The OAO "Thank GOD the Diva Search is over Thread"

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

What I didn't like:

 

The finish to the Benjamin/HHH match. It's irony at its finest. They supposedly are "protecting" Benjamin by not having him lose, but Sheldon did not get *anything* from that win. ALL of the heat went to HHH, despite or inspite of winning Edit:: losing -if that doesn't show the effect of that match, I dunno what does . I am sensing some "Xpac" heat for HHH. It's nothing huge, but it should be something to take note of for the WWE.

 

What's with all the big boots? Gene S., Tomko, Kane, etc. Test must be rolling over in his grave. Speaking of which, do we really need Test jr. in the WWE? I'm not feeling the "It's not my fault" (though the potential in hilarious parody is great), but it would be cool to see him being "reluctantly protected" by Bischoff (Snitsky threatening to sue the WWE if Kane does something bad, or the legal consequences of Kane going over the edge), and him taking advantage of that protection.

 

Poor Val Venis. This guy is one of the best wrestlers on the roster, and has been positioned as a complete jobber. It's sad. He did a pretty ok job of making GS look good, as it wasn't a total disaster of a match that it could have been given GS's experience and skills. It's a shame that the ability to make others look good is being taken for granted and abused rather than rewarded.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

BTW, Since when has Flair been coming out with a "Wooo!"-less entrance theme?

[Guest M. Harry Smilac]

Poor Val Venis. This guy is one of the best wrestlers on the roster, and has been positioned as a complete jobber. It's sad. He did a pretty ok job of making GS look good, as it wasn't a total disaster of a match that it could have been given GS's experience and skills. It's a shame that the ability to make others look good is being taken for granted and abused rather than rewarded.

What was worse was JR feeling like he had to tell us that Val is a superstar.

 

As for Orton.Over?Not Over?He's still green and sucks.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

"Oh that Val Venis, he's a big name. He's a big time superstar. He's a major leaguer for sure. A win over him is a statement. Yes it is. Sure, he only appears on RAW to lose and has a 50/50 record at best on Heat, but that doesn't stop him from being on top of the mountain."

[Exslade ZX 0]

Poor Val Venis.  This guy is one of the best wrestlers on the roster, and has been positioned as a complete jobber.  It's sad.  He did a pretty ok job of making GS look good, as it wasn't a total disaster of a match that it could have been given GS's experience and skills.  It's a shame that the ability to make others look good is being taken for granted and abused rather than rewarded.

What was worse was JR feeling like he had to tell us that Val is a superstar.

 

As for Orton.Over?Not Over?He's still green and sucks.

But...if he is still green, and does in fact suck, and is still over. Then you know something's being done right.

[Open the Muggy Gate 0]

From what I watched last night, Orton is OVER. Interview was awesome. Solid match. Great crowd reaction for him. He's got the Shawn Michaels face thing going where girls scream for him too.

 

And I don't believe it, but some of you think he sucks, therefore, he is not over. Hulk Hogan always sucked, but he got the crowd on their feet every damn time he came out to that ring. Sometimes, it's not always about the ability.

 

The moral of the story: Orton is over.

 

THE END

 

P.S. Hope you enjoyed being there Y2Jerk.

[Gary Floyd 0]

I honestly wonder how Snitsky feels that everyone in the arena including their mother chanted "baby killer at him? Now THAT is heel heat.

 

It's probably just me, but Lawler really got on my nerves last night, or at least more than usual. Particularly during the diva segment. Even JR was annoyed by him. I mean come one, you could really tell that he was annoyed.

[Guest M. Harry Smilac]

Poor Val Venis.  This guy is one of the best wrestlers on the roster, and has been positioned as a complete jobber.  It's sad.  He did a pretty ok job of making GS look good, as it wasn't a total disaster of a match that it could have been given GS's experience and skills.  It's a shame that the ability to make others look good is being taken for granted and abused rather than rewarded.

What was worse was JR feeling like he had to tell us that Val is a superstar.

 

As for Orton.Over?Not Over?He's still green and sucks.

But...if he is still green, and does in fact suck, and is still over. Then you know something's being done right.

Yea something's been done right...he's been crammed down people's throats for so long.

 

He gets cheered in some towns and not others.Just because he got a pop in KC last night doesn't mean he's over.We'll see when he comes out next week to the usual crickets.

 

Or lightning could strike twice and he could be cheered again.

Maybe this time it will come off that way on TV otherwise we'll have to have another smark telling us he was there and they popped like crazy for him with no one to dispute his bs.

 

[Exslade ZX 0]

He gets cheered in some towns and not others.Just because he got a pop in KC last night doesn't mean he's over.We'll see when he comes out next week to the usual crickets.

Ahhhh..so now he was cheered last night? Just last night, everyone was trying to say he got no pops at all. And that's the case with Orton. He gets pops. People say he doesn't. Simple as that. The only time..that Orton (since turning face) hasn't really gotten a good reaction...is when his new music first debuted and it seemed like it was a 'WTF' notion when people heard it...but hey, when he came out, he was cheered once more. But I'm sure next week...he'll get a pop, but of course you will have 10+ people saying he didn't get a reaction...either that or it was a 'silent reaction'.

 

Yea something's been done right...he's been crammed down people's throats for so long.

That can be said for anyone who's been given a push. I could just as easily say Bret Hart was crammed down our throats. Or that the Rock was crammed down our throats. Or Austin, or Angle, anyone almost..

[Silence 0]

It's probably just me, but Lawler really got on my nerves last night, or at least more than usual. Particularly during the diva segment. Even JR was annoyed by him. I mean come one, you could really tell that he was annoyed.

That shouldn't be surprising at all, considering just one or two years ago that he was EXTREMELY annoying on several Raws during that time.

 

Lawler to Molly at commentary:"Molly, are you a virgin?"

 

*Molly gets a disgusted look on her face*

 

Lawler:"Are you a virgin, Molly?"

 

JR:"Will you stop?!"

 

-------------------------

 

Lawler going on about Kane doing necrophilia during a match of his:"I've heard of a Hulkamaniac, but a NECROPHILIAC?!?!"

[Guest fanofcoils]

Fact:  Orton does not get a reaction other than teenage girls screaming when making an entrance.

Fiction.

 

That dude was getting pops from everyone in the arena tonight.

 

Not as loud as HBK's.

 

Not as prolonged as Flair's.

 

But he was definitely getting some crowd noise.

I stand by this statement. I was there, and I know what I saw and heard.

 

It doesn't make me on crack.

It doesn't make me a retard.

It doesn't make me a troll.

 

And that's all I'm going to say about it.

You were there and said he got loud pops, from the TV I may not have gotten a good impression of the pops, but I definitely saw how people reacted to Orton, they looked unexcited during his entrance before his match with Batista. Now it is up for others to decide who is right here since we are just going back and forth.

[Guest fanofcoils]

From what I watched last night, Orton is OVER. Interview was awesome. Solid match. Great crowd reaction for him. He's got the Shawn Michaels face thing going where girls scream for him too.

 

And I don't believe it, but some of you think he sucks, therefore, he is not over. Hulk Hogan always sucked, but he got the crowd on their feet every damn time he came out to that ring. Sometimes, it's not always about the ability.

 

The moral of the story: Orton is over.

 

THE END

 

P.S. Hope you enjoyed being there Y2Jerk.

Except face Randy Orton never gets the crowd to their feet every time (or any time) he comes out to the ring for a match/interview.

[Exslade ZX 0]

From what I watched last night, Orton is OVER.  Interview was awesome.  Solid match.  Great crowd reaction for him.  He's got the Shawn Michaels face thing going where girls scream for him too.

 

And I don't believe it, but some of you think he sucks, therefore, he is not over.  Hulk Hogan always sucked, but he got the crowd on their feet every damn time he came out to that ring.  Sometimes, it's not always about the ability.

 

The moral of the story: Orton is over.

 

THE END

 

P.S. Hope you enjoyed being there Y2Jerk.

Except face Randy Orton never gets the crowd to their feet every time (or any time) he comes out to the ring for a match/interview.

Ok, so you're saying, he may get a good reaction...but the crowd (that you can see) isn't standing up, so it's not a good reaction? It's known that I'm an Orton fan, but if I'm in the first few rows, and he is very clear in view, what reason do I have to stand up? Even though I'm a big fan...I probaly wouldn't take the time to stand up...for anybody, if I can see them just as clearly sitting down, but I'll cheer. So most of the front row won't stand up, (hell, they didn't even for HBK which seems to be your 'opposing person') Does that mean the rest of the arena didn't? No, it doesn't. Hell, all we ever really see is the first few rows.

[Guest fanofcoils]

From what I watched last night, Orton is OVER.  Interview was awesome.  Solid match.  Great crowd reaction for him.  He's got the Shawn Michaels face thing going where girls scream for him too.

 

And I don't believe it, but some of you think he sucks, therefore, he is not over.  Hulk Hogan always sucked, but he got the crowd on their feet every damn time he came out to that ring.  Sometimes, it's not always about the ability.

 

The moral of the story: Orton is over.

 

THE END

 

P.S. Hope you enjoyed being there Y2Jerk.

Except face Randy Orton never gets the crowd to their feet every time (or any time) he comes out to the ring for a match/interview.

Ok, so you're saying, he may get a good reaction...but the crowd (that you can see) isn't standing up, so it's not a good reaction? It's known that I'm an Orton fan, but if I'm in the first few rows, and he is very clear in view, what reason do I have to stand up? Even though I'm a big fan...I probaly wouldn't take the time to stand up...for anybody, if I can see them just as clearly sitting down, but I'll cheer. So most of the front row won't stand up, (hell, they didn't even for HBK which seems to be your 'opposing person') Does that mean the rest of the arena didn't? No, it doesn't. Hell, all we ever really see is the first few rows.

They don't have to necessarily stand up, they just have to look excited like they did for instance in HBK's entrance to his match last night. They never look excited for the face Randy Orton when he makes his entrance for a match/promo therefore he is not over.

[JHawk 0]

Maria should have won. Carmella number 2.

Anglesault and I agreed on who the diva winner should have been? Holy shit!

[SuperJerk 0]

I don't necessarily agree with the philosophy that says that whoever gets the loudest pops should be who gets to be in the main event. Ratings should also be taken into consideration.

 

Orton was one of the most over people in that arena Monday night (men, women, kids...and there were a shitload of Randy Orton t-shirts being worn by people...virtually everyone cheered the guy at some point). However, that arena was also half-empty.

 

Being over and being a draw are not the same thing.

 

P.S. For those of you wondering (both of you) if I was on TV, I have not watched the whole show yet, but I was the guy who held up the PWN3D sign when Shelton grabbed the mic away from HHH in the first segment.

[Exslade ZX 0]

P.S. For those of you wondering (both of you) if I was on TV, I have not watched the whole show yet, but I was the guy who held up the PWN3D sign when Shelton grabbed the mic away from HHH in the first segment.

, you are like dead center in the camera, (taped it) so yea saw you (Y). Damn, you had good seats.

[Guest fanofcoils]

Being over = being a draw. The only indication of being over/being a draw that is very clear other than merchandise sales is when someone comes out for their entrance for a match/promo. When they are interacting with their opponent you cannot determine if they are over or not because the crowd generally cheers the face because they hate the heel or because they love the face or both, you don't know this unless you know what their pop is when they make their entrance or their merchandise sales. If the fans are excited every time a certain wrestler makes an entrance in a lot of markets then he is a draw. Orton was not over in the arena on Monday night because the crowd looked unexcited during his entrance. I don't believe there were a "shitload" of Randy Orton shirts being worn by people at the arena on Raw, there could have been some here and there and if so they are plants for TV which WWE loves to do (evidence: The HHH/Undertaker match from 2002 on Smackdown that was botched so they had to redo a part of it in front of an empty arena except people who worked for WWE who posed as fans that were sitting in the front rows and they held up a lot of HHH signs to promote him when it was clear that the real fans weren't as pro HHH at the time).

 

Ratings are not a good measure because an unover face can be in a feud with a heel/heel group and the ratings could be OK instead of bad because people like to watch the heel/heel group get overcome. But when the heel/heel group has no chance of being overcome by the unover face in a segment, then that segment will bomb ratings wise (for example the Orton vs Evolution handicap match on Raw earlier this month).

[SuperJerk 0]

There is no way on Earth I could disagree with you more.

 

The Undertaker is over.

The Undertaker is not a draw.

I rest my case.

 

As far as Randy Orton t-shirts being plants...

 

...they must've planted all the folks buying them at the souvenier stand too, because that's where they were getting the t-shirts from.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I was just hoping everyone would overlook that and forget about it ever being said.

 

Hogan in 2002 is a perfect example of someone being incredibly over in the arena and actually bringing in less fans.

[Guest fanofcoils]

I haven't kept track of the Undertaker's this year, so I don't know if everyone gets excited when he makes his entrance, therefore I don't know if he is over.

 

I don't think many people bought Randy Orton t-shirts this week on Raw.

In 2002, Hogan was a big draw and got huge pops for the short-term because of nostalgia but after awhile they weren't the same and he was no longer a draw then.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Hogan was mega over well into his title reign, and ratings and attendance still went down.

 

In order to be a draw, you have to be over.

 

If you are over, it does not automatically make you a draw.

 

So, over = draw is not an absolute.

[Guest fanofcoils]

I don't remember that at all. What I do remember is they gave him a huge nostalgia pop the show after he won the title, after that he was no longer mega over that I can think of now in the US. Over = draw.

[SuperJerk 0]

Aren't you getting tired of getting proven wrong about everything yet?

 

Or are you trying to keep this thread alive long enough for everyone one on the forums to get a shot at you?

 

Just quit arguing already and go away.

[Guest fanofcoils]

Nobody has proven me wrong about anything. I think it is time to report you again for trolling.

[SuperJerk 0]

Nobody has proven me wrong about anything.

I'm sure Rudo is thrilled that you just called him a nobody.

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat was quite over during his return to WCW in late 1991. As was "Ravishing" Rick Rude when he debuted around that time. Sting was a huge babyface. The Steiners were pretty damn over. The DANGEROUS ALLIANCE STABLE was huge. Nikita Koloff came back to some decent, if not great pops. Big Van Vader was picking up steam.

 

The company put on some great matches after that, but DREW SHIT.

 

Jushin Liger (among others) werre heavily hyped for a special Christmas show at the Omni in 1991. Liger took Pillman's title belt in a heavily hyped bout. It didn't draw.

 

Overness Not = Draw,

[SuperJerk 0]

If anyone else would like to join the "Prove fanofcoils wrong about something" bandwagon, we'd love to have you.

 

Sorry, but I tend to get really annoyed with people who flame me because I actually know what I'm talking about.

[Guest fanofcoils]

Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat was quite over during his return to WCW in late 1991.  As was "Ravishing" Rick Rude when he debuted around that time.  Sting was a huge babyface.  The Steiners were pretty damn over.  The DANGEROUS ALLIANCE STABLE was huge.  Nikita Koloff came back to some decent, if not great pops.  Big Van Vader was picking up steam.

 

The company put on some great matches after that, but DREW SHIT.

 

Jushin Liger (among others) werre heavily hyped for a special Christmas show at the Omni in 1991.  Liger took Pillman's title belt in a heavily hyped bout.  It didn't draw.

 

Overness Not = Draw,

Over = draw relative to how business is.

[Guest fanofcoils]

Nobody has proven me wrong about anything.

I'm sure Rudo is thrilled that you just called him a nobody.

I didn't call him a nobody. Now I can make an assumption that you meant that he proved me wrong, but that isn't true.