The OAO NHL 2003-2004 Season Thread

[treble 0]

Well, the streak's over, but the Leafs still haven't lost in regulation in 9 games~!

[starvenger 0]

The streak had to end sometime. Now I hope that they can maintain that momentum and resume their winning ways.

[CanadianChris 0]

Butch Cassidy was fired as coach of the Capitals today.

 

No word on whether or not he would be replaced by the Sundance Kid.

[the max 0]

Butch Cassidy was fired as coach of the Capitals today.

 

No word on whether or not he would be replaced by the Sundance Kid.

Not only did you beat me to that story, but you beat me to the joke.

 

Bastard.

[The Czech Republic 0]

You can't help but feel sorry for the guy. If the Wings had just won their last game of the season last year, were the top seed in the West, and drew the Oilers instead of the Ducks as the 2nd seed, it's likely that NONE of this stupid sitation would have happened. Or, if his team mates could have solved Giguere (hell, if Robitaille's shot went in and didn't hit the post in OT in game 1), then there's no need for Hasek to come back and screw everything up. To top this all off, whenever Joseph's actually in Detroit, he's behind Leagce on the depth chart.

Yeah and if it hadn't been for Cottoneye Joe, I'd been married a long time ago. Quit your conjecturing, I don't want to hear it. The Oilers could have easily swept the Wings as well. And that would've made for a better story anyway.

[nl5xsk1 0]

Has anyone checked out the All-Star voting? Why the hell are people like Mogilny or Langenbrunner so high up? They have 12 points each, yet are in the top 5 or 6. Mogilny I can understand, I guess, as it makes sense that TO fans would vote for their own, but who's voting for a Devil? Both of the fans that go to their games?!?

 

Hell, Dany Heatly is towards the top of the list, and he's out for the year, but Glen Murray, who's got 89 goals in the last 2 years, only has 12k votes. Come on, Bruins fans, the guy is one of the most consistent players on our team, yet he's getting no votes.

[Lightning Flik 0]

EDMONTON - Disgruntled Oiler Mike Comrie questioned the ethics of team management Wednesday after learning Oiler GM Kevin Lowe wants the unsigned centre to cough up $2.5 million of his own money to complete a trade to the Anaheim Mighty Ducks.

 

Comrie said he was shocked at the latest turn in negotiations, particularly since he was told the trade to Anaheim had been completed last Saturday.

 

"If somebody approaches you after the fact and tells you something like this ... the first thing that goes through your mind is that's a little bit unethical," Comrie said after skating with players from the University of Alberta Golden Bears at Clare Drake Arena.

 

Comrie, who believed he'd been dealt in exchange for Anaheim's 2003 first-round draft, junior winger Corey Perry of the London Knights, as well as a first-round draft choice next year, didn't sound like a guy who was about to buy his way out of town.

 

"I don't know if you can compare this to anything," Comrie said of the bizarre turn in what has become a lengthy holdout. "It's a very unique situation. I've never heard of something like this ... I've heard of things happening at the 11th hour and holding up deals, but this is beyond that. It's like the 13th hour."

 

Comrie was clearly agitated Wednesday night but was also careful in what he said.

 

"It's frustrating...I'm very disappointed. Hopefully we'll get through this like professionals."

 

Maybe so, but he didn't sound like he was willing to give the Oilers one penny to get the trade done.

 

He has already lost a third of the NHL season and a third of his season's pay waiting for a deal.

 

"I've seen where teams pay to get a player, like when Los Angeles paid to get Wayne Gretzky. But this has never happened before from a player's standpoint," he said.

 

Comrie said he'd agreed to a two-year contract with Anaheim "for exactly what they offered," and didn't argue when it was suggested he was in line to make a pro-rated $1.5 million US this season. For now, Comrie doesn't consider himself an Oiler or a Mighty Duck.

 

He had thought about cleaning up his affairs here after being told the trade was done and a contract was hammered out. Now, if nothing is done by Dec. 19 when NHL rosters are frozen until Dec. 27, Comrie says he'd gladly play for Canada at the Spengler Cup in Davos, Switzerland. He has been invited and knows he could use the game action after months of practising, but he has been holding out hope for a trade.

 

"I don't understand this but hopefully we can look back and say this was a learning experience for all of us," he said.

 

Comrie, who first signed with the Oilers in December 2000, has been locked out since the start of training camp Sept. 12 because he wouldn't agree to a contract. His agent, Rich Winter, said Comrie doesn't deserve the treatment he's receiving from the Oilers.

 

"To me the saddest thing here is that a very fine man who is dealing in good faith has been led down the garden path," Winter said Wednesday. "The idea of making the deal conditional on money being paid by Mike Comrie was never mentioned to him at any time during the course of the discussions and I feel absolutely terrible for him."

 

Meh... Since this is to talk about hockey, what does everyone think of the Comrie situation as it stands now? I added the story, just in case any hockey fan didn't know what was going on (and in some ways, we still don't know what's up with how we got to this point).

 

Personally, I really don't care for what Lowe is doing. I didn't care for it the day he signed Laraque to a 1.5 million contract. I was of the mind, "ok, you can pay Laraque, a fighting gritty checker that, but you can't give Comrie his 2.5 million now? Or at least give him a decently looking offer? Then just trade him." I don't know why, I'm like this (as many are against Comrie that I've spoken to around town), but seriously, he's about as screwed over as CuJo. I mean, although I find the thought of a player paying for his trade is amusing and probably a decent tactic if it had been done differently, how the hell does Lowe pull this shit? The trade was made, a deal negotiated for Anaheim and Comrie, and after it is all done you (Lowe) spring "oh, we want YOU to cough up the money, otherwise no deal".

 

Heck, at least CuJo is getting to play. Maybe I'm just not seeing it from Lowe's point of view and in the minority, but geezus, I really really don't care for crap like this pulled. And I'm a diehard Oiler fan, but hell, I'd rather be cheering on a team like the Thrashers right now (no offense to Thrashers fans, I just mean you guys willing to embrace what your team has struggled through instead of outright hating of Heatly) then my pathetic bunch of ragtags after this. Ugh...

 

(Note: Yes, I do get the business applications of this and understand WHY Lowe would pull it from that point, but fuck... I always laughed at teams and feel proud when my team hasn't pulled this shit ever, but looks like it was just bidding it's time.)

[the max 0]

LaRoque has acted like a team player, and not held out for a perfect deal.

 

Personally, I wish they'd just get it done and part ways. Anaheim gets their future first-line player, and gives up draft picks, and potential stars in return.

[CanadianChris 0]

That really sucks for Comrie. Basically, Lowe is starting up his own form of the old protection racket.

 

Anyway...Max, you were wondering what was going on with the Senators? Well, wonder no more -- tonight was the tenth time the Sens have been involved in a one-goal game. It's the FIRST such game that they've won.

[the max 0]

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=64444

 

Carolina fires Paul Maurice.

 

 

I never thought that he'd get fired...or replaced by such an...overrated candidate.

[Lightning Flik 0]

Your kidding? ...no apparently not...

 

But the WHOLE staff? Oh man, Carolina is probably going to be on quite a bit of a losing stall fora while now, as they'll probably be implementing a whole new system now... Best knowning you now.

[the max 0]

http://tsn.ca/news_story.asp?ID=64563&hubName=main

 

Mike Comrie dealt to the Flyers in exchange for...nothing much, really.

 

Edmonton got fucking HOSED on this deal, as they needed someone to step in and help on the first line (Gagne, Williams, etc.) but instead got a future defenseman, a very high first round pick this year, and a third rounder next year. Kevin Lowe is an idiot.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

Well, getting a defensemen for the future is fine. But a couple of draft picks? Bleh. Unless next year has a wicked crop of players, I'm not sure what the Oilers are thinking. Like Max said, they need offensive help now. Do you really see Brad Isbister cutting it for em?

[CanadianChris 0]

Kevin Lowe is an idiot.

This is a true statement.

[Red Baron 0]

no, but Raffi Torres is, and they can bring up Jani Rita, he's played well down in the AHL.

 

 

And I guess no Bobby Clarke picture this time. Anybody want to hang a Kevin Lowe picture with bullet holes in his head>

[The Czech Republic 0]

I have a question. What are the chances that all six Canadian teams make the playoffs, and one ends up in the Cup final? Vancouver is a major power seeing as the 3-D probably won't dominate the conference the way they did last season, Calgary seems to be on the rise, Edmonton I can't tell, Toronto is doing very well, the Habs look better than last year, and Ottawa will probably make it in again.

[CanadianChris 0]

Edmonton won't make the playoffs...not enough talent, too many good teams ahead of them. Calgary is hard to tell, because they play in spurts. Montreal will battle for the last spot in the East -- although if they're battling the Rangers, I like their chances. The rest are pretty safe bets.

 

As for whether a Canadian team will make the final...this year's as good a bet as any. Although it'll be a lot easier to tell after the trade deadline.

[the max 0]

Calgary doesn't make it unless Iginla starts earning his money and playing like he did two years ago.

 

I'm sorry, but 5.5 million for 8 goals so far is ridiculous.

 

Montreal seems to be on the upswing again, and could battle for #8.

 

Edmonton, after this terrible deal, just signed their chances away, and seem to be building for next year and beyond.

 

TO, Ottawa, and Vancouver are forgone conclusions.

[The Czech Republic 0]

I see the two Canadian divisions sending 4 teams to the postseason: Vancouver, Colorado, Minnesota, Calgary; and Toronto, Ottawa, Boston, Montreal.

[the pinjockey 0]

I wouldn't say the Oilers got nothing. Woywitka was a very highly regarded prospect, just slightly below Pitkanen in the eyes of most in the Flyers organization. The draft picks are meaningless.

[the pinjockey 0]

But it is certainly a deal looking to the future as he probably won't be ready til next year.

[the max 0]

But it is certainly a deal looking to the future as he probably won't be ready til next year.

Which is exactly my point, as Comrie is a front line center, and they got nothing of the same in return for him...of which the Flyers have in Simon Gagne, Justin Williams, etc. Edmonton was so desparate to get rid of Comrie, and Lowe was so blind to make himself out to be the good guy in the whole thing that he unloaded an extremely talented player for practically nothing.

[CanadianChris 0]

And, of course, they already had a much better deal with Anaheim done, until Lowe shot his mouth off about wanting a ransom to finish it.

[Brush with Greatness 0]

But it is certainly a deal looking to the future as he probably won't be ready til next year.

Which is exactly my point, as Comrie is a front line center, and they got nothing of the same in return for him...of which the Flyers have in Simon Gagne, Justin Williams, etc. Edmonton was so desparate to get rid of Comrie, and Lowe was so blind to make himself out to be the good guy in the whole thing that he unloaded an extremely talented player for practically nothing.

Considering what Clarke said about Comrie in November I don't figure there is any way that he would part with Gagne or Williams for Comrie, especially because the Flyers don't at all need Comrie. Trading away a Gagne or Williams for Comrie isn't going to make the Flyers better it's just going to make the same team with a different player. And with their depth down the middle why trade a winger for a centre?

 

So essentially there was no way Lowe was going to land Gagne or Williams. Comrie was a big fish in a small pond and by the sounds of it there were no teams willing to part with name guys to get Comrie. Like the Corey Perry deal was so much better? Perry can't skate and Woiwytka will be a better NHLer and will be ready sooner.

 

The one thing Lowe should have done was to push for either Jeff Carter or Mike Richards as opposed to a 1st round pick. Or with the current deal, gotten a 2nd round pick in 2005 instead of the 3rd rounder.

 

Woiwytka is a stud on D and almost made the Flyers last year as a 19 year old. Woiwytka straight up for Comrie wouldn't have been a terrible deal (although in that case the Oilers would have lost the trade) but throw in the draft picks, the trade is even and the Oilers maybe even win it if they can draft good.

 

Face it, Lowe was in a situation where he was unable to get anyone that could help the Oilers right away so he did his best and got what he could.

[the max 0]

A situation that Lowe brought upon himself by not being patient with Anaheim.

 

Had he waited for Anaheim, he would have gotten Andy McDonald PLUS a first rounder in this years AND next year's draft.

 

As it is, yes, he got a good-to-great defenseman, but only because he was stupid enough to be THAT desparate to get rid of this talented centerman and so desparate in fact, that he didn't get full value for him.

[the max 0]

http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=64700

 

AND Kevin Lowe screwed over Bryan Murray of the Ducks by saying "We have a deal" and then trading Comrie to the Flyers. So not only does Bryan Murray not get an impact player in the deal, he gets NOTHING.

 

[Brush with Greatness 0]

Hell, I didn't realize that the Oilers were an Andy McDonald away from winning the Stanley Cup.

 

Anyone who thinks the Oilers lost this trade is a fool (probably one of the many fools who were calling Lowe an idiot for the Carter-Dvorak-Cross deal).

 

As it is, the Oilers aren't going to win the cup this year. Not with Mike Comrie, not even with Andy f'n McDonald!

 

Kevin Lowe has made it clear with his dealings the past few seasons that he is going to play it safe, load up on younger players and prospects and wait and see how the chips fall in September 2004 and beyond (which isn't a bad idea at all because they were never going to win any cups in the meantime and why go broke trying). Woiwytka and a 1st rounder help add to this young group which even includes Raffi Torres (OMG-What a bad trade that was too). Two first round picks and Andy McDonald was a pipe dream some reporter in Edmonton who overvalues Comrie dreamed up and Murray would have been stupid to pull the trigger on that deal.

 

And on top of this, where the fuck is Mike Comrie going to fit in on the Flyers. Let's take a look. Primeau, Handzus, Kapanen, Rechhi, Leclair, Gagne, Williams, Roenick, Amonte. All of those guys get at least 15 minutes of ice time a game including powerplay time (except Primeau while Williams/Kapanen split time and Recchi plays the point). So which one gets scaled back? Or is Comrie going to take over Claude Lapointe's spot while he's in rehab and play 10 min's game with no ice time on the PP.

 

Comrie's production in Edmonton was based around the opportunity to play 18 minutes a game (only one Flyer forward plays 18 minutes a game) including over 4 minutes a game on the powerplay (where he registers a third of his points). In comparison no Flyer forward has over 3 minutes/game on the powerplay. And is Hitch really going to like the way Comrie plays. Comrie was a -18 in Edmonton last year (no other forward was worse than a -8). Guys like Smyth, Marchant, Horcoff, Hemsky and Reasoner were all +'s. Not to mention Comrie's effectiveness will be scaled back because of his lack of size in the East.

 

Even if the Oilers were to get the ANDY MCDONALD~! deal, it is minimally better than what they got. Woiwytka > 1st round pick because Woiwytka is more of a sure thing on top of being more talented than most late first round picks. The other 1st round picks cancel out (although the Ducks pick should actually be slightly better depending on how the standings play out). Andy McDonald is better than the 3rd round pick. So, the rumoured yet never offered Duck deal is minimally better than what the Oil got.

 

So the Oilers should take it? Trade the player to the team he wants and set a precedent for letting the players run the team? Not to mention trading that guy to a rival team in your conference, a team which the player will undoubtly help, and the potential for the player to come back and bit you in the ass. Yeah, good fucking move.

 

There is a lot more to a trade than simply the players invovled. Yes, right now Mike Comrie is a better player than Jeff Woiwytka. However, the intangibles weigh out in the Oilers favour.

 

Hope you learned something today.

[Dogbert 0]

Woywitka.

 

And the Flames continue to roll, despite INCREDIBLY shoddy refs trying to give the Jackets the game back. There is no way in hell that the Flames took 13 penalties, and 3 almost full 5-on-3s, without some kind of crap going on with the officiating. And while I'm on the subject, I would hate to be on the Jackets' powerplay and have to face Doug Maclean now.

 

17-9-2-3. I can live with that.

[Brush with Greatness 0]

So what do you do with Roman when he gets back?

 

It looks like the Sharks gave up on Kiprusoff a bit early (which is weird considering the high praise he was receiving early in his career). Not like Vesa Toskala is hurting them or anything though.

 

Boy is there a plethora of goalies out there that no one wants. And that's because each team has a guy just as good. There is only one goalie (maybe two if you count Luongo but that's iffy) who standouts above the rest and about 25 other starters who are all even. There are probably about 10-15 backups who are as good as or better than those 25 starters. Hell, I think even Ray Emery, Ryan Miller, and Kari Lehtonen (all playing in the A) could start and be just as good as almost anyone in the league. The market for goalies seriously crashed big time.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Awesome point Brush With Greatness. Everyone's a good goaltender these days, it appears. You have your flukes (Giguere), your chokers (Thibault), your vastly overrated (Brodeur), but everyone seems to be a good goalie.

 

And Manny Legace is better than most starters.