Meltzer on JBL's Wrestlemania opponent

[Some Guy 0]

Rock shouldn't be coming in and working a Title Program. Getting the Title of JBL should be something to a Face who is gonna stay around and benefit from it no someone like Rock who is gonna come in Win, Defend at a Smackdwon, Lose and Go back to do his Movies.

I agree in theory, but who the hell does WWE have to challenge Bradshaw? Cena is a crappy worker and Angle, Taker, Eddy, etc.. has been done to death.

 

I hated it when Rock came back and took the WCW Title from Booker and I'll hate if he comes in and takes JBL's Title.

 

That didn't bother me as much as him beating both Booker and Shane in a handicap match the next month and Booker getting emoted to teaming with Test afterwards.

 

At least Hunter around continuously to get his title Reign's instead of Rock's One Month Wonder Reigns.

 

Oh yeah? Two words: Draft Lottery.

 

I could easily see Hunter switching himself over to SD! so he could "save the show" by making a hasty face turn, putting himself over JBL, and then quickly turning heel again, you know, to make sure that the last 9 months the WWE spent building up JBL goes to complete waste. Then he could further help out the promotion by programing himself with Cena and giving him the Booker/RVD/Kane treatment. That and the return of Steph to SD! to feud with him will really help. The sad thing is that I could really see it happening, but not before he beats Batista at WM 21 and then vacates the belt, so Raw would have no credible World Champ and he could claim that Raw suckign after he left was because he wasn't there to hold it together anymore.

[clean rob 0]

This is utter bullshit.  What exactly does this mean?  If they don't think that Cena/JBL will draw or be a decent match then here's an idea: don't push the worthless fucks! 

It won't be much of a match I'd expect, but if WWE is serious about pushing Cena they really should start to nudge him into the title scene soon. Nothing is drawing that much right now anyway, but I think JBL/Cena could do a pretty good buyrate personally.

 

As far as UT/Angle goes, does anyone want to see that either?  Their previous matches have been shit, either a UT squash or Angle sneaking his bro in to cheat for him.

The match they had on Smackdown that ended in the triangle choke/pinning combination was ***1/2 or so, as I recall. I think it'd be a good match, but would be dragged down by the fact that at WM, everyone and their mother knows that Taker is not jobbing.

 

Further, Rock has no business being in a main event slot at WM.  Special appearance slot in a tag type match?  Ok.  But not fighting for a title.

Agreed. Rock wouldn't need the title in a program anyway.

 

Last, given that Rocky has been a WM job bitch of late, don't they kinda have to have him WIN this match?

Hardly. He lost at WMXX (but didn't get pinned), but won clean at both previous WMs - against Hogan and Austin, no less. He should definitely do the job and put someone over this time.

[SuperJerk 0]

If Rock faces anyone at WM, it should be Orton.

 

The match they had on Smackdown that ended in the triangle choke/pinning combination was ***1/2 or so, as I recall.

 

That was the July 4, 2002 match I mentioned.

[Angle-plex 0]

As far as UT/Angle goes, does anyone want to see that either? Their previous matches have been shit, either a UT squash or Angle sneaking his bro in to cheat for him.

Their Smackdown matches were OK, but their Survivor Series 00 match is one of the only Angle matches that I actually have trouble watching (along with Triple H, No Way Out 2002). I'd prefer he face HBK at Mania, but as of now all signs point to Big Show.

 

::shudders::

[Damaramu 0]

Ok now......I haven't watched WWE since JBL became champ and I don't really plan on doing so anytime soon so I'm out of the loop but.....doesn't anyone think Rock might eventually get rusty from his once a year work?

[cabbageboy 0]

It's the so much Rock being rusty that I object to, it's the idea of a part time guy who acts mainly nowdays coming in and getting the main event paycheck. If SMDN was a stronger show they wouldn't be in this bind.

 

To be honest I was just remembering the most notable UT/Angle matches from PPV. I had totally forgotten the SMDN matches, in fact I'm still hazy. I know I saw them, but I obviously must not have cared.

[humongous2002 0]

Vince refuses to push guys like Eddie or RVD, so he would rather give the SD main event spot to Hollywood Rocky to get that untalented Crapshaw over.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

Vince refuses to push guys like Eddie or RVD,

Yeah even though Eddie won the World Title.

[Guest combat_rock]

Call me a conspiracy nut, but I honestly believe that Eddie and Benoit's title reigns were meant to appease/fool the smarks and then sabotaged so they could say "Well, we tried, but that didn't work out!"

[SuperJerk 0]

Call me a conspiracy nut, but I honestly believe that Eddie and Benoit's title reigns were meant to appease/fool the smarks and then sabotaged so they could say "Well, we tried, but that didn't work out!"

What part of Benoit's title reign didn't work out? Business was steady.

[Guest combat_rock]

Not much, other than the big part that even while holding the biggest title in the company he was never really featured as the "main star" other than perhaps the month between WM and Backlash. I'll admit it wasn't as bad as Eddie's reign though. Plus, if his reign was so great, why was his role diminished right after losing the belt?

[Use Your Illusion 0]

Uh, because it's Vince McMahon?

[iggymcfly 0]

Everybody's role is diminished after losing the belt, that's just natural. People just acted like it was a new thing, because they missed not having anything to complain about when Benoit and Eddie were champions.

 

And for the record, I like the JBL/Rock idea. If it was me, I would have pulled the plug on JBL about 18 different times, but if he is going to be in one of the Wrestlemania main events, Rocky's about the only one that can make it interesting.

[Guest TheLastBoyscout]

As far as UT/Angle goes, does anyone want to see that either?  Their previous matches have been shit, either a UT squash or Angle sneaking his bro in to cheat for him. 

Their Smackdown matches were OK, but their Survivor Series 00 match is one of the only Angle matches that I actually have trouble watching (along with Triple H, No Way Out 2002). I'd prefer he face HBK at Mania, but as of now all signs point to Big Show.

 

::shudders::

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

[Guest Hass of Pain]

It's a bad decision. The way it looks now, Bradshaw doesn't really have many options for a high profile Wrestlemania title defense. It looks like they are going to do a slow burn with a Cena World Title feud, which I like, I think they should wait until at least SummerSlam to even give him his first title shot and drag it out even longer by the time he finally wins the title.

 

WWE seriously needs to have The Rock work with John Cena at Wrestlemania. It would be one hell of a verbal battle leading up to Wrestlemania and it would really make Cena step up his game, and it would put Cena over huge going into a program with JBL.

[tekcop 0]

Call me a conspiracy nut, but I honestly believe that Eddie and Benoit's title reigns were meant to appease/fool the smarks and then sabotaged so they could say "Well, we tried, but that didn't work out!"

That makes absolutely no sense. The general belief for Eddie's title win is that they were finally paying attention to how awesomely over he was earlier in the year and the whole Latino market thing. Benoit's title win makes less since, but it pretty simple if you think about it.

 

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

I was going to say that. That match is great stuff.

[Guest Hass of Pain]

Not much, other than the big part that even while holding the biggest title in the company he was never really featured as the "main star" other than perhaps the month between WM and Backlash. I'll admit it wasn't as bad as Eddie's reign though. Plus, if his reign was so great, why was his role diminished right after losing the belt?

Probably because Eddie proved he wasn't mentally strong enough to hold the title when he cracked a few months after winning it and was given a lesser role to take the pressure off of him. It's yet another thing the blind smart fans will blather about the unfairness of, but Eddie had his chance and blew it, and Bradshaw has taken the ball and ran with it.

 

I think the notion that WWE would use the 20th anniversary of their biggest show as a platform to deceive smart fans is insane, and I'm hoping you don't actually believe that. I'll give you that Benoit was kind of treated like an afterthought at times even as champion though, but that had a lot to do with his own limitations on the mic as well.

[Guest SoZe]

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

Unless they had another one that I'm unaware of, the match was in 02. I know because Taker was champ when that match happened, and it ended in a pin/submission spot where no one won. Real good match, but that was two and a half years ago, when Kurt was healthy, and Taker was less broken down. Really doubtful that they can replicate that one, even if it IS the biggest show of the year.

[tekcop 0]

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

Unless they had another one that I'm unaware of, the match was in 02. I know because Taker was champ when that match happened, and it ended in a pin/submission spot where no one won. Real good match, but that was two and a half years ago, when Kurt was healthy, and Taker was less broken down. Really doubtful that they can replicate that one, even if it IS the biggest show of the year.

I belive it was two weeks after SummerSlam '03. Taker beat Show and Brock in a three way the week before to earn a shot at Kurt's title.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

Couple things:

 

First, I know Cena is a hated man in these parts, but can anyone deny that he's quite possibly the most over guy in the company (at least top 3)? So that alone should be enough to make him a viable choice for WWE Champ at Mania. I know he's nothing in the ring, but really, that means nothing, so its really meaningless when talking about who should get a belt.

 

The one knock against him would be that he hasn't drawn any money yet, but then he's never been put in a position to draw, so you cant really fault him for that. And Batista will likely walk out of Mania with the other World Belt, and he's never drawn any money, so.

 

My feeling is that if they plan on having Batista win the RAW title, then they should hold off on Cena's title win for Summerslam. I really think only one World Title should change at Mania, just because if they were to have two, it would get watered down. So I'd save the Cena switch for the Summer and combine that with his movie release and really go all out with pushing him (if thats their ultimate goal for him).

 

Which leads to the JBL-Rock talk. Again, I dont get what the gripe is with that match. If JBL is to retain the title, and there's nobody left that he can beat on the SD roster (at least nobody that would be a justifiable WM main event), why not Rock? Rock is the biggest star the company has, so whats wrong with his giving a rub to the guy who has to carry the SD brand for the forseeable future? Are there better matches for Rock? Sure, but for the sake of the title and the brand, I think JBL-Rock would be a good thing.

 

Dont get me wrong, JBL wouldn't be my chouce for WWE Champion going forward, but obviously the WWE is behind him, so with that as a given, it seems like a senseable match.

[Guest Ray]

"Eddie proved he wasn't mentally strong enough to hold the title when he cracked a few months after winning it and was given a lesser role to take the pressure off of him. It's yet another thing the blind smart fans will blather about the unfairness of, but Eddie had his chance and blew it, "

 

Do you believe every rumor you read on the internet?

 

"and Bradshaw has taken the ball and ran with it."

 

Ran with it? To Where? Shitty ratings? Horrible buyrates? Bad matches? Yeah, he's sure taken that ball and ran with it...

[Guest Hass of Pain]

"Eddie proved he wasn't mentally strong enough to hold the title when he cracked a few months after winning it and was given a lesser role to take the pressure off of him. It's yet another thing the blind smart fans will blather about the unfairness of, but Eddie had his chance and blew it, "

 

Do you believe every rumor you read on the internet?

 

"and Bradshaw has taken the ball and ran with it."

 

Ran with it? To Where? Shitty ratings? Horrible buyrates? Bad matches? Yeah, he's sure taken that ball and ran with it...

Well you're just following me to every thread and being condescending aren't you.

 

I don't believe every rumor that I have read on the internet thanks, but when I read it in a 20 year running publication as respected as the Wrestling Observer Newsletter then yes, I'll take the leap of faith and believe Dave Meltzer over you.

 

Eddie Guerrero is a recovering alcoholic who's last tenure in WWE ended in a total breakdown. It's in WWE's own DVD on Guerrero and on the internet, so that's a fact. Eddie Guerrero looked tired during his WWE title reign, and EVERYONE who's established credibility on the internet (Meltzer, Keller, Scherer) said the same thing: The pressure of being champion was making Eddie crack (see: Attacking Kurt Angle, blowing up at fans at ringside) so WWE made the call to take the title off of him. If you're that blind in your love for Guerrero that you can't at least admit that had a little to do with Eddie, fine, but he wasn't fit to be champion at that time and it was right for all parties to let him get his life back in line.

 

Bradshaw has been no worse than any other WWE champion in recent memory and Smackdown pulled a pretty impressive number this week and it's only getting better. Bradshaw might not be a huge quarter hour draw just yet or a draw on the road, but everyone knows the brands are more of the draws than the wrestlers currently and it doesn't really matter who's wearing the belt. If people want to see the Smackdown brand, they'll buy a ticket. He's not drawing well on Smackdown pay-per-views, but he's improving and the brand is soft in general. I have been watching wrestling for 20 years and though at first I was skeptical about Bradshaw as champion, he and his cabinet are slowly turning into the most entertaining heels in the company and by SummerSlam he'll be the hottest champion in wrestling.

[SuperJerk 0]

Plus, if his reign was so great, why was his role diminished right after losing the belt?

Because they stupidly wanted to push Orton as a main eventer, mistakenly believing he'd be a better face champ than Benoit.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

RAW's numbers, even on PPV are no better than SD's, so JBL is no worse as champion than anyone else.

 

I know thats not a good reason to put or keep a title on someone, but at the same time, who do they reqally have that can/will do a better job.

 

Personally I feel Eddie could do a great job if he was given another chance, but even as a huge Eddie fan I can recognize that maybe he cant handle the pressures of being champ. Really, only the WWE and Eddie knows the truth with that one. But if he can handle it, I think he should eb carrying the gold and the brand.

[Guest Frank_Nabbit]

http://board.deathvalleydriver.com/index.php?showtopic=26998

[Guest TheLastBoyscout]

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

Unless they had another one that I'm unaware of, the match was in 02. I know because Taker was champ when that match happened, and it ended in a pin/submission spot where no one won. Real good match, but that was two and a half years ago, when Kurt was healthy, and Taker was less broken down. Really doubtful that they can replicate that one, even if it IS the biggest show of the year.

They had another one. Angle was champ. It was in NO. Finish was UT hit Angle with the Last Ride but Brock ran in to stop the pin.

[SuperJerk 0]

They had a match on SD in 2003 that was tremendous.

Unless they had another one that I'm unaware of, the match was in 02. I know because Taker was champ when that match happened, and it ended in a pin/submission spot where no one won. Real good match, but that was two and a half years ago, when Kurt was healthy, and Taker was less broken down. Really doubtful that they can replicate that one, even if it IS the biggest show of the year.

They had another one. Angle was champ. It was in NO. Finish was UT hit Angle with the Last Ride but Brock ran in to stop the pin.

As I already posted, they had matches on both July 4, 2002 and September 4, 2003 that were quite good.

 

If The Rock puts JBL over, when the hell's he ever going to lose the title?

 

By that point it'll have been 9 months since he won the thing.

 

As far as UT/Angle goes, does anyone want to see that either?  Their previous matches have been shit, either a UT squash or Angle sneaking his bro in to cheat for him.

Smackdown episodes from July 4, 2002 and September 4, 2003 say different.

 

SEE??????

 

[Guest wildpegasus]

About the ratings things in the last few posts here. People are forgetting how important Eddie and Rey are to Smackdown's health.

[SuperJerk 0]

If they put Rey in a title program I might actually start watching regularly again.

 

I've only watched sporadically since Big Show threw Angle off of the balcony. I could see that they were building the show around Bradshaw, one of the most boring wrestlers alive.

 

Everybody keeps talking out how he's risen to the occasion with his matches and cuts great promos, so I finally tuned in again the week he wrestled Kurt Angle, since many who'd already seen the show said it was a good match and his opening celebration/confrontation was entertaining.

 

I hated it.

 

Bradshaw simply bores the hell out of me. I hate watching him, and I certainly don't want to watch him wrestle for the world title. He only uses five or six generic hoss moves (the Undertaker is Ricky Steamboat by comparison), and his promos still don't rise above the generic "your hometown sucks/I'm better than you" heel promos.

 

Regardless of whether or not the ratings and buyrates are good, or if people will tune in just to see him get beat, but I can't stand watching him at all.

[humongous2002 0]

About the ratings things in the last few posts here. People are forgetting how important Eddie and Rey are to Smackdown's health.

Actually Eddie, RVD and Angle are the 3 guys that are getting the big ratings on SD while that undeserving shitbag JBL is responsible for turning viewers away.