Let's Talk About...Kevin Sullivan's run with the book in WCW i

[The Big Wiggle 0]

The Sullivan-era merely highlights why I was actually a Russo supporter. You may not get much wrestling, but the ridiculous, over-the-top nature of the show was fun. WCW was always fun under Vince Russo. Sullivan was like watching paint dry, without the ability to get high from the fumes.

 

This era really hurt as a WCW fan when you compare it with what was happening in the WWF. We lost Benoit, Malenko, Guerrero, and Saturn, four of our biggest future prospects, so that Kevin Sullivan could book his old-school wrasslin' show in the year 2000. Ergo, all of the younger guys in the company who had been there for a few years, sans Vampiro, seemed to lose motivation. Hogan and Flair were both brought back in their same stagnant roles. The once promising nWo 2000 completely fell apart, making the company's new storyline dead in the water one month out of the gate.

 

Why Bill Busch gave the role to Sullivan at the expense of the Radicals is still one of the biggest head scratchers in WCW's history, but it's been said that Sullivan and J.J. Dillon had been in Busch's ear from the moment that Bischoff got fired, and were responsible for undermining initial Russo and Ferrera's run so that they could make a power grab when the opportunity arose.

 

As someone who almost gave up on WCW during the "summer of suck" but stayed with it, I actually did call it quits in early March of 2000. That's how bad it was, especially contrasted to the ultra-hot WWF still riding high on the Attitude era and now infused with some of WCW's most talented performers. When people try to point towards Arquette or any other post-Sullivan moment as the moment WCW died, I always point back towards these three months as when WCW passed the point of no return. Fans weren't going to come back after this, especially with WCW changing directions every quarter-of-a-year. Bischoff, Russo, and even Vince McMahon couldn't salvage the WCW name after Kevin Sullivan infused it with Yappapi straps, the Dog, jobber squashes, and all of the crap I must have blocked out.

[cabbageboy 0]

The 2000 nWo had no real potential. The whole concept of the group itself was so dead in the water by 2000 that there was no way to gather interest in it.

 

WCW in early 2000 is one of my favorite eras of wrestling to discuss (but not to watch, oh lord no). Imagine a company where everything goes wrong, everyone gets hurt at once, and the men in charge have zero concept of how to deal with any of it and make the worst decisions at every turn.

 

I saw a bit of a Nash shoot interview where he discussed things like WCW in 2000 and also his own booking run. He hinted at something that I've often wondered about the Fingerpoke, that it was an angle leading to Goldberg taking out Hall, Nash himself, and finally getting to Hogan to regain the title. Nash makes an error in saying that Goldberg tore up his arm with the car window and the angle was nixed (this happened almost a year later). My question is this: What exactly DID happen to Goldberg in 1999? I recall he did beat Hall, then Nash at Spring Stampede, but after a nothing match with Sting at Slamboree I don't really know where Goldberg went.

[King Kamala 0]

Goldberg was gone in the spring/early Summer of '99 because he was filming his part in whatever Universal Soldier sequel he was in.

[Zack Malibu 0]

I've always supported the "random" times in wrestling, such as when a youngster gets a push out of nowhere, or a new gimmick pops up on a familiar worker in an effort to get them over. I enjoy things like makeshift tag teams, such as when Ken Shamrock and Big Boss Man were the WWF World Tag Team Champions.

 

I did not, however, find any enjoyment in the 2000 Sullivan era.

 

He HAD the tools to try and make things right. Sure, the main event scene sucked for the most part, but there was talent to be used. Vampiro, Kidman, and Booker T are the obvious three that come to mind, but you also had a solid undercard with guys like Three Count, Lash Leroux, Lane, Lodi (Rave by that point), Juvi, Konnan, Mysterio, Finlay, and a few guys past their prime would could still put on watchable performances for the most part in Curt Hennig and Dustin Rhodes.

 

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...I have always backed Russo for certain reasons, those being that no matter what silliness he came up with, EVERYONE had something to do, and everyone had a role. Not to mention he never did anything as stupid as Booker T feuding over the T in his name. Plus, he is and was always much more willing to give the younger, unheralded workers a chance. We never would have gotten the Natural Born Thrillers, or Three Count, or even the Filthy Animals if it wasn't for him. Sullivan's big idea was to build Sid into a monster to turn and feed him to Hogan, AGAIN. It was like a bad redux of WWF 1992.

[cabbageboy 0]

Couldn't WCW have somehow worked around Goldberg's schedule though? They had a storyline set up, though I guess Hogan's injury at Spring Stampede would have thrown that storyline out the window anyway.

[The Big Wiggle 0]

The 2000 nWo had no real potential. The whole concept of the group itself was so dead in the water by 2000 that there was no way to gather interest in it.

 

Oh, I don't know. The nWo was as big a brand name as WCW, and the first month of the black and silver went back to what made the group great in the first place (but this time with Bret Hart as the leader). Granted, Sullivan can't be blamed for Bret getting kicked in the head and the various other calamities that reduced the stable to Jeff Jarrett, but he DID bring the Harris Boys into it, and for that reason alone he deserves all the scorn he can receive.

 

I do think that the first week of Sullivan was the best (or rather, least offensive) of this wretched period, because everything was in such disarray that they had no booking plan. This was the booking team that you didn't want to have a plan, because all of their ideas were absolute horseshit. Feuds over the letter T, The Demon vs. The Wall, Big Al, and Hogan being brought as the company's number one star. Blegh.

 

When I initially watched the Nitro after Souled Out, I really felt bad for Arn Anderson, what with him having to deliver his "Chris Benoit never won the world title" monologue. WCW never recognized the reign, and it wasn't until the buyout that it was included in the "official" title history. Of course, it may be removed again at this point. Regardless, the title situation remained a bloody mess for well over a week. If I remember correctly, the belt was stripped from Bret at Souled Out. Benoit beat Sid for the belt, but that decision was thrown out the next night and the belt remained vacant until the following week's Nitro, where Sid won it. Then on Thunder, Nash awarded himself the belt and Sid had to beat him for it all over again. Yeah, Russo didn't add any luster to the belt after that, but it was such an inept start to Sullivan's booking reign that it's even more frustrating when you realize Hogan was initially going to win the title at Spring Stampede. At least Russo was able to stave off Hogan's ego until July, and then drove him out with the "bald headed son of a bitch" shoot immediately afterwards.

[King Kamala 0]

I don't know if I would call either of Russo's runs with the book in WCW fun but they were certainly interesting. Sullivan's was anything but. Zack hit it right on the head- a lot of his ideas just seemed boring and played out. Any tiny, tiny sliver of potential the nWo 2000 had went right out the window once Bret retired and very few people wanted to see Hogan Vs Flair again and even less wanted to see Hogan settle the score from WrestleMania VIII with Sid. The original ideas Sullivan did have outright sucked.

 

 

The only wide spread defense of Sullivan's run I've heard is "Well, he was given an unsalvagable situation." Yes, I think we can all agree that he was dealt a terrible, terrible hand. But people dealt with worse hands have done much better jobs. An example; Smackdown in the Spring/Early Summer of '06 when Batista was out, Undertaker was on hiatus, JBL had just retired, and a burned out Kurt Angle was tusseling with Mark Henry. That roster was weaker on paper and way less star studded than that era of WCW and yet managed to put on consistantly solid (if a little bit unspectacular) shows and some good PPVs. Even at its weakest point in early '00, WCW still had some of the biggest names in professional wrestling (Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Sting, and to a lesser extent, Nash, Sid, and Luge), some solid dependable veterans (Finlay, Bam Bam Bigelow, Curt Hennig), and a plethora of extremely talented younger guys....and they couldn't put on a show that would qualify as more than mediocre.

[cabbageboy 0]

The problem with the nWo being as big as WCW is that at the end of the day it's a heel faction, and as all heel factions do it simply ran its course. WCW never realized this and never simply moved on and tried out another concept, but instead kept rehashing the tired nWo concept until no one cared.

 

Sure, if Bret hadn't been hurt they could have kept this group intact, but so what if they had? Maybe they would draw a .35 buyrate on PPV instead of the .10 buyrates they did draw. Maybe they lose 30 million dollars in 2000 instead of the 60 million they did lose. At the end of the day AOL/Time Warner would have still pulled the plug, unless Bischoff's group of money men were content to buy a company that was losing a ton of money, but not a historic ton of money.

[Richard 0]

What was the point of reuniting Hogan and Jimmy Hart? Wasn't he still managing heels on Sat. Night, and playing the heel against Mancow and other local djs?

[garfieldsnose 0]

Sometimes I don't understand where some WCW fans come from. They liked Russo's booking in WCW because it was fun, even if there was less wrestling. But they slam WWE because they do the same thing. I dunno, I like everything and rarely hate anything in the wrestling world, mainly cuz almost everything entertains me. I'm easily entertained. I don't see why WCW was interesting with Russo even though there was less wrestling, and WWF sucked when they had less wrestling.

[cabbageboy 0]

Eh, I don't think that many people slam the WWF during the 1998-99 era for not having much wrestling. I guess some do but it's more like that one big flaw in an otherwise very entertaining time period for the company. By 2000 I'd say the WWF was a much more wrestling centered promotion, since they actually had some workers.

 

As far as Russo goes, I've said it before and I'll say it again. His runs were counterproductive and lost all sorts of money in WCW, but at least unlike the horrible trash before him and the Sullivan trash that followed his run his booking wasn't boring by any means. Believe me, WCW in mid 1999 would have almost been torture to watch if not for it being so car wreck bad that I kept watching just to see how bad it would get (the hummer angle, the No Limit crap). I still remember that first Russo Nitro in Oct. 1999 and how truly bizarre and different it seemed from the horribly boring dreck of the previous few months. It was like a 3 hour car wreck of breakneck speed, angles galore, run ins, chaos, etc. There wasn't much to it from a wrestling standpoint, but it certainly commanded attention.

 

The ultimate sad irony of WCW is that by the time they did have people booking who wanted to push some different people and create some long term planning the company was basically on its last legs. I am speaking of the late 2000, early 2001 booking of Bill Banks and Co. I think even Bob Mould from Husker Du was helping in creative.

[King Kamala 0]

I'm not a Russo apologist and I wasn't entertained by his runs in WCW but let me play devil's advocate. I think it's because Russo's WCW was so batshit insane while WWE (for the most part) is relatively straightforward by modern standards. I don't know, maybe a Russo fan could explain it better but that's how I think someone could make that argument.

 

 

To answer Richard's question, Jimmy Hart had pretty much stopped managing by the time Hogan returned in February '00. I know Hugh Morrus, Brian Knobbs, and Meng were all flying solo. I'm not sure about The Barbarian. He probably wasn't even on the roster at that point. And IIRC, he turned face when Luger "broke" his arm in the buildup to Super Brawl 2000 (or was it Uncensored 2000? These shitty shows run together). Then when Russo and Bischoff showed up, Jimmy Hart showed up inexplicably as a weasley heel again.

[The Big Wiggle 0]

Like I said, I'm a Russo supporter (at least in theory, as I qualify that designation by knowing that a lot of his ideas are absolute turds when he doesn't have a guy above him filtering him out), because whether he's good or bad, he always tries to produce intriguing television. That's something that late-period Bischoff, Nash, Sullivan, and others failed to do for the company. We can debate the merits of his work up and down, and I'm right with you that there wasn't a lot to like by Fall Brawl 2000, but the man always put his all into each Nitro and Thunder, and for that I've got take my hat off to him.

 

I'm a WCW fan who was envious of the Attitude era, so I'm a bit different in that I don't care so much about the wrestling aspect of it. When the WWF received the infusion of the WCW castoffs, they suddenly had the benefit of being able to put on great matches along with the entertaining Attitude style of booking (which remained somewhat close to Russo and Ferrera's style until Stephanie took over in late 2000). Meanwhile, with this best of both worlds in the WWF, we had neither under Kevin Sullivan.

 

I've thought a lot about his mistakes (as it was a more entertaining way to spend my time than actually paying attention to those shows), and he should have made the best out of the Radicals leaving, sending a message that their fears were unfounded and that the proper guys were going to get pushed. Throwing the belt on Sid was the absolute wrong choice to make. While you can argue that no other young guy was ready for the belt, I'd argue that they could have gone with either Jarrett or Booker that January (as both men would hold the title later that year anyway).

 

Sid? Well, Sid was actually over in January, but that was due to him being booked as the dim-wittingly goofy but tough-as-hell brawler that he was molded as during the Powers That Be era. Sullivan tried to recast him as the straight babyface, and, when that failed, turned him heel to feed him to Hogan. None of these choices were the right ones to make, especially when Hogan was brought back as the red and yellow superhero, aborting the purported character change that put him on the shelf in October (and was finally used in April when the New Blood storyline began).

 

I'll say it again: The only minor success story of Sullivan was Vampiro finally getting over, which Russo fumbled when he turned him heel and started that Carnival of Darkness crap. Hell, Vampiro as World Champ would have been some seriously ballsy booking and may have been exactly what WCW needed at the time, but Sullivan wouldn't even dare put the Hardcore Title on him during this time.

[cabbageboy 0]

Here is one overwhelming problem with putting the belt on Vampiro: The dude simply wasn't very good. For all the talk about Vampiro being misused by WCW and all that, I can't think of a single good match he ever had. In fact one match I WAS looking forward to (Awesome/Vampiro from HH 2000) ended up being a negative star fiasco. One could forgive the goofy graveyard matches or the Human Torch match if Vampiro was lighting it up in his standard matches, but he wasn't.

 

The other "young guy" options were guys who in my opinion have never been great talents. Is Jeff Jarrett really the guy you want carrying your company? I even like Jarrett and have at times excused his narcissistic TNA run, but he's never been world championship material. He's never been over enough for it, never had good enough matches for it, never been good enough on the mic for it. How about Booker T.? I know Booker has won basically every belt known to man, and certainly has shown more charisma than JJ, but in the ring Booker has never really been a great talent. He's adequate, but can anyone seriously tell me a good Harlem Heat match? I suppose he had the wildly overrated Best of 7 (or 8) series with Benoit, but most of those were typical TV matches that aren't especially memorable.

 

Honestly the best guy they could have put the belt on if they didn't want to go back to Goldberg was what they did when it was too late: Give it to Steiner and let him beat the crap out of people.

[Richard 0]

I think Jarrett actually turned down winning the belt at one point, because he would have been the worst-drawing champ in WCW history up till then.

[MillenniumMan831 0]

Re: Vampiro. A definitely agree w/ cabbage. But I would have loved to see WCW invest in a prolonged face push for Vampiro. The guy never really did anything for me in the ring but the crowds seemed very much into him. Plus, a vested vault to the top would show that WCW was willing to shake things up. I think that's why Russo was embrased by fans during his 1st stint and some of his 2nd. It felt like anything but same ol same ol Dubbya Cee Dubbya. And only Mt Dew addicts could actually sit through summer of 1999 shows w/o falling asleep. Russo may have made your eyes roll but at least they weren't shutting.

 

Then again, I may be the only mark of senile President Flair on the board.

[King Kamala 0]

Vampiro wasn't very good in retrospect- workrate wise. Even as a mark- his series with Kidman was disappointing as hell. I remember WCW hyped it as a meeting between two of the greatest up and comers in the world. I don't even want to talk about his series with Sting...

 

Even if Vampiro, was average at best in the ring, he was very over at the time. Vampiro got the 2nd biggest pop of the night behind Sid on that shitty Nitro we were watching the other week. Besides, was Vampiro any worse workrate wise than Sid? Maybe he is just as bad as The Master and Ruler of Squirrels but it's a different kind of bad. Vampiro is sneaky bad. I never really thought he was all that terrible till Jingus mentioned it in the aforementioned Nitro chart and then I realized I couldn't remember a match of his that was better than **1/2. But at the same time, I remember any matches of his being memorably terrible. I can't remember very many of his matches that were memorable period. As a semi-mark, I think I liked Vampiro's potential more than I liked Vampiro himself. He was something different for the fans of WCW and at that time, that was sorely needed.

[cabbageboy 0]

I think we wanted Vampiro to be better than he was. He had a cool gimmick and was fairly over by WCW 2000 standards, but he just never was worth a crap in the ring. I've at least seen Sid in a few decent matches (mostly involving HBK or Benoit), though he's not especially good for the most part.

 

I mentioned Steiner earlier. Even though by 2000 he wasn't the worker he once was, he still had immense credibility as an ass kicker. Monster heel Steiner vs. face Goldberg could have been the feud to drag WCW out of the gutter had they gone with it a lot earlier. By the time they did do it though they had done the idiotic shoot angle crap with Nash being involved, then had Goldberg/Steiner in a good but too early encounter at Fall Brawl 2000.

[King Kamala 0]

I'll say that this was the point in WCW history where my feelings towards WCW loyalists changed from confusion to pity. It's really kind of sad to read DDTDigest recaps and the writers trying to find some good in shows that are absolutely horrible.

 

I think what makes this period all the more worse is the fact that WWF was so incredibly awesome during this period. WCW was almost as shitty during the Summer of '99 but WWF wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire either so choosing WCW over them wasn't completely absurd. But choosing to watch Nitro over RAW in February '00----that's downright dumb loyalty. I almost admire it.

 

Whatever happened to those WCW loyalists anyways? Where did they go when it got bought out?

[cabbageboy 0]

While the WWF in 1999 wasn't as good as it was in 1998 I would say on a regular basis Raw was a vastly better show than Nitro. The biggest problem I had with the WWF during that period was that they were TOO much about the sports entertainment schtick and not enough about wrestling. I did go to a Raw in July 1999 and it was a terrific show.

[King Kamala 0]

*NERDY FANTASY BOOKING POST ALERT*

 

 

OK, I was chatting with Dandy on AIM and I was expounding on a fantasy booking idea I had regarding The Main Event/World Title match at Souled Out 2000 and he told me I should post it here. Tell me what you think about it. Positive or negative feedback is welcome, just make it constructive.

 

 

At the beginning of the show Terry Funk comes out and runs down the changes in the card. Bret Hart is out indefinitely and he's being stripped of the WCW World title. To determine the new champion, Funk says there will be a one night only,eight man tournament for the WCW World title. The participants will be the Top Seven contenders for the title and the winner of a 20 man battle royal will fill out the eighth slot.

 

The battle royal opens the show. All of the second-tier wrestlers of WCW duke it out for an opportunity of a lifetime. Eventually it comes down to longtime veteran Booker T and the towering newcomer The Wall. Booker T manages to win the match after The Wall misses a charge and the momentum carries him over the top rope.

 

So after the match, the bracket is announced and we got;

 

1. Chris Benoit Vs 8. Booker T

4. Diamond Dallas Page Vs 5. Buff Bagwell

 

2. Sid Vs 7. Tank Abbott

3. The Total Package Vs 6. Vampiro

 

We have one or two non tournament matches and then we get the first quarterfinal... Sid Vs Tank Abbott. It's an extremely hard hitting, extremely short match. The Ron Lyle Vs Georger Foreman of professional wrestling if you weel. Sid goes over with The Powerbomb.

 

Next The Total Package Vs Vampiro. Vampiro comes thisclose to edging out the win but Luger manages to squeeze out the victory through nefarious means. The announcers crow about how Vampiro should have won, the wrong man advanced, etc.

 

Then we get Chris Benoit Vs Booker T. The most competitive match of the first round with Booker barely going over cleanly. After, the two men shake hands.

 

Diamond Dallas Page Vs Buff Bagwell would be pretty much the same match they had at Souled Out 2000 albeit slightly truncated. DDP picks up the win in a screwy finish involving Kimberly.

 

So with that the semi-finals are;

4. Diamond Dallas Page Vs 8. Booker T

2. Sid Vs 3. The Total Package

 

Sid goes over Lex Luger easily in under a minute. Sid manages to catch Luger off guard during his elaborate entrance and quickly dispatches him with the Chokeslam and Powerbomb

 

Booker T and DDP have a relatively short (six or seven minutes) but extremely competitive match. Booker wins by the skin of his teeth but during the process of the match, he gets injured.

 

There'll be a backstage vignette where a doctor warns Booker not to compete and he could be risking his career, yada, yada, yada but Booker won't have any of it and he wants to compete in the biggest match of his career. The doctor doesn't know if he'll be able to clear Booker medically.

 

The announcers discuss the final. They bring up Booker T and Sid's history how Sid helped bring Booker T into the company seven years before. They put over the fact that Booker's been with the company longer than almost anybody and how he's been a loyal WCW employee through and through and how he's slowly worked his way up the rankings and finally earned his World title shot in the most difficult way imaginable.

 

So Sid comes to the ring first and everyone is still unsure whether Booker T. Terry Funk comes out and tells Sid that the match may be a forfeit and he may have to award the title to Sid. Sid won't have any of it though and he doesn't want to win the title without a fight. He tells Funk that he'll take personal responsibility for the punishment he inflicts on Booker. Sid's no wordsmith but ideally, this promo would be simultaneously noble and vaguely heelish.

 

Finally, Booker T comes limping out from the back.So the match starts and for the first half of the match, Sid dominates and is unleashing all of his arsenal on Booker. Just brutalizing him. But somehow, Booker is incredibly resillient and just can't be put away. Sid becomes incredibly frustrated and that frustration starts leading to mistakes. Slowly, Booker T starts getting more and more offense. Sid becomes even more frustrated and starts resorting to heelish tactics (Throwing him into the ringsteps, into the ringside barricade, chokeslamming him on the floor, what have you) but he still can't manage to put Booker away.

 

Sid manages to hit Booker T with the Powerbomb but Booker with his last ounce of strength puts his foot on the ropes at the 2.99999999999 mark.At this point, Sid is exhausted as well but Booker's running on fumes. Sid dishes out some more punishment and Booker's nearly defenseless at this point after the powerbomb. Sid throws him into the turnbuckle and goes for a running clothesline but Booker somehow manages to get out of the way and Sid eats turnbuckle. Booker T manages to summon something within to hit The Bookend on Sid out of nowhere and he gets the pin.

 

All of the mid-card babyfaces come out and congratulate Booker. Booker holds up The WCW World title and collapses in exhaustion. Booker gets taken out on a stretcher, still holding the WCW World title in his hands.When Sid comes to his senses, he beats up the referee. I know he had just done a face turn like a month before but I like Sid way better as a heel. Besides, it's a reboot anyways so it doesn't really matter.

Then you proceed to do a Bret Hart type reign with Booker T. After having him out with the injury for a week or two, I'd have him win competitive matches against mid-carders every week on Nitro and Thunder, leading up to a rematch with Sid at SuperBrawl X.

 

Anyways, I think it's more interesting and intelligent way to crown a new champion and a better way to make Booker T a star than what they did a couple of months later at Bash At The Beach.

 

Again, all feedback on my idea is welcome.

[cabbageboy 0]

Well, that idea is certainly better than the fiasco of a debacle wrapped in a nightmare that WCW ended up booking. Are you factoring into this the whole notion of guys wanting their release?

 

The sad irony is that I think what WCW ended up doing wasn't even all that bad given the circumstances (Benoit vs. Sid with Benoit winning), but my head spins when I think about WCW putting the belt on a guy who quite literally asked for his release the day of the show.

 

Who would actually put a world title on a guy that wanted his release? Who would release a guy that had the world title? To this day I still wonder what Busch was thinking. Seriously (to play armchair GM/President) if Benoit and Co. had come to me demanding their releases I would have said "Chris, you have the world title, we're not going to bury you or anything like that. The rest of you? Go out and do your fucking job or you're in breach of contract." Of course, if I'm the President of WCW I wouldn't have named Sullivan my head booker in the first place. Let's review these golden decisions:

 

1. Remove Russo as booker over him wanting to put the belt on Tank Abbott. A bit excessive, could have just told Russo to do someething else, but we'll go with that.

2. Name KEVIN SULLIVAN the head booker, despite the fact that anyone under 40 in the back hates his guts, including the guy you want to put the title on.

3. When a mutiny predictably ensues, instead of backing off on the Sullivan crap you stick with Sullivan and actually release 4 of your top wrestlers, and a few other guys like Konnan and Douglas as well (who didn't sign the form). Don't just ignore their protest and tell them to go to work. Didn't just send them home for a while to cool off but kept them under contract. But no, actually releasing 4 guys so that they could show up next week on Raw. Bravo!

 

 

[King Kamala 0]

Well, that idea is certainly better than the fiasco of a debacle wrapped in a nightmare that WCW ended up booking. Are you factoring into this the whole notion of guys wanting their release?

 

 

Yeah, I factored in the notion of guys wanting their release and the guys who were out with injuries at the time (Jarrett, Scott Hall). I don't think any of the guys in my tournament asked for a release except for Benoit and he jobbed in the quarterfinals.

 

I'm not sure I follow what you're saying, cabbage. You say Sid Vs Benoit isn't all that bad of an idea given the circumstances but then you spend the next paragraph talking about why it's a bad idea. Now was Kevin Sullivan the booker going into Souled Out 2000? Did Benoit request his release before the show?

[cabbageboy 0]

Oh what I meant was that Benoit beating Sid for the belt was about the best thing they could have done in the situation since Benoit had been built up to that level via his Bret matches and was seen as a contender. Booker in early 2000? Nah.

 

Kamala, allow me to go into more detail on the debacle known as WCW in Jan. 2000. The week before the Souled Out PPV Bret Hart had to forfeit the world title due to his career ending concussion. At the same time Jarrett briefly relinquished the US belt due to Jimmy Snuka (of all people) giving HIM a concussion with the Superfly Splash from the top of a cage on Nitro. Jarrett would be okay and get that belt back soon after, but he was scheduled for a best of 3 series with Benoit at Souled Out so the damage was done for that PPV.

 

Russo had to come up with something, so he suggested to Bill Busch that TANK ABBOTT should win a battle royale at the PPV to become the new world champion. Who knows if Russo was serious about pushing Abbott with the belt for any length of time, but Busch freaked out and removed Russo as booker, or at least demoted him to a committee and Russo said "piss off" and went home. Sullivan was promoted to head booker the week of the PPV.

 

Here's where it gets truly insane. The day of the PPV about a dozen guys (among them the Radicals, Douglas, Kidman, Rey, Konnan, etc.) basically stage a mutiny and go to Bill Busch and refuse to work under Sullivan's new regime. The kicker is that Sullivan was in fact going to put the belt on Benoit and vowed to give him a real run with the belt and not just job him for personal reasons relating to Nancy. We'll never know if he was serious about that. Either way Benoit refused to work with Sullivan and everyone wanted their release. Amazingly enough they actually went through with the Benoit/Sid match despite Benoit threatening to walk, hoping he would simply change his mind and stay. He didn't. The next day he got into a heated argument with Busch and Busch sent him home along with Saturn, Malenko, Eddie, etc. That's why we got the whole Arn announcement on Nitro the next night declaring the title vacant....Benoit had walked.

 

About a week later Busch said the hell with it and actually released Benoit, Guerrero, Malenko, Saturn, Douglas, and Konnan. The WWF wanted no part of the last 2, so they ended up staying in WCW anyway, but obviously the first 4 left at the drop of a hat and went to the WWF.

 

So yes, Sullivan was in fact just barely in charge before Souled Out 2000, and Benoit did in fact demand his release the very day they put the belt on him. Why on earth they didn't just job him to Sid there I have no idea, at least then they could send him packing with a loss. In the end they had him beat Sid for the belt, then stripped Benoit of the title and released him, and then expected anyone to care about Sid when they DID put the belt on him.

[King Kamala 0]

See I think you're wrong RE: Booker. Was Booker seen as a contender in early 2000? No, you're probably right but like Vampiro, I think the fans were willing to buy into Booker being a main eventer given the proper buildup (IE NOT randomly putting him in a WCW World title match ala Bash at The Beach 2000). In fact, the WCW fans did sort of buy into Booker T's surprised WCW World title run if only because of the sheer randomness of it, they didn't fully realize the potential of it. And Booker was no worse off in January 2000 than he was in July. In fact, he was probably better off since he hadn't completely undergone that awful feud over the letter "T" and the insipid G.I. Bro gimmick was months away. Was Booker really more of a contender in July of '00 than he was in January?

 

Even though my scenario would be kind of rushed, it's certainly less hasty than what was presented six months later. Booker slowly gains momentum through out the night and the announcers could hype up him having the night of his career. He's captializing on his opponent's mistakes at the right time and he makes it through the night with a combination of luck, ring smarts, and sheer determination. I think by the end of the Sid match in the scenario I presented, the audience would buy into him as WCW's newest main eventer.

 

He'd certainly be a better option than a departing Benoit and he'd be a way better option than Sid. Sid's a fine transition champion but what WCW needed that night was a man who could carry the torch and represent what was supposed to be a new era in the company. I think Booker could have been that man. You could talk about his troubled youth, how he found an outlet for his anger and a way to get himself and his brother out of the projects through wrestling, the years he spent working his way up his the rankings (The Tag Team, The Television), and his struggle to break into WCW's upper echelon. Play him up as the ultimate underdog and company man who reached the top in momentous fashion.

 

Does someone have to be an established contender before hand to win a World title? More often than not. But in rare exceptions it does work. Was Bret Hart an established threat to the WWF World title in September '92? CM Punk had The Money In The Bank but did anybody see him winning the World title in a matter of weeks when he was jobbing to The Miz a little bit back?

 

And besides,with my scenario, The SuperBrawl X print advertisements would make sense!

[cabbageboy 0]

I think we're actually discussing things on two different levels: 1. What we would have done in a sane world. 2. What happened in the madness known as WCW.

 

I agree that Booker could have been an effective main eventer, but it needed buildup. Benoit had been built a bit as a world title contender and as such was a more viable champ in early 2000. I'm talking in a world where Benoit isn't demanding his release. Obviously in the world where he DID demand his release they should have never put the belt on him.

 

Ideally what they could have done is put the belt on Benoit, then elevate Booker into a title feud with Benoit playing off their TV title Best of 7 series.

[DarKnight 0]

Superbrawl X might be the worst PPV EVER! I know I'm not the first to say that, but look at how pathetic that card is. This sounds really scary, but if Tank Abbot actually got the belt, does that mean the match with Big Al would have been the main event?

[PILLS! PILLS! PILLS! 0]

Superbrawl X might be the worst PPV EVER! I know I'm not the first to say that, but look at how pathetic that card is. This sounds really scary, but if Tank Abbot actually got the belt, does that mean the match with Big Al would have been the main event?

 

It means that Big Al would had been left off the card entirely.

[DarKnight 0]

I wonder what was the point of them bringing in Al? It's like WCW during the awful summer of 99 and early 2000 was trying to test the fans' sanity. To see if they can actually survive watching that shit. I guess the answer was no.

[BruteSquad_BRODY 0]

Wasn't Big Al just a WCW job guy from the Mutha~ship anyway?