The NBA Offseason Thread

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

See, that's what I mean. Where's the real value in that trade for Phoenix? You just get role players and a lesser point guard and less flexibility with the expiring deals.

[naiwf 0]

That's what I was going for as well but I wasn't sure how many years Nash had left. He can be moved easily if the Suns are willing to take 50 cents on the dollar value wise, but there's no one they could trade him for that would make the Suns as well off as they are with him, and certainly they wouldn't be better afterwards. Considering they don't like to spend money and have essentially decided to go in a different direction offensively they might as well see what they can get for him and start to rebuild since they don't realistically have a shot to win a title in the next 5 to 10 years given the great young teams in the Western Conference.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

I fucked around with the trade machine for 20 minutes, and the best I could get for the Suns without going into multi-team trades was Nash to Portland for LaMarcus Aldridge, Steve Blake, and either Travis Outlaw or Martell Webster. Which doesn't make any sense, cause Portland's already pretty good and only likely to get better with Oden next season.

[alfdogg 0]

Billy Knight has resigned from the Hawks. Long live Mike Woodson!

[Guest Vitamin X]

I could see Nash moved to the Raptors in exchange for TJ Ford, as Ford is being replaced by Jose Calderon as the PG of the future and seems unwilling to take a demotion to the bench.

 

Ford's contract is $8 million a year for 2008-2009, 2009-2010, and a player option for 2010-2011.

 

According to the ESPN Trade Machine, this can work under the following scenario:

 

The Suns send Nash (1 year left)

 

The Raptors send TJ Ford (2 years left), Anthony Parker (1 year left), and Joey Graham (1 year left).

That's retarded, teke. If Ford is being replaced by Calderon as the PG of the future, then how would that trade make a lick of sense for the Raptors if Steve fucking Nash rolls into town?

 

Although, the closest thing to the way the Suns play ball is how Toronto plays, or maybe Golden State- but you're not replacing Baron Davis. Maybe they can strike a deal with Chicago or god forbid, New York? They have a lot of inflated contracts.

 

On ESPN.com's trade machine I worked out Steve Nash and New York native D.J. Strawberry for Zach Randolph and Nate Robinson. On one hand, that would give Phoenix a pretty killer frontcourt, but it leaves the point guard position a bit unsettled because Robinson hasn't proved to be starting material yet. Fuck if Stephon Marbury doesn't like it; can't he play the 2, anyways?

[Precious Roy 0]

The Suns aren't trading Steve Nash.

 

And Calderon is a free agent, the Raptors may not be able to keep him

[Guest Vitamin X]

Well then maybe the trade teke proposed isn't a bad idea after all.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

Fuck if Stephon Marbury doesn't like it; can't he play the 2, anyways?

 

How much is left on Marburys contract?

[Precious Roy 0]

Fuck if Stephon Marbury doesn't like it; can't he play the 2, anyways?

 

How much is left on Marburys contract?

 

He's on his last year, thank God.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

I'm sure a team looking for cap relief next year will take him... Why not look for a trade? How much is Marburys final year worth anyway? Is a buy out an option?

[Precious Roy 0]

EDIT* 21 million

 

The Knicks aren't going to flip his expiring contract unless they're getting someone else's expiring contracts back, at least I hope they won't. One of the first things Donnie Walsh said at his press conference was that he didn't want to take any more contracts on, that he wanted to shed contracts with the hope of acquiring a top level free agent in 2010 (LeBron).

 

At the end of next season Marbury, Malik Rose and Jerome James come off the books, that puts us within striking distance of the cap. After the 09-10 season Q-Rich and Eddy Curry come off, which is like 17 million between the two of them, and that would put us far enough under the cap to be a player in the 2010 free agent market.

 

If Walsh is going to trade Marbury and live up to his promise of not adding any more long term contracts he's going to have to get really creative, and I'm not sure if it's even doable. As far as buying him out goes, I'm all for it. All I know is he's an absolute cancer and I don't want him anywhere near this team. Pay him to sit at home or just to go away. He can go play in Italy a year earlier than he'd planned.

[Guest College Party]

NBA trade talk is second behind fantasy sports as the worst sport-related thing in the world. What a stupid and contrived system.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

It is pretty silly. The notion of expiring contracts of useless players often being more valuable than the players themselves makes most NBA personnel deals into quite the goofy game. I guess it's nice that all these guys get guaranteed money, but I much prefer the NFL route of a big bonus upfront, a certain percentage guaranteed, and the ability of a team to just cut a guy if he's no longer producing. The recent influx of performance incentives in contracts, particularly for players with questionable remaining ability or character, is also smart. The whole NFL system is a bit cutthroat, but outside of the guys making the league minimum and trying to just stay on any team, I think it helps a lot more than it hurts. The result is an ability for good ownership to rebuild or correct mistakes pretty quickly; really, with a good draft, good player evaluation, and timely trades, a shot at the playoffs is only a year or two away for any well-run organization. In the NBA, you pay guys $15 million a year to sit on your bench, and hope you don't miss your chance to replace them with someone good 3 years later.

[Ripper 0]

Okay, i am late to the party.

 

A: The Suns aren't trading Steve fucking Nash. Even if you believe that the suns are going to be alottery team or something next year, he is still one of the most marketable guys in the NBA. You don't trade away money and get a losing record that will cut back on fans. Why would anyone fuck with their revenue like that.

 

B: Fuck Billy Knight too, but at the same time, he tried to trade for Jose Calderon and the trade got blocked by the owners. then he tried to fire Mike Woodson last year and twice this year and the owners blocked that too. Outside of that disastorous Sheldon Williams at 5 pick and paying Speedy Claxton all that money, I think he hasn't done a BAD job as a GM. But fuck him, he can go. but if this leads to keeping the worse coach in the last 2 decades of the NBA, then fuck that move.

 

C: Edwin, the NFL's system is pure bullshit and shouldn't be copied by anyone. Sure they cut guys that underperform. But 9-10 they are underperforming because of injuries sustained while doing their job. Its like if you were a cop and they could fire you for getting shot on a drug bust. Yes, technically you probably couldn't perform the job at the same capacity of when you got hired, but you got fucked up working for them.

 

I like guarenteed contracts. If you are worried a guy might not perform, don't give him a big guarenteed contract. The ability for a guy to sign a contract and believe that they are making X amount of money, then get hurt playing for you and you say 'Oh, sorry...we aren't going to give you anymore money. Ever. And since you got hurt working for me, most other teams are going to think you can't come back so you are probably screwed for ever....but thanks for all that hard work in playing for me and ending your career."

 

I think you would be hard pressed to find a big contract that wasn't worth it at some point. And if it wasn't it was a dumb signing in the first place. Juawn Howard never should have gotten 100 million dollars. Nor Glenn Robinson, nor that huge contract Brian Grant got. Those were always horrible deals. You can't blame the contract methods on those. You blame dumb GM/Owners. Some guys like Michael Finley, Jalen Rose, Penny Hardaway, and to a degree, Stephon Marbury, they earned those contracts and just because they weren't the same players at the end, doesn't exactly mean it was a bad contract.

 

I have decided to pay this player 80 million dollars for his service for te next 4-5 years. Thats the contract. People should ignore Allan Houston being the highest paid player in the NBA his last season and realize that for the overall contract it wasn't that bad of a deal...wait...bad example...Allan Houston should have never been able to get that contract....

 

[Ripper 0]

All joking aside, "play against Michael Jordan" is the correct answer here.

 

 

They would have lost to anyone. The games they won on the way to the finals featured them keeping the ball out of Sucky VonChokesalot hand. Stocktons three, Horney's layup, Ostertags block. All plays that fuck up would have fucked up.

 

The bulls doubled stockton two years in a row to force him to pass to Malone with the game on the line and he turned it over both times. That dude really did suck ass.

 

For people to put him in the All-Time PF list over Barkley or Mchale is embarrassing. (duncan is still a center. Fuck the spurs lineup chart)

 

You say Malone chokes alot, yet would put Barkley ahead of him??????? wtf?

 

WTF what? Barkley missed some shots at the end of games and such, but there is a difference between missing some and absolutey sucking ass at the end of games all the fucking time, which Malone did. All the time. Turnover by Malone, Missed freethrows by Malone, passing the ball to someone else with time running down so he didn't have to take the shot....thats Malones career. He was simply the worse crunch time player I have seen seeing as he sucked in crunch time for almost 20 years.

 

[naiwf 0]

It looks like Carlisle is headed to the Mavs as early as tomorrow, and that the Knicks aren't out of the D'Antoni sweepstakes (ugh).

[Ripper 0]

And its being reported they are throwing a HUGE contract at him. So much for the not adding big contracts.

 

And honestly, i can;t think of a worse place to coach for D'Antoni than New York. David Lee would start though, so thats a plus. But besides that, its a team not built to do anything particularly well. They can't run, they can't grind it out half court, they can't even run a quick hitting offense. Its a team full of talent with no direction. that said:

 

They should go for a real point guard, Crawford as your two unless you can move him for someone that has seen a shot they don't love, Q-Rich for now at the 3 but Wilson Chandler is the future at that spot, Lee at the 4 and just play Z-bo at the Center. A bench of Nate(ugh) Chandler and Jeffries will have to do for now, because you know you aren't going anything more than 8 deep.

 

Ugh...he really should just take the Chicago job.

[Guest College Party]

I like guarenteed contracts. If you are worried a guy might not perform, don't give him a big guarenteed contract. The ability for a guy to sign a contract and believe that they are making X amount of money, then get hurt playing for you and you say 'Oh, sorry...we aren't going to give you anymore money. Ever. And since you got hurt working for me, most other teams are going to think you can't come back so you are probably screwed for ever....but thanks for all that hard work in playing for me and ending your career."

Guaranteed contracts aren't my gripe so much as the dollar-for-dollar trade stuff and "expiring contracts" and all that jazz. It really hampers rebuilding efforts when you can't just fire-sell all your parts and instead get stuck lugging around so much dead weight, so if you make the mistake of paying a big contract for a star player who doesn't pan out, the best way you can rectify your error is to use the same amount of money to pay for a handful of role players that don't fit into your plans. I don't have a problem with being on the hook for the remainder of a contract once you've released a player, I just know that whenever I have to read all that "well I tried this on the trade machine and" shit, my head hurts.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

How could D'Antoni going to Chicago possibly be a good idea? Isn't he ostensibly leaving Phoenix because his philosophy doesn't mesh well with Kerr's? But it's going to mesh with Paxson? Not only that, but the only players on the Bulls that would fit into D'Antoni's style are Deng and Thomas; the rest of those guys are halfcourt players.

[Ripper 0]

Deng, Thomas, Hirnich, Noah and Thabo all fit into it. Especially Noah who can initiate the break himself. Plus he has jump shooters to spread the court, only no big to finish at the rim consistantly, but they do have a lottery pick to go after that. Its not a great job, but its definately better than the knicks.

 

Also, I think its just that Kerr was trying to miromanage and that was bullshit.

 

I mean, lets call it what it is.

 

Mike D'Antoni had 2 bad defensive teams in his 4 years in Phoenix. one of his best defensive teams happened to be when Amare Stoudimire missed the whole year. Then he had another good defensive year last year when he used Thomas as the defensive anchor.

 

The lack of focus on defense is because his best offensive weapon is a lazy fuck that doesn't want to play defense. And how can you say discipline Amare, when Amare whines about not getting touches in the media and you go to the coach and say "Hey, give Amare the ball". You obviously just took sides.

 

[TheOriginalOrangeGoblin 0]

D'Antoni would be perfect for the Raptors. Just saying.

[Ripper 0]

Yeah, the Raptors are obviously the best team for him. With Ford/Calderon as his Nash, Parker as his Bell, Moon as his Marion, Bosh as his Amare (only he tries to play defense) and Bargs as the type of Center he wished he could have had in Phoenix.

[Ripper 0]

LMAO...

 

 

So...yeah. The hawks are thinking of Hiring...BILLY FUCKING KING to replace Billy Knight. King of course has a great relationship with Mike Woodson...

 

All signs are pointing towards a Mike woodson return. Oh, and Josh Smith and Josh Childress are both up for contracts so they will probably sign for 2 years, 200 million dollars any day now. And Salim Stoudimire should be able to pull a 4 year 25 million dollar deal out of it.

[Brett Favre 0]

Lee, Nate, Balkman, Chandler, and Crawford would excel with D'Antoni. They'll probably draft a point guard and change up the rest of the team.

[Ripper 0]

Lee, Nate, Balkman, Chandler, and Crawford would excel with D'Antoni. They'll probably draft a point guard and change up the rest of the team.

 

Nate would probably not get much playing time though. Mike has a short leash for point guards. It took years before he let Barbosa stay on the court and he would pulled Marcus Banks at the slightest prompting. Nate with about one or two of those "Nate being Nate" plays would have his ass on the bench towel waving.

[Brett Favre 0]

He's such a good shooter though and he can rebound very well. I'd say he's way more polished than Barbosa was those years, and he's waay better than Marcus Banks. I'm not sure if he'd even play PG though. He's more of a scorer, although he's a decent passer.

[Ripper 0]

I thnk Marcus Banks is underrated because Bill Simmons said he sucks.

 

He is a monster defensively, can hit the open jumper, is ridiculously fast in the open court...honestly, the differences between him and Rondo are minimal. He is a better shooter than Rajon.

[teke184 0]

He's such a good shooter though and he can rebound very well. I'd say he's way more polished than Barbosa was those years, and he's waay better than Marcus Banks. I'm not sure if he'd even play PG though. He's more of a scorer, although he's a decent passer.

What PG do the Knicks take if Rose is off the board?

 

(That assumes the Heat get a better pick than the Knicks, as they're likely looking for Rose rather than Beasley.)

[Brett Favre 0]

It's either going to be OJ Mayo or Jerryd Bayless. Bayless is super quick and can shoot but he wasn't really running the point in Arizona. Mayo can run the point but he also ran it sporadically at USC and his game was slowed down by Tim Floyd. That's if we take a PG, which I think we will.

[Precious Roy 0]

Nate Robinson is a dynamic player. Outside shooting, driving, steals, rebounds, he can get shit done. He gets on hot streaks where he just dominates, and looks like the best player on the court. The problem is he's a two in a one body. Pairing him in the backcourt with Crawford can work for stretches because Crawford is a good ballhandler and can initiate the offense, but it doesn't play to his strengths to do that, he's too shot oriented to run point for a whole game and he's not particularly good in a set half court offense.

 

The ideal pairing for Robinson would be a big natural point guard who's good enough on defense to guard the other team's SG. Robinson could be himself on offense and match up with the point on defense. But guys like that don't come along that often. Derrick Rose might be that guy, might not be. I could get with a 3 guard rotation of Crawford, Robinson and Rose coached by D'Antoni though.