Cena or JBL?

[Art Sandusky 0]

Im just afraid of what Cena will do with the belt once he gets it.

 

he already turned the US title into a Rim

I wish people would drop this shit already.

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

Why should people drop it?

 

Cena STILL has the awful looking title belt, which makes people think he's more of a collector of hub caps than a defending champion of a prestigious title (in reality, the title hasn't meant SHIT since Eddie had it).

 

And he's still a boring, stale, poor worker. People have a right to bitch.

 

Go JBL at WM.

[Art Sandusky 0]

Why should people drop it?

 

Cena STILL has the awful looking title belt, which makes people think he's more of a collector of hub caps than a defending champion of a prestigious title (in reality, the title hasn't meant SHIT since Eddie had it).

 

And he's still a boring, stale, poor worker. People have a right to bitch.

 

Go JBL at WM.

His customized belt has absolutely nothing to do with his workrate. It fits in with his character perfectly, is executed well enough so it doesn't look like "a hubcap" (and I don't give a shit, anyone who keeps using the hubcap line is a fucking moron), and it gives an otherwise lifeless secondary title some recognition. It does more to remind you that Cena's the US Champion than the normal belt would have. The only foolish part about it is that he has a personalized secondary belt when he's pushed to be a regular main eventer at some point. I think it really boils down to a bunch of (yes, I'm using the HHH/WWE/JBL line) smark nerds behind their computers who can't even understand why or how Cena's popular and maintains that popularity in the first place. I hope he has a real Sprewell WWE Championship belt made for when he does beat JBL down the road, not one big piece, but a narrower piece with the same circumfrence spinning over the actual centerpiece of the belt. The old-school Word Life WWE logo spinning over a circular center medallion would be the shit.

 

Fuck, did people bitch this much when Bradshaw Tex-ified the Hardcore belt or Austin had the smoking skull belt?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

I hope he has a real Sprewell WWE Championship belt made for when he does beat JBL down the road, not one big piece, but a narrower piece with the same circumfrence spinning over the actual centerpiece of the belt. The old-school Word Life WWE logo spinning over a circular center medallion would be the shit.

Instead of just having him come out one day with is custom made WWE Title belt, they should make it part of a feud. Have JBL steal the WWE Title belt, and refuse to give it back unless he gets a rematch. Cena can then come out the next week and unveil his custom made belt, and tell JBL to keep the original belt, because he's got a real belt, and he's the champion anyway. JBL can then come out the week after, decry the custom belt as not befitting the WWE Champion, and Cena can interrupt and they can set up the rematch for the next SD PPV.

[Art Sandusky 0]

Yeah, when a wrestler has a custom belt, it's just begging to have a feud set up around its theft or something. Readymade.

 

I should add that what I meant up there about smark nerds not getting it was pertaining to the sort of popular culture which Cena portrays in his character.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

Why should people drop it?

 

Cena STILL has the awful looking title belt, which makes people think he's more of a collector of hub caps than a defending champion of a prestigious title (in reality, the title hasn't meant SHIT since Eddie had it).

 

And he's still a boring, stale, poor worker. People have a right to bitch.

 

Go JBL at WM.

See this is the crap I dont get.

 

Do you see people with the spinning signs in the crowd? Again, you may not like it, but its not doing any damage to the value of the championship, its just a gimmick. And a gimmick that appears to be working.

 

Personally I like the belt, but just because i like it, doesn't by itself mean it makes the title more meaningful. I agree with Kotzen's point that the title is in the spotlight more because of the gimmick. And this is a title that the WWE usually treats as a joke. Cena has had a decent run (well 3 runs) with the title over the past year, so its probably more important now than it was then.

 

But to say its credibility is lowered because it spins is ratehr absurd IMO.

[Guest Rrrsh]

I am with Kotz here. Quit whining like little bicthes about Cena belt. It is so insignificant. Bottom Line is that its another thing that makes Cena unique and interesting, something totally lacking right now in the WWE.

[Jericho2000Mark 0]

Im just afraid of what Cena will do with the belt once he gets it. 

 

he already turned the US title into a Rim

Turn it into a tire?

 

I'm one of the few who really doesn't mind Bradshaw; unfortunately, he's not exactly Stone Cold when it comes to drawing money. That being said, Cena's not much better. His "rap" act is already getting kinda stale, and will not improve with age.

 

Cena's a budding ratings draw and with RVD gone, is the second biggest ratings draw on Smackdown, next to Eddie.

 

JBL needs to drop the belt. He's, by all accounts, a failure as champion and

nothing more than a midcard comedy act who relies entirely on cheap heat tactics to draw any reaction. The ONLY reason he's been having better matches than Cena is because he's faced better opponents. Throw him in there with someone besides Eddie and Angle, his true talent(or lack thereof) shows. He's probably the most protected wrestler in the company, even more than Triple H(who can only put on a decent match if it's gimmicked or has a strong worker,like Benoit, Shelton or Tajiri to carry him).

 

I would rather see Cena as a heel champion, as he's capable of having better matches(as a heel) and doesn't need to be protected as much as JBL. They can turn him after he wins the belt(kind of like they did with Rock), which can create possible fueds with Eddie, RVD, Rey or Taker(they seem to work eally well together for some reason).

 

Or if they wan't to keep him face, they can do that "Champions switch brands" deal they were talking about a couple months back, and send him to Raw where there's fresh heels.

 

I just think there are more possibilities with Cena as Champion than JBL(who has already gone over everyone on the brand, twice).

[what 0]

They gave Benoit the title. He beat HHH/HBK clean at WM. He beat Rhyno. He beat Conway. He beat HHH/HBK clean again on PPV. He won the tag titles. He defended them the next week and won. He kept winning. He beat Kane clean on PPV. He beat him weeks later BY SUBMISSION clean. He still kept winning tag team matches in six man tags. He was the sole survivor of the elimination match that seemingly went for 45 minutes. He went on and defeated Triple H *again* on PPV. He then beat Triple H *again* in an Iron Man Match.

 

I'd say that's putting the champion over. And he drew shit. And the ratings went nowhere.

His reign was horribly mis-booked after the first few months. They made him look like shit. Gave Eugene the #1 face spot over him.

[what 0]

Cena, without a doubt.

 

He's insanely over right now, and strike while the iron is hot. The only potential problem I see is that the win might seem less special because it isn't the main event. And if Cena does win, I'm thinking that Batista won't. I don't really like Batista, but damn it'd suck for the live crowd if he didn't win. Both challengers should win.

Both challengers can't win. This is one of those 'diminishing by compositing' things.

 

JBL has been champ 9 months, so two more months won't hurt things, and hopefully Cena taking the title is 'special' enough to focus the next SD only PPV around. It would mean a lot more than to expose SD for the B-show that it is by having him win a midcard match that'd be forgotten by the end of the night. Cena can wait.

 

Batista, on the other hand, has to win the title at WM 21. They just can't afford to have Triple H holding the title at the end of the pay per view. Sure, they let a heel retain at WM 2000 when the WWF could do no wrong and could take those risks, but things have changed. They can't piss off that much of their fanbase on the biggest night of the wrestling year.

If both challengers don't win, WrestleMania will be a disaster.

[CanadianChick 0]

Does everyone honestly believe that Batista will win? That's a reason why I'm thinking Cena will. I don't have faith enough to say with full confidence that Trips will drop the belt to Batista.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

The problem isn't Trips giving up the belt, it's Trips giving up his spot.

[what 0]

The problem isn't Trips giving up the belt, it's Trips giving up his spot.

Yeah, Trips will give it up so he can win it back and keep working toward Flair's record.

[CanadianChick 0]

So unless Batista only feuds with Triple H for his entire reign, he won't win?

 

Also, would Triple H lose in two WM main events in a row?

[Fökai 0]

They gave Benoit the title.  He beat HHH/HBK clean at WM.  He beat Rhyno.  He beat Conway.  He beat HHH/HBK clean again on PPV.  He won the tag titles.  He defended them the next week and won.  He kept winning.  He beat Kane clean on PPV.  He beat him weeks later BY SUBMISSION clean.  He still kept winning tag team matches in six man tags.  He was the sole survivor of the elimination match that seemingly went for 45 minutes.  He went on and defeated Triple H *again* on PPV.  He then beat Triple H *again* in an Iron Man Match.

 

I'd say that's putting the champion over.  And he drew shit.  And the ratings went nowhere.

His reign was horribly mis-booked after the first few months. They made him look like shit.

Here's his week-by-week results after he won the World Championship...

 

March:

--with Michaels, defeated Orton, Batista and Flair in a handicap match.

--defeated first challenger, Rhyno, by submission.

--with Michaels, defeated Batista and Flair for tag titles ("dusty finish" changed it to a DQ).

 

April:

--defeated Rob Conway.

--with Michaels, Benjamin and Foley, defeated Evolution.

--(PPV) retained World Title over HHH and Michaels.

--with Edge, defeated Batista and Flair for tag titles.

--with Edge, successfully retained tag titles over Batista and Flair.

 

May:

--defeated Shawn Michaels to retain World Title.

--no match.

--with Edge, successfully retained tag titles over Orton and Batista.

--with Eugene, defeated Coach and Cade.

--with tag titles, lost to La Resistance (home team went over)

 

June:

--with Edge, lost to Kane and La Resistance in a handicap match.

--(PPV) retained World Title over Kane.

--with Edge and Jericho, defeated Orton, Batista and Flair in a elimination match (sole survivor).

--no match.

--defeated Kane to retain World Title.

 

July:

--with Edge, lost to HHH, Flair and Eugene.

--(PPV) retained World Title over HHH.

--went to a NC with Eugene.

--defeated Batista by disqualification.

--defeated HHH in an "Ironman Match" to retain World Title.

 

August:

--with Edge and Jericho, lost to Orton, Batista and Flair.

--with Eugene, defeated Orton and HHH by disqualification.

 

...and your point has now been squashed.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Also, would Triple H lose in two WM main events in a row?

As I said in another thread, he will, purely because it'll give him the political capital to get out of future jobs, and also to take some internal pressure off of himself.

[Guest Rrrsh]

Trips wont lose his belt in two straight Main Evnts of WrestleMania. No one has ever lost the World Title in 2 straight WM in matches he was orgianally booked for.

 

HHH just wouldn't want to be known like that.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

They gave Benoit the title.  He beat HHH/HBK clean at WM.  He beat Rhyno.  He beat Conway.  He beat HHH/HBK clean again on PPV.  He won the tag titles.  He defended them the next week and won.  He kept winning.  He beat Kane clean on PPV.  He beat him weeks later BY SUBMISSION clean.  He still kept winning tag team matches in six man tags.  He was the sole survivor of the elimination match that seemingly went for 45 minutes.  He went on and defeated Triple H *again* on PPV.  He then beat Triple H *again* in an Iron Man Match.

 

I'd say that's putting the champion over.  And he drew shit.  And the ratings went nowhere.

His reign was horribly mis-booked after the first few months. They made him look like shit.

Here's his week-by-week results after he won the World Championship...

 

*lots of results*

 

...and your point has now been squashed.

Just looking at results alone is missing the big picture. It's not just about results, but about presentation. Benoit was presented as second-tier, below Hunter and HBK. Regardless of the wins he got, the presentation of him as not at the top level, even after winning the World Title, cemented him as second-tier.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

What does it matter? He'll be holding it by the next Wrestlemania, and the Wrestlemania after that.

 

Bravesfan, count all the matches Benoit had with Evolution.

[Guest Rrrsh]

Also, would Triple H lose in two WM main events in a row?

As I said in another thread, he will, purely because it'll give him the political capital to get out of future jobs, and also to take some internal pressure off of himself.

There was a reason he retained at wm 16. He wanted to be known as the first heel to ever to walk out of WM as champ. That shit means something to him.

 

So he won't go 0-2 in Main Event Title matches at 2 striaght WM. It wont happen.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Also, would Triple H lose in two WM main events in a row?

As I said in another thread, he will, purely because it'll give him the political capital to get out of future jobs, and also to take some internal pressure off of himself.

There was a reason he retained at wm 16. He wanted to be known as the first heel to ever to walk out of WM as champ. That shit means something to him.

 

So he won't go 0-2 in Main Event Title matches at 2 striaght WM. It wont happen.

I'll repeat:

 

He will, purely because it'll give him the political capital to get out of future jobs, and also to take some internal pressure off of himself.

 

And Hunter going 0-2 in consecutive WM main events will give him the perfect line to give to Vince when he feels like getting out of jobs. "Hey, Vince, I just did my second job in a row in 'mania main events, so I can't job now."

 

Hunter thinks long term.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Also, would Triple H lose in two WM main events in a row?

As I said in another thread, he will, purely because it'll give him the political capital to get out of future jobs, and also to take some internal pressure off of himself.

There was a reason he retained at wm 16. He wanted to be known as the first heel to ever to walk out of WM as champ. That shit means something to him.

 

So he won't go 0-2 in Main Event Title matches at 2 striaght WM. It wont happen.

He is not 0-2. He is 3-2 dating back to Mania 2000. Not a horrible record by any stretch.

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

My point isn't squashed, retard. Benoit was on most Raws and most of the weeks was involved in some way with the top heels on the show, 9 out of 10 times defeating them. As champion.

 

And it drew dick ratings/gate wise.

 

But that's due to Benoit's lack of world championship credibility. An imposing character like Batista would have credibility.

[CanadianChick 0]

My point isn't squashed, retard.

I'm pretty sure he was telling what that his point was squashed, not yours. I think he was agreeing with you actually.

[Fökai 0]

My point isn't squashed, retard.

You weren't who I quoted.

 

Just looking at results alone is missing the big picture. It's not just about results, but about presentation. Benoit was presented as second-tier, below Hunter and HBK.

 

...because the HHH/HBK feud was the bigger focus for a PPV than a Benoit/Kane main event that was slapped together? Benoit defeated all of the contenders on the brand sans Kane, even though Kane had an ongoing feud outside of the title picture.

 

Bravesfan, count all the matches Benoit had with Evolution.

 

Total record: 18-4-1 (two losses were handicap matches, another had Orton going over to build Summerslam, last one had La Resistance going over to pop the Quebec crowd).

 

Record against Evolution in any form: 12-2 (one match handicap, other had Orton going over to build Summerslam).

[Guest FromBeyondTheGrave]

I think it really boils down to a bunch of smark nerds behind their computers who can't even understand why or how Cena's popular and maintains that popularity in the first place.

I understand 13 year old boys might find gay jokes funny, and his "awesome" raps to be "kewl". But, why cheer this guy? He sounds like an idiot, acts like a dick, and is a white boy rapper. As a heel, his gimmick was like a parody of Vanilla Ice, as a serious babyface, it's retarded.

[CanadianChick 0]

Even though you don't enjoy it, judging by his reactions, more than immature 13 year olds find it funny. It might seen stupid on paper, but it works.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

From May, the main focus of Raw was Hunter and HBK. From mid-June to SummerSlam the main focus was Hunter and Eugene. In both cases, those storylines were treated as the most important thing, and given top billing. Benoit, for all the wins he got, was either treated as a bit player in those scenarios, or given his own little deal that was presented below the 'real' stars'. Even when Benoit was put with Orton it was never presented as the most important thing on Raw.

 

Any World Champion treated in such a manner won't draw, because he isn't the person being put in the position to draw.

 

What don't people get about such a simple concept ?

[Guest FromBeyondTheGrave]

Even though you don't enjoy it, judging by his reactions, more than immature 13 year olds find it funny. It might seen stupid on paper, but it works.

That's my point. The older fans are retards with no taste.

[Fökai 0]

Even though you don't enjoy it, judging by his reactions, more than immature 13 year olds find it funny. It might seen stupid on paper, but it works.

That's my point. The older fans are retards with no taste.

By that, you mean the loyal fanbase who've been there the whole time?

 

Face it, Cena's schtick also appeals to an older crowd - if it didn't, he'd be in Orton or Hardy's shoes right now.