tommytomlin 0 Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Iraqi PM shot inmates: reports Iraq's interim Prime Minister, Iyad Allawi, has been accused of shooting seven Iraqi insurgents, killing six of them, in the week leading up to the handover of power from the US last month. Two unnamed people alleged to have seen the shootings have told Australian journalist Paul McGeough that Dr Allawi shot the insurgents in a courtyard adjacent to a maximum security cell in Baghdad. Dr Allawi's office has denied the claims. (full article at ABC.net.au) Hard to really condemn him for this, considering the crimes the insurgents committed against the country, and I guess Iraq likes their leaders to bust some skulls every now and then. The article questions the source of the reports, but the Sydney Morning Herald is one of the most reputable papers in the world, and McGeough isn't exactly a rookie journalist. Still, we can't be 100% sure this is an accurate report, so we shouldn't condemn or praise Allawi just yet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Highland 0 Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Sometimes, if you want to get things done, you just have to take matters into your own hands..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jesse_ewiak 0 Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Well, I'm glad the rule of law is working perfectly there. It's not like they were in police custody or anything... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted July 17, 2004 But did he put any panties on their heads? That's the important question here... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted July 17, 2004 But did he put any panties on their heads? That's the important question here... Did they eat pork? -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest INXS Report post Posted July 17, 2004 If this is true, it's horrifying. You can't go around shooting people in courtyards for Godsakes! It's the kind of thing Saddam got upto! Jesus Christ..and some here are actually saying it was the right thing to do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted July 17, 2004 If this is true, it's horrifying. You can't go around shooting people in courtyards for Godsakes! It's the kind of thing Saddam got upto! Jesus Christ..and some here are actually saying it was the right thing to do. Because there's no more definitive witnesses than "two unnamed people" -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest INXS Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Hence why I posted "If it's true"! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Hence why I posted "If it's true"! Doesn't begin to explain the whole "You can't go around shooting people in courtyards for Godsakes! It's the kind of thing Saddam got upto! Jesus Christ..and some here are actually saying it was the right thing to do." part, though. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest INXS Report post Posted July 17, 2004 I posted with "if this is true" beforehand. So i'm commenting IF IT IS TRUE. If it isn't true, then obviously my comments aren't applicable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EricMM 0 Report post Posted July 17, 2004 Maybe they were guilty of a capital crime? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest INXS Report post Posted July 17, 2004 If they were guilty of a capital crime and they've been found guilty by a jury of their peers and the law at that time stated they should be killed by being shot in a courtyard then I guess, well, there's nothing else to be said, whether one agrees with it or not. It's worth noting that IF this happened, then it was before Iraq became "it's own country" so basically there was very little in the way of law to authorize this. This incident wouldn't surprise me if it was carried out by say other Iraqi vigilantes but this is the guy who is now the interim Prime Minister! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vyce 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 If this is true, it's horrifying. You can't go around shooting people in courtyards for Godsakes! It's the kind of thing Saddam got upto! Jesus Christ..and some here are actually saying it was the right thing to do. I don't know if it was the right thing to do, but if it was done, it may have been the necessary thing to do. Let's not kid ourselves. So much of the culture of the Middle East thrives on fear; even if we want Iraq to become a fully-functioning democracy, they'll likely have to become similar in a few ways to, say, Israel - i.e. being quick and devastating towards its enemies. And that might mean that the PM has to make examples out of some of the insurgents if that's what it's going to take to show that he's serious. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Highland 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 If this is true, it's horrifying. You can't go around shooting people in courtyards for Godsakes! It's the kind of thing Saddam got upto! Jesus Christ..and some here are actually saying it was the right thing to do. I don't know if it was the right thing to do, but if it was done, it may have been the necessary thing to do. Let's not kid ourselves. So much of the culture of the Middle East thrives on fear; even if we want Iraq to become a fully-functioning democracy, they'll likely have to become similar in a few ways to, say, Israel - i.e. being quick and devastating towards its enemies. And that might mean that the PM has to make examples out of some of the insurgents if that's what it's going to take to show that he's serious. Exactly. Their culture and customs are completely foreign to us and for all we know the Iraqis might admire a leader that takes matters into his own hands. He killed some terrorists, so what? The previous ruler of Iraq was doing far worse and in far greater numbers to his own citizens. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted July 18, 2004 I know this sounds horrible, but if this new government wants to usher in any kind of stability, then they need to do more of this stuff LIVE on TV or in the public square to show that they mean business. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Oh yes, clearly the democracy should embrace dictatorship tactics. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Oh yes, clearly the democracy should embrace dictatorship tactics. The insurgents aren't using democratic means to get across their points, why should a fragile new government have to try and restore order with lesser means? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 I thought we were here to do the dirty work while they tried to solidify their public approval. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Yeah, but something has to be done (I don't know what exactly) to let even the most hardcore Saddam loyalists that the party is over and things are going to be different. During the allied occumpation of Germany it took a very very long time to convince (or kill) the most loyal Nazi insurgents that Hitler was gone and the good guys had won. Germany didn't go instantly from goose stepping to saying "gee whiz these allied occupiers sure are swell, let's make a democracy and VW's!" I'm not an Iraqi or a Muslim so I have no idea how to put this new reality into the minds of the public and the insurgents. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vyce 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Oh yes, clearly the democracy should embrace dictatorship tactics. Obviously, I wouldn't broadcast this live on TV. But again - it's a different culture. It may take some of this extreme action in order to get the message out there that the terrorist bullshit isn't going to be tolerated anymore. You can't have it both ways. You can't criticize the Bush administration for the Iraqis not accepting us as liberaters because of a "failure to understand their culture" and then piss and moan because the Iraqi PM pops a few caps in someone to get his point across. I think my earlier statement was correct - if Iraq is going to succeed as a democracy, it's probably going to have to become a "badass democracy" like Israel, in that they don't suffer terrorist actions against them lightly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Vyce, I wasn't responding to you, so I really don't have anything to say to that. I was talking to Slam, who was endorsing that the new democracy employ the same tactics that the Taliban used to try and supress the Northern Alliance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Highland 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Another point to consider is if the US constantly does Iraq's dirty work, then the newly formed government will be seen as a puppet of the US. And yes, I'm well aware the US still has a great deal of influence over Iraq, but there's a difference between having influence and pulling the strings and it's important that the Iraqi government can show its citizens that it can deal with problems on its on, and doesn't have to turn to a foreign power to solve its problems. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jesse_ewiak 0 Report post Posted July 18, 2004 Or they could go by the rule of law instead of shooting people IN police custody. Just a wacky, radical thought. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
