Is HBK over-rated

[Guest Jason]

First of, I appologize for such long threads that really seem like articles, and if any one has a problem with them I'll try to make them a lot shorter next time...but for now:

 

Many consider "The Heartbreak Kid" Shawn Michaels to be the greatest professional wrestler in the history of the business - or at least one of them. I, however, do not share this opinion, and do not believe that Shawn Michaels should ever be categorized amongst the greatest of all time. Throughout this thread, I will analyze his career and explain why I do not believe he is one of the greatest ever, but merely ... Over-rated.

 

HBK has always been known to be a great entertainer, and I'll give him this much, however, he is not much more. Shawn Michaels was a spectacular entertainer, in fact, he was ultra charismatic and has successfully gotten over as both a heel and a face. He is very fluent on the microphone and can generate both amazing heat and pops from an audience. He has a natural charisma about him, however, if we were to compare him to other entertainers, I can list many who he does not amount to.

 

Beginning quite a way's back in time, Freddie Blassie in my opinion is perhaps the greatest heel of all time, in terms of portraying the heel persona. Known as the "Hollywood Fashion Plate," Blassie was an entertainer way ahead of his time. He had the best of mic skills and could generate heat like no other, making fun of opponents with hilarious remarks seldom made by even the best of talkers, like the Rock.

 

Speaking of Rocky Maivia, he's another superstar who could easily top Michael Hickenbottom in terms of entertaining a crowd. He consists of the greatest microphone skills in the history of professional wrestling, as far as I'm concerned, and is ultra-charismatic. He's perhaps the most over superstar of all time, however, challened by various other superstars who I believe are superior entertainers than Shawn Michaels: Including "Stone Cold" Steve Austin, "The Nature" Boy Ric Flair and "The Immortal" Hulk Hogan.

 

However, lets put aside "the Heartbreak Kid's" abilities to entertain, but his in-ring abilities, the factor that really forces me to question his worth. It's because of his in-ring work that I believe he is extremely over-rated.

 

Shawn Michaels began his main stream wrestling career as a tag team competitor, along side Marty Jannety; This squad was dubbed "the Midnight Rockers," as they ventured promotions such as the American Wrestling Alliance as well as the World Wrestling Federation under the shorter alias: "The Rockers."

 

Much like his tag team partner, Marty Jannety, Michaels was known for his amazing athleticism. They ran a somewhat risky style of work, however, nothing compared to the best of lucha libre superstars like Rey Mysterio Jr. They could perform spots such as Moon Saults and Baseball Slides - they were indeed fantastic athletes. But the fact of the matter is, Shawn Michaels isn't and never has been a fantastic technical wrestler: Seemingly the most important quality in a professional wrestling today. He was merely a fantastic athlete, and if you lack a sound technique, you have to bring something more to the table, like the innovative high-flying junior heavyweight legends such as Jushin "Thunder" Liger, Rey Mysterio Jr and Ultimo Dragon contained.

 

Never had he become a superstar that could provide spectacular aerial assault and this, Shawn Michaels was merely an athlete with charisma. In my opinion, these attributes alone simply do not cut it for someone who is being looked upon as one of the greatest professional wrestlers of all time.

 

The Rockers - who had gone down as one of the greatest tag teams of the late 1980's and the early '90's - eventually disbanded, as Shawn Michaels made a heel turn and betrayed his partner in Marty Jannety.

 

From there, Shawn Michaels began a career full of glory and success. He became an Intercontinental Champion as a heel amongst the singles division, and began to play a large part of WWF programming. He got involved in high profile angles which had him hiring superstars like Sid Vicious and Big Diesel as his body guards. After reaping the benefits as a singles heel and making a few Intercontinental Championship reigns last, "the Heartbreak Kid" returned to his former face persona, befriending Diesel.

 

In the year 1996, a point in time which sent Shawn Michaels amongst the list of the greatest wrestlers of all time, the company seemingly rested their fate on Shawn Michaels' shoulders when, in the biggest match of his career and what many consider the greatest match of all time, he defeated Bret Hart in over time of a sixty minute Iron Man match.

 

I myself was not impressed with this match. It was good, don't get me wrong, in fact, it was great, however, for what it is played up to be, this match wasn't merely as entertaining as the one hour encounter between Ric Flair and Ricky Steamboat.

 

It was from 1996 and on that Shawn Michaels began putting on the high profile matches that lead people to believe that he was indeed one of the greatest wrestlers of all time.

 

However, lets look at the list of superstars in whom Shawn Michaels put on phenomenal match-ups with: Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Razor Ramon, "Stone Cold" Steve Austin and the Undertaker. All of in which who were talented superstars, and within their famous encounters, played the ring general and seemingly carried Michaels through their fair share of matches. Superstars like Steve Austin and Bret and Owen Hart had no choice but to carry Michaels, simply because he was not a talented technical wrestler.

 

It's merely apparent to me that Shawn Michaels is not the amazing competitor people make him out to be. He contained amazing athleticism, and was very charismatic, however, he was nothing more. He never had one amazing attribute that would set him amongst the Tom Billington's, Jushin Liger's, Ric Flair's, Ricky Steamboat's, Kenta Kobashi's, Mitsuharu Misawa's, Bret Hart's and Owen Hart's of the business. And if a superstar merely has great athleticism and entertainment value going for him, I think it's unfair to consider him amongst the greatest of all time.

 

Besides, today, Shawn Michael's - at his age - has deteriorated, and lost the athleticism he once contained - and yet, people still consider him one of the best in the WWE. I simply can not buy into this. Without his athleticism, what does he have left going for him besides the ability to cut a half-way decent promo?

 

In conclusion, I firmly believe that Shawn Michaels is over-rated. Do you agree?

[Use Your Illusion 0]

Honestly, I think you'll find few here that share a differing opinion to yours, Jason. Just about everyone here will admit that, while Shawn can put on a hell of a show when he wants to, he isn't half the wrestler of some of the true greats of professional wrestling (such as those listed in your original post).

 

Many examples of Shawn 'carrying' someone, for example Sid Vicious, simply involved him doing what he does best - bumping his ass off and getting the shit kicked out of him really, really hard. His bout with Nash at IYH and with Sycho Sid at SSeries 96 are great examples of this. However, bumping does not equate to wrestling talent.

 

UYI

[Guest LooneyTune]

Not even close to the best. He had great matches, but I will never call him the best of anything except being the best dickhead of the 90s. I'm sure many people can name 50 Puro wrestlers that are as good or better than Michaels was in his prime.

[Use Your Illusion 0]

We talk about American pro-wrestling here, traitor!

[Guest LooneyTune]

Even by American standards, from the 80s til now I'll take Paul London, Christopher Daniels, American Dragon, Kerry Von Erich, Bret Hart, Ric Flair, Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit, Brian Pillman, Steve Austin, JEff Jarrett (kidding), Ted Dibiase, Randy Savage, The Dynamite Kid, Rick Martel, Tully Blanchard... the list goes on and on, over Shawn Michaels.

 

I liked Jannetty better than Michaels too.

[razazteca 0]

Shawn Michaels is one of the better WWF/E workers but he is not on the upper level of wrestlers of the world simply because he worked the Sports Entertainment style. Now he is on the level with the Hogan's and HHH's who were not the greatest technical workers but knew how to work the crowd and get people to focus on the personality instead of the in-ring work.

[Guest wildpegasus]

Even by American standards, from the 80s til now I'll take Paul London, Christopher Daniels, American Dragon, Kerry Von Erich, Bret Hart, Ric Flair, Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit, Brian Pillman, Steve Austin, JEff Jarrett (kidding), Ted Dibiase, Randy Savage, The Dynamite Kid, Rick Martel, Tully Blanchard... the list goes on and on, over Shawn Michaels.

 

I liked Jannetty better than Michaels too.

Shawn Michaels is both overrated and underrated. He does know how to build a match and can have some fun transistions in his matches. And for me personally (just for me though I've seen the same reaction with other people) he makes one of the best heels I've seen. His offence is a mixed bag. He can do a lot of different stuff and some of it's really nice looking but it can also be too light at times.

[The Czech Republic 0]

I don't know that anyone considers him the best. Good for the 90s but not the best ever.

[Guest LooneyTune]

I've also seen Andre The Giant sell something longer than Shawn Michaels and the Magic Healing Kip Up.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Shawn Michaels is/was a good wrestler, most people will not argue that. But he's not one of the top two or three of all time in North America, so yes, he is quite overrated.

 

The real underrated one is Steve Austin. A lot of people are familiar only with the punch, kick & stomp, injured face Austin we got in 1998-99, or the pale shadow of his former self that he was when he retired. He was fantastic for the other 90% of his career.

 

If we are talking about the complete package than even HHH has him beat. HHH has been on top longer, has drawn better, and has had far more influence in the industry than Shawn Michaels ever had.

 

Technically speaking, HBK isn't as good as Benoit, Malenko, Guerrero and several other North American wrestlers.

 

In terms of complete package he isn't as good as Flair, Rock, Austin and several other North American wrestlers.

 

He's overrated. There is no other way to get around it. Especially now, when he is not anywhere near what he used to be.

[Downhome 0]

HBK is one of the all time greats. He's not the best, he's not in the top ten either, but he's up there with the greats. His matches are almost always solid, and he is one of the greatest underdogs of all time. Even as recent as Survivor Series '03 he has showcased that. Also the fact that he came back after all those years of being gone, and actually ended up busting his ass and working really hard to put on great matches, and you can't help but to respect the guy at least a little.

 

Put all backstage bullshit aside, and just take him for what you see on TV and his matches, and what you have is a wrestling legend.

 

In my opinion of course.

 

Again, he's not in the top ten or even top twenty of all time, it's not like that. He's simply a guy that I love watching in the ring, he always seems to really work hard, and I appriciate that a lot. I don't think it's wrong to say he's a great though, and a legend.

[algrim 0]

He's a great showman and has keen knowledge of psychology. Still, I wouldn't put him in my top ten list. There are people more deserving and qualified ahead of him.

[Celtic Jobber 0]

I'd put HBK in my top ten list, but he would be in the bottom 5. I think if anything, Shawn is under-rated online.

 

Alot of people have a hard time getting over how big of a jerk Shawn was backstage in the 90's and hold that against him when judging his in-ring talent.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

It has nothing to do with his attitude. Steve Austin beat his wife, and I'd still have him at #2. Also, Bret Hart was every bit the asshole Shawn was, and I would still rank him higher.

[cabbageboy 0]

I've always found Michaels incredibly overrated. This isn't to say I haven't liked some of his matches, but it was mainly him getting his ass kicked all over the place. This makes for a bad top face IMO...you shouldn't WANT to see the top face get the shit kicked out of him and take joy in it. Know what I mean? Shawn was always a terrible face as a singles wrestler, I know I never ever liked him or got behind him.

 

Then again I've hated Michaels' guts ever since he beat Bulldog the IC title in 1992, so I'm biased.

[Prophet of Mike Zagurski 0]

I like Shawn Michaels and when I came into wrestling, he was defending his first world championship and I hated him. I was happy Sid won.

 

After he turned heel and broke his back, I knew I would not see him for what I thought would be forever. I was happy that he came back but HHH vs. HBK is the only thing company (HHH) ever wanted to do with him.

 

I like the Wrestlemania matches he had (vs. Jericho and the Yriple Threat). I think Shawn can have good matches but most of his promos suck. I think he works better as a heel.

[Guest BionicRedneck]

Yes, he is overrated.

 

If you look at it from a pure in-ring point of view, at his peak, there were probably 25 guys easily better than him. If you look at his promo work, he wouldn't make the top 25 for me. He's pretty much non-existant as a top line draw. He was a crappy world Champion.

 

The only aspect of wrestling where Shawn would rank with the very best is charisma, and he wouldn't be #1 in that regard, either.

 

So, yeah, he's the most overrated wrestler who has ever lived.

[Black Lushus 0]

okay so with all this being said, who would you all rank as the top 25 all time in AMERICAN wrestling history...and I don't mean all these little Indy leagues (not even TNA), I'm talking the big times here: NWA/WCW, WWE, AWA, hell even ECW...

 

I think HBKs problem is that he wasn't at his peak LONG ENOUGH to crack an all-time greatest list...his peak, IMO was about 95 to 97...sure he's been wrestling for years on end, but he's been shit for the most part since coming back in 2002 and really was insignificant prior to 95...

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Based on this thread he's become pretty fucking underrated online. Probably a top 50 worker of all time worldwide and easily top 5 as far as work under the WWF/E banner is concerned.

 

Someone calling Christopher Daniels a better worker than Shawn is the funniest thing I've read all week.

[Guest krazykat72]

It's merely apparent to me that Shawn Michaels is not the amazing competitor people make him out to be. He contained amazing athleticism, and was very charismatic, however, he was nothing more. He never had one amazing attribute that would set him amongst the Tom Billington's, Jushin Liger's, Ric Flair's, Ricky Steamboat's, Kenta Kobashi's, Mitsuharu Misawa's, Bret Hart's and Owen Hart's of the business. And if a superstar merely has great athleticism and entertainment value going for him, I think it's unfair to consider him amongst the greatest of all time.

My favorite is the person who put Ted Dibiase ahead of him, since looking back, it's hard to pick out *any* great Dibiase matches, save a few with Savage (maybe) and a great angle he did with Flair (the less than 10 minute match isn't the total classic it's pimped to be).

From your post

 

Tom Billington-I think he(Michaels) is on par with Dynamite

Jushin Liger- Liyger's better

Ric Flair - honestly, Shawn's work holds up better than Ric's at this point. We'll say equal for longevity

Ricky Steamboat-was overrated. He was very good, but if you look back, he does just as much "goofy'" selling as Shawn and *lots* of pointless armwork

Kenta Kobashi- No question, Kobashi's up with the all time greats

Mitsuharu Misawa- see Kobashi

Bret Hart-seriously, Bret's more overrated than Shawn is. He comes across as the sympathetic figure in everything, which despite what someone claimed earlier is a big reason for all of the Shawn hate. It's always been *far* more pronounced. Bret was every bit the asshole, but no one harps on him being a loner and apparently difficult to get along with, especially after his portayal in Wrestling with Shadows and the entire Montreal incident. As far as work goes, he dogged it all the time on the house shows and if you look back has tons of matches that incredibly formulaic, with the same pointless arm work that plagued Steamboat. To sugggest he's far ahead of Shawn is ridiculous.

Owen Hart-lets get real. His peak (90-91) was as good as Shawn's, but his work leaps down over the course of his career. He was great at the beginning and very good over the course of time, but for the most part, not better than michaels.

My favorite is the person who put Ted Dibiase ahead of him, since looking back, it's hard to pick out *any* great Dibiase matches, save a few with Savage (maybe) and a great angle he did with Flair (the less than 10 minute match isn't the total classic it's pimped to be).

 

A ton of the younger guys cite him as *the* influence for them getting into the business and he's working the crowd now better than he probably ever did. He's using the less is more approach, and despite the nay sayers, he's still the most consistently over guy on RAW and the people like to get behind him. Is he in the 10 best ever? Probably not, but to see people shunt him off like he wasn't awesome at his peak, and still good now is absurd.

 

-Paul Jacobi-

[Black Lushus 0]

that's exactly my point...his peak, being 95-97, though riddled with injuries and backstage stupidity easily outranks tons of other "peaks"...his problem is that his peak is not as big as other peaks, that's why he can't go past 22 or 23 on a top 25 of all time in America list...

 

EDIT: fuck it, I'd put him at least in the top 15 of American wrestling for sure...

[Guest Rob Edwards]

I personally think 1992 was his best year anyway. From 92-97 he'd rank as great unless he was high and from 89-91 and since he came back he'd qualify as good.

[Black Lushus 0]

see, to me anyway, I enjoyed him the most during his late 94/early 95 heel run and then his time in DX...i wasn't a huge fan of his first title run but he did put on decent matches, several against shitty workers...

[Guest BionicRedneck]

Bret Hart-seriously, Bret's more overrated than Shawn is. He comes across as the sympathetic figure in everything, which despite what someone claimed earlier is a big reason for all of the Shawn hate. It's always been *far* more pronounced. Bret was every bit the asshole, but no one harps on him being a loner and apparently difficult to get along with, especially after his portayal in Wrestling with Shadows and the entire Montreal incident. As far as work goes, he dogged it all the time on the house shows and if you look back has tons of matches that incredibly formulaic, with the same pointless arm work that plagued Steamboat. To sugggest he's far ahead of Shawn is ridiculous.

 

1. Bret isn't AS much of an asshole as Shawn, and even if he was, it's not what we are talking about.

 

2. Shawn dogged it on house shows, too.

 

3. Shawn's matches were often formulatic, too.

 

Basically, Bret generally had better matches, his peak work was better than Shawn's, he was a better World Champion, he was more consistent (on TV) and better on the mic (his '97 heel work blows Michaels out of the water, IMO). Plus, I'd say he's better at carrying people. He could get matches as good out of limited opponents, but he did it without all the stooging/shortcuts.

 

For me, Bret is comfortably ahead of Shawn.

 

Probably a top 50 worker of all time worldwide and easily top 5 as far as work under the WWF/E banner is concerned.

 

I'd probably agree, but he's still overrated. Because, the majority of the time I don't hear 'Shawn was a top 50 guy', I hear 'Shawn was a top 10 guy'. Hence, overrated as hell.

[Guest krazykat72]

1. Bret isn't AS much of an asshole as Shawn, and even if he was, it's not what we are talking about.

 

2. Shawn dogged it on house shows, too.

 

3. Shawn's matches were often formulatic, too.

 

Basically, Bret generally had better matches, his peak work was better than Shawn's, he was a better World Champion, he was more consistent (on TV) and better on the mic (his '97 heel work blows Michaels out of the water, IMO). Plus, I'd say he's better at carrying people. He could get matches as good out of limited opponents, but he did it without all the stooging/shortcuts.

2. I've seen them both numerous times. Michaels never dogged it nearly as much as Hart. Besides a match with Vader I saw in '96, I never had a problem with Shawn on the house shows. Bret on the other hand...

 

3. To a degree, but not nearly as much as Mr. 5 moves of doom.

 

I don't think Hart had better matches, and Michaels run of matches in '96 blows any of Hart's reigns out of the water. I disagree he was better at carrying people.

I think Michaels late '97 -early '98 heel schtick was just as good as Hart's anti-US mic work too.

 

 

-Paul Jacobi-

[AndrewTS 0]

As a wrestler, sure.

 

As a performer, not so much.

 

He's excellent at working a crowd (in the ring, not necessarily on the mic), but I think as far as actual wrestling (especially on the mat) Hart, Perfect, etc were superior.

 

It's easy to overrate him since he's just about the only major WWE worker recently who did high-spots and worked them very well into his matches. Until Eddy won the title, HBK was the only guy that made you think "moonsault" and "WWE Champion" fit together at all.

 

Although HBK's WMXIV match is supposedly what actually paved the way for the "WWE style" for main eventers to follow. Up until then it wasn't so much that MErs had to work a slower-paced style so much that it was all they could do (larger guys in general were the standard for WWF champs for quite a period of time).

 

Yet, guys who work high-spots rarely sell properly or use the psychology HBK would put into his matches, but of course we know as a face the kippup was just as bad of a no-selling tactic as Hulking Up. Crowds loved it, but it could take you out of the story of the match.

 

I think a good example is the first HIAC match at the original Badd Blood. Marks and budding smarks at the time loved the hell out of the match, but these days it's barely mentioned and basically gets crapped on when it is brought up because of the way it was worked.

[Black Lushus 0]

I'd take his HIAC match you mentioned, his screw job match with Bret (purely for psychology reasons), his Mankind match and his street fight with Kevin Nash at that IYH over damn near everything I've seen the WWE pump out the past few years...

[Guest krazykat72]

I think a good example is the first HIAC match at the original Badd Blood. Marks and budding smarks at the time loved the hell out of the match, but these days it's barely mentioned and basically gets crapped on when it is brought up because of the way it was worked.

Really? It was worked excellently and whenever brough up is usually deemd the best HiaC, by a large margin.

 

 

-Paul Jacobi-

[SuperJerk 0]

I don't think the admiration of Shawn Michaels is based on him being the best at any particular aspect of wrestling, but that he's very good at every aspect of professional wrestling. Its the diversity of his skill that earns him the high marks.

 

We could all easily name someone who was better than Shawn at technical wrestling, high flying, bumping, hardcore spots, mic skills (both heel and face), drawing money, longevity, psychology, etc. But someone who was really good at ALL of those things? That's rare.

 

That's why Shawn's great, in my opinion.

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

Ok, I DO have a few problems with this.......

 

Speaking of Rocky Maivia, he's another superstar who could easily top Michael Hickenbottom in terms of entertaining a crowd. He consists of the greatest microphone skills in the history of professional wrestling, as far as I'm concerned, and is ultra-charismatic. He's perhaps the most over superstar of all time, however, challened by various other superstars who I believe are superior entertainers than Shawn Michaels: Including "Stone Cold" Steve Austin, "The Nature" Boy Ric Flair and "The Immortal" Hulk Hogan.

 

Although, I'm not going against what you said because I agree with it.......but name me ANYONE that is above Rock/Hogan/Austin/Flair in that category. I don't think anyone in their right mind would put Michaels in their category, so it's kind of a moot point.

 

 

However, lets put aside "the Heartbreak Kid's" abilities to entertain, but his in-ring abilities, the factor that really forces me to question his worth. It's because of his in-ring work that I believe he is extremely over-rated.

 

Now, I would agree that in the eyes of marks in general....he IS overrated. But I wouldn't say he is overrated by the majority of the "smarks" though......

 

Much like his tag team partner, Marty Jannety, Michaels was known for his amazing athleticism. They ran a somewhat risky style of work, however, nothing compared to the best of lucha libre superstars like Rey Mysterio Jr. They could perform spots such as Moon Saults and Baseball Slides - they were indeed fantastic athletes. But the fact of the matter is, Shawn Michaels isn't and never has been a fantastic technical wrestler: Seemingly the most important quality in a professional wrestling today. He was merely a fantastic athlete, and if you lack a sound technique, you have to bring something more to the table, like the innovative high-flying junior heavyweight legends such as Jushin "Thunder" Liger, Rey Mysterio Jr and Ultimo Dragon contained.

 

To be a tad fair to Michaels on this one, your comparison is just not fair. I DO agree that the lucha stars you named worked the "risky style" better than Michaels ever did, but that could also because he had certain restrictions because of being in the WWF/WWE for the majority of his career. Honestly, I haven't seen enough of the "Midnight Rockers" work to justify where it would fit amongst Michaels working style.

 

Never had he become a superstar that could provide spectacular aerial assault and this, Shawn Michaels was merely an athlete with charisma. In my opinion, these attributes alone simply do not cut it for someone who is being looked upon as one of the greatest professional wrestlers of all time.

 

I know that Shawn isn't the greatest in-ring worker of all time and that's not what I'm saying here. But I would say that Michaels was more than an athlete with charisma as he was DEFINATELY better than average in the ring work department.

 

I myself was not impressed with this match. It was good, don't get me wrong, in fact, it was great, however, for what it is played up to be, this match wasn't merely as entertaining as the one hour encounter between Ric Flair and Ricky Steamboat.

 

I will agree with you on this and basically say that the ironman is one of the most overrated matches of all time.

 

It was from 1996 and on that Shawn Michaels began putting on the high profile matches that lead people to believe that he was indeed one of the greatest wrestlers of all time.

 

If his career was based on 1996 alone, he WOULD be one of the greatest of all time. But it's not judged that way and just going by that year would obviously be misleading.

 

However, lets look at the list of superstars in whom Shawn Michaels put on phenomenal match-ups with: Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Razor Ramon, "Stone Cold" Steve Austin and the Undertaker. All of in which who were talented superstars, and within their famous encounters, played the ring general and seemingly carried Michaels through their fair share of matches. Superstars like Steve Austin and Bret and Owen Hart had no choice but to carry Michaels, simply because he was not a talented technical wrestler.

 

Once again, I think you make good points here and I would credit those workers for adding to the matches they worked with Michaels. But you are obviously forgetting the workers that Michaels probably carried to their best matches of their careers like Sid and Diesel. Not to mention that he carried Davey Boy Smith in their series and Michaels was the reason the first Hell in a Cell worked out so well......

 

He never had one amazing attribute that would set him amongst the Tom Billington's, Jushin Liger's, Ric Flair's, Ricky Steamboat's, Kenta Kobashi's, Mitsuharu Misawa's, Bret Hart's and Owen Hart's of the business. And if a superstar merely has great athleticism and entertainment value going for him, I think it's unfair to consider him amongst the greatest of all time.

 

Those guys you named are among the greatest of all time. Also, on a side note.....if you wanna talk about overrated workers, maybe you should do this kind of thread for Flair......

 

Besides, today, Shawn Michael's - at his age - has deteriorated, and lost the athleticism he once contained - and yet, people still consider him one of the best in the WWE. I simply can not buy into this. Without his athleticism, what does he have left going for him besides the ability to cut a half-way decent promo?

 

Saying someone is the best in the WWE isn't exactly the most flattering thing of all time. With the great workers they have (Eddy, Benoit, London, Mysterio, etc.) they have their fair share of poor to atrocious workers on their roster.

 

In conclusion, I firmly believe that Shawn Michaels is over-rated. Do you agree?

 

I would say that in the mind of marks...........yes. In the mind of smarks.........no.