evilhomer 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 I've noticed recently that with the better quality that Raw's been showing, I've also been liking the commentating better as well. JR's showing some genuine excitement and even though he does still use them, he isn't relying solely on his repetitive catchphrases. Lawler, while still being useless whenever breasts are within view, seems to have finally remembered that he's the heel(ish) commentator. He's coming up with some insight and interacting with JR as the heel commentator should. They still make mistakes, miss opportunities to cover botches or inconsistencies, but they aren't as noticable and pronounced as they were a while ago. I'm not saying that they've returned to their previous great levels, just that I'm enjoying them better. Over on Smackdown, it's just the opposite. Cole is once again completely worthless. During the Smackdown six run, I really noticed an improvement in him. He was calling well and had an excitement level that went with the flow of the matches. He wasn't great, but I liked him better. Now he's just as bad or worse than ever. Tazz had some great lines in there and worked great in the ex-wrestler counterpoint insight role. It's now been at least three months since his last humorous line, he's more annoying than funny, and he isn't adding anything with what he says. A particular annoyance is on Dupree's french tickler; I want to reach through my tv screen and rip his tongue out on the schit he's using for that. What I'm wondering is if this is all just my imagination. Am I just enjoying the Raw matches more so the commentating seems better? Are Smackdown matches sucking so badly that the commentating sounds shitty as well? I think it's just a matter of the commentators being human. What they're watching affects their emotions and simply by impulse it reflects through on what they're saying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Mandarin 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 Josh Matthews > Lawler, Coach, Snow, Grisham, DeMott, Tazz and Cole Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kizzo 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 Back when Heyman was the head writer for Smackdown...he was also helping Cole and TAZZ in commentating....Ever since he left the post...Cole and TAZZ's commentary has suffered as well... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Fook Report post Posted July 5, 2004 It comes down to the fact that when the product is good, the announcers have an easier time conveying that message. Since SD sucks the meat missle now, Tazz and Cole have a much harder time convincing the audience that what's on the screen is entertaining. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted July 5, 2004 JR has somewhat been going back to the style that many enjoyed him with. People forget that JR used to be an incredible announcer before the disease kicked in and he became daunted with a new workload, that he got lazy with the work. Now that he is no longer a part of Talent Operations, he seems to be more focused. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
algrim 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 EM is right. Lawler is not as annoying as he can be and offers more insight into the matches. Over at SD!, it looks like Cole is suffering from brain farts and is making more mistakes. Tazz corrects him a lot more times now than before. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 It's not the match. I don't care how bad a match is, the quality of commentating should always be the same. There are many purposes of commentating... 1) To put over the wrestlers. That's the biggest one. 2) To put over the story of the match (if there happens to be one). 3) To put over any storyline(s) involving the wrestlers. So if right now, Benoit wrestled against Randy Orton, the announcers should put over both men while talking about Benoit's storyline with Evolution (but mostly HHH) and also Orton's dealings with Benoit's semi-partner Edge. Having those men at ringside greatly helps, though it leads to the fans KNOWING there will be a screwy finish. If the match ended with HHH sneaking in and going for a Pedigree, only for Edge to come out and spear HHH before he can hit it (as Orton might be distracting the referee) only for the referee to turn around and see Edge AND HHH in the ring...he may either call for the bell or kick them out. If he calls for the bell, BEDLAM breaks loose, as all four men just starting beating the crap out of each other, ending in either the heels retreating or beating up the faces. If the ref kicks them out of the ring and keeps the match going, Orton has a chance to move in and steal one from Benoit, though that could lead to even MORE shenanigans from HHH and Edge, and eventually Benoit would win or the match would go to a DQ and the brawling would happen either way. No matter what, it's assured the segment would end with a) Evolution celebrating or b) Evolution running away. The fans should be programmed to know that by now (but it's more of a smark foregone conclusion), but the announcing can still make it seem that much more exciting by adding the drama to it that only they can, since they can be vocal and the wrestlers really can't. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChick 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 I have one major problem with both JR and Cole. It's a bit picky, but I absolutley hate them calling people "kids". Cole does it with all the cruiserweights because, you know, if you're small you must be a kid. Granted, I can see with someone like London, but still. My favorite is when JR calls someone like Jericho, a person who has been in the company for almost 5 years and is 33, a kid. Espeically if he's in the ring with someone who's younger and more inexperienced than him, like Tyson Tomko. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wildpegasus Report post Posted July 5, 2004 JR will typically be excited at the beggining and end of a telecast and perhaps the middle. It doesn't matter how good or bad the match is. Since about 91 when I started hearing JR commentate I've noticed large inconsitencies in the emotion he puts into a match. If your match is in the right slot all of a sudden it will become exciting. If it's in the wrong slot it's boring and he doesn't put anything into it. He also favours some wrestlers over others. Examples being The Steiners, Williams/Gordy, Austin and Kane. On the other side of the coin there are some wrestlers where you can tell he doesn't care for too much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted July 5, 2004 The only time I minded JR using the "kid" line was with Jeff Hardy. "CMON KID! CLIMB THE LADDER! MAKE YOURSELF FAMOUS!" It was the perfect call to create the feeling of desperation and his underdogness to the deadman. Another thing about Ross is this...and it's kinda annoying... Sometimes he'll go in 1989 NWA mode, where he is ultra serious and is very detailed with the commentary, pointing out the psychology and the story of the match as he should but then the next match, he goes into rambling who gives a damn about this match JR. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dazed Report post Posted July 5, 2004 The problem with JR is that he gets into a ridiculous amount of screaming and shouting about whatever's happening on screen. As wildpegasus said, it's typically at the end of the night. Obviously, he needs to be putting over the action, and the idea should be that if he's excited, everyone should be... but it doesn't work. His credibility in that regard is shot, because of week after week of screaming. Had he saved it, or if he had some extra level to go to, it'd be okay, but he only ever gets to "BAH GAWD THIS IS A NIGHT STONE COLD WIL NEVA FORGIT". Repeatedly. Lawler is all over the place. The character is clearly a face, with him and good ol' JR taking on the evil Coach. However, he commentates as a heel, putting over Evolution the most. However, he doesn't make an effort to put over what the heel is doing, and most importantly WHY. There's a lot of "ahahahaha JR, look!", but no "Triple H got the chair because he's the smartest man out there". He's also inconsistent, as he favours the people that he likes, rather than following strict face / heel boundaries. Especially when it comes to talking about fucking breasts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
landy1987 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 Lawler is all over the place. The character is clearly a face, with him and good ol' JR taking on the evil Coach. However, he commentates as a heel, putting over Evolution the most. However, he doesn't make an effort to put over what the heel is doing, and most importantly WHY. There's a lot of "ahahahaha JR, look!", but no "Triple H got the chair because he's the smartest man out there". He's also inconsistent, as he favours the people that he likes, rather than following strict face / heel boundaries. Especially when it comes to talking about fucking breasts. Hasnt Lawler been more on the heel side with Coach, when Coach has occasionally joined the announce team over the past 2 months or so? the only times I notice King commentating as a "face" is when there's a "serious injury" or something eg Shawn Michaels a few weeks back. And you have to admit he's not as bad now when talking about the women, he only seems to do it now and again. (btw I havent watched last weeks Raw yet, so if everything I just said turns out to be false then sorry about that!) Smackdown, I have no comment, I'm bored with EVERYTHING on that show Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HollywoodSpikeJenkins 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 Josh Matthews > Lawler, Coach, Snow, Grisham, DeMott, Tazz and Cole I agree. On Velocity several months back, when Bryan Danielson was having a match, Matthews explained who Danielson was, The American Dragon character, who he was trained by, his time in Japan, Europe, and all over the US, The Cattle Mutilation, AND the attempt at a Dragon Suplex. Matthews does his homework, that's for sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted July 5, 2004 He did that all in the 2 minutes they likely gave Danielson? Nice. Let's not forget...Josh was a smark like us once. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Staravenger Report post Posted July 5, 2004 I wouldn't say Tazz & Cole have gotten THAT bad, but I'm still not too much a fan of them. Tazz is good, possibly one of the better wrestlers turned PBP men in recent history, but carrying Michael Cole, who has a habit of saying stupid crap, is too much to ask. Lawler seems to have toned down the puppies image, but he's still not completely done with it (whenever Trish is on, he blows his load). Jim Ross has never been THAT bad in recent years, but he is nothing close to the level he was at in the NWA and his early WWF years before the 2nd time he got bells palsy. If anyone should quit being a PBP Man, it's Bill DeMott. The only thing mentionable is him saying "Junior" every other sentence. I noticed the Heat guys have gotten zero mention, but Snow isn't too bad, although his jokes are VERY stale, and Coach is a bit better as a heel, but he still has problems with calling someone "him" and "he" instead of the persons name. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
landy1987 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 I noticed the Heat guys have gotten zero mention, but Snow isn't too bad, although his jokes are VERY stale, and Coach is a bit better as a heel, but he still has problems with calling someone "him" and "he" instead of the persons name. i'd rather not mention the Heat commentators. Recently, we have been getting Todd Grisham and Marc Loyd provide commentary on the UK version of Heat (we dont get same version except for Live pre-PPV shows) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheBigSwigg 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 I wouldn't say Tazz & Cole have gotten THAT bad, but I'm still not too much a fan of them. Tazz is good, possibly one of the better wrestlers turned PBP men in recent history, but carrying Michael Cole, who has a habit of saying stupid crap, is too much to ask. Lawler seems to have toned down the puppies image, but he's still not completely done with it (whenever Trish is on, he blows his load). Jim Ross has never been THAT bad in recent years, but he is nothing close to the level he was at in the NWA and his early WWF years before the 2nd time he got bells palsy. If anyone should quit being a PBP Man, it's Bill DeMott. The only thing mentionable is him saying "Junior" every other sentence. I noticed the Heat guys have gotten zero mention, but Snow isn't too bad, although his jokes are VERY stale, and Coach is a bit better as a heel, but he still has problems with calling someone "him" and "he" instead of the persons name. Yeah, I'm tired of Al Snow calling ever single jobber "-------- Bobbaganoush" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted July 5, 2004 It's just sad listening to JR anymore. Back when he was doing NWA shows he rarely yelled. He seemed to know what's going on and he didn't play favorites. And he talked about what was going on in the ring. Now he screams constantly, doesn't know the moves at all and always plays favorites. Plus he rarely talks about what's going on in the ring. Jericho vs. Christian JR: HHH, HHH, HHH, HHH, HHH, Bisch, HHH, HHH, BY GAWD, SLOBBERKNOCKER, HHH, HHH You get the point of how his announcing is these days. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Fook Report post Posted July 5, 2004 In JR's defense, I think he and Lawler were told to focus more on the main event guys, which (surprise) includes HHH. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silence 0 Report post Posted July 5, 2004 Yeah, I'm tired of Al Snow calling ever single jobber "-------- Bobbaganoush" As bland as Todd Grisham may be, at least he got onto Al Snow about it last night on Heat by telling him:"I thought his name was Murray Happer." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Reservoir_Kitty Report post Posted July 5, 2004 JR and Lawler have been improving, but on the whole, I really just tune them out. They have this bad habit of straying off the topic at hand.. Lawler is especially bad if there's an upcoming women's match... that's all he talks about, no matter what's going on in the ring, or backstage. Cole and Tazz... awful.. I find it's much easier to watch Smackdown on mute. I do like their little 'comedy' bits that they get into every now and again. I gotta agree though, I cringe everytime they utter "French tickler". Embarassing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TigerDriver91 Report post Posted July 6, 2004 Al Snow: "I hate it when a match interrupts my point." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted July 6, 2004 I don't buy this theory. The really great teams like Ventura/Monsoon were just as good for Hercules/Warrior as they were for Savage/Steamboat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
