Ripper 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution: 10/25/03 ] U.S. may try two convicted of beating More time in prison sought by prosecutor By BILL MONTGOMERY The Atlanta Journal-Constitution The U.S. attorney will investigate the possibility of a federal trial in the beating of two African-American brothers in Little Five Points last year, Fulton County District Attorney Paul Howard said Friday. Howard, accompanied by beating victims Che and Idris Golden, their parents and others, met for about an hour Friday with U.S. Attorney Bill Duffey. Howard said the federal prosecutor would explore the possibility of a federal trial on civil rights violations. Duffey declined comment. Howard requested the meeting with Duffey following what he considered lenient sentences handed down by Fulton Superior Court Judge Marvin Arrington. On Thursday, Arrington sentenced Christopher Botts, 26, to serve eight years in prison and pay a $10,000 fine. Botts, convicted of a hate crime, pleaded guilty to charges including aggravated assault. Co-defendant Ulysses Andrade, 28, cleared of the hate crime charge, was sentenced to serve four years for aggravated assault and ordered to pay a $5,000 fine. Don Samuel, Andrade's attorney, said his client's sentence was "middle of the road" in severity, rather than especially lenient. "To the victims, this is the worst case ever, and I understand that. 'Their acts weren't justified, but this wasn't a methodical hate crime where, for instance, you stalk someone because of their race and shoot them. This was a spontaneous act for what reason we really don't know, even after listening to all the witnesses." A third defendant, Angela Pisciotta, 21, pleaded guilty last week to aggravated assault and simple battery on a police officer. She faces trial in Superior Court Monday on the hate crime charge. Howard had sought the maximum 20 years for Botts and Andrade. Howard said that a prison sentence for any conviction on civil rights charges could possibly be served consecutively, after the defendants have served time on the state convictions. Duffey "was blunt and candid . . . he said he'd been following the case from the beginning," Howard said Friday. "We are very hopeful." The Golden brothers were attacked and severely beaten and kicked in April 2002 when they rejected what Atlanta police called aggressive panhandling by the defendants on Moreland Avenue. The victims and their parents, Henry and Jewel Golden, declined to comment after meeting with Duffey. State Sen. Vincent Fort, author of the state's hate crime law who was also present, said he found Duffey "open to the idea of a federal trial. "Justice was not done to the Golden family. . .and I feel they were further traumatized by the light sentences," Fort said. I do believe this is the first time that the hate crime legistlation has been put to use here in Georgia, adding 2 years to the female and one of the guys sentences. Whats the opinions on hate crime legislation and do you feel these people got soft sentences. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Regarding hate crime itself, I personally think assault and murder are just that, plain and simple, whether it's for reasons involving someone's race or wanting someone's money or revenge or whatever, as the label of hate crime does nothing but cloud up all interracial crimes, whether hate motivated or not (ex: if a black man attacks a family member of mine and I track him down and get revenge, I don't want the fact that I'm white and he's black be the deciding factor since I would've hunted him down no matter what his race) As for the sentence itself, if it were actually 8 years, I'd say that would be fine, but since the served time always seems to be half of the sentence for relatively lesser crimes (i.e. sentenced for 10 years, only serve 5), then a sentence of 15 years would've been better suited for this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Hate crime legislation is a load of shit in my opinion. Why should you get extra time in jail if the person you happened to mug, assault, etc. happened to be of a different color? Also I hate it b/c it seems to be almost exclusively used for white on black crime. There have been some racially motivated attacks on white people I've read about where the hate crime deal hasn't been used. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ripper 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 A: I feel the sentence was too soft because it was basically attempted murder and they are getting 8 years max for it. B: Bullshit Mad dog, hate crime legislation has been used for white on black, black on white, and plenty of sexual and religious related crimes. C: I am torn on the hate crime thing. If these guys had attacked a white person, they should get the same amount of years. But I can see how getting jumped while people are screaming racial slurs at you can be more tramatic than being attacked. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 28, 2003 There's really no point to it though. Just b/c someone of a different race does something to someone else doesn't mean it's racially motivated. And really isn't any kind of assault a hate crime. There have been a few cases I've heard of where this could've been slapped on and it wasn't. I don't think that kid that shot the girl in class a few years back was charged with a hate crime even though it was very racially motivated from what I remember. I don't recall the specifics other than that seeing that it was probably 4-6 years ago. EDIT: I do have one question. Would gang violence be able to fall under hate crimes? While it could be same race it's still the same general motivation as "hate crimes". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted October 28, 2003 I do believe this is the first time that the hate crime legistlation has been put to use here in Georgia, adding 2 years to the female and one of the guys sentences. Whats the opinions on hate crime legislation and do you feel these people got soft sentences. Hate crime laws are horrid. Thought crime is a road we should NOT be travelling down. Who gives a damn WHAT the guy was thinking when he committed a crime? And, can any violent crime NOT be a hate crime? -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Firestarter 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Hate crime laws are not only silly, they're ineffective and redundant. Conspiracy to commit a felony is a crime in and of itself. Prove conspiracy (based on race or anything else) and you've got two easy convictions. As for trauma, if I were "attacked and severely beaten and kicked," I doubt I'd give a shit what the hell the criminals were yelling while they did it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spicy McHaggis 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 "Man, he just broke a 5th bone in my body! Well, at least he doesn't hate me because of my race." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Wish I had seen this topic earlier because most of my fire had been taken away. Hate crime legislation is one of the dumbest ideas in the long of dumb ideas. I was never really a fan of the NAACP but I lost all respect for this group when they made a disgusting political ad in 2000 regarding Bush and his refusal to sign a hate crime bill while guv. Those that remember it know what I'm talking about... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Was the guy that made all the racial comments about Leiberman still high up in the organization then? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Damn. Everything I wanted to say has been said. Oh well, to sum up: hate crime laws are ridiculous and obscene. Assault is already illegal. Murder is already illegal. Conspiracy to commit those crimes is already illegal. Going after someone because of what they were thinking is a terrible thing to do. And if I were the victim, I think I'd worry more about the punches, kicks, and weapons than I would about a few racial slurs. More traumatic indeed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 I'd support hate crime legislation if it covered other things, especially financial backgrounds. Street thug beat up someone that is middle-class. They did it because that person was "rich." Extra 50 years in jail. HATE CRIMES FOR EVERYONE!!!... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted October 28, 2003 I'd support hate crime legislation if it covered other things, especially financial backgrounds. Street thug beat up someone that is middle-class. They did it because that person was "rich." Extra 50 years in jail. HATE CRIMES FOR EVERYONE!!!... But then you'd have people jumping out of the wood work to get them off on the grounds that it was the middle-class person's fault for not wanting to give up another 5% of their income so the thug could stay on welfare a little longer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EricMM 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 Do the hate crime rules apply to non-violent activities? I mean, if someone is constantly threatening someone due to their skin color, can they be put away because it seems that their irrational racial hatred makes them a definite threat to many people? Once violence has been commited I agree that there is always hate involved. Thus adding years for a white person beating a black person is stupid. But what if it's a non-violent crime? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 28, 2003 If that were the case there would be a few black kids locked up for threatening me in my youth whenever my old man took me into the city. Of course, these kids are probably locked up by now, so it's all a moot point... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Do the hate crime rules apply to non-violent activities? I mean, if someone is constantly threatening someone due to their skin color, can they be put away because it seems that their irrational racial hatred makes them a definite threat to many people? Once violence has been commited I agree that there is always hate involved. Thus adding years for a white person beating a black person is stupid. But what if it's a non-violent crime? It'd fall under harassment, which is illegal. We can never know exactly what somebody was thinking. Heck, if the defendant says he DIDN'T do what he/she did out of racial animosity --- how in the heck can we say that they're lying? -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Your Paragon of Virtue 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 two African-American brothers I just found this part funny. South Park had a good episode on this. It had everything this thread had, plus a Monopoly board game up the ass. South Park>Thread withOUT Monopoly board game up the ass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Oh that South Park episode was great. Loved Token's dad (I'm paraphrasing here)" Stan: If you don't agree in having hate crimes, why don't you tell them? Token Dad: They'll never listen to me. I'm black... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MrRant 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 So how is this a hate crime? You can't beat up other races anymore? Are there bonus years associated to each race? White guy beats up another white guy = 5 years White guy beats up black dude = 7 years White guy beats up Jew (assuming beater was of German heritage) = War Crime This just further seperates the races in this country. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Don't forget white guy beats up gay white guy. Can't even imagine how many years you'd get if you beat up a gay Jew that votes Republican -- can't get any more minority than that... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dmann2000 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Don't forget white guy beats up gay white guy. Can't even imagine how many years you'd get if you beat up a gay Jew that votes Republican -- can't get any more minority than that... a gay BLACK Jew who votes Republican Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Oh, I forgot to mention he smokes... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Actually, I went to college with a chap who was a gay, Black, Hispanic Jew who voted Republican. I told him if he were a cripple, he'd be a member of every minority... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted October 29, 2003 Actually, I went to college with a chap who was a gay, Black, Hispanic Jew who voted Republican. I told him if he were a cripple, he'd be a member of every minority... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2003 I was never really a fan of the NAACP but I lost all respect for this group when they made a disgusting political ad in 2000 regarding Bush and his refusal to sign a hate crime bill while guv. Those that remember it know what I'm talking about... That would be the ads refering to James Byrd. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spicy McHaggis 0 Report post Posted October 30, 2003 Actually, I went to college with a chap who was a gay, Black, Hispanic Jew who voted Republican. I told him if he were a cripple, he'd be a member of every minority... You should have taken a bat to his knees... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
