Joss Whedon's Dollhouse

[Ripper 0]

I wonder if they're going to make Joss show one of the midseason episodes and rivet on an "Oh by the way here's the cast" like he had to do with Firefly?

 

BTW Ripper I think my favorite moment on Buffy is when Spike got his soul back and Buffy finds him in the mausoleum (I think it was) crazy as hell. When he embraces that cross and starts smoking, I was like "FUCK". Ever since then I've loved watching James Marsters work, even when he's stuck being Brainiac on Smallville.

 

 

That is my favorite Buffy moment too. Especially since that ep kinda sucked. But from when he stabbed that guy with the pole to the end of the show...just fucking amazing.

[Jingus 0]

Heads up, season premier's this Friday, 9:00 EST.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

Heads up, season premier's this Friday, 9:00 EST.

 

 

I can see this thread in about two weeks

 

"So Fox announced they cancelled dollhouse today."

[Jingus 0]

You might not be wrong. Has anyone seen any commercials or any marketing for this show at all? I sure haven't.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

I think Whedon knows the show is probably screwed. Hearing him and the rest of the cast try to spin the move to Friday as a good thing was depressing.

 

And after seeing some clips of Eliza Dusku in Dollhouse, I'm even more convinced it was terrible casting. Emote Eliza! Emote!

 

 

 

[dubq 0]

I saw tons of advertising for this on Global (the Canuck channel that's carrying it). I dunno, I like it so far. I certainly don't mind Eliza but I'm glad to see Amy Acker as a part of the guest cast as well.

[Jingus 0]

Well, that was certainly a Joss Whedon pilot on Fox. Reminded me more of "The Train Job" on Firefly more than anything else Joss has done. Same feeling of two hours worth of exposition squashed into one hour of time. Same disheartening focus on generic Exciting TV Stuff in the first twenty minutes before slowing down to consider more thoughtful subjects. Same plot where our mercenary protagonists are firstly in it for the money, but then run into a situation so awful that they're morally forced to become big damn heroes. Same massive crew of characters all thrown at us at once, to the point where I don't remember any of their names besides Echo.

 

Aside from that, I think my reaction to this episode as a whole is identical to that of seeing Amy Acker made up with a bunch of scars all over her face: it's not what I expected, and it's rather ballsy to go that route, but I'm not sure if I like it. We do seem to have a good supporting cast, at least, both the old familiar faces and the noobs all seemed to do well in their parts. Dushku... I'm still not sold on. She's always seemed somewhat insincere and false in everything I've ever seen her in, and although she was playing it more toned-down and subtle than usual, those old tendencies still peeked through at times.

 

On the plus side, they're already come up with some fascinating ideas with which to play around with the main gimmick. Like, the borrowed personality accidentally running into someone she once knew; you'd expect that more like around the middle of the season, not in the very first episode. And of course there's all the subtextual meditation upon the nature of memory, identity, what makes up the human soul, yadda yadda yadda.

 

In short: I'll keep watching, I'm curious where Whedon is going with this, since in tone it does feel different from his previous work. (Especially noteworthy was how ordinary the dialogue sounded, with none of the cutesy slang and witticisms which overpopulate most of Joss's work.) However, I will be terribly surprised if the Fox viewers will be willing to watch something with such an existential point to the proceedings, especially in the godfucking Friday Night Timeslot O' Doom.

 

And oh yeah, Dushku and Summer Glau's little bumper host segments were just embarassing and counterproductive to the mood of the show, hope they cut that shit out soon. Even worse, Fox somehow figured out how to do the impossible: make Glau look ugly, with that awards-show dress and caked-on makeup.

[Jingus 0]

Sooo, did anyone else actually watch this damn thing? Considering that this board once spawned a thread which went two hundred and twenty two pages about the last season of Angel, the apathy here can't be a good thing as far as the ratings are concerned.

[Molotov The Bear 0]

Shut the fuck up and give it time. It's the first episode. It was a good thing, to me. I'll be watching.

[Jingus 0]

Just saying, for Joss shows usually we get a whole shitload of people in here doing running commentary on each and every episode. Kinda like the 241-page monstrosity of the Lost thread. This one... does not follow that trend. Which to me is somewhat worrisome, since the Whedon fanboy contingent on this board is historically so strong.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

You might not be wrong. Has anyone seen any commercials or any marketing for this show at all? I sure haven't.

For what ever reason, FOX had a whole ad campaign going with ads in a Grindhouse Style promoting Friday Nights of Dollhouse and Terminator.

 

I think what will save this show is that a lot people will probably dvr it (I did so I could keep watching Friday the 13th marathon on HD Net), but now Nielsen counts ratings for DVR watching as well so even though live viewing on a friday night ratings will suck, they'll more than likely pick up viewers on the DVR rating..

 

Or not, if most people decided not to even bother with it since it seems to be a forgone conclusion to be canceled by fox already by most people..though I doubt that myself.

 

 

[Molotov The Bear 0]

Just saying, for Joss shows usually we get a whole shitload of people in here doing running commentary on each and every episode. Kinda like the 241-page monstrosity of the Lost thread. This one... does not follow that trend. Which to me is somewhat worrisome, since the Whedon fanboy contingent on this board is historically so strong.

 

Oh, I'm not blaming you. But I think the days of the Buffy/Angel thread's ridiculous amount of posts are behind us. I think everyone is basically expecting the show to fail at this point, given it's Joss and FOX. Which sucks, because this was a pretty good show.

 

[milliondollarchamp 0]

it was better than I expected considering all the bad reviews, not perfect, but it had a lot of potential. Seems stupid to program an active with something so potentially lethal as asthma.

 

I was impressed with Eliza her three characters felt sufficiently different to me. I hope she can keep pulling that off.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I don't recall the Firefly thread being large, so there will probably be a lag in regards to Joss fans getting on board. Natch, I haven't seen it. More cause I forgot/don't have kaybell. It will be downloaded/streamed sometime this week.

[Jingus 0]

Yeah, looks like they'll be streaming the episodes on Hulu. That site generally keeps the last five new episodes aired up for watching, in real nice quality too.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

Eliza as a top hostage negotiator was not believable at all, although maybe that was the idea. Putting her hair up and giving her glasses did not make it anymore believable. Uwe Boll did the same thing with Tara Ried in Alone in the dark and then marvelled at how smart she looked. So, that's one thing Whedon and Boll have in common.

 

 

The premise is very flawed, and it seems difficult to get a few seasons out of a show that doesn't have a main character to speak of. I don't know where you can go with it.

[AnonymousBroccoli 0]

Jingus pointed out some Joss moments, but overall it felt more like a Fox show than a Joss show.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Meh. Alright concept that hopefull works better moving forward. I don't like Dushku very much. The episode didn't really click for me...but I'll give it time to see if it finds its footing.

[AnonymousBroccoli 0]

http://www.thrfeed.com/2009/02/dollhouse-t...re-ratings.html

 

The series premiere of Joss Whedon's "Dollhouse" was seen by 4.7 million viewers Friday night and garnered a 2.0 preliminary adults 18-49 rating and 6 share. It was beaten in the 9 p.m. hour by ABC's "Supernanny" (6.1 million viewers, 2.2/7) and is the lowest-rated scripted series premiere on a major broadcast network this season aside from NBC's now-defunct "Crusoe."

[Atticus Chaos 0]

The number isn't bad, but you have to remember, shows always lose a chunk of their viewers after the pilot.

 

[HarleyQuinn 0]

It did come off as a "place setter" type episode, although Joss arguably has a knack for mediocre premiere episodes of seasons/shows (either due to script or executives) dating back to Buffy.

 

I like it well enough but I hope it turns out more like Buffy or Firefly, where the "main" premise is almost a background part and the focal development becomes more about the characters, their individual situations, and relationships. There was some early development there (intrigued by the contrast Echo and Sierra had in the opening episode and whether that'll continue) and I have a feeling it'll turn out to be more like Firefly, in that it'll be a solid enough 1st season but still get axed.

 

As far as I know, it's scheduled for 13 episodes and Joss has admitted that the second half of the season is where it starts to ramp up (which fits his other first season series'). Not the biggest fan of Eliza as lead, see Tru Calling, but I'll continue watching.

[YourKock'sReallyGreat 0]

How can you knock Tru Calling? I loved that show and the whole Eliza vrs Jason Priestly aspect on the show.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

How can you knock Tru Calling? I loved that show and the whole Eliza vrs Jason Priestly aspect on the show.

 

 

Tru calling only got interesting after Jason Priestly showed up. But the first half of that season was dreadful. It's a shame because they cancelled it just as it was getting good and going into the reasons Tru had her powers and what it meant for the universe and all that. If it hard started out like that, it might have done a lot better.

[YourKock'sReallyGreat 0]

How can you knock Tru Calling? I loved that show and the whole Eliza vrs Jason Priestly aspect on the show.

 

 

Tru calling only got interesting after Jason Priestly showed up. But the first half of that season was dreadful. It's a shame because they cancelled it just as it was getting good and going into the reasons Tru had her powers and what it meant for the universe and all that. If it hard started out like that, it might have done a lot better.

 

 

The rumor is that her bf on the show (the 30 year old who plays a teenager in every movie) was going to turn into a serial killer and become aware of how Tru saved him when he was meant for death. That was supposed to play for the rest of season 2 before the show got the ax. They were going to play into the whole morality of if it was the right thing to do for Tru to save people and the impact that these people would have on the world by being kept alive.

 

My favorite episode is the one with the girl who has cancer and decides to jump off the tower.

[Jaxxson Mayhem 0]

I'm watchin my 1st ep right now and am wondering how this is any different than My Own Worst Enemy?

[Jingus 0]

Stuff running through my head as I watched episode #2 of Dollhouse:

 

-Man, that was a drop in quality from the pilot. You could really tell Joss Whedon was neither writing nor directing this time. Notably lower budget, too.

 

-Eliza Dushku... still really not sold on her as a leading lady. Sure, it helps that she's not really playing an actual character here, but intentionally false combinations of various cliches. That helps sometimes. Still doesn't help when she does one of those groan-inducing line readings where she's growling with all the talent and sincerity of Elizabeth Berkeley.

 

-Is it just me, or is the Dollhouse set just the Wolfram & Hart set from the last season of Angel with a tiny bit of halfhearted remodeling? You wouldn't think that something like that would be kept randomly standing for five years, studio space can't be cheap, but it looks so identical that I gotta wonder.

 

-So far we've had two Crisis Of The Week individual episode plots, and neither one of them was very good. I tell myself, this is the standard pattern for every Joss show, they always start out weak... and then build to something stronger. If, y'know, they get the time. But still, first a kidnapping case straight outta Law & Order: SVU, and now a freaking Most Dangerous Game ripoff? (The added detail that this hunter only hunts girls and starts the hunt almost immediately after he fucks them is kinda creepy, but the rest is ancient formula.)

 

-I'm wondering when we're gonna get a Ship Episode. This goes back to an old saying about the original Star Trek: sometimes they would spend an entire episode on the Enterprise and never beam down in order to save on budget, and those Ship Episodes sometimes wound up being the best episodes in the show's history. So, sometime soon can we please get a Dollhouse episode which doesn't involve some kind of fabricated situation involving one of Echo's missions? The supporting characters in and around the Dollhouse itself are rather fun, and I'd like to see a storyline based on them. And the show needs more Amy Acker, dammit.

 

-I hope they're going somewhere with this FBI Agent plotline which will make it feel different. Cuz right now, I can't look at this guy for a second (with the already-too-many scenes of his colleagues mocking him) without thinking about that reporter on the old Incredible Hulk show.

 

-Also we've apparently met our big bad villain, Sylar. WHOOPS I mean Alpha, ahem, sorry. Although watching the first half of the first season of Heroes, the depiction of the two is rather similar.

 

-Comparing this one to the other shows Whedon has done, it still feels way more like Firefly than the others. Not because of quality; good lord no, so far Dollhouse hasn't even sniffed that particular bottle's cork. But more because of how rushed everything feels. I mean, second episode of the series, and we're already getting plot elements laid out for the overall story arc. It's definitely that same Sword of Damocles feeling, like the creative team know damn well from the very beginning that their days are probably numbered and that they have to shove in everything they can as fast as possible.

 

-There was exactly one punchline I laughed at. Black Giles asked Dushku if she knew how to use a gun; she takes it, chambers it, and says "I have four brothers... none of them democrats". That was funny. Not funny enough to make up for the little bit of throwup in my mouth when the phantom billionaire serial killer said, "Prove you're not an echo!" to the girl whose name just happens to be Echo though neither guy nor girl happen to know that at the moment.

 

All in all, I wonder what the hell Whedon's gameplan is here, since it sure doesn't seem as meticulously planned as his other work. Comparing it to the post-pilot episodes of Buffy and Angel, it seems roughly on the same level, except of course being in the most infamous timeslot on the most infamous network when and where shows always get cancelled early, so the chance of them having enough time to grow and improve isn't looking too good.

[Molotov The Bear 0]

I thought it was already mentioned last week that Alpha WAS the FBI agent, atleast that was my thoughts. I dunno what you were watching, cause this episode was much better than last week's. And the arrow through the throat was badass.

 

I do agree, that there needs to be more Amy Acker though.

[naiwf 0]

I'm watchin my 1st ep right now and am wondering how this is any different than My Own Worst Enemy?

 

Hmm, Edward knew about Henry when the show began. Then he became broken and Henry learned about Edward. There were some wacky hijinks involved where Edward and Henry would flip back and forth at the worst possible times (every week of course!) and then the show got cancelled just as it was getting somewhere.

 

Here Echo does NOT know that she's a mindless drone when the show began. Then she became broken and there were some wacky hijinks involved where Echo could remember things at the worst possible time (I didn't see tonight's ep yet) and then the show will get cancelled just as it's getting somewhere.

 

So I guess the answer would be Dushku has breasts and Slater did not. Other than that, I got nothing.

[dubq 0]

I like the show so far. I hope it finds its wings soon, though. I'm finding a hard time grasping what the entire "pull" to the storyline is... does the Dollhouse eventually turn into an elite crime fighting unit? Do they save the world? Where exactly is this going, I guess is what I'm asking...

 

Joss' stuff seems to work so much better when there's an almost unbeatable antagonist rearing it's head at every turn. I realize they're probably going that way with this Alpha guy.. but really.. it doesn't feel as "epic" as, say, the Alliance in Firefly or Wolfram & Hart in Angel.

[Youth N Asia 0]

I think I'm not even going to try and watch till we get a handful of episodes in and it looks like it could avoid getting canceled before it's a season in. They screwed me on Drive. I'm not falling for that again