Mik Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Scott Smith/Robbie Lawler is the co-main for the first EliteXC CBS card with Kimbo vs. TBA in the main. Hell - I want to see that fight. Scott Smith is a damn entertaining brawler.
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Lytle vs. Serra was a controversial decision. It could've gone either way... I had Lytle winning though, for the record. Either way, it was a boring fight which shouldn't happen again. And that certainly doesn't warrant Lytle a title shot over Jon Fitch, Karo Parisyan(whom beat Lytle and Serra), Thiago Alves(whom also has a victory over Lytle), or Josh Koscheck.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Please don't count Alves as having a "victory" over Lytle when the fight was even going into the third and the cut stoppage was total BS.
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Please don't count Alves as having a "victory" over Lytle when the fight was even going into the third and the cut stoppage was total BS. A win is a win, it wasn't like it wasn't a bad cut stoppage... Re-watch the fight, the docters made a right desicion.
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Posted March 21, 2008 Fitch vs. Lytle would be a pretty dope match.
Just call me Dan Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 As if I didn't like Lytle enough, he killed Kyle Bradley who is the boyfriend of a friend of mine from high school and is a total douche.
Jorge Gorgeous Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Royce Gracie ate at the PF Changs I work at today. He isn't a big dude.
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Fitch vs. Lytle would be a pretty dope match. Not really... Fitch would most likely just takedown Lytle and control him on the ground for 3 rounds.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Maybe Lytle would do what Fitch's last three opponents couldn't do and sub when when he, like always, puts himself in a bad position on the ground.
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Maybe Lytle would do what Fitch's last three opponents couldn't do and sub when when he, like always, puts himself in a bad position on the ground. Doubt it... It's not like Lytle is better then Diego Sanchez, or Roan Carneiro when it comes to submissions. I like Lytle, but he's nothing more then a gatekeeper pretty much. Now him Vs. Marcus Davis would be a awesome fucking fight, a lot better then Swick Vs. Davis.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Really? Then please elaborate on how Lytle has WAY more submission wins on his record then both Carneiro and Diego. If they are, in fact more gifted then Lytle with submissions why aren't they winning with them?
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Really? Then please elaborate on how Lytle has WAY more submission wins on his record then both Carneiro and Diego. If they are, in fact more gifted then Lytle with submissions why aren't they winning with them? Lytle doesn't have any of the grappling credentials both Carnerio and Sanchez have... There is no point in even arguing that Lytle's BJJ is better then Carnerio, only if you want to make yourself look stupid. And maybe Lytle has more submission wins then Carnerio, because Lytle has like 45 fights... Did you ever think about that smart guy? Lets see Lytle pull off those slick submissions against top talent, and not tomato cans... Who has Lytle submitted that is noteworthy? Also Lytle has more submission victories then Diego Sanchez, is because Sanchez doesn't really go for submissions... Ground and pound is his passion, although he does train submissions and is very good at them... He perfers to ground and pound, it doesn't take a genius to figure that out.
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Posted March 21, 2008 Lytle would fuck Fitch up on his feet, and taking Lytle down would be difficult. On the ground, Fitch isn't this dominating beast so it's not like Lytle couldn't win rounds on his feet. Fitch is a great fighter, but he has holes in his game that someone as solid as Lytle could exploit. Fitch has looked flawed in most of the matches that I've seen him in, against Wilson he looked nearly done in, ditto vs. Carnerio, and those two guys aren't in Lytle's league. The main point in Fitches favour is that he doesn't wear down as the fight goes on, so he can afford to look bad in round one as he can come back and win the next few rounds. Against Lytle that would be difficult to do. Lytle is too good and as been too competitive with top guys to be considered a gate keeper, imo. He's had some unfortunate breaks, but I think this "reinvention" to a more aggressive Lights-Out can only mean good things for him. Plus, that sub on Jason Gilliam was seven kinds of badass. And he fucking mugged Kyle Bradley. I could see him finding a home for that overhand right on Fitch.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Indeed. I think Lytle would eat Serra's food if they rematched again.
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Posted March 21, 2008 Dude, he'd have a buffet of that shit, all you can eat.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 Dude, the money for Montreal is still at my house. If you don't come pick it up soon my Dad is likely to buy a new fax machine or something stupid with it.
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Posted March 21, 2008 Dude, man, c'mon. It's like five minutes out of my day to pick that money up. Think of all the shit I could be doing with that five minutes. Shiit, I could do some SHIT with that five minutes. Fuckin, makin minute rice...
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Posted March 21, 2008 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=37...h&plindex=1 In my TF moment of the day, Marcus Davis in a TNA Wrestling hype package? The fuck?
Lord of The Curry Posted March 21, 2008 Report Posted March 21, 2008 TNA is really hyping up the MMA aspect of that fight, saying that Joe has been sequestered training and shit. I expect to see a lot of guard work with near-submissions like triangles and armbars. Curious to see how stiff they work with each other.
Lei Tong Posted March 22, 2008 Report Posted March 22, 2008 Lytle is too good and as been too competitive with top guys to be considered a gate keeper, imo. Gatekeepers can be comeptitive, but they'll almost always lose to guys above their level much like Lytle has (Riggs, Karo, Hughes).
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 22, 2008 Report Posted March 22, 2008 Lytle is too good and as been too competitive with top guys to be considered a gate keeper, imo. Gatekeepers can be comeptitive, but they'll almost always lose to guys above their level much like Lytle has (Riggs, Karo, Hughes). The funny thing is Riggs isn't above Lytle's level... Ahahahaha.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 22, 2008 Report Posted March 22, 2008 Yeah, I'm not seeing how Riggs is above Lytle. Granted, he was landing some nice ground and pound before the cut stoppage but in terms of victories over competition it's close.
Lt. Al Giardello Posted March 22, 2008 Report Posted March 22, 2008 But either way... The point that Lei Tong made is clear... I can't see Lytle beating any of the top guys. Fitch would takedown and control Lytle on the ground for 3 rounds, sure Lytle has better stand up, but Fitch has good enough stand up to set up his takedowns. And if Sanchez or Jucao can't submit Fitch, I can't see Lytle doing it... Because as I explained earlier, his BJJ isn't as good as neither of those fighters. Sure theres always a chance of a flash KO, but 9/10 I see Fitch winning this fight. And say what you want about Chris Wilson, I doubt too many people know about him... He's underrated, he has really good striking, infact he is the kickboxing coach at Team Quest. I actually think Chris Wilson would be a good fight for Chris Lytle, both have very similar styles. But either way, Chris Wilson will be in the UFC for a long time to come.
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 22, 2008 Author Report Posted March 22, 2008 The disparity at 170 between the high and mid level is perhaps second only to 185 (which is just one guy dwarfing an entire division), so I think that it is unfair to relegate Lytle to gatekeeper status when we're not even talking about a handful of guys who are better than him. And even then, it's not like they are so much better than him that he has no chance no matter how many times they fight. Since losing to Hughes, Lytle has looked *amazing*, which I think deserves him the benefit of the doubt when it comes to this "style change". The dude has the tools to be a top ten fighter, and he's finally putting those tools to use. If this were this time last year, I wouldn't have such a hard time relegating him to gatekeeper status, but after those fights it's hard to put him at that level.
Lei Tong Posted March 22, 2008 Report Posted March 22, 2008 I put Riggs above Lytle because, despite having never been overly impressive at welterweight, he was an arguable Top 15 level fighter after he beat Lytle & Diaz. The disparity at 170 between the high and mid level is perhaps second only to 185 (which is just one guy dwarfing an entire division), so I think that it is unfair to relegate Lytle to gatekeeper status when we're not even talking about a handful of guys who are better than him. And even then, it's not like they are so much better than him that he has no chance no matter how many times they fight. I think Lytle is a gatekeeper for the division because he fits one of the oldest definitions of one: If (he) beats you in convincing manner, you're likely not going to accomplish much. In any other division, a guy of Lytle's skill set might fair a little better, but with an average wrestling & guard game, he lacks the tools to win against the upper tier of the welterweight division. As for the improvement he's shown, it' also important to remember the type of guys it's been against. Alves is a good test (even though his boxing leaves a bit to be desired), but Gilliam & Bradley are strictly regional level fighters who most truly skilled welterweights would look like killers against.
AboveAverage484 Posted March 23, 2008 Report Posted March 23, 2008 If (he) beats you in convincing manner, you're likely not going to accomplish much. See also: Heath Herring
RavishingRickRudo Posted March 23, 2008 Author Report Posted March 23, 2008 See, that's my problem with labeling Lytle as a Gatekeeper. P4P, he's a lot better than other divisions' relative gatekeepers. It's just at WW, the cream is so thick at the top that it's almost by default that he is relegated to that position. Which is unfair to his talents.
Lei Tong Posted March 24, 2008 Report Posted March 24, 2008 The term "gatekeeper" is always relative, though.
Mik Posted March 25, 2008 Report Posted March 25, 2008 Some interesting bits of news floating around this morning. Fedor may be on the verge of signing with EliteXC to a 4 fight deal that would put him on two of the CBS cards and two PPVs. Also: Cote vs. Big Dog is on the Griffin/Rampage undercard. That fight has potential. Cote is already saying he doesn't fear Almeida's jitz.
Lord of The Curry Posted March 25, 2008 Report Posted March 25, 2008 Good fight and one I'm happy to see Cote get because if he can survive on the ground and still manage to wreck Almeida like he did Grove and McFedries then he'll really be on a roll.
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