NFL Week 13

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Because he has Randy Moss, Wes Welker and co? I mean, this is the same team Tom Brady was scorching the earth with last year, before New York decided enough was enough. That set aside, it's the LOGIC that Matt Ryan needs to prove himself before you'd put him on the list, when Matt Cassel is in almost the same boat himself, that I'm questioning.

 

Also I'd like to point out that by this logic, Tom Brady himself hasn't proven himself capable, because he has not had 400 yards passing back to back. Neither has Peyton.

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season? Miami

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season? This is tough, in fact there may not be that many teams wild about signing him. He might end up like Culpepper, sitting around until the phone rings. I'll say Miami in the end.

Haha, what? Pennington was signed for 2 years, and I'm guessing the plan is to turn it over to Chad Henne afterwards. Why would Miami want to bring on McNabb?

[JaMarcus Russell's #1 Caucasian Fan 0]

Having Moss, Welker and co. at your disposal doesn't equate to automatic success in my book. Plus the Patriots this year aren't the same team Tom Brady had last year thanks to injuries, key players leaving etc. And in my eyes, Matt Cassel as proven himself to be a good quarterback in the brief time he has led the Patriots. I mean Matt Cassel had to follow Tom Brady and perform well on team that expected to go back to the Super Bowl again, while Matt Ryan, who is have a nice season as well, is leading a team that was expected to be rebuilding and has come out of nowhere. I don't think you plug Matt Ryan into the Patriots and expect him to have as pretty good of a season as Matt Cassel. Comparing the pressures of following one of the best quarterbacks in history and leading a team that is Super Bowl or bust and the pressures of being a rookie quaterback on a rebuilding team that Matt Ryan came into the league with, then yes I would take Matt Cassel over Matt Ryan.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Ok, that's a fair point. But Cassel is 26/27 (not sure which). Ryan is only 23. Who's not to say that when Ryan's Cassel's age, he'd be even better, and in fact, a legitimate star on his own? And don't forget, the Falcons are Ryan's team to keep for the long term. It's not like Michael Vick will waltz back in and take the job. The very second that light flashes green in the New England trainer' room, Cassel's on the bench.

[Cartman 0]

Because he has Randy Moss, Wes Welker and co? I mean, this is the same team Tom Brady was scorching the earth with last year, before New York decided enough was enough. That set aside, it's the LOGIC that Matt Ryan needs to prove himself before you'd put him on the list, when Matt Cassel is in almost the same boat himself, that I'm questioning.

 

...and Ryan has White, who is among the best WR's in the league, along with Turner who is infinitely better than any RB's the Pats have.

[JaMarcus Russell's #1 Caucasian Fan 0]

Well the question was which 10 quarterbacks I would take right now over Matt Ryan, and based on right now I would take Matt Cassel. Matt Ryan is an expectational rookie quarterback and there is no doubt he has the chance to surpass Matt Cassel and a bunch of others in time and be the quarterback in the NFL. But, before we go gaga over him, I want see him repeat and build this season next season. Matt Cassel is in the same boat, but at 27, I trust his maturity a little more than a 23-24 year old.

[Guest Czecherbear]

The successes of all quarterbacks and wide receivers are functions of one another and the offensive line. Moving on...

[HarleyQuinn 0]

Also Cassel threw the ball a ton to reach those 400 yards... He had 51 and 43 pass attempts the last two games (numbers Brady was hitting weekly it seemed last season). Brady hit yard totals of 388, 373, 380, and 399 last year and that was with him being benched in the early 4th quarter of almost all his games. He easily could've clipped 400 yards if Belichick gave him the green to play the whole game.

 

Here are the "rookie" number comparisons at this point

Matt Cassel: 238/359 for 2615 with 13 vs. 8. 53 carries for 199 yards and 2 TD.

Matt Ryan: 186/310 for 2418 with 11 vs. 6. 34 carries for 74 yards and 0 TD.

Joe Flacco: 183/302 for 1996 with 10 vs. 9. 40 carries for 145 yards and 2 TD.

 

One thing I want to point out is that Cassel, as great as he's been, has also been really lucky as of late. There've been several throws that should've been picked off but were dropped so his interception totals could easily be around 10 or 11 rather than 8 right now. Also IIRC the announcers during the Pats/Dolphins game made the mention that the Patriots have run the most plays (pass and run) out of the shotgun formation in comparison to any other team in the NFL so that's also helped with Cassel's gaudy 400+ yard stats.

 

 

[cabbageboy 0]

Getting back to McNabb for a minute, I was purely guessing Miami. I don't think he will have people begging him to grace their franchise with his presence though. He does remind me of Culpepper in a lot of ways, with his history of injuries and now looking essentially washed up. With McNabb also add in people now questioning his QB acumen due to the OT fiasco vs. the Bengals (not knowing a game can be a tie, etc.).

 

If Pennington or Henne is the Miami QB of the future, McNabb won't go there. Do the Raiders bother with him, or do they stick with JaMarcus Russell? The Chiefs? They have Tyler Thigpen, who actually has put up some nice numbers. Kyle Orton has played well for the Bears, would they really want a burnt out McNabb?

 

As far as the Ryan vs. Flacco debate goes, there really isn't one. Joe Flacco is in the typical Ravens QB role of "Don't screw this up, let the defense do most of the work." And a few times Flacco has been laughably bad, like the game with the Colts where he was horrid. From Day 1 Matt Ryan has looked like a legit NFL QB, and took over a team that was complete garbage to boot.

[CanadianGuitarist 0]

1. How do you feel about the Dallas/Detroit tradition? How would you change it, if at all?

I have no problem with it. The flex scheduling during Sunday night seems a little ridiculous, and with all the surprising play of six or seven teams, I'm fine with continuing tradition.

2. Are there ten QBs in the league -right now- that you would take over Matt Ryan? If so, who? If not, does that blow your mind? Where do you rate him?

Ten? Probably not. Let's see: Brady and Romo all get exemptions. Both Mannings, Favre, Brees. Warner and Collins are having MVP-calibre seasons. What's that, eight? Ryan's ninth. It's surprising, but not mind-boggling, given the injuries and starting inconsistencies around the league.

3. Who is the best player in the AFC west? Cutler, for now.

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season? I can't explain it, but NFC North.

5. Why does Seattle suck so bad? It can't all be Hasselback, but I really don't know.

[the pinjockey 0]

If they keep Childress, I think McNabb ends up in Minnesota. Let's them draft a QB this year to groom and McNabb can get them through the next year or two.

[Guest Vitamin X]

Judging by this thread and the last NFL thread, I can see it's Porter's time of the month again. Rawr.

 

Let's make the Thanksgiving discussion the focus of this week's Five Question Footlong

 

1. How do you feel about the Dallas/Detroit tradition? How would you change it, if at all?

2. Are there ten QBs in the league -right now- that you would take over Matt Ryan? If so, who? If not, does that blow your mind? Where do you rate him?

3. Who is the best player in the AFC west?

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season?

5. Why does Seattle suck so bad?

 

1. I agree with Kinetic; just blow the whole thing up and feature a couple of good games instead. Rather than this whole NFL Network b.s., it'd be great if we could schedule a couple good games or rivalries on this day- for example, it'd be an awesome day to have Cowboys/Redskins, Bears/Packers, and Raiders/Chiefs, something like that. What better way to express family togetherness than bitter hatred for another team?

2. Probably not. He's been a hell of a player for the Falcons, and there just aren't a lot of good quarterbacks in the league these days. I don't even know if I'd take Rodgers over Ryan, and I've liked how Aaron's done so far for Green Bay.

3. Yeah, I don't know much about this division. I'm going to go with Jay Cutler, because I always liked him.

4. Anywhere in the NFC North that's not Green Bay, just so he can torment the Packers twice a year. No matter how terrible he's playing, he always does well against Green Bay (last year's result aside).

5. They were down to their fifth string receiver for much of the year, and Hasselbeck's been out for a long time. The defense has also been playing really, really bad- particularly against the run, but the secondary is getting shredded too- and their leading running back is Julius Jones. The only part of the team that seems like it's playing alright is the offensive line, but this team needs to go into full out rebuilding mode.

[JaMarcus Russell's #1 Caucasian Fan 0]

Getting back to McNabb for a minute, I was purely guessing Miami. I don't think he will have people begging him to grace their franchise with his presence though. He does remind me of Culpepper in a lot of ways, with his history of injuries and now looking essentially washed up. With McNabb also add in people now questioning his QB acumen due to the OT fiasco vs. the Bengals (not knowing a game can be a tie, etc.).

 

If Pennington or Henne is the Miami QB of the future, McNabb won't go there. Do the Raiders bother with him, or do they stick with JaMarcus Russell? The Chiefs? They have Tyler Thigpen, who actually has put up some nice numbers. Kyle Orton has played well for the Bears, would they really want a burnt out McNabb?

 

The Raiders are not going to sign Donavan McNabb to start because they have too much money invested in JaMarcus Russell for him not to start. I'd like to see where is Russell next year where there is hopefully (fat fucking chance) not as many distractions as there is this year and a little more talent on offense. I wouldn't be surprised to see Michael Vick in silver and black in two years.

 

I see McNabb going to either Chicago which is his hometown or the Vikings where their quarterback of the future flopped. I don't see Parcells in Miami particularly interested in McNabb and I don't think the Chiefs want to mess with Tyler Thigpen too much. The only places where I could see McNabb that are not the Bears or Vikings are places where they have no quarterbacks or looking for a veteran to play well during a rebuilding process like the Lions or 49ers.

[Guest Czecherbear]

McNabb ain't coming cheap. You think the McCaskeys are going to pay for old expensive declining McNabb when they can just stick with the neckbearded folk hero?

[Just John 0]

1. How do you feel about the Dallas/Detroit tradition? How would you change it, if at all?

 

The only thing I'd change is mandatory throwbacks. I don't care how shitty the games are if the teams play them in some sweet old-school unis. They did this for a few years, but they stopped for some reason, and the games seem a lot less interesting. Come on, how pumped would you be for TEN/DET if you knew the Titans were going to bust out the old Oilers powder blue unis?

 

2. Are there ten QBs in the league -right now- that you would take over Matt Ryan? If so, who? If not, does that blow your mind? Where do you rate him?

 

I agree with the consensus that he's lower top 10 at this point, which is great for a rookie. Brady, the Manning bros, Roethlisberger, Rivers, and Brees are the only guys who strike me as decidedly better overall. Favre and Warner are having nice years, so they might go over Ryan for now, but I wouldn't take them over Ryan long-term.

 

3. Who is the best player in the AFC west?

 

Nnamdi Asomugha shuts down half the field for Oakland. He leads the defense that keeps the Raiders in the game long enough for their offense to piss it away. Philip Rivers is very quietly having an excellent year despite some rough losses and LT providing very little compared to previous years. If the Chiefs had a decent QB, Gonzalez might be in consideration as well, given how he's played despite his terrible team.

 

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season?

 

Probably somewhere in the NFC North. I would've thought Detroit before they signed Culpepper, but Chicago and Minnesota are two very realistic possibilities. There's an outside shot of him going to KC, but that's been looking less likely since it appears Thigpen could be a serviceable QB for them in the future, and they have more pressing needs like an O-Line and WRs.

 

5. Why does Seattle suck so bad?

 

All their good players getting old, injured, or leaving.

[MFer 0]

1. How do you feel about the Dallas/Detroit tradition? How would you change it, if at all? I don't really care either way. Of course I'd like to see the Lions keep their game since it's basically all they've got, but at some point the outcries will become too great and they'll get that taken away too. I do agree with making the Cowboys and Lions playing rivalry teams if they stay on.

 

2. Are there ten QBs in the league -right now- that you would take over Matt Ryan? If so, who? If not, does that blow your mind? Where do you rate him? No. I'd have Ryan somewhere in that 8-10 range-kinda depends on who's healthy or not. It's not shocking to me that he's already in the top 10, he has a good support system around him and there aren't a lot of great QB's in the NFL these days.

 

3. Who is the best player in the AFC west? Right now, I'll go with Rivers. Leads the NFL in passer rating with LT having a down year and not having any elite receivers (not counting Gates).

 

4. Where does Donovan McNabb play next season? I'll say Minnesota. I would say Chicago but they seem to be fine with Orton at the moment.

 

5. Why does Seattle suck so bad? Besides Hasselbeck and numerous WR's getting hurt, I don't know. The lame-duck coaching situtaion doesn't help, but I thought they'd still be good enough. The run game has been respectable with Morris and Jones averaging 5.2 and 4.5 YPC respectively. Maybe I'm overrating their talent, but I thought Seattle had quite a few talented players on defense. Guess not.

[Kinetic 0]

The consensus seems to be that there's a dearth of quality quarterback play in the NFL, yet we can't seem to think of a lot of possible destinations for McNabb. The teams that currently need a QB or will soon: St. Louis, San Francisco, Minnesota, Detroit, Tampa Bay, Carolina, New York Jets. Those are probably the only teams that will be in the market for a QB this offseason. I would imagine that Matt Cassel and not Donovan McNabb will garner the most attention from potential suitors. If you assume that Derek Anderson will also be available and throw in a potential rush of college juniors trying to get into the NFL before Goodell changes the way rookies are paid, things could potentially get pretty dicey for McNabb.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Yeah if Chicago signs McNabb, it's to back up, and he'll be too expensive for that role.

[JaMarcus Russell's #1 Caucasian Fan 0]

I don't follow that one Porter. If Chicago signs McNabb, I can't imagine him not starting. Are the Bears that high on Orton now?

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

I don't follow that one Porter. If Chicago signs McNabb, I can't imagine him not starting. Are the Bears that high on Orton now?

 

Bears? Yes. Chicago the city? Yes. Lovie Smith? No.

[Kinetic 0]

Orton has been fine this year. The Bears have plenty of other areas to address, so giving a bunch of money to a guy like McNabb wouldn't make much sense. That's not to say that they won't do it, only that they shouldn't.

 

Typing out that list up there has further convinced me that Tampa is going to make a run at McNabb and might not have a lot of trouble getting him.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Bears need a lot of help in many areas. I'd rather stick with Orton for at least one more year, and if nothing works out next season, we'd be in a semi-decent position to grab one of the better quarterbacks out there in the draft, like Colt McCoy or Sam Bradford. (Not including Tebow because I don't think we'll be so bad we're in top 3 picking in 2010)

[Guest Vitamin X]

Donovan McNabb can be like the new Kordell Stewart for Chicago!

[Guest Czecherbear]

I don't follow that one Porter. If Chicago signs McNabb, I can't imagine him not starting. Are the Bears that high on Orton now?

 

Bears? Yes. Chicago the city? Yes. Lovie Smith? No.

Lovie gave Orton, not Rex, the starting job after a Fake Quarterback Competition, so I think he'd rather go with the improving Orton than the proven (bad) commodity in Rex. If anyone's high on Grossman, it's Angelo, who doesn't like to see his top draft picks flop. Long story short, you're right, McNabb in Chicago isn't viable.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

It just seemed to me in 2007 Lovie just kept wanting reasons to go back to Rex Grossman. Maybe he's starting to get it in terms of who he should really go with, or NOT go with, rather. But he was just as pro-Grossman as anyone at one point.

[Kinetic 0]

Hey, Rex is going to be another guy out there on the market. If David Carr and Joey Harrington can get chance after chance after chance, then surely someone will pick up Sexy Rexy and make him a backup. Leftwich might have earned another look, too. It's going to be a crowded free agent market at QB next year, I think.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

And don't laugh, but if Rex lands anywhere that has a decent line and good receivers, you can expect him to break out. Of course, you'll have to accept the 10-20 picks per year as well.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

As far as the Ryan vs. Flacco debate goes, there really isn't one. Joe Flacco is in the typical Ravens QB role of "Don't screw this up, let the defense do most of the work." And a few times Flacco has been laughably bad, like the game with the Colts where he was horrid. From Day 1 Matt Ryan has looked like a legit NFL QB, and took over a team that was complete garbage to boot.

 

Joe Flacco is on pace to have the 2nd best season for a QB statistically in the history of the Ravens franchise. No way he passes Testeverde's 1996 season of 4177 yards and 33 TDs (though he did throw 19 ints and led to a whopping 4-12 record). McNair's 06 (3050 yards 16td/12int) and Grbac's 2001 (3033 15/18 in 14 games) are pretty much within Flacco's reach right now with 5 games to go at 1996 and 10/9. The Ravens have only had 3 QB's play all 16 games (Testeverde 96, Boller 04 and McNair 06).

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Pretty sure with the Falcons' weak history of quarterbacking, Matt Ryan's probably having as tremendous a season as any of the former Falcons has had, except MAYBE Chris Chandler in that Super Bowl run.

 

[edit: actually looking at the Falcons list, the only guy Matt Ryan doesn't stand a chance of catching is Jeff George in 1995. Everyone else is in reach]

[Kinetic 0]

Tennessee @ Detroit

 

This one probably won't be close. Tennessee by four touchdowns.

 

Seattle @ Dallas

 

Ditto this game. Dallas will look like they're righting the ship until they play a real team. Cowboys by 21.

 

Arizona @ Philly

 

Sort of interesting, as Arizona is largely unproven and Philly is decent but in turmoil. With all that's gone on in the past two weeks, I doubt that the Eagles will be able get it together. Cards by 7.

 

San Francisco @ Buffalo

 

They're all must-wins for Buffalo at this point, and they shouldn't have too much of a problem at home against a nothing San Fran team. Buffalo by 13.

 

Carolina @ Green Bay

 

Both teams are coming off of bad losses. Green Bay's secondary will forget to cover Steve Smith a couple of times and pay dearly. Panthers by 10.

 

Giants @ Washington

 

The Giants are red hot! The Redskins are red skinned! Hawt NFC East Action! It's totally possible that Washington wins this game, but I wouldn't favor anyone in the league to beat New York right now. Giants by 10.

 

Colts @ Browns

 

Should be a pretty easy one for the Colts. Cleveland has pretty much packed it in at this point. Colts by 17.

 

Ravens @ Bengals

 

Same here. The Ravens have the look of a mildly dangerous wild card team. Not the sort of team that could beat a higher-seeded team in the playoffs, but probably the kind of team that could injure the quarterback of a higher-seeded team. Baltimore by 21.

 

Miami @ St. Louis

 

No problem for the mighty Dolphins here. They'll win by 20.

 

Saints @ Bucs

 

On the hallowed grounds of storied Raymond James Stadium, the noble Buccaneerss will avenge their week one loss against the hated Saints. Brees will be intercepted at least twice. Jeff Garcia will throw for over 300 yards. Bucs by 13.

 

Atlanta @ San Diego

 

Another opportunity for Atlanta to prove that they're "for real," albeit against a team with a losing record. I don't think they'll do it. San Diego by 3.

 

Pittsburgh @ New England

 

Really good matchup here. I think Cassel spend a lot of time on his ass, Pittsburgh will rediscover their running game, and the Steelers will win by 9.

 

KC @ Oakland

 

Oakland's miracle run to the playoffs continues! Raiders by 3.

 

Denver @ Jets

 

Tough game for a Denver team reeling from an embarrassing loss last week. The Jets are "for real," y'all. New York by 13.

 

Chicago @ Minnesota

 

Should go a long way toward deciding the NFC North, as I think Green Bay is about done. I still like the Bears to come out on top of that division, so I guess I'll have to pick them here by 6.

 

Jacksonville @ Houston

 

Yeesh. Another bad Monday night game. Both teams are a bit of a mess right now. Jacksonville by 10, I guess.