IndyMedia and Pat Tillman

[Guest Cerebus]

OMGTOWNHALLLOL2004!

 

This isn't a knock against liberals here, several of whom I respect and whose posts I enjoy reading, but a general silence and alliance with garbage like IndyMedia, DemocraticUnderground, and MoveOn.org will eventually come out, and it doesn't look good. Naturally, we on the right are guilty for still leading credence to Ann Coulter among others, but I would hope to get a general reaction from our more liberal boarders.

 

P.S. I am now anticipating Mike's general comment on liberals being out of touch and overly extreme.

[Guest MikeSC]

OMGTOWNHALLLOL2004!

 

This isn't a knock against liberals here, several of whom I respect and whose posts I enjoy reading, but a general silence and alliance with garbage like IndyMedia, DemocraticUnderground, and MoveOn.org will eventually come out, and it doesn't look good. Naturally, we on the right are guilty for still leading credence to Ann Coulter among others, but I would hope to get a general reaction from our more liberal boarders.

 

P.S. I am now anticipating Mike's general comment on liberals being out of touch and overly extreme.

The extreme left is laden with people about whom the world would have benefitted greatly if their fathers simply pulled out a little quicker.

-=Mike

...May their mothers get cancer

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

This isn't a knock against liberals here...

Speak for yourself, hippie.

 

I bet Tyler and JOTW are mods at Indymedia.org...

[Vyce 0]

Whoa.

 

After reading that article, I have to agree with Mike - I hope their mothers get cancer.

[Guest thebigjig]

God that insane... about as insane as Ann Coulter saying in one of her columns that we should take over middle eastern countries, kill their leaders, and convert all of their people to Christianity

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Hey cereb., I think when you do your "OMG..." when it comes to Townhall.com, I think you should re-word it to "Clownhall..."

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

I think the difference between the extreme left and the extreme right is that the moderate right takes the extremes somewhat seriously (but admitting they have wacko opinions sometimes), whereas the left completely ignores the extremes.

 

Nobody on the left takes DemocraticUnderground or whatever seriously. Moveon.org isn't extreme in anything but their rhetoric, though; what they stand for is center-left moderatism, although you'd never know it by their advertisements.

[Guest MikeSC]

I think the difference between the extreme left and the extreme right is that the moderate right takes the extremes somewhat seriously (but admitting they have wacko opinions sometimes), whereas the left completely ignores the extremes.

 

Nobody on the left takes DemocraticUnderground or whatever seriously. Moveon.org isn't extreme in anything but their rhetoric, though; what they stand for is center-left moderatism, although you'd never know it by their advertisements.

Ah, once again, the left knows better. They ignore their "extremes", but the right takes their extremes "seriously".

 

God knows conservatives here think highly of Ann Coulter.

-=Mike

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

You've quoted sources from Townhall.com plenty of times, Mike. And let's not forget that NewsMax story you tried to pass off as legit.

[Guest Cerebus]

You've quoted sources from Townhall.com plenty of times, Mike. And let's not forget that NewsMax story you tried to pass off as legit.

Scroll up Tyler, so did I. The author is not Ann Coulter however.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Regardless, it's a fringe right-wing screed site. As we've discussed several times on AIM, hardly any liberal on this board dares to cite anything farther left than the New York Times, and I'd stretch to say that most not named Hunger2Unger or whatever find much other than that more than just entertaining garbage.

[Guest MikeSC]

You've quoted sources from Townhall.com plenty of times, Mike. And let's not forget that NewsMax story you tried to pass off as legit.

You know what's REAL ironic--- the newsmax story WAS legit. BOO YAH! You couldn't dispute the ACTUAL voracity of the story --- so you simply bashed the source, even though the story --- again --- was correct.

 

Of course, Mr "Moveon.org isn't really that radical, outside of their advertisements" wouldn't recognize that. Heck, let me guess, in your world, Kerry is closer to the center than Bush, isn't he?

 

I post what I feel is accurate.

 

You don't see me quoting Michael Savage, Ann Coulter, et al --- do ya?

-=Mike

[Guest Cerebus]

Regardless, it's a fringe right-wing screed site. As we've discussed several times on AIM, hardly any liberal on this board dares to cite anything farther left than the New York Times, and I'd stretch to say that most not named Hunger2Unger or whatever find much other than that more than just entertaining garbage.

Aye, but don't you feel that more liberals (not on this board but in general) should spend more time distancing themselves from stuff like this?

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

You couldn't dispute the ACTUAL voracity of the story --- so you simply bashed the source, even though the story --- again --- was correct.

 

Actually, I didn't debate either. I simply don't care enough to respond to the 100 editorials you post in the form of new topics. When you get a chubby about dissing John Kerry, nothing can steer you off that track. I find it's best to go do something more productive than argue with you over the voracity of your NewsMax sources.

 

Of course, Mr "Moveon.org isn't really that radical, outside of their advertisements" wouldn't recognize that. Heck, let me guess, in your world, Kerry is closer to the center than Bush, isn't he?

 

Moveon.org's biggest issue is balancing the budget. They were formed to protest Clinton's impeachment.

 

Those are some real radical planks, bro.

 

I post what I feel is accurate.

 

Damn, I appreciate that!

 

You don't see me quoting Michael Savage, Ann Coulter, et al --- do ya?

-=Mike

 

Jonah Goldberg and Peggy Noonan aren't much better.

[Guest MikeSC]

The problem with the left is that they DON'T RECOGNIZE their radical members.

 

The gay marriage groups? They are extreme.

The pro-choicers in Washington this weekend? Extreme.

 

But, in your eyes, they are likely mainstream.

Actually, I didn't debate either. I simply don't care enough to respond to the 100 editorials you post in the form of new topics.

Well, aren't you the adorable little elitist?

When you get a chubby about dissing John Kerry, nothing can steer you off that track. I find it's best to go do something more productive than argue with you over the voracity of your NewsMax sources.

Except, again, that the story WAS true.

Of course, Mr "Moveon.org isn't really that radical, outside of their advertisements" wouldn't recognize that. Heck, let me guess, in your world, Kerry is closer to the center than Bush, isn't he?

 

Moveon.org's biggest issue is balancing the budget. They were formed to protest Clinton's impeachment.

 

Those are some real radical planks, bro.

See my quote at the beginning of this. You can't even RECOGNIZE extremism on your side.

I post what I feel is accurate.

 

Damn, I appreciate that!

 

You don't see me quoting Michael Savage, Ann Coulter, et al --- do ya?

-=Mike

 

Jonah Goldberg and Peggy Noonan aren't much better.

Not exactly raving right-wingers, either. They're wittier versions of Franken, more often than not.

-=Mike

[Guest Cerebus]

Jonah Goldberg and Peggy Noonan aren't much better.

I would place them on the same level as William Safire and Maureen Dowd. Which is to say, I don't think they're crackpots but they unabashadley swing the left/right.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

The gay marriage groups? They are extreme.

The pro-choicers in Washington this weekend? Extreme.

 

So, you're saying that anyone in favor of civil marriage as opposed to a constitutional ban on gay marriage is extreme?

 

And pro-choice people are extreme?

 

Uh...

 

Okay, Mike. Sure. I'll leave that one for everyone else to dissect. I'm too elitist for this debate.

[snuffbox 0]

Someone please tell me I read that wrong....

 

Please...noone REALLY would disparage Pat Tillman....

 

This may be one of the most atrocious ideas Ive seen lately. Tillman absolutely embodies courage. The guy gave up millions to fight after his friends died on 9-11. I dont give a shit if a war is justified or not, these soldiers are all heroes and have more courage in their thumbs than I have in my entire body, and Im not a particularly fearful soul either.

 

I come from a long, decorated military family. My father was permanently disabled during two tours in Vietnam. My legacy has scared me from participation but taught me to respect.

 

I dont feel Iraq or Vietnam was justified but the men and women who fought and still fight are the bravest souls ever on earth.

 

Anyone who is so pathetic to disrespect any veteran is on the same level of child molesters.

[C Dubya 04 0]

The parts that were beyond belief were the ones where they called Tilman a "dumb jock". He carried a 3.8 gpa through college for christ sake.

 

 

In regards to the argument above, I think that it's unfair to say that the left should have to distance themselves from these nutjobs. It should be understood that anyone with a sliver of a brain doesn't agree with these statements.

[Guest Wildbomb 4:20]

Let me first start out by addressing the actual topic. On Sports Sunday, we dedicated the show to Pat Tillman. We talked for an extended period of time about his career, his choice, his sacrifice. The man earned, embodied, and deserves respect. I don't care what your political, personal, or the voices in your head views are, you give the guy the respect he deserves. Therefore, these idiots deserve a Boondock Saint style double-tap to the back of the noggin.

 

Mike=Pro-choicers are extreme? Pro-gay marriages? They might be MINORITIES, but certainly not EXTREMISTS. There's a difference. And we've already shown that the religious right probably shouldn't cite the Bible for reasoning behind banning gay marriage, unless they've never gotten haircut, haven't shaved their beards, eaten the shellfish, coveted anything, lusted after anyone, eaten the rare meat, gotten a tattoo. It's all in Leviticus. Then there's the problem of translation, as next to nobody reads Arameic anymore. Yet somehow, they aren't labeled as extremists. As for abortion, someone apparently hasn't done their homework on statistics: a recent ABCNews poll shows that 53% of Americans support it. Which would make them the majority. Anyways.

 

If political websites are your game, you should probably read something that, you know, is published first, and then put on the Net. Cause you can basically say whatever the fuck you want online. It's why I don't read the Drudge Report, or reporter's blogs. It's why I don't go to MoveOn.org. I might be a liberal, but dammit, a lot of people are giving it a damndably bad name.

[Guest Cerebus]

OMGTOWNHALLLOL2004!

 

This isn't a knock against liberals here, several of whom I respect and whose posts I enjoy reading, but a general silence and alliance with garbage like IndyMedia, DemocraticUnderground, and MoveOn.org will eventually come out, and it doesn't look good.  Naturally, we on the right are guilty for still leading credence to Ann Coulter among others, but I would hope to get a general reaction from our more liberal boarders.

 

P.S. I am now anticipating Mike's general comment on liberals being out of touch and overly extreme.

The extreme left is laden with people about whom the world would have benefitted greatly if their fathers simply pulled out a little quicker.

-=Mike

...May their mothers get cancer

Proving me right for free Mike. You're a pal.

[Guest MikeSC]

The gay marriage groups? They are extreme.

The pro-choicers in Washington this weekend? Extreme.

 

So, you're saying that anyone in favor of civil marriage as opposed to a constitutional ban on gay marriage is extreme?

 

And pro-choice people are extreme?

 

Uh...

 

Okay, Mike. Sure. I'll leave that one for everyone else to dissect. I'm too elitist for this debate.

Oh, I'm sorry, positions YOU hold that the majority of the country DON'T hold are mainstream.

 

Hard to keep up with that liberal logic.

Mike=Pro-choicers are extreme?

The ones who marched this weekend were.

Pro-gay marriages? They might be MINORITIES, but certainly not EXTREMISTS.

They are QUITE extreme.

Yet somehow, they aren't labeled as extremists. As for abortion, someone apparently hasn't done their homework on statistics: a recent ABCNews poll shows that 53% of Americans support it. Which would make them the majority. Anyways.

The pro-choicers oppose a ban on partial birth abortions --- which the vast majority of Americans DO support.

Proving me right for free Mike. You're a pal. 

Who's your buddy?

-=Mike

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

Pro-gay marriages? They might be MINORITIES, but certainly not EXTREMISTS.

They are QUITE extreme.

How are they "extreme"?

 

Anti-abortion activists murdering doctors = extreme

 

Animal rights activists destroying labs = extreme

 

I don't get how supporting gay marriage is extreme.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

You don't have to. MikeSCland is much different than real planet earth.

[NoCalMike 0]

I can honestly say if I had to sit and read the actual editorial that, the link is referring to, I would get physically ill. And, I consider myself one of the more liberal/anti-war folks on this board.

[Guest MikeSC]

You don't have to. MikeSCland is much different than real planet earth.

Says Tyler "Dean isn't that extreme" McClelland.

 

Gay marriage proponents are EXTREMISTS.

 

DEAL WITH IT.

-=Mike

[NoCalMike 0]

You don't have to. MikeSCland is much different than real planet earth.

Says Tyler "Dean isn't that extreme" McClelland.

 

Gay marriage proponents are EXTREMISTS.

 

DEAL WITH IT.

-=Mike

Extremism is becoming overused though in many ways. While the authors opinions' in the Tillman article will never be accepted by a rational human being, is it really that hard to imagine that one day in this country gays will be able to get married, is it THAT radical of an idea? That is why I kind of take issue to someone saying that feeling gays should be allowed to get married is considered extremism...

[Guest MikeSC]

You don't have to. MikeSCland is much different than real planet earth.

Says Tyler "Dean isn't that extreme" McClelland.

 

Gay marriage proponents are EXTREMISTS.

 

DEAL WITH IT.

-=Mike

Extremism is becoming overused though in many ways. While the authors opinions' in the Tillman article will never be accepted by a rational human being, is it really that hard to imagine that one day in this country gays will be able to get married, is it THAT radical of an idea? That is why I kind of take issue to someone saying that feeling gays should be allowed to get married is considered extremism...

It's no less extreme than considering pro-lifers "extreme".

-=Mike

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Except nobody considers pro-lifers extreme, either. It's just you throwing around moronic labels.

[Guest MikeSC]

Except nobody considers pro-lifers extreme, either. It's just you throwing around moronic labels.

Ah yes, I just made all that up.

 

Of course.

-=Mike