Lost in Translation

[Downhome 0]

EDIT

[godthedog 0]

I just finished watching it.

 

Good movie, but overated. I The midle part was brilliant, but it fell apart towards the end.

 

SPOILER~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

dude, come on. when they were in the elevator near the end and they wanted to stay together so badly but couldn't even kiss each other, how could you not FEEL THAT TENSION~?!

[Lord of The Curry 0]

I agree w/ GTD. That kiss broke my fucking heart.

 

Anywho, fantastic, really really fantastic movie. I liked Virgin Suicides but found it overrated and coming into this I'd hoped LiT wouldn't repeat the past. It did not.

 

This, to me, is going to be one of those movies that either people "get" or they don't. The relatioship between Murray and Johannsen is one of the best on-screen in a long time. It's the little nuances about this film that make it great.

 

 

~SPOILERS A 'COMIN!~~~~~~~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I loved it when they were both laying on the bed and Bill just started lightly tapping on her toes with his fingers. They didn't say anything because they didn't need to. Same goes for the scene in the sushi bar after she finds out that Bill slept w/ the karaoke gal. They could've made the scene into a melodramatic weepfest w/ Johannsen being angry that Bill slept w/ the woman, but they didn't. And THE KISS in the elevator. Well, both of them actually. So well done. Nervous, awkward, restrained. Totally pefect for the moment. Oh, and the scene w/ Bill vs the treadmill.............genius.

[k thx 0]

Spoilers:

 

I dunno, the bit in Kyoto kind of killed it to me. It just seemed that not that much happened in the second half of the movie. THe chemistry between the two was electric, and the subtle build up (eg Bill doing that tv show just to stay in the country to be with here and the foot touching bit) was brilliant. However, when she was pissed off with him, it just seemed a little flat, and the two were suddenly extremely bitchy with each other. If there was a scene or two before it to build up the tension, it would have been better IMHO.

 

After watching it for a second time, the ending doesn't seem so anti-climatic, but I did realise tht Scarlett Johanssons charachter pisses me off. She's petulent, ungrateful, spoilt and is more than willing to fuck around behind her husbands back, despite the fact that he's the one paying for her happy little lifestyle. If I were that bloke, I would have fucked the movie star when I had the chance.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Chave- I think that may be the point that Sofia is trying to make. Charlotte IS spoiled, petulant and ungrateful.........except when she's with Bob. One of the revolving themes of the movie is the finding of one's self and trying to change. Charlotte realizes that (her talking about Yale and shrugging off her degree) and is trying to work towards change but is trapped by everything around her (husband who ignores her, foreign land, nobody to talk to, growing up rich) and is attemping a break out.

[HarleyQuinn 0]

Just saw this and loved it. Loved the tension/chemistry between Johannsen and Murray

 

SPOILER~!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also loved the bit with the blonde friend(Kelly?) of the photographer singing the karaoke to the two people, found that kinda cute and funny at the same time.

[k thx 0]

Chave- I think that may be the point that Sofia is trying to make. Charlotte IS spoiled, petulant and ungrateful.........except when she's with Bob. One of the revolving themes of the movie is the finding of one's self and trying to change. Charlotte realizes that (her talking about Yale and shrugging off her degree) and is trying to work towards change but is trapped by everything around her (husband who ignores her, foreign land, nobody to talk to, growing up rich) and is attemping a break out.

SPOILERS: you know the drill.

 

Maybe that's what Coppolla was working towards, but at no point did I feel any sympathy towards Charlotte, and at no point did I see her making any progress or even trying to change. You said she was trapped, but at the beginning of the film, she was basically free in one of the most interesting cities in the world, she had friends (those guys from the bar), and she did nothing but moan and feel sorry for herself. Her husband, on the other hand, seems to be the one making a go of things, paying for her to sit about on her ass and decide what she wants to do. The defining moment of their relationship in the film, for me at least, was after they met the actress in the hall. The two of them walk off, with Charlotte being catty about her and him telling her to be less judgemental. Then, when it's his time to leave, she stands there with her arms crossed, while he has to walk over to her and kiss her goodbye.

 

Don't get me wrong, it was a good film. But the fact that the female lead, who in the structure of the film the audiance is meant to be behind, is basically a bitch. Hell, she basically cheated on her husband behind his back when he's off working to support her lifestyle.

[spiny norman 0]

Their relationship was over, I was pretty convinced that they were going to divorce one another pretty soon after the film ended. And I wouldn't call her a bitch, she was just extremely insecure and she found in Bill Murray someone whom she was no longer insecure around, but I think were they to stay together any longer the novelty of their relationship would have worn off and their friendship would have been fleeting anyway.

 

As for practically cheating, which you cited as a reason to feel little sympathy for her, what about Bill Murray? He's been married for an extremely long time, yet he has little time for his wife and bringing up the children. He gets paid five million (it's five million, isn't it?) to do the whiskey commercials which don't look to be massively strenuous work. Yet you feel sympathy for him? And he actually does cheat on his wife, and I don't see him arranging for a divorce like I do for Johansson. If I was to say that one deserves less sympathy, it would be him. At least I get the impression that she's going to try and rectify the emptiness in her life, whereas he seems doomed to dwell in it for some time.

 

So I don't understand how you can say she is worse than him. Though he is extremely charming, I found myself empathising with her more.

[k thx 0]

Their relationship was over, I was pretty convinced that they were going to divorce one another pretty soon after the film ended. And I wouldn't call her a bitch, she was just extremely insecure and she found in Bill Murray someone whom she was no longer insecure around, but I think were they to stay together any longer the novelty of their relationship would have worn off and their friendship would have been fleeting anyway.

 

As for practically cheating, which you cited as a reason to feel little sympathy for her, what about Bill Murray? He's been married for an extremely long time, yet he has little time for his wife and bringing up the children. He gets paid five million (it's five million, isn't it?) to do the whiskey commercials which don't look to be massively strenuous work. Yet you feel sympathy for him? And he actually does cheat on his wife, and I don't see him arranging for a divorce like I do for Johansson. If I was to say that one deserves less sympathy, it would be him. At least I get the impression that she's going to try and rectify the emptiness in her life, whereas he seems doomed to dwell in it for some time.

 

So I don't understand how you can say she is worse than him. Though he is extremely charming, I found myself empathising with her more.

Oh yeah, it's just that I personally like Bill Murray's charachter and the way he plays him more. Also, He had many chances to kiss her earlier in the film, and he only cracked at the last second when he newif he didn't, he'd regret it. Also, Bob Harris tells his wife he loves her. Charlotte, on the other hand, just bugs me. She's the type of person I'd slap in real life. Plus, her character annoyed me before she met Harris, whereas Harris was sweet until he met her. Hell, you could even argue that she used him and corrupted him to make herself feel better.

 

However, it's ultimately just personnal preference and not logic that makes me dislike her character.

[cabbageboy 0]

I finally saw this movie and to be honest I don't get what all the hype is about. It seemed meandering and nothing much happened in it. I think that maybe it would have been better as a Woody Allen movie in the 70s, since that's what it struck me as....a modern update of 70s character study type films.

 

Thing is, a movie can still be good if it is meandering and nothing happening. To do that though we have to really get to know the characters, and I just never felt that way while watching L.I.T.

[Guest Just Looking]

Not to be a post whore, but another thing I've got to say about LIT is that it takes full advantage of the beauty of Tokyo and, as a result, it is an extremely gorgeous film. Just great, great cinematography.

 

EDIT: Just checked the Oscar noms, and it really pisses me off that LIT didn't get nominated for Best Cinematography. In my opinion, that was its best point.

You can't get the Oscar for best Cinematography when you have the boom mike showing on at least three separate occasions. It took me right out of the movie.

[monkey 0]

I loved the film. The DVD should be great if it includes some deleted scenes and commentary. I do feel though that some people have een turned off by all the hype. One of my friends went to watch the film expecting the one of the best films ever and came away disappointed. I went in with no real expectations was thought it was great.

[Spicy McHaggis 0]

And he actually does cheat on his wife, and I don't see him arranging for a divorce like I do for Johansson. If I was to say that one deserves less sympathy, it would be him. At least I get the impression that she's going to try and rectify the emptiness in her life, whereas he seems doomed to dwell in it for some time.

 

So I don't understand how you can say she is worse than him. Though he is extremely charming, I found myself empathising with her more.

I think the movie raises an interesting question. Is it worse to have sex or to fall in love with someone else behind your spouse's back?

[converge241 0]

I liked this movie for a few reasons

 

1) I'm fascinated with Japan/ Japaneese culture

2) I'm a fan of Sofia's other behind the camera work

3) I'm a fan/ fascinated with Scarlet

 

on top of all that it's just a damn good movie

[notJames 0]

Some of the best images of the movie were of Charlotte* either crouching or lying in a fetal position. You can almost feel her balling up, ready to burst free of whatever prisons are holding her. There is so much tension throughout the film that you can't help but ache for whatever conclusion her relationship with Bob reaches. The ending definitely sealed it for me... awesome film.

 

I also loved the colour scheme... single splashes of blue, green and pink amidst a ton of greys and blacks. Breathtaking.

 

*Interesting how Charlotte rhymes with Scarlett... Johansen, that is.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

I wasn't sure what I thought of this movie after I watched it. I'm glad someone else (Chave) felt the same way as I do about the Charlotte character. She was a bitch. Even the scene on the hotel bed with Bill Murray that everyone loves, she was still bitchy there. I don't remember the lines exactly, but she goes "Look at you" when they're talking about whether life/marriage gets easier over time. It was such a snide thing to say, even if she was joking around. The character does that a lot..guess she attacks in order to guard against her own emotional insecurities. That isn't exactly very endearing, not to me anyways.

 

Someone mentioned above that they thought Kelly was cute when she was singing her little karaoke number. I thought so too. But Charlotte has to stifle her laughter at seeing her sing. Little things like that made me dislike the character quite a bit.

 

I definately liked how the romance was done, though...not at all like your typical terrible romantic comedy of doom. I also loved the scene where they had lunch. It really fit with the characters...no overblown weepy argument, but just a few traded insults that hit hard.

[notJames 0]

I think it all comes down to understanding where Charlotte is coming from to truly empathize with her. Fresh out of college with a philosophy degree that probably won't lead here anywhere outside the teaching profession, she's searching for a life amidst a world that promises so much yet hardly delivers. She adores her husband, but is considered second best to his career. His world is one of facades and outer appearances, as witnessed with her introduction to Kelly (whose name her husband can't even remember, yet he fawns over he nonetheless). She is expected to put up with this girl's insipid banter and egocentric Cali-speak, yet is denigrated by him for not lowering herself to copy his pandering. Sure, she may have spawned from Harvard's haughty bosom, but if you watch her scenes where she's alone in her hotel, you realize that it's all for naught, as she's trapped in a world that she may have chosen to come to, but wasn't prepared for what it offered, or isn't offering. Even when she ventures forth into Japan's rich culture and environment, it still feels like there's splashes of promise here and there (embodied by the little splashes of bright colours amidst the overwhelming grayness of the film), but she's just not getting it. Having the one person in her life abandon her in this despair is all the more crushing and devastating.

 

Enter Bob, whose charm, friendly face, and cynical wit mirror her own, so it's only natural that she gravitates toward him. Considering that he too is escaping a home life that is slowly slipping away from him, only to find himself in another environment that's even more confusing and alien to him, it's so fitting that they should find each other. As for the few snide remarks she directs to Bob, I'm sure they've built up such a bond between them that it's all done without any malice. It's probably also a little piece of defense to keep her from truly falling for him, and vice versa. To call her a bitch is probably a little undeserved. Young and guarded against shallowness, maybe. But not bitchy.

 

And about Kelly's karaoke scene... Charlotte was definitely justified in laughing at her. Her performance was weak, yet were you to ask Kelly about it, she probably would tell you that she was "so on tonight" and that the crowd loved her. That's what that performance was to Kelly. Contrast to Bob and Charlotte's karaoke scene, it was about being with friends, sharing a moment with real feeling and not just wanting to be seen and heard. It's especially evident in the songs they chose. Very telling stuff.

 

Damn, I must have really loved this movie... Yep, I did.

[Guest thebigjig]

God I loved lost in translation... but a few of my friends didnt... some of them didnt like it because they're morons with small attention spans... others didnt "feel" it because it suffered from overhype and they pretty much were expecting something a little more brilliant

 

American Splendor is also fucking amazing... probably the most unique and inventive movie I've seen in years

[notJames 0]

Yeah, I just saw American Splendor last night. Great stuff. I loved the pseudo documentary style, with the real Harvey Pekar blending in with the actor playing him. The supplemental stuff on the DVD is great, too.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

I wasn't sure what I thought of this movie after I watched it. I'm glad someone else (Chave) felt the same way as I do about the Charlotte character. She was a bitch. Even the scene on the hotel bed with Bill Murray that everyone loves, she was still bitchy there. I don't remember the lines exactly, but she goes "Look at you" when they're talking about whether life/marriage gets easier over time. It was such a snide thing to say, even if she was joking around. The character does that a lot..guess she attacks in order to guard against her own emotional insecurities. That isn't exactly very endearing, not to me anyways.

 

Someone mentioned above that they thought Kelly was cute when she was singing her little karaoke number. I thought so too. But Charlotte has to stifle her laughter at seeing her sing. Little things like that made me dislike the character quite a bit.

 

I definately liked how the romance was done, though...not at all like your typical terrible romantic comedy of doom. I also loved the scene where they had lunch. It really fit with the characters...no overblown weepy argument, but just a few traded insults that hit hard.

If you know anything about Japanese culture you'd know that they take their karaoke far more seriously then we do here in N.A, so I think Charlotte was right to laugh at Kelly when she was singing. Also, IIRC there were shots of the audience watching her sing and they appeared none too amused. It's a cultural insult over there to do karaoke badly.

[NoCalMike 0]

it's almost as if Charlotte is gravitating towards Bill Murray the way Thora Birch gravitated towards Seymour(Buscemi) in Ghost World, you can find very similar themes in both movies.

[notJames 0]

Interesting theory, except Charlotte and Bob's interaction was more equally give and take than Enid and Seymour's. In the former, each person was viewed by the other as an equal pretty much from the start. There were times when one was a little needier than the other, but there was never really any imbalance of "power" (for lack of a better term).

 

With the latter, Enid was definitely in control of the situation at the start, using Seymour for her own enjoyment, even though she felt somewhat sorry for him being so pathetic. Little by little, their friendship became more give and take. You can see Enid becoming really fascinated with Seymour's life (as sad as it may have been), and she starts to rely on him more than he does with her. After Seymour started dating Diane, you could see Enid's control over Seymour slipping away, to the point where she had to throw herself at him to continue their relationship.

 

But yes, there is a sense of loss on the part of all four people that they're trying to alleviate via their respective partners. It's in the nature of the relationships that spells the difference between the two.

 

Also interesting was the fact that Scarlett Johansson appeared (andshined[/i]) in both films. I sort of want to see Girl With a Pearl Earring, although I'm not too big on period pieces.

[NoCalMike 0]

Interesting theory, except Charlotte and Bob's interaction was more equally give and take than Enid and Seymour's. In the former, each person was viewed by the other as an equal pretty much from the start. There were times when one was a little needier than the other, but there was never really any imbalance of "power" (for lack of a better term).

 

With the latter, Enid was definitely in control of the situation at the start, using Seymour for her own enjoyment, even though she felt somewhat sorry for him being so pathetic. Little by little, their friendship became more give and take. You can see Enid becoming really fascinated with Seymour's life (as sad as it may have been), and she starts to rely on him more than he does with her. After Seymour started dating Diane, you could see Enid's control over Seymour slipping away, to the point where she had to throw herself at him to continue their relationship.

 

But yes, there is a sense of loss on the part of all four people that they're trying to alleviate via their respective partners. It's in the nature of the relationships that spells the difference between the two.

 

Also interesting was the fact that Scarlett Johansson appeared (andshined[/i]) in both films. I sort of want to see Girl With a Pearl Earring, although I'm not too big on period pieces.

Well to me Seymour never really relied on Enid for anything. He knew he was pathetic, and while not necessarily "happy" about it, he was content on just being who he was and living out his life. To me Seymour never really cared whether Enid was there or not, until the slept together, which is ironic because that seemed to be the exact moment that Enid realized she had made a mistake and she needed to escape the situation ASAP. True, Seymour probably enjoyed her company and companionship, but he never really seemed attatched at all until after they hooked up.

 

 

I don't mean to turn this into a ghost world discussion, but what are we to assume happened to her mother, or is there no assumption to make? I mean her Dad was a single father for whatever reason, and they had one of those relationships where they hardly acknowledge each other. I wish there was a bit more backstory on how they ended up in that situation. That I suppose would be my only real complaint about the film.

[SpikeFayeJettEdBebop 0]

I liked this movie for a few reasons

 

1) I'm fascinated with Japan/ Japaneese culture

2) I'm a fan of Sofia's other behind the camera work

3) I'm a fan/ fascinated with Scarlet

 

on top of all that it's just a damn good movie

Yes, actually I loved it. And I am on ya with those 3.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Watched it again tonight. Still a great movie. And Scarlett Johannsen is the most goddamn beautiful human being on the face of the earth right now.

[notJames 0]

Well to me Seymour never really relied on Enid for anything. He knew he was pathetic, and while not necessarily "happy" about it, he was content on just being who he was and living out his life. To me Seymour never really cared whether Enid was there or not, until the slept together, which is ironic because that seemed to be the exact moment that Enid realized she had made a mistake and she needed to escape the situation ASAP. True, Seymour probably enjoyed her company and companionship, but he never really seemed attatched at all until after they hooked up.

Very true. I was just pointing out that Enid was in control of the relationship from the start, leading Seymour hither and thither, while, like you said, he probably didn't care why she took such an interest to him. I guess I should have made that clearer.

 

As for Enid's mother, I can only assume from the way her father is, her mother just didn't want to be with someone so weak and ineffectual. He's so cowed by his own daughter that I can't imagine how bad it was with his ex-wife. It might have been interesting to have some background info on Enid's mom to explain perhaps why she was the cynical girl she was, but in the long wrong, it probably wasn't necessary.

 

And yes, the more I watched LiT, the more beautiful Scarlett gets. Was she really only 17 when they filmed this? Too bad I had to return it to the video store. I hope they make an "Oscar Edition" for the movie, as they could really use a commentary track with Scarlett and Bill.

[Downhome 0]

I first posted in this thread about LiT on Jan 31, 2004, and in that post I stated I had watched the film for the first times just a few days before. Anyway, it's been almost two years since I first watched this flick. Since that time, the film has remained with me. At first in the very back of my head, but for some reason as the months have went by, I've been thinking about it more and more, and here lately it's just been insane.

 

If I could pick just one film of this decade so far that I believe will be looked back on and remembered in 20, 30, 40, even 50 years from now, LiT would be the one.

 

Nothing in the film that is in any way important to the film is exclusive to it's time period, the themes are those which will apply in any time period, and when it comes down to it, I just view it as a film that will only get better with time. There are many people who either haven't even seen it yet, or those who do not like it as of right now. In time, the more it'll be around and the more people view it, the more people will really "get it".

 

Even though it's not my favorite movie (that would be ESotSM, although LiT is up there), it is without a doubt the one DVD that I own that gets the most play time. It's a film that I can put in and have it just be playing in the background while I'm doing something else, and at any point I look over at the TV, it captures me and I can really get into whatever scene is on. Its a film that I really love to watch as I'm going to sleep. Not because it bores me, far from it. It's a very, very relaxing watch for me. I just really love the overall feel of the flick. It does a great job of getting across the point of "fish out of water" to the viewer, more than most other films. It says so much about relationships, for both the young and the older crowd. It's just a really thick, multi-layered film.

 

I'm not really one to look too much into what I'm watching, but I just can't help but do so with LiT. For some reason, the film just really speaks to me, both on the visual and emotional levels. And lets not forget the fantastic soundtrack. It just works so well throughout the film, start to finish. LiT also has what just might be my favorite ending to a film of all time. It's unrelentlessly heartbreaking, yet hopeful at the same time.

 

And even though it's not a comedy, the comedic lines and elements the film does present, are fantastic. It actually has one of the funniest lines from any movie that I've seen in years. Right after Bob notices the whiskey he is drinking for the pictures is really tea:

 

Japanese photographer: "I need more mysterious and, uh--"

 

Bob: "More mysterious. Yeah. I'll just try to think, 'Where the hell's the whiskey?'"

 

 

 

The following also cracked me up:

 

*Japanese man speaks a lot*

 

Japanese translator: "Right side, and, uh, with intensity. Ok?"

 

Bob: "Is that everything? I mean, it seemed like he said quite a bit more than that."

 

 

Those are not the best lines in the flick, just a couple that cracked me up.

 

And yes, Scarlett Johansson is just about the most beautiful woman in the world right now in my opinion.

 

I could talk about this film for a very long time. The themes, the setting, the music, the especially fantastic performance of Bill Murray, the differences between American and Japanese culture and customs, all of the different characters, the relationships, and on and on.

 

My reason for bumping this thread up, is basically to just state how well the film has aged so far with me. Not only do I still love the film, but I actually love it more today than I did when I first posted in this thread...when I first watched it. It's like I like the film more and more each time I watch it. Few films have this effect on me, this is one powerful work of art.

[Guest El Satanico]

How does this thread still exist? It's 8 months old

[k thx 0]

LiT is okay, but not amazing.

 

Ans Scarlett Johansons character still pisses me off. Whiny little cock teasing bitch.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Watched it again tonight. Still a great movie. And Scarlett Johannsen is the most goddamn beautiful human being on the face of the earth right now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It's been well over a year and she's still the queen.