Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 And yes, Im a huge Raven mark, and its probably clouding my judgement I can't see how being a Raven mark is clouding your judgement, when his feud has been one of the most consistent and thought out. He's fighting hired goons, guys with name recognition, that are being sent after him by a manager. The way you say "he's feuding with a manager" makes it sound like when Ultimate Warrior fought Bobby Heenan in "weasel suit matches". Mitchell hasn't been involved in any of the in-ring action, the heat has been great, and guys like Julio, Punk, Slash et al are getting more over by the feud as well. Onto the JJ/Hogan thing, I'm pretty damn sure Jarrett of all people will not cater to Hogan's ego, so why worry? Yeah sure Jarrett is gonna get the belt again, honestly I think just so they can do Raven/JJ II and get the belt on Raven finally. If Hogan EVER got the belt, I think it'd be more or less a transition move to give the title some cred, and then put over someone more worthwhile. The Observer said that Raven would feud with Mitchell as opposed to a wrestler as an excuse for them to bring in flaky or unreliable workers (Douglas and Vampiro) and have them fight Raven. And for the #473838398 time, Jarrett wont put Raven over for the belt. Ever Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zack Malibu 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 And yes, Im a huge Raven mark, and its probably clouding my judgement I can't see how being a Raven mark is clouding your judgement, when his feud has been one of the most consistent and thought out. He's fighting hired goons, guys with name recognition, that are being sent after him by a manager. The way you say "he's feuding with a manager" makes it sound like when Ultimate Warrior fought Bobby Heenan in "weasel suit matches". Mitchell hasn't been involved in any of the in-ring action, the heat has been great, and guys like Julio, Punk, Slash et al are getting more over by the feud as well. Onto the JJ/Hogan thing, I'm pretty damn sure Jarrett of all people will not cater to Hogan's ego, so why worry? Yeah sure Jarrett is gonna get the belt again, honestly I think just so they can do Raven/JJ II and get the belt on Raven finally. If Hogan EVER got the belt, I think it'd be more or less a transition move to give the title some cred, and then put over someone more worthwhile. The Observer said that Raven would feud with Mitchell as opposed to a wrestler as an excuse for them to bring in flaky or unreliable workers (Douglas and Vampiro) and have them fight Raven. And for the #473838398 time, Jarrett wont put Raven over for the belt. Ever I'd bet anything Jarrett WOULD put Raven over, considering TNA guys have more to GAIN if they "rebelled". We always talk about WWE guys standing up to Triple H, but can't due to breach of contract and the like. What's to stop guys from saying "I'll go work ROH until that merchandising deal runs out with you, then I'm going to Vince" if JJ starts booking everything around himself. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 But everything is booked around him...remember that one a few weeks back where he just started randomly attacking all the heels for no reason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Raven's been getting more screen time since July. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 5, 2003 The swearing and not beating women was to make the promotion more attractive for a tv deal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest PowerPB13 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 ... Whatever it takes to knock WWE down a peg. I don't even care that it's Hogan. -Patrick Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
syxx2001 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Yeah, everything is booked around Jarrett which is why he was involved in a fued with Scott Hall while Ken Shamrock had the World Title fueding with Malice. And is the reason why Jarrett allowed a country music guy to suplex him on the first show and eliminate him. Jarrett could have took the belt on the first show, but he waited until, what? Week 15 or something? I dunno. Maybe shorter. Jarrett has already said he was ready to put the title on Raven that night, but when Raven held out on a contract to try and get Russo more power, Raven didn't get the belt. Dont believe me, look for a older issue of the Observer. And as Borash said in his column "Those who work with us will be repayed in the end." Raven wanted to be a dick and hold out on the contract for Russo, he didn't get the belt. And Jimmy Yang's situation was different. Jimmy was told by someone with a last name that rhymes with hoss that if he wrestled on TNA again he wouldn't get a TNA contract. Don't believe it? Go look for an older Observer. Jarrett might be making himself look like Superman, but who has the belt? AJ Styles. Isn't that what you all wanted? But once he got it, you complained? Didn't you all say Raven's heat would never come back after losing to Jarrett? Isn't he the most over person on the roster? None of you know what the hell is going on or what is going to happen, so please, just stop. Im sure most of you were the same people going "This promotion wont last 5 weeks" last year, but now its a year and a few months with the vision of lasting for 2 more years. TNA wont be going anywhere anytime soon so all of that "Goodbye TNA" talk can stop. Its amazing. In the WWE folder people complain about not having something else to watch instead of RAW and SD!, but when someone offers it to you and it is better most of the time, you still complain. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest OSIcon Report post Posted October 5, 2003 There are really two big variable to the whole deal: 1.) Can TNA garner enough mainstream advertising and attention to get the word out that Hogan is appearing? 2.) Is Hogan a big enough draw still that people will pay ten dollars (or more since it is a 3 hour show) to see him wrestle Jeff Jarrett when they were able to see him on free TV just a few months ago? That is all it comes down to. TNA's current form of "advertising" (if you can call it that) consists mainly of the internet, a little word of mouth, and I guess some sporadic television ads (which I haven't seen in D.C. or Baltimore and you would think they would advertise in markets like that). So they need A LOT more to get the word out about Hogan. As for the second point, Hogan didn't exactly send Smackdown's ratings skyrocketing when he was there. I tend to doubt that there are going to be an overwhelming amount of people paying to watch him on PPV. Granted, there will be some, but I think TNA maybe too hopeful with this. Hogan was just on free TV a few months ago. Its not like they are bringing him back to wrestling after years away from the spotlight. I think TNA is putting all their eggs into the basket on this one and honestly, I don't see the gamble paying off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Real Nosferatu Report post Posted October 5, 2003 I can gurante the 1inch punch doesn't even follow TNA now, as he's throwing in names from week fucking 2-6 when we are at year 2 month 4. For TNA hater,s if you don't like it, don't talk about, it watch it, and save us time from reading your retarded hate comments that make no sense, have no proof to back up, and overall just plain stupidity. Raven didn't get the title cause he wouldn't sign a long term contract (for ex: Ron Killings & A.J Styles were, and both were world champs). James Mitchell is more over than most of the roster, cuts good promos, draws plenty of heat, and hes NOT WRESTLING. HE's had his NEw Church guys do his bidding, and they even brought in Vampiro (BOO!) to further the storyline. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob_barron 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Yeah, everything is booked around Jarrett which is why he was involved in a fued with Scott Hall while Ken Shamrock had the World Title fueding with Malice Just because he wasn't in a World Title programme doesn't mean he wasn't the centrepiece of the show. And is the reason why Jarrett allowed a country music guy to suplex him on the first show and eliminate him. Jarrett could have took the belt on the first show, but he waited until, what? Week 15 or something? They couldn't put the belt on him at first since everyone would just whine about how he was the owner's son. Maybe shorter. Jarrett has already said he was ready to put the title on Raven that night, but when Raven held out on a contract to try and get Russo more power, Raven didn't get the belt. That doesn't excuse him making Raven look like a bitch. And if they were so worried about Raven's contract they could've easily had him sign it a while ago before putting him in a big world title programme. Jarrett might be making himself look like Superman, but who has the belt? AJ Styles. So your just devaluing your champ and devaluing the belt. Isn't that what you all wanted? But once he got it, you complained? I don't want AJ to be the champ if he's being made to look like a chickenshit champ. Didn't you all say Raven's heat would never come back after losing to Jarrett? Isn't he the most over person on the roster? That's because Raven is a smart booker and knows how to get the fans on his side. For a month though Raven was an afterthought. It took two-three months for him to become mega over. In the WWE folder people complain about not having something else to watch instead of RAW and SD!, but when someone offers it to you and it is better most of the time, you still complain. RAW and SD! are free. TNA costs $10. For TNA hater,s if you don't like it, don't talk about, it watch it, and save us time from reading your retarded hate comments that make no sense, have no proof to back up, and overall just plain stupidity. So by your logic everyone in the WWE folder should just shut up right? It's okay to criticise WWE but not TNA. James Mitchell is more over than most of the roster, cuts good promos, draws plenty of heat, and hes NOT WRESTLING. HE's had his NEw Church guys do his bidding, and they even brought in Vampiro (BOO!) to further the storyline. Yea- I don't mind the Raven feud even though they're gonna have to blow it off soon and they better make the blow-off match bloody and violent as hell. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Yeah, everything is booked around Jarrett which is why he was involved in a fued with Scott Hall while Ken Shamrock had the World Title fueding with Malice. And is the reason why Jarrett allowed a country music guy to suplex him on the first show and eliminate him. Jarrett could have took the belt on the first show, but he waited until, what? Week 15 or something? I dunno. Maybe shorter. Jarrett has already said he was ready to put the title on Raven that night, but when Raven held out on a contract to try and get Russo more power, Raven didn't get the belt. Dont believe me, look for a older issue of the Observer. And as Borash said in his column "Those who work with us will be repayed in the end." Raven wanted to be a dick and hold out on the contract for Russo, he didn't get the belt. And Jimmy Yang's situation was different. Jimmy was told by someone with a last name that rhymes with hoss that if he wrestled on TNA again he wouldn't get a TNA contract. Don't believe it? Go look for an older Observer. Jarrett might be making himself look like Superman, but who has the belt? AJ Styles. Isn't that what you all wanted? But once he got it, you complained? Didn't you all say Raven's heat would never come back after losing to Jarrett? Isn't he the most over person on the roster? None of you know what the hell is going on or what is going to happen, so please, just stop. Im sure most of you were the same people going "This promotion wont last 5 weeks" last year, but now its a year and a few months with the vision of lasting for 2 more years. TNA wont be going anywhere anytime soon so all of that "Goodbye TNA" talk can stop. Its amazing. In the WWE folder people complain about not having something else to watch instead of RAW and SD!, but when someone offers it to you and it is better most of the time, you still complain. The World Title feud between Shamrock and Malice took a backseat to the X Guys and Jarrett's wacky adventures. Jarrett let Toby Keith eliminate him as a shot at Vince. As I've said before, Raven isnt the sort of person who'd abandon ship with the belt (are all you Jarrett grekas Torch readers, because they hate Raven as well) How is Raven being repayed...by feuding with a manager As for Jimmy Yang...bleh As for Raven trying to get Russo power...good for him, Russo is the only one who's been treated worse than Raven in the past few weeks. Styles has the belt so Jeff and Daddy can say the promtion isnt booked around the owners son In the WWE folder people complain about not having something else to watch instead of RAW and SD!, but when someone offers it to you and it is better most of the time, you still complain. I rarely complain about the WWE. Generally, the WWE isnt booked around an ignorant hack who hates the WWE with a passion, and yet, is turning into HHH And its free TNA is an alternative to the WWE...yeah right Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Bob Barron is my new best friend Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JustJoe2k5 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Why would TNA want Raven, who is still remembered by most WWE fans as the guy who couldn't beat D'Lo Brown and Jeff Hardy on Heat, as their World Champion? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Because Internet Fans love the guy, plus, he's, you know, talented, and stuff, and not related to the owner Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Real Nosferatu Report post Posted October 5, 2003 My only point was if your intention is just to complain about everything, then don't bother with the folder. How can anyone remember Raven as WWE's Heat resident? Barely anyone watches Heat in the first place. I wanna see Hogan v. Raven in a clockwork orange house of fun match....hehehe... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob_barron 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Why would TNA want Raven, who is still remembered by most WWE fans as the guy who couldn't beat D'Lo Brown and Jeff Hardy on Heat, as their World Champion? They put the belt on Ron Killings- who couldn't even beat Justin Credible Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tpww7 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 So your not allowed to criticise the product at all now?Anyone who pays for the product has the right to express their opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 My only point was if your intention is just to complain about everything, then don't bother with the folder. Well, for one, if i was in America, i'd be paying $10 a go, id have every right to complain about whatever the hell i want. Second of all, I dont wanna complain, I desperately want to like this promotion, but not if they are consistently gonna fuck talented people like Raven, Russo and Styles over, just to appease Jeff Jarrett and Hogan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro101 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Back to the actual subject, I really don't like Hogan. But I have to admit, this is big news for TNA. And if it means they get a TV deal sometime in the future, put him on my PPV broadcast next month. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eirejmcmahon 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 It'll be interesting to see what kind of buyrate Hogan will draw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist Report post Posted October 5, 2003 The problem is, if it does better than normal, the Hogan will then have free reign to pull every stunt in the book. I suspect it wont be a massive impact though. Both the 1c ppv's and Sting turned out to be monumental flops, so you know, this'll fail as well Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eirejmcmahon 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Another point : I hope that NWATNA got Hogan's name on a cast iron contract, otherwise they're just playing a part in his efforts at getting back into the WWE. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
King Cucaracha 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Vince freaked at the thought of MLW becoming competition with Lawler...god, I hate to think what he's like now. This is good news. The non-Hogan fans who think the TNA is gonna die overnight because of this can blow me. If TNA was gonna die over one little thing, it would have happened already. It hasn't. Hopefully this is the thing that can push TNA to near-competitiveness with the WWE. With that out of the way, what's the betting we'll kick off the show with Hogan bashing the WWE? That's a shoot brotha! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob_barron 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 --1wrestling.com's Jeff McGrath reported earlier today that TNA will be doing a three-hour full-blown PPV on 11/30 (which will not be from the Fairgrounds in Nashville), which is a Sunday, headlined by Hulk Hogan vs. Jeff Jarrett. Since Bob Ryder, who is in the TNA office, owns that site, I'd presume the story to be true, but I know as a fact that as of last night, no deal had been signed, because Jeff was desperately trying to get a hold of Hogan to finalize it. They had been negotiating since 9/12 and were said to have been very close to a deal by the early part of this past week. Hogan's lawyer, Henry Holmes, had agreed verbally to terms on Tuesday with Jerry Jarrett. We'll have a major story on the nature of the deal, in next week's issue. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest OSIcon Report post Posted October 5, 2003 It most likely won't have a great effect on TNA because they have little to no advertising to get the word out about Hogan. Plus, Hogan did little to really boots the WWE's buyrates a few months ago, so its unlikely he will have a huge effect on TNA. Hogan being there won't kill TNA, but they probably had to pay him a good sum of money to appear on that one show. So that show has to be REALLY successful for TNA to make any money on it. I guess they are then banking on people liking it and returning, but what happens when the Hogan fans return and don't see Hogan? So financially, this could be a set back to TNA unless everything really works out. I still question the belief that people will flock to buy the PPV just because Hogan is on it. Everyone just saw Hogan a few months ago on free TV so I doubt there are that many people dying to see him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tpww7 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 I always see ads for TNA on my TV, maybe its just me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
res37618 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Back to the actual subject, I really don't like Hogan. But I have to admit, this is big news for TNA. And if it means they get a TV deal sometime in the future, put him on my PPV broadcast next month. Amen. I'm not the biggest fan of the guy either, but if Hogan can provide NWA:TNA with just a little more mainstream publicity, and help them in any way be in line for a possible TV deal in the future, then I'm all for it. WWE needs a little competition, and while TNA may always play second fiddle, ANY competition is better than no competition. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 5, 2003 So then how did a promotion with no ads manage to land 100,000 buys for the .01 PPV? Obviously someone had to hear about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
syxx2001 0 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 You can criticize all you want, but I dont think "RAVEN IS COOL AND JARRETT SUX CAUSE HE WONT GIVE HIM THE BELT AND HE IS DADDYS BOY AND AJ WILL JOB AND JARRETT WILL RAIN" is criticism. To criticize is to analyze and evaluate, not to smart out and act like you have a VIP pass backstage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest abowen33 Report post Posted October 5, 2003 Wow this is pretty big news! Not just Hogan, but a Sunday 3 hour PPV! I know I'm dreaming, but maybe they're close to a TV deal and the PPV will be the kickoff or something! I just don't see how they could take $50 from me in one month, with 4 Wednesday PPVs and a Sunday too. All I know is that I'm excited by the possibilities. Me, personally? I'd LIKE to see JJ vs Hogan. Shoot, I'd like to see Hogan vs AJ or Raven too. Sounds like fun Buyrates and stuff like that don't much worry me, its all about me enjoying it in the present. I'm not much of a long term thinker Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
