Are the Momons and Jehovah's Witness' a cult?

[spman 0]

I thought this would be an interesting discussion. Not being well versed in theology myself, I thought I'd get the opinion oh those who might be. Do you feel based on their doctrine and beliefs and the Mormons and / or Jehovah's Witness' are a cult, or a legitimate branch of the blankenetd term we call Christianity. I am not familliar with the beliefs and practices of the Witness', but from what I know about Mormons, I fully beleive they are a cult. Joseph Smith was a con man, even people in his own time said that. His doctrine should have been declared bullshit the second he revealed he was unable to reporduce the original translation of his tablets. Unlike the more steamline Christianity, there is no historical or archaeological evidence to back up any of the claims made in the Book of Mormon. I can say with a reletive amount of assurance, that the Garden of Eden was not in Missouri, Jesus did not travel to America, he did not have multiple wives, he's not brothers with Satan, and there are only only one true group of people which can be referred to as Israelites, and the Mormons aren't it. Plus, any religion which requires mandatory donations in order to remain in good standing reeks of a cult to me. What do you think?

[Highland 0]

Mormons = Cult.

Jehovah's Witness = Not a cult, but they still annoy the fuck out of me. Still, I take their literature when they knock on my door just so they'll go away.

[Nighthawk 0]

Mormonism today owes more to Brigham Young than Joseph Smith, but he was just as bad. That's all I'll say for the moment, as I have my own religious thread to maintain.

[Guest T®ITEC]

As someone who lives in the thick of them, ...yeah. The Mormons are a cult. I have no doubt of that whatsoever.

[Guest Nanks]

A cult is really nothing more than an unpopular religion. I'd be interested in somebody presenting an argument that Catholicism isn't a cult. It teaches people to be subservient to a single figure, they ask that money be given to the cause, you're not allowed to do certain things according to the teachings.

 

All religions are cults.

[Nighthawk 0]

A cult is really nothing more than an unpopular religion.

Ah, yes, Nanks, that is the dictionary definition of a cult. Brilliant insight.

[Guest Nanks]

From Collins English Dictionary

 

cult n. 1. a specific system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and deity. 2. a sect devoted to the beliefs of a religious or other cult. 3. a group having an exclusive ideology and ritual practices centred on sacred exclusive ideology and ritual practices centred on sacred symbols. 4. intense interest in and devotion to a person, idea or activity.

 

Is that better IDRM?? That sounds like any number of mainstream religions to me. However, the word cult is generally used in reference to religions or belief systems that aren't deemed "normal". How about some of your own brilliant insight??

[Nighthawk 0]

Well, I can't just go handing out my brilliant insight like tupenny rice... but very well.

Cult is a very misunderstood idea in this culture. It is, in truth, only a word which can be applied to many things. We have cult movies and tv shows, cult books and cult bands. It involves a relatively small and relatively devoted following. Using cult as a way to talk down about a religion brings it's own set of problems, because by definition every religion is a cult. So what does this make cult? Meaningless. How can we distinguish cult, the true definitionk, from cult, the popular definition? Well, it's like this: the popular definition of cult involves relgious devotion to or based on a (wo)man. If most of your rites and doctrines are all the work of one man, you are a cult.

So here, Mormans qualify, as they are based on the teachings of Brigham Young.

JW's do as well, as they can be traced to Charles Russell, although this is less flagrant than in the case of Mormonism.

Catholics? Eh. They have a supreme overlord, but their genesis and doctrine is not rooted in his teaching, it's rooted in the Bible. Which makes them Christians in the popular sense of the word, if not the spiritual. Christian= not cult.

But wait, some semi Christian organizations are cult. The Worldwide Church of God for example (at least they used to be, they've actually cleaned up their act), basically Christianity but all run through the sift of Herbert W. Armstrong. That's the difference.

 

So, there you go. By true definition, most everything is a cult, and the word loses all meaning. By popular definition, I say we say it's rooted in one (hu)man, and by this Catholics are excluded.

 

It may interest you to know that Pentacostals are a cult by this definition as well.

[Guest Nanks]

You essentially just agreed with me.

 

Except I used the dictionary definition you wanted and you made your own interpretation. According to the dictionary definition, Christianity most certainly is a cult. It's a big one, but a cult nonetheless.

[Nighthawk 0]

You essentially just agreed with me.

I was trying to agree with you. Stunning wit. The point was that we might as well throw the dictionary definition out the window because it means something totally different than what everyone thinks it does.

 

The internet dictionary defines cult as "A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader" by the way.

[Guest Nanks]

I can no longer discern your sarcasm from sincerity.

 

That internet definition is what I originally said in more words. It's entirely a matter of perception.

[TheBigSwigg 0]

It may interest you to know that Pentacostals are a cult by this definition as well.

motherfucker.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I hate it when you're right.

[Guest Shoes Head]

Wow, a thread on organized religion? How controversial and fresh.

[Slayer 0]

When the hell did "Hardcore Discussion" become "Theological Discussion"?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

I think most people are cults myself.

[DerangedHermit 0]

When the hell did "Hardcore Discussion" become "Theological Discussion"?

Uhhhhh.......the Dames said so.

[Guest SP-1]

Jehova's Witnesses aren't Christians either. Like Mormon's their definitions of God, Christ, and Spirit are incompatible with biblical Christianity. The JW's even went so far as to alter their Bible to reflect this belief from the original manuscripts.

 

Mormon's and JW's are most certainly cults in the respect that they are not Christianity.

[Nighthawk 0]

Wow, a thread on organized religion? How controversial and fresh.

Mine was. One good trend deserves another.

[Dr. Tom 0]

A thousand followers is a cult. A thousand thousand is a congregation.

 

Anyway, yes, they're both cults. They differ quite a bit from mainstream Christianity. I'd say the Mormons are the bigger offenders, with the whole Book of Coming Forth by Day nonsense. Jehovah's Witnesses got popular because Charles Taze Russell made a bunch of end-of-the-world predictions. Despite the fact that all of them were wrong, people still kept joining his cult. Tremendous.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I bet I could get a cult together. That'd be an interesting project. Instead of a grindcore band, have a grindcore cult and keep adding more members.

[Guest SP-1]

The question is whether 2,000 people can make grindcore sound good.

 

ZING~!

Edited October 19, 2004 by SP-1

[TheBigSwigg 0]

The question is whether 2,000 people can make grindcore sound good.

 

ZING~!

Here it was I thought MushroomHead had too many members

[cynicalprofit 0]

The only difference between a cult and a religion is the number of people who follow it. So really, all religions are cults. Both of them annoy the shit outta me. Legally I think they both qualify as a religion though.

[Guest whitemilesdavis]

I think the original question was more along the lines of if Mormons and JW's fall in line with mainline Christianity, not the strict defintion of a cult.

 

The extra-biblical teachings in both religions would be enough for me to define them as a cult.

[razazteca 0]

I bet I could get a cult together. That'd be an interesting project. Instead of a grindcore band, have a grindcore cult and keep adding more members.

The KISS Army is a militant cult?

[Lil' Bitch 0]

Mormons are evil.