Kobe or LeBron

[Ripper 0]

When it comes to defense, you rarely see a player that gets all over the guy with the ball like Kobe does. I swear it's awesome to watch Kobe play the point, which is usually in the All-Star game. He's a hell of a defender. Lebron has NOTHING on him in that category whatsoever, I don't see how anyone could say otherwise.

 

Now you....you have GOT to be fucking kidding me.

 

The same Kobe Bryant that was (and lets just go over the past few games) gave up 18 to Raja Bell on 6 of 10 shooting and forced him into no turnovers. The same Kobe Bryant that help give up 40 to Mike Bibby forcing only 3 turnovers. The SAME Kobe Bryant that had Dwayne Wade embarrasing him for 34 points and 1 turnover. The SAME Kobe Bryant that watched Jason Richardson drop 37 on him before that. Lebron before that had a damn good game. Juan FUCKING DIXON dropped 27 on him before that. Cuttino Mobley for 36. He did a good job on Jalen Rose and Stephen Jackon in the last 10 or so games. THIS Kobe Bryant?

 

Seriously, keep going back. Just keep going. WHOEVER Kobe has been checking this year have been having their season highs and big games against him. WHOEVER. I know points isn't always a good factor in who was playing D, but his lack of forced turnovers and their above season average shoting tell a whole lot too.

 

Now look at Lebrons games. He isn't a all world defender, but he forces turnovers from his guys and force them into tough shooting games. Yeah, Marion and a few others torched him but NOTHING like the streak that Kobe had going before Jalen got shut down.

 

I know you are a laker fan but come the fuck on.

[Ripper 0]

I hate to belabor the obvious, but if Vince shoots threes at a higher clip than Kobe by 6 points, but Bryant STILL has the better overall percentage all that means is VC is even WORSE at shooting the 2 relatively speaking. I don't really see how you can say Carter is a better shooter with a lower percentage of shots made and Kobe's penchant for taken God awful shots at least 5-10 times per night.

 

 

Um, isn't not taking God Awful shots a sign of a good shooter? Good point on the three point shooting, but minus Shaq, Kobe isn't shooting better from anywhere than Vince.

[naiwf 0]

I hate to belabor the obvious, but if Vince shoots threes at a higher clip than Kobe by 6 points, but Bryant STILL has the better overall percentage all that means is VC is even WORSE at shooting the 2 relatively speaking. I don't really see how you can say Carter is a better shooter with a lower percentage of shots made and Kobe's penchant for taken God awful shots at least 5-10 times per night.

 

 

Um, isn't not taking God Awful shots a sign of a good shooter? Good point on the three point shooting, but minus Shaq, Kobe isn't shooting better from anywhere than Vince.

 

You're making my point for me. If Kobe takes bad shots, and still makes more than Vince, how can Vince be the better shooter?

[Ripper 0]

Once again, SINCE SHAQ HAS BEEN GONE, VINCE CARTER IS THE BETTER SHOOTER STAT WISE BETWEEN THE TWO. Carter shot better than Kobe last year and Kobe is shooting better than Vince this year by less than one percentage point. Take away a dominant big man and the playing field is even. In the even playing field, Vince is statistically the better shooter.

 

People, I would see if Kobe was the best shooter in the league and I was challenging that, but seriously, there are at least a dozen better perimeter shooters than Kobe. Vince is one of them. Kobe is a better player than almost all of them.

[naiwf 0]

There's no doubt Kobe's not in the top 10 pure shooters, I was just curious why you would post stats that indicate Vince is the lesser shooter to back up an argument that he's better. Scoring prowess can be argued, but shooting stats don't lie. Fair enough.

[UZI Suicide 0]

You are really using stats as a crutch. You are assuming that Kobe is one on one with those guys every play for the entire game. Smush Parker often guards the other team's PG or SG because Kobe does so much on the offensive end that if he played with that same intensity on D, he'd have no energy by the end of the game.

 

Granted, his defense this year is not as good as it has been in years past, but LeBron has NEVER been a good defender. He rarely ever defends the other teams 1 or 2, much for the same reason, because he'll wear out, but even without that he still couldn't defend them because he's not quick enough to. Partly because he's 6-8, but nevertheless he still can't.

 

Reggie Miller used to light up the Bulls all the time, so did John Starks, so did Glen Rice. Doesn't mean Jordan was overrated on D, it just means he probably wasn't on them more than half the game.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

Ripper just sounds like a typical Kobe hater to me.

[Ripper 0]

How am I sounding like a Kobe hater? Kobe's man lights him up. He is on the court most minutes for the Lakers and guards either the two guard or the point(not as often). They seldom put him on the opposing teams SF because of the punishment he would take against them. Night in and night out the opponets Two guards are having great games against the lakers. Even guys that usually are pretty average. If you are going to say that it has nothing to do with Kobe you have to fooling yourself. Its simply following trends. Sure you can pretend maybe Kobe guarded the PF that night or the Center, but come on. Its quite obvious.

 

And I have to use stats as a crutch because when I mention what I see watching the game, people call me crazy. Then I show stats and there must be an excuse. He doesn't play great D. I would definatly say Lebron is the better defender although not by much. Lebron stays on SF's because they know he can't guard smaller players because they are too quick. Eventually the Kobe is going to have to accept that also or he is going to keep getting scorched.

 

And Michael Jordon was quite possibly the best team defender I ever saw. Every team had to always know where he was on the court or he was going to hurt you. Either in the passing lanes a well timed blocked shot, or just disrupting your offense. HOWEVER. He was not that great of a on man defender. Guys would blow by him with ease at times and him trying to help all the time would leave shooters open. THere are different types of D. Both Kobe and Lebron are also good team defenders. Guys like Alvin Robertson, Andre Igudola, Ron Artest...those are great on the ball defenders.

 

Call me a hater if you wish, but look. Kobe will PROBABLY be the second best offensive force at the two guard in NBA history when it is all said and done. If he changes his game, and he still has plenty of time, he could be one of the best players ever. But the guy is great only on one end of the court and only at one function at that end of the court.

[alfdogg 0]

as a team player, his willingness to defer and actually put up big numbers in assist

...this is VINCE CARTER we're talking about, right?

[naiwf 0]

Kobe must really be fooling the masses here

 

3-time All-NBA Defensive First Team: 2000, 2003, 2004

2-time All-NBA Defensive Second Team: 2001, 2002

[nogoodnick 0]

Ever since Kobe hit a game winner in week one Ive said he is the best in the league.

[Guest]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

Just to play devil's advocate here, if Kobe's a superior defender and an opposing player is ripping apart the defense, why isn't Kobe guarding him?

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

Just to play devil's advocate here, if Kobe's a superior defender and an opposing player is ripping apart the defense, why isn't Kobe guarding him?

 

Because Phil wants Kobe to use most of his energy on the offensive side, because quite frankly no one else on the Lakers is playing up to standards.

 

And also isn't Bibby a point guard? Why would Kobe guard the point guard? That's Smush Parkers job.

[Lil' Bitch 0]

LeBron, he still has time on his side so who knows what he'll be pulling off in the future.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

LeBron, he still has time on his side so who knows what he'll be pulling off in the future.

 

That is true, LeBron has yet to even hit his prime and he is among the best in the NBA.

[Guest]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

Just to play devil's advocate here, if Kobe's a superior defender and an opposing player is ripping apart the defense, why isn't Kobe guarding him?

They don't want Kobe running around and wasting energy. I'd like it if he did guard them, but that's Jackson's decision. The Lakers like those 2 that I mentioned as defenders, don't really know why.

[Ripper 0]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

Just to play devil's advocate here, if Kobe's a superior defender and an opposing player is ripping apart the defense, why isn't Kobe guarding him?

 

Because Phil wants Kobe to use most of his energy on the offensive side, because quite frankly no one else on the Lakers is playing up to standards.

 

And also isn't Bibby a point guard? Why would Kobe guard the point guard? That's Smush Parkers job.

 

 

Because Bibby was anally raping Smush and Kevin Martin was just kinda standing there watching everything so Phil made Kobe stop wasting his time and sent him over to be anally raped by Bibby also. And he was on him from late second quarter, late third and all of the fourth. That is MOST of the game.

 

Ripper - felt like saying anal rape.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

In the Sacramento game, Mike Bibby was being guarded by Smush Parker and Vujacic for most of the game, so we can toss that argument right out of the water.

 

Miami game, Smush and Vujacic guarded Wade for most of the game, Kobe guarded him late.

 

All these dudes that you're mentioning besides J-Rich were being guarded by someone else.

Just to play devil's advocate here, if Kobe's a superior defender and an opposing player is ripping apart the defense, why isn't Kobe guarding him?

 

Because Phil wants Kobe to use most of his energy on the offensive side, because quite frankly no one else on the Lakers is playing up to standards.

 

And also isn't Bibby a point guard? Why would Kobe guard the point guard? That's Smush Parkers job.

 

 

Because Bibby was anally raping Smush and Kevin Martin was just kinda standing there watching everything so Phil made Kobe stop wasting his time and sent him over to be anally raped by Bibby also. And he was on him from late second quarter, late third and all of the fourth. That is MOST of the game.

 

Ripper - felt like saying anal rape.

 

Yeah but it's not like its nothing new, Bibby always steps his game up againest the Lakers. Bibby also tore A.I. a new asshole to IIRC.

 

Remember when Bibby almost by himself beat the Lakers by himself in 2002 WCF, when they HAD Shaq? Bibby is in my opinion Top 5 point guard in the NBA, put him with a franchise player like KG, Shaq, Kobe, etc. And you got a title contender.

[alfdogg 0]

Who are the other four PGs on your list?

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

Who are the other four PGs on your list?

 

In no order

 

Jason Kidd

Steve Nash

Baron Davis

Chauncey Billups

[Guest tony manero]

In what was mentioned in a published report, the Lakers rejected an Odom for Artest and Croshere or Foster swap.

 

Everyone -- Phil, Kobe, Mitch Kupchack -- was in favor of the above trade except Jerry and Jimmy Buss, who rejected it.

 

 

Also, FWIW, there seems to be lots of tampering between the Lakers and Lebron James. There seem to be some rumblings that Lebron told Lakers management directly that he wants to be a Laker when his contract is up in 07 or 08. This also seems to coincide with the Lakers' risky "2007-08 plan."

 

Too soon to tell for obvious reasons...

[Guest Vitamin X]

WILL LEBRON AND KOBE BE ABLE TO CO-EXIST? WHEN WILL IT ALL IMPLODE!

[Guest]

Fuck Jerry Buss with a STEEL TOED BOOT. Just kidding, I think he probably did the right thing. This LeBron thing is interesting, as it's not the first time I've heard it.

[bobobrazil1984 0]

I think LA shoulda done that trade. Artest could really help them, and Foster off the bench is always good for some rebounds.

[UZI Suicide 0]

Also, FWIW, there seems to be lots of tampering between the Lakers and Lebron James. There seem to be some rumblings that Lebron told Lakers management directly that he wants to be a Laker when his contract is up in 07 or 08. This also seems to coincide with the Lakers' risky "2007-08 plan."

 

Based on what?

[The Czech Republic 0]

I thought LeBron's contract is up after this season. Don't draftees only sign for three years?

[Guest Vitamin X]

I think LA shoulda done that trade. Artest could really help them, and Foster off the bench is always good for some rebounds.

 

I could see why LA wouldn't make that trade, as after the whole Kobe/Shaq and Kobe/rape trial fiascos, the last thing they'd want is more PR nightmares, and Artest might have the whole "character issue" thing working against him.