UFC 51: SUPER SATURDAY~!

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

 

Tito Ortiz vs. Vitor Belfort

Tim Sylvia vs. Andre Arlovski

Evan Tanner vs. David Terrell

Phil Baroni vs. Pete Sell

David Loiseau vs. Gideon Ray

James Irvin vs. Mike Kyle

Justin Eilers vs. Paul Buentello

Nick Diaz vs. Drew Fickett

Karo Parisyan vs. Chris Lytle

 

I don't know, even with Riggs out, cancelling a match that I was looking forward to, this card looks pretty good, and it could be a "sleeper hit". No hype, but lots of potential...so long as UFC actually shows the matches that is.

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

UFC 51 Main PPV Fight Card

 

1. Paul Buentello vs Justin Eilers

 

2. David Terrell vs Evan Tanner - UFC Middleweight Championship

 

3. Andrei Arlovski vs Tim Sylvia - UFC Heavyweight Interim Championship

 

4. Phil Baroni vs Pete Sell (Swing Bout)

 

5. Vitor Belfort vs Tito Ortiz - Main Event

 

Everything else is a Prelim, which is lame, but I highly doubt they won't be shown, since you really can't fill three hours with five matches...can you?

[Styles 0]

Well, it's my last weekend home before returning to school, but I don't know if this really sounds like a "must see" card. Then again, the same thing was thought about UFC 49 which ended up being the show of the year for UFC. So...is this worth ordering or should I wait until the DVD comes out?

[AboveAverage484 0]

It's got three title fights so I say it's well worth ordering.

[Styles 0]

It's got three title fights so I say it's well worth ordering.

Heavyweight, Middleweight, ?

 

What's the 3rd?

[Lei Tong 0]

It's got three title fights so I say it's well worth ordering.

Heavyweight, Middleweight, ?

 

What's the 3rd?

Ortiz vs. Belfort is for the "Hey-At-Least-I'm-Not-As-Mentally-Weak-As-THAT-Guy" title.

[AboveAverage484 0]

Oh, yeah. Well, Ortiz and Belfort is title match quality.

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

This show is mainly for the undercard, there's something interesting about every match, save for maybe Irvin V. Kyle (Okay, not maybe). Who will emerge as a top threat in the WW division? Will Arlovski overcome Tim's reach and take it to him, as he is technically the better striker of the two? Who will win the battle of opposites, the least hyped fighter in the UFC aka Tanner or the most hyped fighter aka Terrell? Will Baroni demand the belt after he knocks out a relative unknown?

 

Really, this show will be great, if they show a lot of the prelims, that's the problem with the UFC, I don't see why you don't advertise it, since a lot of people would buy it if it had all those great matchups guaranteed for showing, as opposed to the "well, they MIGHT be on".

[Styles 0]

RRR, you around to put your stamp on this one? You've never steered me wrong before with MMA. I'm actually leaning towards ordering it, but I need that extra oompth.

 

Anyway, Dave Meltzer has posted the odds:

 

 

--Here are the latest UFC odds for tomorrow night courtesy of thegreek.com

 

Vitor Belfort -115

Tito Ortiz -105

I'm actually confident enough on this one to recommend betting Belfort, but it's far from a sure thing. Actually, UFC matches are booked evenly enough to where there are few sure things.

 

Andrei Arlovsky -110

Tim Sylvia -110

I don't know how fully recovered Sylvia is from his broken arm. Arlovsky is a real tough guy. He's giving away some size here but he's the far better fighter. I think I'd go with Arlovsky, but it's an even fight

 

David Terrell -220

Evan Tanner +180

Don't bet this one. I expect Terrell to win, but the odds are too strong in his favor to be worth it

 

Nick Diaz -185

Drew Fickett +155

I've never seen Fickett fight, but Diaz doesn't look like much when you see him, but he's a hell of a fighter and well rounded

 

Chris Lytle +100

Karo Parisyan -125

I just hope this fight makes television because on paper it's one of my favorites. I'd favor Parisyan but it could easily go either way

 

Phil Baroni -320

Pete Sell +260

Baroni should be the strong favorite here, and if he loses, he's really done this time.

 

James Irvin -175

Mike Kyle +150

Go for Irvin. He's going to win.

 

Justin Eilers -175

Paul Buentello +150

Eilers is a tough brawler. Buentello is more experienced, and I think, more skilled. If I was to bet, I'd go with Buentello taking the odds because I see this more as a pick-em, and would even slightly favor Buentello at even odds.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I didn't want to touch this, cause I don't plan on buying it. And that kills me inside. Cause this is an awesome card. I am debating whether or not to completely avoid the spoilers until I have it downloaded, but you can't simulate the excitement of watching a UFC show live, spoilers be damned. UFC is on a roll for providing good shows, I really enjoyed War of 04. UFC 49 was the card of the year. I liked Payback, but I didn't buy it. It's On was good, but I was watching it in a really weird setting. Super Natural would have been great if the main event had delivered. Revolution was really good, but I didn't buy it (got the DVD). Undisputed was great. Meltdown was great. I mean, shit, that's an amazing string of good-great shows. No company right now, MMA or otherwise, has that consistency. The only negative is that they take so long to follow up.

 

Eilers is fighting, and he could be the UFC's Heavyweigtht savior. They need another guy up there, and he has the charisma and style to be it. The guy he killed, Kyle, is fighting. And it's always fun to see him get his ass kicked.

 

Parisyan/Lytle could be a great, great match and if it is, the better show it.

 

Terrell vs. Tanner is hot. This is Terrell's chance to show the world that the Lindland fight wasn't a fluke and that he really is head and shoulders above the rest of the division. Tanners last few fights were fun to watch, as his fights with Baroni were good, his Lawler fight was good. I think he'll underestimate the sub skills of Terrell and will get caught in a Chonan-esque leg lock. This could be quick, or it could be a war.

 

I was hyped for Belfort/Ortiz in 2001, and needless to say, the hype has died down quite a bit. Ortiz didn't deliver against Cote, and Belfort has been hit-or-miss for quite a while. Tito looked timid striking against Liddell and Cote, so I imagine he'll be the same against Vitor. If Belfort ups the intensity and lays it down on Ortiz, it'll be a sweet finish. Vitor is training with BTT now, which is both a blessing and a curse. If Tito gets in control and does his GnP, there are probably more options for Vitor now to sub him. But Vitor shouldn't be looking to sub him, he should be looking for the knockout. Tito is looking for a cut stoppage, so the longer the ground game is played, the better chances of him winning.

 

Arlovski vs. Sylvia, in my eyes, is the money match here. This is going to be brutal. Someone is going to go to the hospital. And in the wake will be someone to challenge Frank Mir for the #4 best heavyweight on the planet... Ignore that last part...

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

Hmm, I disagree with Meltzer a lot on this one. My picks:

 

Ortiz V. Belfort: People keep talking about how Belfort is so much better on paper than Ortiz, and I think that's bullshit. Tito is an *excellent* grappler, and will be able to take Vitor down at will. He'll just pound on him, as Tito is better on top than Vitor is on his back. Combine that with the fact that Tito actually does have pretty good striking (hard to tell when he's facing two excellent strikers in Liddell and Couture), and I see him as being better on paper. Vitor has great striking, but it's very straight forward and can be solved, ala Couture or Liddell. Will Ortiz be able to outstrike him? No, but he can stand with him till he finally gets the takedown. Belfort has really never shown great sub skills, and I don't think that's going to change now after a few months with BTT. If Vitor happens to catch him with one shot while standing, he'll win, but I don't think that will happen, so I pick Ortiz. It will be Randy-Vitor III all over again.

 

Arlovski is a much more skilled fighter than Tim Sylvia, but Tim has that reach, and I don't think Arlovski wants to take this on the ground. If he did he should have it in the bag, so going by the fact that he has more chances to win than Sylvia, I'll *still* take Sylvia because I don't think he'll be able to get through that long reach. But who knows, maybe he's smartened up, and I think he would be the guy to lead this division, because of his vast skill set.

 

Irvin will probably KO Kyle, I don't know much about Buentello so I can't really pick that fight.

 

I think Lytle will *beat up* the "Heat". He's too good of a striker and his ground game is underrated, he's never lost a non-decision and Karo doesn't exactly have good cardio.

 

Diaz should walk through Fickett, I wish Sean Sherk was in this position instead of Fickett, the UFC should give him another chance.

 

Baroni should KO Sell, but funny enough if you go to his website, his "fans" have actually picked Sell to sub him as the overwhelming end to the fight.

 

Tanner should beat Terrell, I don't know what Meltzer is talking about here. His striking is better, his wrestling is better, his ground game is not, but he's competent enough to survive. Combine that with the fact that he has much more experience, and his claim to fame is NOT KO'ing a *wrestler*, and I think he should take it in a brutal war. I don't think Terrell will be able to sub him, though he's much better in that facet of the game.

 

I wish I could watch this live, but I can't find a bar that's airing, so I will have to wait a bit too.

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

 

How can you bet against this man?

[Brush with Greatness 0]

Unfortunately, prior commitments allowed me to only catch the Baroni-Sell fight and the main.

 

IMO, I thought Vitor edged out Tito in the first round (as well as the second) and by the UFC 10 point must system, Vitor should have won the decision. Now going by any other standard, I thought Tito deserved to win the fight.

 

Indeed though, where do Baroni and Belfort go from here?

[Quit Calling My Mama 0]

I really liked Terrell/Tanner and Ortiz/Belfort was awesome.

 

 

 

Looks like Baroni is pretty much done for now.

[Styles 0]

Just watched the show. Another good one from UFC.

 

Really close main event, but I would give the edge to Tito since he finished so dominent and Vitor was clearly gassed in the 2nd. Maybe Vitor goes to Pride for the tournament? Boy, Tito sure knows how to set himself up in negotiations but making 2 big rematches people want to see after his contract fight.

 

Arlovski is the man. I was sad to see Sylvia go down so quick since I like him, but hopefully he'll recover. Mir vs. Arlovski in June?

 

Baroni is done. Sell won the first round, I'd give Baroni the second, and he was wining the 3rd, got lazy and got choked out. Sell should be back.

 

My respect for Evan Tanner grows (as does his hair!) a just total domination ass whipping on the over hyped David Terrell. Tanner vs. Lindland?

 

The first 2 matches were just slugfests but both were nice knockouts, including Buentello dropping Eiliers into a Flair Flop!

 

I'd like to see the prelims though, probably will pick up the DVD when it comes out for that.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

The Eilers KO was hysterical. It's like his body didn't know he was knocked out, and it took a second to register before he finally fell. Evan Tanner was incredible with the way he hung in there. Terrell had that guillotine on for 20-30 seconds, and he had it on tight, but Tanner just refused to quit and managed to fight his way out. And when Tanner was G&P'ing the shit out of Terrell, it was quite the sight to see Terrell covering up, and not knowing what the hell to do.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Yeah, I don't use the words "Beat the shit out of him", but Tanner BEAT THE SHIT out of Terrell. My god that was some pretty pretty.

 

Godammit, if they cut all the c-level celeb oogling they would have been able to show another match. We have 2 problems in PPV right now. PRIDE cuts way too much out, and UFC leaves way too much in. The "too much", of course, is fluff.

[AboveAverage484 0]

Don't count Ortiz out of the Pride GP either. That was his last fight on his UFC contract. Entering the GP may be a big gamble for him, but if enough money is thrown his way I suspect he'll enter.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Tito knows that PRIDE would set him up to lose in the first round. He'd just use PRIDE as leverage to get a bigger contract in the UFC. Zuffa should ignore him, IMO. They invested so much in hyping him up in the early days and he really fucked em over. He doesn't fight the style that Zuffa is trying to promote, and he lost a lot of credibility after losing 2 straight. Invest that time in someone else.

[Styles 0]

Tito knows that PRIDE would set him up to lose in the first round. He'd just use PRIDE as leverage to get a bigger contract in the UFC. Zuffa should ignore him, IMO. They invested so much in hyping him up in the early days and he really fucked em over. He doesn't fight the style that Zuffa is trying to promote, and he lost a lot of credibility after losing 2 straight. Invest that time in someone else.

But what about the Ortiz vs. Shamrock vs. Liddell 3 way dance they're setting up?

[AmericanDragon 0]

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Watching Ortiz/Belfort, Belfort took round 1 and 2, don't care what happens in round 3, under the UFC scoring he should have won.

 

Looks like the Iceman may be sniffin a lil snow, man.

[AboveAverage484 0]

Belfort/Ortiz should have been a draw.

 

First round was even, second round to Belfort, third round to Ortiz.

 

Can't remember if UFC does extra rounds or not.

[Brush with Greatness 0]

Looks like the Iceman may be sniffin a lil snow, man.

 

Our thoughts exactly when we were watching it.

[AboveAverage484 0]

Tito knows that PRIDE would set him up to lose in the first round. He'd just use PRIDE as leverage to get a bigger contract in the UFC. Zuffa should ignore him, IMO. They invested so much in hyping him up in the early days and he really fucked em over. He doesn't fight the style that Zuffa is trying to promote, and he lost a lot of credibility after losing 2 straight. Invest that time in someone else.

You can't ignore the fact that Ortiz is the biggest draw the UFC has. Every PPV they have with Ortiz, they make 500k more than ones without him.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

You mean 50,000.

 

I question Tito's drawing power right now. I think with every loss and boring fight his stock goes down. I don't get why people assume Ortiz/Sham will make the same numbers as it did before.

 

Meanwhile, I love me the commentary team of Couture, Goldberg and Rogan. Couture is hilarious.

[Guest NCJ]

Did you think the fight with Vitor was boring RRR, or is that a general statement. Honestly I think Tito is actually more viable as a top draw than ever because of the way he is playing the heel. People legitamately want to see him destroyed, and right now it is just a matter of who catches him while he is hot. Liddell and Shamrock vs Ortiz will both do bigger numbers than any other ppv that the UFC can put together outside of(or maybe even including) a Silva vs Couture matchup.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I thought the first round was good, and I was more impressed with Vitors sprawl than anything in the entire match.

 

He already got destroyed by Chuck, and he already destroyed Shamrock. I don't get why there would be rematches as there was no questions left open and Tito (or Ken) hasn't improved enough to warrant "that was then, this is now".

 

My point is that they shouldn't spend the time in promoting him any more, but rather, use that time to build someone else. Someone new. Someone that could have legs and won't make you worry about hijacking the division.

[AboveAverage484 0]

No, I mean 500k. And as for Tito not fighting the "UFC style" right now, his style is pretty much the same as Randy's. Takedown, GNP, elbows, punches, etc.

 

I actually find Randy a bit less exciting than Tito.

[Guest NCJ]

I thought the first round was good, and I was more impressed with Vitors sprawl than anything in the entire match.

 

He already got destroyed by Chuck, and he already destroyed Shamrock. I don't get why there would be rematches as there was no questions left open and Tito (or Ken) hasn't improved enough to warrant "that was then, this is now".

 

My point is that they shouldn't spend the time in promoting him any more, but rather, use that time to build someone else. Someone new. Someone that could have legs and won't make you worry about hijacking the division.

At this point Ortiz is pretty well established. I don't think you throw all of your marketing muscle behind him, but you atleast keep him around because he is easily your most over heel. To use a wrestling example RVD's contract was running out, and despite the fact that he dosen't work the WWE style, they were in the middle of roster cuts to save money, and probably have no intention(and honestly no substantial reason to since he has already been buried repeatedly and he has dogged it for the last 2 years) to push him in the future they still put the money up to resign him. Why? Because he was still somewhat of an asset, and they didn't want the competition TNA, ROH, and Japan to pick him up. In Ortiz the UFC actually has an RVD who consistently draws their biggest crowds and 2nd largest ppv buys when they are strugling to pull 60,000 buys for incredible cards like UFC 49. You have to admit it makes sense to keep him especially with Pride talking about moving into the U.S. and any Pride card in the U.S. that is headlined by Tito Ortiz versus Silva, Rampage, Randelman, or Mirko just to give a few examples would be a definate sellout.