WWF needs to go back to formula

[Guest RollingSambos]

I think that the WWF needs to re-evaluate a lot of things about their company. Too many key players are getting seriously hurt. Kurt Angle - a guy who has (or had) the potential to be the greatest of all time - may be cut down only 5 years into his WWF career. Edge - a promising young superstar who hasn't even cleared 30 or had a world heavyweight title reign - has already had his neck fused. Steve Austin - a guy that could still be drawing huge $$ for a few more years if he was healthy - is retired. I mean, at this point, it's like, "Who's next?" I seriously fear for all of the young guys on the Smackdown! brand who are taking those nasty-looking release Germans and chairshots from the likes of Brock Lesnar and Hardcore Holly on a nightly basis.

 

I think that they need to look at 3 things:

 

1) The ring. Now I know that they got new rings with a lot more give in the summer of 1998, but obviously they aren't very effective if guys are still injuring their backs and necks. Knee injuries and muscle tears are always going to plague the business, but if they are going to have guys suplexing the shit out of each other on a nightly basis, they need better, safer ring construction. I really think that they should look at the old WCW rings, which reportedly had a great spring system. Those rings had tremendous give on bumps, but the ring floor was firm enough when not being bumped on so that the cruiserweights could do their shit and the wrestlers could run around without wrecking their knees. Also, it didn't look bad on TV. Even though it had more give than the WWF rings, the ring floor actually looked very unforgiving when somebody would take a bump. How many people had to have their necks fused in WCW (besides the Buff Bagwell incident)?

 

2) The style. The German suplexes are totally out of control. At least with vertical, belly-to-belly, and belly-to-back/backdrop suplexes, the wrestler can take a flat-back bump. The Germans are ruining necks, and now EVERYBODY (Angle, Benoit, Edge, Lesnar, WGTT, Tajiri) are doing them. They should either be reserved for the guys who can safely deliver and take them (get enough height so you land on your shoulders and not your neck and the back of your head) or cut down on them. I'm not saying eliminate them like the Tombstone a few years back, but do we really need 12 per match? Looking back, I have no idea what Steve Austin - a guy with a fused neck - was thinking taking 7-10 Germans from Kurt Angle and Chris Benoit in those matches in 2001. That's probably why he can't wrestle today. Personally, I'd be willing to part with these suplex-fests if it meant the health of my favorite workers. HHH is right to an extent about slowing the wrestling down. Notice that there are less injuries on RAW, and when there are they never concern the neck?

 

3) Punish sloppy workers. How many times has Brock Lesnar dumped somebody on their head? Hardcore Holly, A-Train, Kurt Angle...he's come close to paralyzing quite a few wrestlers and he put Hardcore Holly on the shelf. Most recently he made one of Kurt Angle's vertebrae explode. Now as great and important as he is, the office shouldn't be putting up with this. WCW tolerated it with Goldberg, and now Bret Hart can never wrestle again. Brock is obviously careless if he's hitting a guy who just had major neck surgery that hard with a steel chair. Like it or not, the office needs to crack down on this.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Or they could lighten the schedule... whatever.

[Guest RollingSambos]

That too, but it only takes one bad bump or stiff chairshot to fuck up someone's vertebrae.

[1234-5678 0]

Or they could lighten the schedule... whatever.

Lighter schedule=less money in the McPocket. It'll never happen.

[Guest Choken One]

As far as I'm concerned RVD is the only one who can take a German and not get hurt.

[MrRant 0]

That's because he seems to land on his face.

[Guest Choken One]

well..THAT part is messed up clearly.

 

RVD oughta start training the WWE workers...

 

It's about FLEXIBILITY not muscle people!

[1234-5678 0]

They should either be reserved for the guys who can safely deliver and take them (get enough height so you land on your shoulders and not your neck and the back of your head) or cut down on them. I'm not saying eliminate them like the Tombstone a few years back, but do we really need 12 per match?

The Tombstone wasn't the only thing eliminated, it was all moves where someone could get dropped on their head. Tombstones, piledrivers, brainbusters. That's why Cena's DVD is so weak compared to when Saturn or Spicolli did it.

[Austin3164life 0]

I think that only certain wrestlers with experience should perform these moves. You brought up how Benoit used a ton of German Suplexes on Austin back in 2001, but I believe Austin has said before that he ultimately trusted Benoit, because he knew that Benoit would never be careless enough to drop Austin on his head/neck. It's not so much the bookers/promoter's fault as it is the worker's to train hard enough to know how to execute a proper suplex.

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

The Tombstone wasn't the only thing eliminated, it was all moves where someone could get dropped on their head. Tombstones, piledrivers, brainbusters. That's why Cena's DVD is so weak compared to when Saturn or Spicolli did it.

Honestly, can you even count the F-U as a DVD? I understand the way that they take the move is DVD-like in principal, but the mechanics are totally different.

[1234-5678 0]

Honestly, can you even count the F-U as a DVD? I understand the way that they take the move is DVD-like in principal, but the mechanics are totally different.

I think it's a DVD, but just a shitty one.

[Austin3164life 0]

He's probably not allowed to drop the guy shoulder/neck first, so thus it's basically a glorified Fireman's Carry takeover turned into a slam. They're trying to censor out a lot of moves that focus on the neck, especially in the past year (excluding the German Suplex-fest).

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

Vince needs to drop the fetish for big men if he wants a healthy roster. If you look at the stars in Japan or even some of the NWA stars. Guys who are muscleheads like Batista are going to be constantly hurt. The more muscle someone adds the less flexibility they have. Again look at Batista; the guy has no range of movement and doing anything but basic moves causes him to tear something.

 

Wrestlers need to not be roided up freaks to stay healthy. Look at Ric Flair, Randy Savage (80s) and Steamboat for an example of smaller guys who did big moves but were never seriously hurt.

[haVoc 0]

Brock is obviously careless if he's hitting a guy who just had major neck surgery that hard with a steel chair. Like it or not, the office needs to crack down on this.

 

OR, the guy, Angle, could just refuse to take the chair shot while their planning the match out. I mean, they have a good 8 hours to think these things up before TV.

[Guest wildpegasus]

Chairshots need to be eliminated without a dobut. There's absolutely no point to them.

 

More tags have to be presented at house shows. It'll eliminate wrestlers in ring time overall.

 

Flexability is key. Look at the Japanese wrestlers like Tajiri, Otani, Misawa or people that have trained over there. Overall, they're way more flexable. Kobashi although put together by duct tape is an example of how much neck bumps someone can survive. You put almost any WWE superstars in his shoes and have him take the same exact hits and there's no way that wrestler wouldn't be in a wheelchair by the time 1994 rolled around. Manami Toyota who's probably the most flexable wrestler ever is way healthier than she has any right to be. Chris Benoit who's also very flexable took an awful lot of neck bumps before finally having to get his neck fused. In the WWE, RVD's proven that his flexability has saven him. Steve Austin on the other hand is an example of someone who's more prone to get injured off neck bumps and that's because he's not as flexable. I'd say Edge, Scotty Too Hotty and Holly as well suffer from this problem. Lesnar is sussposed to have neck problems too. The WWE needs to install flexability programs in their training camps to make sure the neck and other injuries lessen.

 

Angle is a tough case becuase he's had documented neck problems before he even started prowrestling. Wrestlers today are more athletic than from the days of yesterday. No matter how many moves the WWE bans their problems are still going to be there since wrestlers are trying harder and doing all sorts of stuff to impress the crowd. The same concept happens in other athletic fields as well. Runners run faster, weightlifters lift heavier weights and so on. The ante has been upped and whoever doesn't follow is going to be left behind.

Edited November 25, 2003 by wildpegasus

[J. Hungerford Smith 0]

Brock is obviously careless if he's hitting a guy who just had major neck surgery that hard with a steel chair. Like it or not, the office needs to crack down on this.

 

OR, the guy, Angle, could just refuse to take the chair shot while their planning the match out. I mean, they have a good 8 hours to think these things up before TV.

What's the point of refusal? The spot can still look convincing even if the chairshot is light, at least lighter than Lesnar's anyways. I guess he took that one that Jeff Hardy gave him a few weeks after his debut to heart.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

That too, but it only takes one bad bump or stiff chairshot to fuck up someone's vertebrae.

Brock didn't fuck up Angle's neck.

 

Angle was a fucking idiot and took a chairshot square on the crown of his head. It doesn't matter WHO gave it to him. Dr Jho even told him when he came in "You can't take chairshots anymore."

 

Get off Lesnar's ass, he protected Angle at 'Mania. Angle was stupid and did what he wasn't supposed to, he should've vetoed the spot.

 

Any injury time he gets he brought on himself.

[Guest Mulatto Heat]

Angle is buddies with Vince these days anyway. You'd think he'd take advantage of that to protect his own health.

[Guest wildpegasus]

That too, but it only takes one bad bump or stiff chairshot to fuck up someone's vertebrae.

Brock didn't fuck up Angle's neck.

 

Angle was a fucking idiot and took a chairshot square on the crown of his head. It doesn't matter WHO gave it to him. Dr Jho even told him when he came in "You can't take chairshots anymore."

 

Get off Lesnar's ass, he protected Angle at 'Mania. Angle was stupid and did what he wasn't supposed to, he should've vetoed the spot.

 

Any injury time he gets he brought on himself.

Lesnar caused Angle's head to be whiplashed at the No Way Out PPV last year when he ran with Angle on his back into the turnbuckle. That's when the problems really started with Angle last year I believe. I remember how that spot was than modified so Lesnar's opponent would go back first into the turnbuckle instead of side first though I wouldn't say it was Lesnar's fault that Angle's neck got hurt there as that spot had been done successfully with Cena before. Things happen in wrestling as it's very physical but to say everything is Kurt's fault is silly.

[Guest RollingSambos]

The WWF needs better agents. Not reckless risk-takers like Arn Anderson, who are now nerve-damaged and passing their bad habits onto the next generation.

[Guest Choken One]

Then you gotta go with the Slugs like John Tenta because Tenta NEVER got injured.

[Guest RollingSambos]

Ah, yes, John Tenta. Some call him Earthquake, some call him Avalanche, some call him Golga...I call him non-sensical daredevil. Attempting to shimmy up a 20' pole so that he can knock out Ray Traylor with a sock full of quarters. No, no, this is not what the WWF needs in an agent.

[Guest Megatron]

What a great way to build up my total posts! I think I'll go into every thread and post like RollingSambos! Thanks man!

[The Metal Maniac 0]

The German suplexes are totally out of control. At least with vertical, belly-to-belly, and belly-to-back/backdrop suplexes, the wrestler can take a flat-back bump. The Germans are ruining necks, and now EVERYBODY (Angle, Benoit, Edge, Lesnar, WGTT, Tajiri) are doing them.

 

While I do agree that the move is very over-used (an odd thing coming from me, as it's one of my favourites) I think you at least have to admit that they are trying to protect people better with the suplexes.

 

Watch how they do them these days - The guy doing it doesn't bridge back, he just lifts the guy straight up into the air and they both fall backwards. It's safer, and looks dumb, if you ask me. But they still need to use them much less.

 

Steve Austin on the other hand is an example of someone who's more prone to get injured off neck bumps and that's because he's not as flexable.

 

That's not fair; Austin's prone to get injured from neck bumps because he had his neck broken by a move that would've broken anyone's neck.

[Guest Megatron]

That's not fair; Austin's prone to get injured from neck bumps because he had his neck broken by a move that would've broken anyone's neck.

It "damn near" broke his neck. If he hadn't had so much muscle in his neck it would have broke. I'm not striking down your point. I'm just pointing out a fact.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I really think that they should look at the old WCW rings (...) Also, it didn't look bad on TV.

 

I thought they always looked tiny as hell, especially with guys like Nash in there.

 

3) Punish sloppy workers. How many times has Brock Lesnar dumped somebody on their head? Hardcore Holly, A-Train, Kurt Angle...he's come close to paralyzing quite a few wrestlers and he put Hardcore Holly on the shelf. Most recently he made one of Kurt Angle's vertebrae explode.

 

Basically what we need to do is calm down on the chairshots AND the germans.

 

If you want to clean them up though, any list of Stiffy Stiffersons must start with Goldberg.

[Guest wildpegasus]

Steve Austin on the other hand is an example of someone who's more prone to get injured off neck bumps and that's because he's not as flexable.

 

That's not fair; Austin's prone to get injured from neck bumps because he had his neck broken by a move that would've broken anyone's neck.

Austin's neck was already hurt going into that match. I've seen other wrestlers take worse hurts than that and not be as bad off because they're more flexable.

 

I believe a strong neck helps you as well but that ideally should be combined with flexability.

[1234-5678 0]

Chairshots need to be eliminated without a dobut. There's absolutely no point to them.

AKA let's find as many ways as possible to pussify "Sports Entertainment." People like risks, they like EXCITING matches, and chairshots are exciting and make the crowd react. What DOES NOT make the crowd react are chinlocks, endless side slams, endless spinebuster, sleeper holds, overused chops in the corner, overused clotheslines............I could go on forever but I don't feel like it.