Old School TV format

[Papacita 0]

I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Which television style/format is best for WWE: the old school style (jobbers, vingettes, weekly feature matches, etc) or the current format (skit, match, long promo, skit, promo, match, bikini contest, necrophilia, etc.).

 

Granted, today's style is probably the more entertaining of the two, and definitely brings about better matches, but a problem with the current style is that it limits the amount of variety you have in the federation. Every week, we'll basically get to see the same people...Jericho, Van Dam, HHH, Goldberg, and personally, I think it gets a little old seeing the same guys wrestle week after week. It makes it a lot harder for midcarders to get over, plus it cheapens PPV quality matches to an extent...I mean, what's so special about an Angle/Benoit/Guerrero PPV match when we just saw the same match on TV about a week or a month ago? Why should anyone feel inclined to order shows when we can get similar or better quality every week on TV.

 

With the old school format, you didn't have a lot of these problems. It was a lot easier to put midcarders over, because all you had to do was throw them out there in a jobber match or a few vingettes and that allowed the crowd to connect with them better. Also, you had a lot more variety in matches, you could easily sell the show in control centers and what not, and even during the era of IYH, PPV's were a lot more special than they are today. The only real problem I see with the old school format was the jobber matches...no one wants to sit around and watch unknowns get their asses kicked every week. Also, the fact that the shows weren't live may have hurt them a bit.

 

I dunno. The current crash TV type style is stale, IMO, and I think the WWE needs to change that before things really start to get better for them, and while I think completely reverting back to the old school style would probably do a lot more harm than good, I think a nice mix of the two styles would probably freshen things up a lot.

 

What do you think?

[Guest HoffmanHHH]

I think using jobbers could really help them. I also think that guys like Stevie Richards who go out there andput guys over are a vastly underused tool, because these are the guys who can score the occasional upset. Jobber matches can be a tool in simply getting your star out to the ring (rather than them going out for no reason), and from there they can help progress a feud. Look at Goldust vs. Ramon. Goldust ALWAYS struck after Ramon beat a jobber. Why? Because that's when Ramon would be in the ring, in view of the public, and Goldust could humiliate him most. It's the little things. It gives Ramon a reason to be out there besides just calling him out.

 

I think they should use a mix. We have to accept that not only is the new style of promos and T&A not going away, it has its appeal, especially with the marks. But a successful blend would shake up the program and open some new old ways of doing things.

[OldSchoolWrestling 0]

I think it would be a rough transition. Who would tune in to Raw on Monday if this was the preview:

 

 

See HHH battle Steve Lombardi, Kane battle Randy O, and the WWE Tag Team Champs the Dudleys battle the Mulkey Brothers. Tonight on Raw!!!!

[Guest Duncan Eternia]

I like that they use jobbers on heat and velocity but I doubt it would work on main TV. Altough it could work to get a new guy a little more over for a few shows - like they tried to do with Rodney Mack a few months back.

[razazteca 0]

Jobbers should never be on the main show..........hell the OVW boys should not be on Raw. Stevie Richards, Val Venis, Goldust should be on Raw and Randy Orton, Cade, Jinjrak, Mark Henry, Da Mack should be on Heat.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

yeah but then how do those OVW guys get over? They need to get over if they're the future

[Guest JericholicEdgeHead]

I would love for WWE to go back to a more old school format, but they will NEVER do it, and it is because of one thing....RATINGS.

 

Even though going back to a old-school style of format might help house show attendance and PPV buyrates (because that would be the only way to see the big matches) they still won't change because TV ratings seem to be priorty #1 for the McMahons.

 

It's just another example of how the buisness has changed in the past 10 years.

 

Also most of today's fans are so used to star vs. star matches that they couldn't handle more than 1 squash match on RAW or Smackdown.

[Guest OSIcon]

The best thing they could do to freshen up RAW or Smackdown, would simply be to make the ringside area the center of attention. Eliminate the backstage skits and have everything happen in front of the live crowd.

 

Instead of backstage interviews, have the wrestlers come out onto the stage for an interview with Jonathan Coachman. That would even fit perfectly into the heel-announcer deal they are doing now. It gives Coach a reason to be out there with the other announcers so that he can get in his verbal sparring with Ross every now and then.

 

Skits really had very little. The are either used for announcements (which can be done in front of the live crowd) or "confrontations" between either partners or enemies that are supposed to be happening behind closed doors. Just get rid of those for the sake of realism. Like the angle in Georgia Championship Wrestling where Kevin Sullivan was supposed to team with Austin Idol against the Freebirds. Idol, who had been a heel, no shows. Sullivan comes out for a ton of interviews throughout the hour to keep everyone abreast on the situation and the Freebirds and Solie both try to tell Sullivan that Idol is screwing him. Sullivan doesn't believe that though. Finally Idol shows up at the end and says he had a flat tire. It still seems like Idol is lying until Michael Hayes slips up and says "It's not my problem you had four flate tires." Idol points out that he just said he had "a" flate tire, revealing that the Freebirds slashed his tires.

 

All done in front of a live crowd and explained clearly enough for everyone to understand. On RAW or Smackdown, there would have been a skit(s) that showed the Freebirds slashing the tires which the face may or may not have seen depending on if the writers decided these skits could be seen on the television sets or not for that particular week. Or there would have been a ton of skitsd with Sullivan in the back talking to other wrestlers about the situation. Yet, it can be all done without that stuff and it actually adds suspense since we don't know what really happened until the end of the show.

 

That aspect of "old school" wrestling format would really help to freshen up RAW, make things more realistic, and keep things more entertaining for the live crowd.

 

As for jobber matches, when Nitro was on a roll, they always had quite a few jobber matches on each show with a few big matches thrown in. A mix like that would still work today. I would assume that most people would rather see wrestlers they enjoy (like Golbderg or RVD) squashing someone for a few minutes rather then a Rodney Mack vs. Hurricane match or anything like that. Of course, you still need a couple big matches on the shows and you would need guys in the squashes who people want to watch (ie. No Rodney Mack squashes or anything like that). Plus, you can have guest commentators, run-ins after matches (or during), ect. to keep things varied.

[Guest The Decadent Slacker]

If they give it the feel of the early '90s WWF programming, it'd be awesome. Little to no skits, the occasional interview segments (give the Highlight Reel a set off to the side & out of the ring), & make the matches mean something.

 

I'd also it if they made Heat or Velocity more like the old WWF Primetime show, with the panel of guys discussing the angles & such. 2 from RAW, 2 from SD! & some neutral guy moderating it. I'd watch that, maybe

[razazteca 0]

yeah but then how do those OVW guys get over? They need to get over if they're the future

Shelton Benjamin got over on Heat before going to Smackdown. Cade & Jinjrak looked good on Heat also but are not main event performers yet, they should be somewhere in the 1st hour and never in the 2nd hour.

[Nevermortal 0]

The only way it would work is if they brought back the five PPV schedule and that wouldn't really work nowadays.

[Guest Loss]

We would not be having this conversation had Vince Russo not made it commonplace a few years ago to run 14 angles per television show.

 

Angles used to always draw money, because they would run one every three months and milk it for everything it was worth before moving on.

 

The ratings aren't really going to drop because you're still dealing with the core audience, and they don't have to announce HHH taking on Steve Lombardi, as was previously mentioned. They just announce that HHH will be in action and that we're expected to hear from several top superstars.

 

The Undertaker used to be a pretty good house show draw because he was on TV four or five times a year.

 

If they start doing the occasional house show title change like we saw with Christian and Booker T and then actually hype that this is why you can't afford to miss a WWE event in your area on television, then the bottom line will pick up and television will go back to what it really should be -- a two-hour infomercial. It would take a lot of pressure off of the writers too.

[Guest Doyo]

I'd like a mixture of the two. They need a podium for interviews to be done with

wrestlers by themselves or with their teamate. There is too much of the thing

where one guy stands in the ring with a microphone while the person they are

feuding with stands on the ramp and they poke fun at each other. Not too long

ago, when two guys that were feuding saw each other, they would attack each

other, not smile and crack jokes. Jobber matches could be kept short to avoid

people changing the channel. I used to love watching the Road Warriors take

guys out in under 20 seconds.

[The Tino Standard 0]

I can't believe they haven't started doing this already. They've scaled back what they offer us in just about every other aspect of the product since they bought out all their competition. Why not scale back the amount of top-flight performers on their show by filling in spots with jobbers?

 

I know people like to wax nostalgic about the good ol' days of Wrestling Challenge and Superstars, but those matches SUCKED. It was basically a big-name guy using a string of signature moves (this is where Bret Hart's Five Moves of Doom originated), mixed with 30 seconds of token jobber offense, then the name wrestler's finisher. Every match, every week. Oh, and you got Sean Mooney doing the "Update" and maybe a Brother Love Show.

 

Count me out for going back to those days.

 

The modern format gets more ratings, so that's why they won't go back to the old way? YES. EXACTLY. Do we remember what ratings are designed to indicate? That's right- they measure what people are watching, hence, what they're interested in seeing. The vast, vast majority of the public has no desire to go back to jobber shows, and quite frankly, I'm with them.

 

Iron Mike Sharpe can go work elsewhere, thank you very much.

[Youth N Asia 0]

They've got too many guys on the roster now for jobbers. They have too many guys under contract to get indy jobbers to take the places of guys they're already paying.

[Guest OSIcon]

The modern format gets more ratings, so that's why they won't go back to the old way? YES. EXACTLY. Do we remember what ratings are designed to indicate? That's right- they measure what people are watching, hence, what they're interested in seeing. The vast, vast majority of the public has no desire to go back to jobber shows, and quite frankly, I'm with them.

 

How do you know that the same amount of people would not watch RAW and Smackdown if it had a few more squash matches and a few less Midcarder vs. Midcarder match that goes no where? Using Velocity or Heat ratings to judge that is way unfair because of their poor time slots and the fact that on those shows you see Low Card guys/mid carders doing the squashing where as you would see Upper Mid Carders/Main Eventers doing the squashing on the main shows.

 

I still stand by the fact that the majority of viewers are more likely to stay tuned to see Goldberg, RVD, Angle, Lesnar, ect. do all their moves and squash a guy, rather then watch a Rodney Mack vs. Tommy Dreamer match or anything like that. As long as you have interesting guys doing the squashing and they know how to work a squash (ie. Run through your signiture moves, toy with the guy if you are a heel, ect.) then people won't tune out anymore then they do now. Squash matches beat matches between low carders/mid carders that are essentially filler. You can't have all big matches on a show because you would run through all of those matches in a hurry.

 

They aren't "jobber shows". Its just the idea of using squashes instead of meaningless matches between two peers that has a crooked ending in order to protect each guy. They would obviously still have to have a couple big matches each week, too.

 

The other plus to the idea is it saves matches, making them fresher and making big matches more exciting. Right now, you see your favorite wrestler wrestle against a peer every week. He'll end up wrestling a handful of people twice in the matter of a few months. This way, matches between peers seem so much bigger and more important.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

I wouldnt go for those jobber shows either. I would get bored real quickly.

[Guest Doyo]

Squash matches serve little purpose for a Kurt Angle, but they are probably the best way to

introduce new wresters. It lets them get over their finishers and their personas. If Low Ki

were to destroy 4 jobbers in 4 weeks, then many wwe fans would be like "wow this guy is

awesome!" and they would be curious to see him go against someone like Rey Jr.

But if Low Ki were just to debut and lose to Rey Jr. in 8 minutes, then they wouldn't be

as impressed or see him as a future threat.

 

They have too many guys under contract to get indy jobbers to take the places of guys they're already paying.

 

They already use plenty of indy guys on Velocity every week.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

And there's virtually no direction for those jobbers. Why try to attract the crowds/ fans into watching no storyline-based angles?

[Guest Doyo]

And there's virtually no direction for those jobbers.

 

A jobbers only direction is to make another look good. Just like in Bruce Lee movies

where he takes out 40 thugs all at once, the only purpose of those thugs is to remind

everyone that Bruce Lee is a badass. Then later on Bruce Lee takes on a single

similarly skilled opponent.

 

Why try to attract the crowds/ fans into watching no storyline-based angles?

 

What do squash matches have to do with storylines or angles? The squash matches

build anticipation and when a competitive match happens, it seems more exciting and

important. People go to baseball games and watch Sammy Sosa take batting practice

and they are like "wow, look how far he hit that ball! I can't wait to see what he does

tonight against real pitching."

[Youth N Asia 0]

They have too many guys under contract to get indy jobbers to take the places of guys they're already paying.

 

They already use plenty of indy guys on Velocity every week.

But no one watches Velocity. If the show was drawing 3.0+ and being used for actual storylines then it would be a bad idea. But if they took Raw or Smackdown and used a bunch of jobber matches it would hurt ratings too much.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Yeah but the current formula of star vs star matches has pretty much killed off any interest I have in jobber matches. That's why I dont watch Heat or Velocity

[justcoz 0]

I agree with the fact that they need to go back to some old school elements. The presentation of the shows has to change. Crash tv has grown stale. I posted sometime ago that the backstage skits are pointless. With the brands splitting and PPV potential matchups being limited because of the rosters - they shouldn't blow their wad on Raw and Smackdown. I think there should be maybe three marquee matches with interviews, buildup and video packages devoted to them throughout the show. The rest of the time should be filled with some squash matches, ringside interviews or interviews on the ramp way (which involve the crowd unlike the skits) and maybe one or two Confidential style pieces on current stars and some stars from the past. Angle development could stem from the interviews and there could maybe be two or three squash matches.

[Guest Doyo]

Yeah but the current formula of star vs star matches has pretty much killed off any interest I have in jobber matches.

But not everyone is really a star like they want us to believe. Who really cares

about a Bill Demott vs. Johnny Stamboli match, where it accomplishes little even if one

guy wins cleanly?

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

I don't refer to them as stars... I call them forgotten.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

Just say no to Jobbers!

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

*Claps* You go Marvin... wait, you're a lunatic... never mind.

[MillenniumMan831 0]

Well, if it brings back Barry O, I'm all for it.

 

Lillian: In the ring, from Las Veg . . . (O starts bitching at Garcia) . . . From the FABULOUS Las Vegas, Nevada . . . Barry O!

 

Barry makes the 'O' sign over his head. Man, I miss that.

 

Seriously, I've always thought that every week on Raw, they should air one or two 30sec vignettes/videos of random stars (Goldberg, Dreamer, Richards, Jericho, Xtian, Molly, Venis, . . . everybody) just to get the crowd thinking about the ENTIRE roster. Nothing major, hell it could just be the Titan Tron video if they want to be extra lazy. Give these guys something. It'd take up little effort/time, and could get some decent reactions for the wrestlers.

[JJMc 0]

Jobbers should never be on the main show..........hell the OVW boys should not be on Raw. Stevie Richards, Val Venis, Goldust should be on Raw and Randy Orton, Cade, Jinjrak, Mark Henry, Da Mack should be on Heat.

It would SO work on the main shows. Especially Raw, where it's live. Have someone like Rodney Mack or Dreamer come out and beat a jobber after the 25 minute opening promo. Or just before the main event. It gives the viewers a chance to cool down, and also to anticipate the next big segment. -JM

[The Tino Standard 0]

They've just scaled back so many other things, that I think this would be just one more way they'd be giving a less-than-their-best-effort product.

 

Matches have been scaled back in terms of what wrestlers can do. No variety, fewer high risks. It's all about "pacing" and "telling a story," which is are nice ideals. I totally agree with trying to get rid of "spot-to-spot" wrestling matches that make no sense, but unfortunately, there are few, if any, wrestlers that understand actual psychology in matches. The result is a bunch of slow, boring stuff that is getting pretty boring.

 

- They've split the wrestlers between brands, cutting possible matchups in half. You now only see guys once a week.

 

- They've split PPVs (yet still charge full price).

 

Putting on jobber matches would do nothing to establish somebody as a threat. Winning matches against those guys would do nothing to establish credibility. It would just fill up the show with even more non-suspense than it has now (which is too much to begin with).

 

Trust me, if they started putting on jobber matches to build up guys like Orton and that type, a bunch of fanboys for low-card guys who get little TV time would be whining about jobbers taking up TV time while their precious diamond in the rough is off TV altogether.