Guest Report post Posted January 22, 2009 Time to move the discussion into different areas. This'll be for executive orders. Create threads for the other things as they come along. http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/22/gua...rder/index.html WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President Barack Obama issued four executive orders Thursday to demonstrate a clean break from the Bush administration on the war on terror, including one requiring that the U.S. military detention facility at Guantanamo Bay be closed within a year. A second executive order formally bans torture by requiring that the Army field manual be used as the guide for terror interrogations. The order essentially ends the Bush administration's CIA program of enhanced interrogation methods. A third executive order establishes an interagency task force to lead a systematic review of detention policies and procedures and a review of all individual cases. A fourth executive order delays the trial of Ali al-Marri, a legal U.S. resident who has been contesting his detention for more than five years as an enemy combatant in a military brig without the government bringing any charges against him. The detention facility at Guantanamo Bay became a lightning rod for critics who charged that the Bush administration had used torture on terror detainees. President George W. Bush and other senior officials repeatedly denied that the U.S. government had used torture to extract intelligence from terror suspects. Obama's move will set off a fierce legal struggle over where the prison's detainees will go next. Officials said new White House Counsel Greg Craig briefed congressional Republicans Wednesday afternoon about the three upcoming executive orders "The key question is where do you put these terrorists," House Minority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, said in a statement issued Wednesday. "Do you bring them inside our borders? Do you release them back into the battlefield?" Rep. Bill Young of Florida, the top Republican on the Defense Appropriations Committee, said Wednesday the executive orders "will leave some wiggle room for the administration." Young said he has "quite a bit of anxiety" about transferring detainees to United States facilities. "Number one, they're dangerous," he said. "Secondly, once they become present in the United States, what is their legal status? What is their constitutional status? I worry about that, because I don't want them to have the same constitutional rights that you and I have. They're our enemy." He said he asked Craig what the government plans to do with two recently built facilities at Guantanamo, which he said cost $500 million. He said Craig had no answer, but pledged to discuss the issue further. Young said he suggested reopening Alcatraz, the closed federal prison on an island outside San Francisco, California -- in Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's district. "Put them in Alcatraz, where supposedly they can't escape from," Young said, but added the suggestion "didn't go over well." The revelation coincided with a judge's decision on Wednesday to halt the September 11 terrorism cases at the behest of President Obama. On Tuesday, he directed Defense Secretary Robert Gates to ask prosecutors to seek stays for 120 days so terrorism cases at the facility can be reviewed, according to a military official close to the proceedings. I don't care where they go, but they don't belong here. Send them back where they came from. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Ghost of bps21 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 "A second executive order formally bans torture by requiring that the Army field manual be used as the guide for terror interrogations. The order essentially ends the Bush administration's CIA program of enhanced interrogation methods" It annoys me that we had to have an exectuive order to tell people to do things legally and literally by the book. ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cheech Tremendous 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 I am so glad that they are closing Guantanamo Bay. It'll be interesting to see what the decide to do with those detainees though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 Excellent start. Fuck that place and "enhanced interrogation." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brett Favre 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 Excellent start. Fuck that place and "enhanced interrogation." They used juiced up interrogators? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 They're actually in 1080p. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Obi Chris Kenobi 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 These are sensible EOrders, however, what's the bet that Guantanamo Bay not closed within a year due to red tape and people dragging their heels? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted January 22, 2009 There are three possible scenarios... 1. Doesn't close. Least likely. 2. Most prisoners don't get sent back to their home country because their home country won't take them. As such, even before trial, they get sent to SuperMax in Florence, Colorado. Some will get tried and convicted. They'll stay there. The rest won't get tried, but nobody will take them. Then it'll turn into a mess. Maybe. 3. We pay countries to take the prisoners. Most likely. We've done it before. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Art Sandusky 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 I think it's funny that Republican legislators act like those who are being held are all Lex Luthor and will somehow find a way out of whatever facility they're kept in. Are you guys REALLY that worried? Also consider that if there were an escapee (haven't had one yet), every redneck asshole with so much as a slingshot would be roaming the streets in hope of killing one o' them damn towelheads. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Obi Chris Kenobi 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 There are three possible scenarios... 1. Doesn't close. Least likely. 2. Most prisoners don't get sent back to their home country because their home country won't take them. As such, even before trial, they get sent to SuperMax in Florence, Colorado. Some will get tried and convicted. They'll stay there. The rest won't get tried, but nobody will take them. Then it'll turn into a mess. Maybe. 3. We pay countries to take the prisoners. Most likely. We've done it before. The ultimate fail would be they release them, back to wherever/whoever, and they're found plotting terrorist acts in the future against anyone else. I guess that's the power play, those who were in charge held over anyone who was for releasing them. Out of interest which Countries would take the money from you for Alleged terrorists? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruteSquad_BRODY 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 I am so glad that they are closing Guantanamo Bay. It'll be interesting to see what the decide to do with those detainees though. Arm them and release them in New York. Follow them with cameras. Then bring in Dog, Chuck Norris and 10 other bounty hunters to cap them one by one. Running Man 2010 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJerk 0 Report post Posted January 22, 2009 2. Most prisoners don't get sent back to their home country because their home country won't take them. As such, even before trial, they get sent to SuperMax in Florence, Colorado. Some will get tried and convicted. They'll stay there. The rest won't get tried, but nobody will take them. Then it'll turn into a mess. Maybe. 3. We pay countries to take the prisoners. Most likely. We've done it before. Either of those is preferrable to keeping them in a legal limbo with no chance of proving their innocence. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarvinisaLunatic 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 I think it's funny that Republican legislators act like those who are being held are all Lex Luthor and will somehow find a way out of whatever facility they're kept in. Are you guys REALLY that worried? Also consider that if there were an escapee (haven't had one yet), every redneck asshole with so much as a slingshot would be roaming the streets in hope of killing one o' them damn towelheads. Terrorists took down the World Trade Center. Do you not think they could take down some silly prison to break them out if they wanted (which would be more likely than the prisoners themselves escaping on their own)? Really far fetched but so is taking two planes and knocking down 2 skyscrapers. I like the idea of sticking them on Alcatraz, but you just know Nancy Pelosi woiuldn't like that one bit. They should take some of Obama's infrastructure stimulus and rebuild Alcatraz. Tons of jobs and construction work for the fine people of SF, how could she argue with that? John Murtha says he'd take them in his district but he only has a minimum security prison in his district so he's talking out his ass because they'll never send them to a minimum security prison. The most rediculous part of this whole thing is that they set a date and don't have a clue how they're going to meet that date yet which is why I say GB wont be closed in a year. I dont think there is any country that would dumb enough to take them even if we paid them a ton of money, and it would be very likely that if that did happen, they would be put somewhere that is way less secure than even one of our minimum security problems ("Hey, they dont want to kill us, why should we care if they escape, we got the United States' Money! Suckers.") I also found it hillarious that President Obama didn't know the complete details about his own EO's, he had to have help from Greg Craig to explain them, and then he basically just repeated what he said. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruteSquad_BRODY 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 The planes didn't take down the WTC Marvin. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob_barron 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 The planes didn't take down the WTC Marvin. What did, Brody? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
garfieldsnose 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted January 23, 2009 I split this post off I don't think this is the right thread for this, but all the other Obama threads got closed. What's with all the conservative media folk always saying, well I'll give you an example from today: "Obama said he was going to raise taxes, and now that he's in office it looks like he's changing his stance on that!" - Some bitch that reminded me of Leena. I didn't follow the election too closely, but I still heard Obama say more than once that he was going to LOWER taxes for anyone making under (500 or 200k a year?)... Anyways, for anyone making under some high amount that nobody I know makes anyways. So where are they getting he said he'll raise taxes from? Are they just skewing that he'd raise taxes for the richies? to here http://forums.thesmartmarks.com/index.php?showtopic=93629 Keep this as it's titled, plz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Art Sandusky 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 I think it's funny that Republican legislators act like those who are being held are all Lex Luthor and will somehow find a way out of whatever facility they're kept in. Are you guys REALLY that worried? Also consider that if there were an escapee (haven't had one yet), every redneck asshole with so much as a slingshot would be roaming the streets in hope of killing one o' them damn towelheads.Terrorists took down the World Trade Center. Do you not think they could take down some silly prison to break them out if they wanted (which would be more likely than the prisoners themselves escaping on their own)? Really far fetched but so is taking two planes and knocking down 2 skyscrapers. I like the idea of sticking them on Alcatraz, but you just know Nancy Pelosi woiuldn't like that one bit. They should take some of Obama's infrastructure stimulus and rebuild Alcatraz. Tons of jobs and construction work for the fine people of SF, how could she argue with that? John Murtha says he'd take them in his district but he only has a minimum security prison in his district so he's talking out his ass because they'll never send them to a minimum security prison. Keeping them at Alcatraz was Pelosi's idea, actually. You also realize that their resources and networks in terrorist countries (like, not the United States) made the planning process a lot easier, right? Just because "they" (because it isn't really the people we're talking about since the ones who did it died in the process) can put together a murderous plot doesn't mean they can act on it. They aren't all MacGyver or something, how the fuck would they ever escape? A sympathetic guard? Someone leaves a door open? "Terrorists took down the World Trade Center" makes it sound like they're all Superman. They're subhuman cowards who have been deprived of their tools for destruction. There is no harm at all in closing this alternate universe prison and putting them on the mainland for their trials, trials which will hopefully be executed properly and legally so as to avoid any grey areas or excessive Arab resentment on top of the steaming pile that Gitmo's already created for our reputation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarvinisaLunatic 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 I think it's funny that Republican legislators act like those who are being held are all Lex Luthor and will somehow find a way out of whatever facility they're kept in. Are you guys REALLY that worried? Also consider that if there were an escapee (haven't had one yet), every redneck asshole with so much as a slingshot would be roaming the streets in hope of killing one o' them damn towelheads.Terrorists took down the World Trade Center. Do you not think they could take down some silly prison to break them out if they wanted (which would be more likely than the prisoners themselves escaping on their own)? Really far fetched but so is taking two planes and knocking down 2 skyscrapers. I like the idea of sticking them on Alcatraz, but you just know Nancy Pelosi woiuldn't like that one bit. They should take some of Obama's infrastructure stimulus and rebuild Alcatraz. Tons of jobs and construction work for the fine people of SF, how could she argue with that? John Murtha says he'd take them in his district but he only has a minimum security prison in his district so he's talking out his ass because they'll never send them to a minimum security prison. Keeping them at Alcatraz was Pelosi's idea, actually. You also realize that their resources and networks in terrorist countries (like, not the United States) made the planning process a lot easier, right? Just because "they" (because it isn't really the people we're talking about since the ones who did it died in the process) can put together a murderous plot doesn't mean they can act on it. They aren't all MacGyver or something, how the fuck would they ever escape? A sympathetic guard? Someone leaves a door open? "Terrorists took down the World Trade Center" makes it sound like they're all Superman. They're subhuman cowards who have been deprived of their tools for destruction. There is no harm at all in closing this alternate universe prison and putting them on the mainland for their trials, trials which will hopefully be executed properly and legally so as to avoid any grey areas or excessive Arab resentment on top of the steaming pile that Gitmo's already created for our reputation. FALSE A senior House Republican has suggested a secure location for the detainees now held at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba — Speaker Nancy Pelosi ’s district in San Francisco. “Alcatraz would be a good place to put these people,’’ said Rep. C.W. Bill Young of Florida, ranking Republican on the Defense Appropriations Subcommittee. “There’s a lot of discomfort about the idea of bringing the detainees in to the United States. That’s why I’ve suggested Alcatraz,” said Young, referring to the now abandoned, infamous prison island in San Francisco Bay. Young said he had not discussed the idea with Pelosi, D-Calif., but he did suggest it to Gregory Craig, President’s Obama’s lawyer, during a briefing Craig gave to senior House Republicans Wednesday concerning Obama’s plans for shutting down the detainee center at the U.S. military facility in Cuba. Of course it was a Republican, and yeah, it was probably a cheap shot at Pelosi, but I would dare say that Alcatraz, if it were upgraded and all, would probably be one of the safest places in the continental United States to house the detainees should they need to come to the mainland. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NoCalMike 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 I think it's funny that Republican legislators act like those who are being held are all Lex Luthor and will somehow find a way out of whatever facility they're kept in. Are you guys REALLY that worried? Also consider that if there were an escapee (haven't had one yet), every redneck asshole with so much as a slingshot would be roaming the streets in hope of killing one o' them damn towelheads. Terrorists took down the World Trade Center. Do you not think they could take down some silly prison to break them out if they wanted (which would be more likely than the prisoners themselves escaping on their own)? Really far fetched but so is taking two planes and knocking down 2 skyscrapers. You are directing that towards the wrong group of people, we're not the ones that were sitting in front of a panel of our peers looking like clueless dumbshits trying to explain our way out of a paperbag saying how impossible it was to fathom THAT very idea when our own intelligence put that information under our very noses. I believe that was Condaleeza Rice..... But hey, here's hoping from here on out our executives actually pay attention to those kinds of warnings.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EricMM 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Not to mention all the people who are in Guantanimo, with no evidence at all against them... I mean really now, thats just sad. I heard of 17 immates who will be released to 17 families in the US. They're from the east Chinese muslim sect I can't remember the name of. They can't go back to China because the Chinese govt hates those guys, and I don't think they've been accused of anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 "The turrists'll break outta da prisons!" is a new level of retarded. Is that the best new talking point anyone could come up with? There are tons of terrorists incarcerated all over the country, and they include plenty of Islamofascist muzzie fundos, or whatever we're calling them today. The dude who tried to blow up the World Trade Center the first time and shoe bomber Richard Reid are here, among others. Abdel Rahman, the WTC guy, has been locked up since the mid-90s without problem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruteSquad_BRODY 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. you give Bush too much credit infowars.com I miss the 9/11 threads, I used to enjoy trolling Dames Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob_barron 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. you give Bush too much credit infowars.com I miss the 9/11 threads, I used to enjoy trolling Dames Hey, someone in CE more retarded than Marvin! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted January 23, 2009 There are three possible scenarios... 1. Doesn't close. Least likely. 2. Most prisoners don't get sent back to their home country because their home country won't take them. As such, even before trial, they get sent to SuperMax in Florence, Colorado. Some will get tried and convicted. They'll stay there. The rest won't get tried, but nobody will take them. Then it'll turn into a mess. Maybe. 3. We pay countries to take the prisoners. Most likely. We've done it before. The ultimate fail would be they release them, back to wherever/whoever, and they're found plotting terrorist acts in the future against anyone else. The described ultimate fail has happened before. WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A Saudi national released from U.S. detention at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, in September 2007 is believed to be a key leader in al Qaeda's operations in Yemen, according to a U.S. counterterrorism official. Ali al-Shiri was released in 2007 from the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. The Defense Department recently estimated that more than 60 terrorists released from Guantanamo may have returned to the battlefield. According to the counterterrorism official, freed detainee Ali al-Shiri traveled to Yemen after being released to Saudi Arabia and may have been involved in recent al Qaeda attacks in Yemen, including a car bombing outside the U.S. Embassy in Sanaa last year that killed nearly a dozen people. http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/23/git...inee/index.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruteSquad_BRODY 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. you give Bush too much credit infowars.com I miss the 9/11 threads, I used to enjoy trolling Dames Hey, someone in CE more retarded than Marvin! Tin Foil hats for all~! FTW!~!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gary Floyd 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. you give Bush too much credit infowars.com I miss the 9/11 threads, I used to enjoy trolling Dames That's it, you're on ignore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Big Ol' Smitty 0 Report post Posted January 23, 2009 Eric, you're talking about Uighur Chinese Muslims from Xinjiang in western China. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruiserKC 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2009 Several countries have agreed to get the EU together to discuss the issue regarding what to do with the Gitmo prisoners, but the funny thing to me is that all nations like France and Switzerland have said they won't take the prisoners, even though they were extremely gung-ho about it closing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BruteSquad_BRODY 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2009 Bombs secretly implanted by Bush. Duh. you give Bush too much credit infowars.com I miss the 9/11 threads, I used to enjoy trolling Dames That's it, you're on ignore. Is this a TSM 1st? A 7 year break between offensive post and an earned ignore status? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
