Kerryisms

[snuffbox 0]

Whats worse...playing bagpipes or drunk driving?

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/r...erring.html

 

A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:

 

Topic A is under discussion.

Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A (when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A).

Topic A is abandoned.

 

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because merely changing the topic of discussion hardly counts as an argument against a claim.

At what point in this conversation was bagpipes being discussed?...

[Guest Cerebus]

Then again what was this thread about again? Silly Kerryisms? Well I guess I'm guilty of red herring too, I put up a silly picture of Kerry instead.

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

Every thread in CE is about dodging the issue. Everytime someone knocks a Presidential candidate, someone else is quick to show why the other one is worse. If anything, I think what he said is relevant since you showed him a pic of Kerry as an ass, and he gave you a factoid trying to show that GWB is a bigger ass. Whether that argument holds merit is not the point, the point is that it's relevant. Obviously it doesn't though, since many people have turned their lives around, but I won't get into that. It's funny for a liberal to bash a guy about past mistakes though; they're all about giving second chances.

[Guest JMA]

Kerry sucks.

 

Yeah, so .. a great website for this:

 

http://www.gop.com/kerryvskerry/

That's not really adding much.

[Guest JMA]

Every thread in CE is about dodging the issue. Everytime someone knocks a Presidential candidate, someone else is quick to show why the other one is worse. If anything, I think what he said is relevant since you showed him a pic of Kerry as an ass, and he gave you a factoid trying to show that GWB is a bigger ass. Whether that argument holds merit is not the point, the point is that it's relevant. Obviously it doesn't though, since many people have turned their lives around, but I won't get into that. It's funny for a liberal to bash a guy about past mistakes though; they're all about giving second chances.

Sometimes I wonder if this folder should have its name changed to "Politics." I'm really tired of each side trying to "one-up" the other. Every thread here has become predictable.

[Guest OctoberBlood]

Kerry sucks.

 

Yeah, so .. a great website for this:

 

http://www.gop.com/kerryvskerry/

That's not really adding much.

Has it been posted before? If so, then oh well, I thought it was pretty funny.

[Guest JMA]

Kerry sucks.

 

Yeah, so .. a great website for this:

 

http://www.gop.com/kerryvskerry/

That's not really adding much.

Has it been posted before? If so, then oh well, I thought it was pretty funny.

No, it's new. Don't sweat it.

 

I'm just giving you a hard-time.

[snuffbox 0]

Every thread in CE is about dodging the issue. Everytime someone knocks a Presidential candidate, someone else is quick to show why the other one is worse. If anything, I think what he said is relevant since you showed him a pic of Kerry as an ass, and he gave you a factoid trying to show that GWB is a bigger ass. Whether that argument holds merit is not the point, the point is that it's relevant. Obviously it doesn't though, since many people have turned their lives around, but I won't get into that. It's funny for a liberal to bash a guy about past mistakes though; they're all about giving second chances.

Sometimes I wonder if this folder should have its name changed to "Politics." I'm really tired of each side trying to "one-up" the other. Every thread here has become predictable.

everything else is 'fluff'...

[Vyce 0]

Bushisms show a mangling of the Englisg language,

 

Kerryisms show an intent to deceive.

 

Bushisms are FAR less troubling than Kerryisms.

Come on. You can't claim that isn't spin.

"Whoa. WHOA."

 

[Guest MikeSC]

Thought this was cute

 

John Kerry's stances on Cuba open to attack

BY PETER WALLSTEN | [email protected] | Miami Herald

 

John Kerry had just pumped up a huge crowd in downtown West Palm Beach, promising to make the state a battleground for his quest to oust President Bush, when a local television journalist posed the question that any candidate with Florida ambitions should expect:

 

What will you do about Cuba?

 

Comments | Read more...

As the presumptive Democratic nominee, Kerry was ready with the bravado appropriate for a challenger who knows that every answer carries magnified importance in the state that put President Bush into office by just 537 votes.

 

''I'm pretty tough on Castro, because I think he's running one of the last vestiges of a Stalinist secret police government in the world,'' Kerry told WPLG-ABC 10 reporter Michael Putney in an interview to be aired at 11:30 this morning.

 

Then, reaching back eight years to one of the more significant efforts to toughen sanctions on the communist island, Kerry volunteered: "And I voted for the Helms-Burton legislation to be tough on companies that deal with him.''

 

It seemed the correct answer in a year in which Democratic strategists think they can make a play for at least a portion of the important Cuban-American vote -- as they did in 1996 when more than three in 10 backed President Clinton's reelection after he signed the sanctions measure written by Sen. Jesse Helms and Rep. Dan Burton.

 

There is only one problem: Kerry voted against it.

 

Asked Friday to explain the discrepancy, Kerry aides said the senator cast one of the 22 nays that day in 1996 because he disagreed with some of the final technical aspects. But, said spokesman David Wade, Kerry supported the legislation in its purer form -- and voted for it months earlier.

 

The confusion illustrates a persistent problem for Kerry as Republicans exploit his 19-year voting history to paint the Massachusetts senator as a waffler on major foreign-affairs questions such as the Iraq war, Israel's security barrier and intelligence funding.

 

Cuba policy is particularly treacherous for Kerry because Florida's nearly half-million Cuban-American voters could be pivotal in awarding the state's 27 electoral votes. And Republicans are preparing to unleash a wave of publicity designed to portray Kerry's new toughness as an election-year conversion from a career of liberal positions on Cuba.

 

Speaking to reporters Saturday after a meeting of senior Florida Republicans about increasing Hispanic turnout this year, Lt. Gov. Toni Jennings predicted that Kerry's voting record on Cuba would ''haunt'' him in the coming months.

 

OTHER VULNERABILITIES

 

Kerry will also rue past votes supporting loosened restrictions on travel and cash ''remittances'' that Cubans are allowed to send back to the island, Republicans said. They point to a 2000 Boston Globe interview in which Kerry called a reevaluation of the trade embargo ''way overdue'' and said that the only reason the United States treated Cuba differently from China and Russia was the "politics of Florida.''

 

Republicans say they can increase Hispanic voter turnout in Florida from the 2000 levels, when outrage over the Clinton administration's decision to return Elián Gonzalez to his father in Cuba helped Bush crush then-Vice President Al Gore among Cuban Americans.

 

''Kerry is much softer on Castro than Al Gore was,'' Ken Mehlman, Bush's campaign manager, said in an interview.

 

Saturday's meeting came as GOP strategists worry about Bush's vulnerability on Cuba after months of criticism from some exile leaders who say Bush has failed to deliver on campaign promises to crack down on Castro.

 

One recent poll showed that three in four Cuban Americans planned to vote for Bush again -- but that a substantial number are concerned about his handling of Cuba policy.

 

Democratic strategists hope that such skepticism of Bush gives Kerry a foothold. But they acknowledge that a Democrat with Kerry's record is not likely to score points on Cuba policy among single-issue voters.

 

Some Cuban Americans, however, may be more flexible if they are equally skeptical of Bush and Kerry on the promise to foster reforms in Cuba. Strategists think they could be convinced by Democratic arguments on domestic matters such as jobs, healthcare and education.

 

''If they don't believe Bush on Cuba, then they certainly aren't going to believe someone who is new on the scene like Kerry,'' said Democratic pollster Sergio Bendixen, who is advising the centrist New Democrat Network on a new ad campaign targeting Hispanic voters. "Cuban Americans don't believe anybody on Cuba policy, not Democrats or Republicans.''

 

Nevertheless, as Kerry fought for his party's nomination and began eyeing a Florida strategy, his language on Cuba morphed.

 

The first shift was evident in August, when Kerry told NBC's Tim Russert that he was not in favor of lifting sanctions. ''Not now,'' he said. "No.''

 

Days later, in an interview with The Herald, Kerry offered a more textured explanation of his position, embracing ''humanitarian'' travel and other exchanges with the island to curb "the isolation that in my judgment helps Castro.''

 

HE STRUGGLES

 

But there are also constant reminders that Kerry struggles with the complexities of Cuba. Asked in the Herald interview last year about sending Elián back to Cuba, Kerry was blunt: "I didn't agree with that.''

 

But when he was asked to elaborate, Kerry acknowledged that he agreed the boy should have been with his father.

 

So what didn't he agree with?

 

''I didn't like the way they did it. I thought the process was butchered,'' he said.

 

And when he was asked last week during a town hall meeting in Broward County about immigration policies that allow Cuban migrants to remain if they reach land but do not give the same rights to Haitians and others who travel to Florida, he appeared to grasp for an answer.

 

First, he said all migrants have a right to make their case for asylum. Then, as if anticipating his weaknesses, Kerry turned the conversation back to the embargo, pledging that he would not support lifting sanctions.

 

''I haven't resolved what to do,'' he said, seeming to reflect on the full scope of Cuba concerns. "I'm going to talk to a lot of people in Florida.''

 

Herald staff writer Lesley Clark and researcher Gay Nemeti contributed to this report.

http://havanajournal.com/politics_comments/1492_0_5_0_C/

-=Mike

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I'm calling you out, Mike.

 

Kerry voted for this bill BEFORE voting against it.

 

Quit trying to twist JFK's words, and stop questioning his patriotism. I'm sick of it...

[Guest MikeSC]

I'm calling you out, Mike.

 

Kerry voted for this bill BEFORE voting against it.

 

Quit trying to twist JFK's words, and stop questioning his patriotism. I'm sick of it...

I'll say it now --- Kerry has voted for --- and then against --- America, fluffy bunnies, unicorns, puppies, and gooey fudge.

-=Mike

...The man is a Communist --- and a HUGE Nixon fan!

[Guest MD2020]

Well, all I know is not to cross Kerry on the slopes...

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/19/politics...print&position=

 

On his first full day off, though, Mr. Kerry awoke determined to hit the slopes of Mount Baldy.

 

The image-conscious candidate and his aides prevailed upon reporters and photographers to let him have a first run down the mountain solo, except for two agents and Marvin Nicholson, his omnipresent right-hand man.

 

His next trip down, a reporter and a camera crew were allowed to follow along on skis — just in time to see Mr. Kerry taken out by one of the Secret Service men, who had inadvertently moved into his path, sending him into the snow.

 

When asked about the mishap a moment later, he said sharply, "I don't fall down," then used an expletive to describe the agent who "knocked me over."

 

Now, call me crazy, but is it really a good idea to call the guys who have to take a bullet for you an "asshole" or whatever?

[Guest MikeSC]

Well, all I know is not to cross Kerry on the slopes...

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/19/politics...print&position=

 

On his first full day off, though, Mr. Kerry awoke determined to hit the slopes of Mount Baldy.

 

The image-conscious candidate and his aides prevailed upon reporters and photographers to let him have a first run down the mountain solo, except for two agents and Marvin Nicholson, his omnipresent right-hand man.

 

His next trip down, a reporter and a camera crew were allowed to follow along on skis — just in time to see Mr. Kerry taken out by one of the Secret Service men, who had inadvertently moved into his path, sending him into the snow.

 

When asked about the mishap a moment later, he said sharply, "I don't fall down," then used an expletive to describe the agent who "knocked me over."

 

Now, call me crazy, but is it really a good idea to call the guys who have to take a bullet for you an "asshole" or whatever?

I'm sure his statement was more nuanced than that.

-=Mike

...BTW, ALSO according to NRO, foreign diplomats, while they don't like Bush at all, think Kerry is a joke and none believe that their gov't has endorsed him

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

...The man is a Communist --- and a HUGE Nixon fan!

He also agrees with Tyler's posts...

 

 

and SideFX's.

 

His next trip down, a reporter and a camera crew were allowed to follow along on skis — just in time to see Mr. Kerry taken out by one of the Secret Service men, who had inadvertently moved into his path, sending him into the snow.

 

Um, where is the footage from this?

 

We saw that pic of Bush falling while on that goofy "future" transportation scooter, or whatever it's called.

 

Darn LIBERAL MEDIA...

[snuffbox 0]

Well, all I know is not to cross Kerry on the slopes...

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/19/politics...print&position=

 

On his first full day off, though, Mr. Kerry awoke determined to hit the slopes of Mount Baldy.

 

The image-conscious candidate and his aides prevailed upon reporters and photographers to let him have a first run down the mountain solo, except for two agents and Marvin Nicholson, his omnipresent right-hand man.

 

His next trip down, a reporter and a camera crew were allowed to follow along on skis — just in time to see Mr. Kerry taken out by one of the Secret Service men, who had inadvertently moved into his path, sending him into the snow.

 

When asked about the mishap a moment later, he said sharply, "I don't fall down," then used an expletive to describe the agent who "knocked me over."

 

Now, call me crazy, but is it really a good idea to call the guys who have to take a bullet for you an "asshole" or whatever?

The quote -

 

When asked a moment later about the incident by a reporter on the ski run, Kerry said sharply, "I don't fall down," the "son of a b*itch knocked me over."

 

credit - drudge

 

http://drudgereport.com/kerryid2.htm

 

....Harry Browne - Vote for him...

[Guest Cerebus]

What a major league asshole.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I'm going to laugh long and hard when all this shitting doesn't matter and people go vote for Kerry not because they like him, but because they hate Bush more.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I'm going to laugh long and hard when all this shitting doesn't matter and people go vote for Kerry not because they like him, but because they hate Bush more.

Sad thing is your right. (I don't put any political weight to this Kerry snowboarding story myself -- I just think it's funny as hell. Although Kerry has a point about being tripped up by the guy who's supposed to take a bullet for him. After all, Kerry is already a whiz a ducking bullets. He served in Vietnam you know.)

 

But yet some posters here will still be whining about how this board is too partisan and all Bush supporters blindly follow their leader...

[snuffbox 0]

I'm going to laugh long and hard when all this shitting doesn't matter and people go vote for Kerry not because they like him, but because they hate Bush more.

Sad thing is your right. (I don't put any political weight to this Kerry snowboarding story myself -- I just think it's funny as hell. Although Kerry has a point about being tripped up by the guy who's supposed to take a bullet for him. After all, Kerry is already a whiz a ducking bullets. He served in Vietnam you know.)

 

But yet some posters here will still be whining about how this board is too partisan and all Bush supporters blindly follow their leader...

the board is definitly not partisan...good mix of different views...

 

you dont follow blindly...

 

others dont, some do...either way, TSM is not a fair representation of America anyway.

[Guest thebigjig]

I wouldn't say this board is partisan... infact it seems to be the most balanced message board I've been to

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Depending on who's here, who's taking a break, and who's given up and stopped posting here, it can either seem balanced or like trying to debate at a Republican convention. It certainly is entertaining, though.

 

Especially if it's a Howard Dean thread, where 90% of us just all laugh together.