggest he has already reached the 7 digit range. Even comics have to keep some barriers between "realism" and "escapism" since killing a million or so people would be even radical for the Joker within the confines of comic book "law". You would think that someone would have finished the Joker (ala New Jack City style) after he is being escorted out of the court house or something to that effect.

 

Of course he would probably survive the attack and be better by next month's issue.

 

 

I want to see Batman defeat Joker, even it if means taking the bastard to Hell with him.

 

I don't want to see Batman beat the Joker. Only because comics have this tendency to kill off the good characters and replace them with 3rd rate knock-offs who are supposed to be "the next big bad guy."

 

I'd rather leave the "end" scenarios up to the imagination rather than seeing them printed as the definitive way the guy ends up. It will always end up being a disappointment (except on rare occaisions) since the story does not follow what fanboy Joe had planned.

 

This is why I am not a big fan of these types of discussions. It's cool to hear what some other people think.

 

Chances are I'll probably change my scenario from above if I think about it some more later on down the line.

Edited December 20, 2003 by Sassquatch

[Nighthawk 0]

Honestly, the Joker couldn't keep getting away with his mental illness excuse. They'd have said "Fuck it, I don't care if he is crazy, let's put this bastard on ice." long ago.

[Sass 0]

Honestly, the Joker couldn't keep getting away with his mental illness excuse. They'd have said "Fuck it, I don't care if he is crazy, let's put this bastard on ice." long ago.

 

Agreed.

 

If comics would use the Joker more sparingly (ala Thanos) than I wouldn't have as much of a problem with him getting off from the death penalty. But over the last 4 or so years he has managed to make an apperance in a comic about every other month and after he gets captured for about the 27th time, it starts to become reduntant (and irritating).

 

Of course the Joker "get's his" every now and then (see end of No Man's Land) but it rarely has any long-term value since that would just hinder the character (as well as the writers).

[Guest Indy]

Honestly, the Joker couldn't keep getting away with his mental illness excuse. They'd have said "Fuck it, I don't care if he is crazy, let's put this bastard on ice." long ago.

Tried it in a one-short (or mini-series), it turns out he was innocent. Somehow he escapes it and Superheros can't kill because their heroes, their not murderers, they don't want to be like the people they put away in Jail.

 

He was put in Iron Heights too already, remember the The Last Laugh Saga where Joker thought he was going to die. Now almost every villian in DC wants to kill him. He's has to be put in Arhkam for protection....or Alaska.

[Sass 0]

Honestly, the Joker couldn't keep getting away with his mental illness excuse. They'd have said "Fuck it, I don't care if he is crazy, let's put this bastard on ice." long ago.

Tried it in a one-short (or mini-series), it turns out he was innocent. Somehow he escapes it and Superheros can't kill because their heroes, their not murderers, they don't want to be like the people they put away in Jail.

 

He was put in Iron Heights too already, remember the The Last Laugh Saga where Joker thought he was going to die. Now almost every villian in DC wants to kill him. He's has to be put in Arhkam for protection....or Alaska.

I read the Flash ish but I did not know the Joker was incarcerated in Iron Heights.

[Guest JMA]

I think Frank Miller already told the perfect "last Batman story" (then he created the horrible DKSA...).

[Steviekick 0]

I think Frank Miller already told the perfect "last Batman story" (then he created the horrible DKSA...).

Agreed. DKSA was not really terrible, it just really looked inferior when compared to the original. It didn't help that Miller's art was really whacked out looking either.

[Ravenbomb 0]

What's DKSA? Does it have anything to do with Dark Knight Returns? Cause I really liked DKR.

[Guest JMA]

What's DKSA? Does it have anything to do with Dark Knight Returns? Cause I really liked DKR.

DKSA (The Dark Knight Strikes Again or DK2) is the almost universally hated sequel to DKR (The Dark Knight Returns). Think of it as the comic book equivalent of WrestleCrap.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

During the "Dead Reckoning" storyline in Detective Comics, The Joker WAS in Anartica in some kind of super jail.

 

Just saying.

[Steviekick 0]

What's DKSA? Does it have anything to do with Dark Knight Returns? Cause I really liked DKR.

DKSA (The Dark Knight Strikes Again or DK2) is the almost universally hated sequel to DKR (The Dark Knight Returns). Think of it as the comic book equivalent of WrestleCrap.

It was also crushed thanks to an insane amount of hype and a decade's worth of anticipation.

[Guest SP-1]

HUSH wasn't as bad as people are making it out to be. People want THE USUAL SUSPECTS in a mainstream book about a guy who dresses up like a BAT and they're just not going to get it. Hush was a fantastic superhero mystery. And that's really all anyone has a right to ask of it, IMO.

 

As for thinking my ending was "stupids", that's certainly your right. However, it builds on the continuity of a pretty important, absolutely huge story arc and it does what an ending is supposed to do: bring a character around. For Batman, I believe that this entails leaving behind the traumatic root cause of what he does (which is the pain of losing his parents), and rising into the ultimate healing for him (doing what he does as a parent).

 

But sure. I guess that's "stupids".

[Ravenbomb 0]

They made a sequal to DKR? Weak

[Steviekick 0]

Exactly.

[Austin3164life 0]

I think a lot of you guys have the character wrong. Batman should still seek justice while striking fear into criminals, even though he is an old man. His mission, ever since he began it when he was a young boy, has always been an uphill battle and is literally impossible and neverending, something Bruce knows full well yet still goes on. A great ending to the Bruce Wayne/Batman saga would be for Bruce (I'd say in his late 50s)to instill the persona of "Batman" in Tim Drake, who more realistically can resume Bruce's mission as Batman, a seasoned crime fighting veteran and detective in his own right. Bruce begins to give his final lesson to Tim and tells him that he will be the next Batman. This doesn't sit too well with Dick Grayson, who always thought that he would take up the mantle (flashback: Knightfall-Knightquest when Grayson was infuriated because Bruce chose Valley as Batman). Bruce, knowing full well that Dick was always very independent and was meant to be his own myth, hands his mantle over to Drake, a man who is more like Bruce and still pursues his quest for justice and his obsession of being the greatest detective (a mantle Bruce holds). Grayson thus alienates himself from the trio, and begins taking his anger out harshly on criminals, even having the police force and media scrutinizing him. Grayson, accidentally or not, nearly kills a petty criminal who committs a heinous crime, and Bruce (still Batman) takes it upon himself to stop Nightwing. In the ensuing confrontation, the younger, stronger, and more agile Grayson *barely* edges out a victory over his mentor. However, Dick uses villain-like methods to defeat Bruce, and in a fit of rage spurred by jealousy, Dick actually incapacitates Bruce, putting him into a coma. The next Batman-in-waiting, Drake, steps in and lays the smackdown on Grayson, and brings him to justice. Barely alive, Bruce then officially hands the reigns to Tim and stays at the Wayne Manor as a mentor and ally to the new Batman.

[Guest SP-1]

Ehh . . . that's ignoring all the character work that has been put into Nightwing, though. Dick is his own man and wants to be. I don't think he's really big on taking over for Bruce permanently.

[Steviekick 0]

Ehh . . . that's ignoring all the character work that has been put into Nightwing, though. Dick is his own man and wants to be. I don't think he's really big on taking over for Bruce permanently.

It kind of makes sense. Although Dick wants to be his own man, I could see him getting slightly annoyed that Bruce passed over on him being the next Batman.

 

I do like his idea of Bruce winding up being a reclusive eccentric who lives by himself and advises other heroes.

[Guest SP-1]

Ehh . . . that's ignoring all the character work that has been put into Nightwing, though.  Dick is his own man and wants to be.  I don't think he's really big on taking over for Bruce permanently.

It kind of makes sense. Although Dick wants to be his own man, I could see him getting slightly annoyed that Bruce passed over on him being the next Batman.

 

I do like his idea of Bruce winding up being a reclusive eccentric who lives by himself and advises other heroes.

eh, I disagree but everyone's bound to sooner or later.

 

As for Bruce winding up a recluse, that's kind of the route that Mark Waid took with Kingdom Come. Though there, he was more forced into it than anything else.