The latest twist in the Schiavo case.......

[Guest Arnold_OldSchool]

 

Schiavo Receives Communion, as Protests Continue

Sunday March 27, 2005 5:59pm

 

Pinellas Park, Fl. (AP) - A priest has been allowed in to a Florida hospice to bring Terri Schiavo communion.

 

He said the brain-damaged woman's mouth was too dry to receive the communion wafer, though she did receive sacramental wine. He conveyed the news to the crowd gathered outside the hospice, drawing applause and cheers.

 

It's day ten since the woman's feeding tube was removed. And her family is disputing comments by their lawyer that she has passed the point where she can't recover.

 

Demonstrations have continued throughout the day. Police say they've made a total of 38 arrests in recent days. The situation is forcing a nearby school to send students elsewhere this week - in an effort to protect them from the scene.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

TERRI IS NOT IN ANY TYPE OF VEGETATIVE STATE!

 

THESE PICTURES AND QUOTES FROM DR. RONALD CRANFORD PROVE IT! CRANFORD IS A DEATH CULT MEMBER WHO TRAVELS AROUND THE COUNTRY TESTIFYING EVERYONE IS PVS AND TO REMOVE LIFE SUPPORT! HE LIED UNDER OATH STATING TERRI WAS PVS AND WAS UNRESPONSIVE!

 

 

Many people believe that Terri Schiavo has had “the best of care,” and that everything has been tried by way of rehabilitation. This belief is false. In fact, Terri has had no attempts at therapy or rehabilitation since 1992, and very little had been done up to that point. Terri has not even had the physical therapy most doctors would regard as normative for someone in her condition. The result is that Terri suffers from severe muscle contractures, which have caused her body to become contorted. Physical therapy could remedy this, but husband Michael has refused to provide it.

 

Terri has also suffered from what many professionals would regard as neglect. She had to have several teeth extracted last year because of severe decay. This decay was caused by a lack of basic dental hygiene, such as tooth-brushing. She also developed decubitus (skin) ulcers on her buttocks and thighs. These ulcers can be prevented by a simple regimen of regular turning: a basic nursing task that any certified nurse’s aide can perform. The presence of these easily preventable ulcers is a classic sign of neglect. Bob and Mary Schindler have repeatedly complained of Terri’s neglect, and have sought to remove Michael as guardian on that basis. Judge Greer was unmoved by those complaints as well.

 

 

BAD MEDICINE

And, quite apart from the question of Terri’s therapy and care, it is entirely likely that Terri has never been properly diagnosed. Terri is usually described as being in a Persistent Vegetative State (PVS), and indeed Judge Greer ruled as a finding of fact that she is PVS; but this diagnosis and finding were arrived at in a way that has many neurologists expressing surprise and dismay.

 

I have spent the past ten days recruiting and interviewing neurologists who are willing to come forward and offer affidavits or declarations concerning new testing and examinations for Terri. In addition to the 15 neurologists’ affidavits Gibbs had in time to present in court, I have commitments from over 30 others who are willing to testify that Terri should have new and additional testing, and new examinations by unbiased neurologists. Almost 50 neurologists all say the same thing: Terri should be reevaluated, Terri should be reexamined, and there are grave doubts as to the accuracy of Terri’s diagnosis of PVS. All of these neurologists are board-certified; a number of them are fellows of the prestigious American Academy of Neurology; several are professors of neurology at major medical schools.

 

So how can Judge Greer ignore the opinions of so many qualified neurologists, some of whom are leaders in the field? The answer is that Michael Schiavo, his attorney George Felos, and Judge Greer already have the diagnosis they want.

 

Terri’s diagnosis was arrived at without the benefit of testing that most neurologists would consider standard for diagnosing PVS. One such test is MRI (Magnetic Resonance Imaging). MRI is widely used today, even for ailments as simple as knee injuries — but Terri has never had one. Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one. The neurologists I have spoken to have reacted with shock upon learning this fact. One such neurologist is Dr. Peter Morin. He is a researcher specializing in degenerative brain diseases, and has both an M.D. and a Ph.D. in biochemistry from Boston University.

 

In the course of my conversation with Dr. Morin, he made reference to the standard use of MRI and PET (Positron Emission Tomography) scans to diagnose the extent of brain injuries. He seemed to assume that these had been done for Terri. I stopped him and told him that these tests have never been done for her; that Michael had refused them.

 

There was a moment of dead silence.

 

“That’s criminal,” he said, and then asked, in a tone of utter incredulity: “How can he continue as guardian? People are deliberating over this woman’s life and death and there’s been no MRI or PET?” He drew a reasonable conclusion: “These people [Michael Schiavo, George Felos, and Judge Greer] don’t want the information.”

 

Dr. Morin explained that he would feel obligated to obtain the information in these tests before making a diagnosis with life and death consequences. I told him that CT (Computer-Aided Tomography) scans had been done, and were partly the basis for the finding of PVS. The doctor retorted, “Spare no expense, eh?” I asked him to explain the comment; he said that a CT scan is a much less expensive test than an MRI, but it “only gives you a tenth of the information an MRI does.” He added, “A CT scan is useful only in pretty severe cases, such as trauma, and also during the few days after an anoxic (lack of oxygen) brain injury. It’s useful in an emergency-room setting. But if the question is ischemic injury [brain damage caused by lack of blood/oxygen to part of the brain] you want an MRI and PET. For subsequent evaluation of brain injury, the CT is pretty useless unless there has been a massive stroke.”

 

 

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=67870

 

Michael Schiavo Plans to Cremate Terri

 

Michael Schiavo has taken steps that will prevent investigators from examining Terri Schiavo's body for evidence of abuse after she dies – a suspicion her family has repeatedly raised as her death grows more imminent.

 

Schiavo's attorney George Felos told the Washington Post on Friday that Terri will be cremated and buried in a plot owned by Michael's family in Pennsylvania.

 

Terri's parents had filed a request with the court to block the cremation plans, saying it would violate the religious beliefs of their daughter, who was a practicing a Catholic.

 

But as with every other motion filed in the case on behalf of Bob and Mary Schindler, the Florida courts have rejected the request.

 

A 1991 bone scan performed on Terri Schiavo showed unexplained injuries to her vertebrae and legs.

 

Terri's brother, Bobby Schindler, told Fox News Channel's "Hannity & Colmes" on Thursday that a doctor has testified that she might have been strangled before she was found unconscious in her home in February 1990.

[Slickster 0]

Arnold_OldSchool, your sources in re: Terri's physical condition are contradictory to the official report produced by the State of Florida for the purposes of this case.

 

Also, citing RUMORMILLnews as a legitimate source doesn't exactly help your credibility.

[Slickster 0]

You don't find his decree that she'll be IMMEDIATELY cremated (her family wants an autopsy followed by a Catholic burial) somewhat questionable?

-=Mike

Mike, the State of Florida's official report on the case mentions the alleged abuse and injuries she sustained. However, the damage she suffered was found to be consistent with what happened when she fell down after her heart attack.

 

I'm speculating that he wants her cremated so this whole thing is over. Who knows what some fanatics might do with her body?

[Boon 0]

I don't like the trend that's developing of posting entire news stories and adding nothing to them, citing nothing and basically making your entire post a news story. If you're going to quote a news story, at least add something relevant or cite something important.

[Rob E Dangerously 0]

The Schindlers want an autopsy to see if they can be given any explanation for what caused her problems that led to all of this.

http://www.metronews.ca/reuters_international.asp?id=64237

 

Schiavo to Undergo Autopsy to End Debate - Lawyer 

By Jane Sutton

 

PINELLAS PARK, Fla. (Reuters) - The husband of brain-damaged Florida woman Terri Schiavo has ordered an autopsy after she dies to silence allegations his plan to cremate her body is aimed at hiding something, his lawyer said on Monday.

 

As supporters of Schiavo's parents took their fight to prolong her life to Washington 10 days after her feeding was stopped, Michael Schiavo's lawyer, George Felos, said her pulse had become "thready" and she had not passed urine for a while -- a possible sign of approaching death.

 

He said Michael Schiavo, who has been pitted against the parents in a seven-year legal conflict over whether to allow Schiavo to die, requested an official autopsy to show the "massive" extent of the brain damage she suffered in 1990.

 

"We didn't think it was appropriate to talk about an autopsy prior to Mrs. Schiavo's death," Felos told reporters outside his law office in Dunedin, Florida.

 

"But because claims have been made by, I guess, opponents of carrying out her wishes that there was some motive behind the cremation of Mrs. Schiavo we felt it was necessary to make that announcement today."

 

Disagreement over the planned cremation rather than the full burial demanded by Schiavo's Roman Catholic parents has been a subplot to the long legal battle.

 

The fate of the woman, who has been in a persistent vegetative state since suffering cardiac arrest, has become a cause for Christian conservatives and drawn in Congress, President George W. Bush and his brother, Florida Gov. Jeb Bush.

 

State courts have accepted testimony from Michael Schiavo and others that she did not want to be kept alive artificially, but her parents, Bob and Mary Schindler, disagree, and maintain she tries to communicate with them.

 

Pressured by the Christian right, Congress passed a special law that allowed the Schindlers to take their case to federal court, and President Bush cut short a vacation to sign it.

 

The effort proved in vain as court after court -- all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court -- rejected a flurry of petitions since the feeding tube was disconnected on March 18.

 

Nevertheless, supporters of Bob and Mary Schindler again appealed for federal or state intervention.

 

"This is about the soul of our nation, the soul of our church," said Michael McMonagle, spokesman for the Pro-Life Union of Southeastern Pennsylvania, as around two dozen protesters gathered in a park across from the White House.

 

Outside the hospice in Pinellas Park, Florida, where Schiavo is being cared for, the protesters were dismissive of Michael Schiavo's plans for an autopsy.

 

"It's a way to cover his behind," said Randall Terry, an anti-abortion activist speaking for the Schindlers.

 

Bob Schindler, who has at times asserted his daughter was in her final hours and at others maintained that it was not too late to intervene, said earlier she was "fighting like hell."

 

Doctors said when the feeding tube was disconnected that she would likely last for up to two weeks without sustenance.

 

Schindler said Schiavo was beginning to look like a Nazi "concentration camp" survivor and voiced a fear that hospice staff might try to hasten her end by giving her an overdose of morphine.

 

"We do not hasten death in any way, nor do we prolong life. That is not our role," said Louise Cleary, a spokeswoman for the Hospice of the Florida Suncoast.

 

Felos said Schindler's fears were misplaced. He said Schiavo was not on a morphine drip but had received two "minuscule" 5 milligram doses of the opiate since March 18.

 

He said he visited her on Monday and she looked peaceful and calm.

 

"Mrs. Schiavo's pulse is described by the nursing staff as thready. Also she has had no urine output since last night," Felos said. Doctors say a lack of urine would be an early indication that Schiavo's kidneys are shutting down.

 

"I saw no evidence of any bodily discomfort whatsoever. It doesn't appear from at least me seeing her, and you know I'm not a doctor by any means, but it doesn't appear her death is imminent but it's just impossible to say," Felos said.

 

We'll see what the next demand is

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

THAT MICHAEL SCHIAVO IS SOMEWHAT QUESTIONABLE

[SuperJerk 0]

I read on CNN that the Schindlers were claiming that Terri got up this morning and cooked everybody breakfast, but as soon as she went to drink the orange juice that she'd squeezed herself, police officers stormed the room and hand-cuffed her saying she if drank it then she would be violating the court order.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Okay, not really, but this is about what her family's crazy stories are coming to.

[Guest Arnold_OldSchool]

The Family said today that they can't believe terri's still fighting, and that her eyes are saying "help me."

 

Doctors also gave her morphine to numb the pain she is supposedly not feeling.

[SuperJerk 0]

Great, now her eyes are going to get called by Congress to testify.

[2GOLD 0]

Great, now her eyes are going to get called by Congress to testify.

 

I wish they would, at least then it would mean SOMETHING OF INTEREST WAS HAPPENING!

 

This story is about as exciting as someone reading the minutes at a Town Hall meeting.

[NoCalMike 0]

Some Idiot on Fox was being interviewd saying Terry was trying to say "I want to live" to them....jeez, as people get more desperate, the bullshit meter continues to rise off the meter.

[Slickster 0]

[NoCalMike 0]

I know this is sort of off topic, but I find it ironic that this small number of protestors have received more coverage then all the nationwide protesting done on the two year anniversary of Shock & Awe.

[Guest Vitamin X]

I find it ironic that all the protesting still hasn't meant absolutely jackshit.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Shock and Awe was fuckin' cool though this is just gay

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

While "We Are Idiots" is obviously the focal point, I think "Judge Greer = Poo Head" on the left is the high watermark.

[2GOLD 0]

While "We Are Idiots" is obviously the focal point, I think "Judge Greer = Poo Head" on the left is the high watermark.

 

I like the lady who included O.J on her sign. Gee, she really loves to stay current. I'm surprised she didn't include some priests from the Spanish Inquistition just to REALLY stay up with the times.

 

As for God's will, if God wants her alive then it can wake her up. Then we can shoot her for being a zombie.

 

It's a win win situation for everyone involved.

[Hogan Made Wrestling 0]

The sign on the right of the picture looks like something from maddox.xmission.com

[Jobber of the Week 0]

More

 

DeLay's Own Tragic Crossroads

Family of the lawmaker involved in the Schiavo case decided in '88 to let his comatose father die.

By Walter F. Roche Jr. and Sam Howe Verhovek

Times Staff Writers

 

March 27, 2005

 

CANYON LAKE, Texas — A family tragedy that unfolded in a Texas hospital during the fall of 1988 was a private ordeal — without judges, emergency sessions of Congress or the debate raging outside Terri Schiavo's Florida hospice.

 

The patient then was a 65-year-old drilling contractor, badly injured in a freak accident at his home. Among the family members keeping vigil at Brooke Army Medical Center was a grieving junior congressman — Rep. Tom DeLay (R-Texas).

 

More than 16 years ago, far from the political passions that have defined the Schiavo controversy, the DeLay family endured its own wrenching end-of-life crisis. The man in a coma, kept alive by intravenous lines and oxygen equipment, was DeLay's father, Charles Ray DeLay.

 

Then, freshly reelected to a third term in the House, the 41-year-old DeLay waited, all but helpless, for the verdict of doctors.

 

Today, as House Majority Leader, DeLay has teamed with his Senate counterpart, Bill Frist (R-Tenn.), to champion political intervention in the Schiavo case. They pushed emergency legislation through Congress to shift the legal case from Florida state courts to the federal judiciary.

 

And DeLay is among the strongest advocates of keeping the woman, who doctors say has been in a persistent vegetative state for 15 years, connected to her feeding tube. DeLay has denounced Schiavo's husband, as well as judges, for committing what he calls "an act of barbarism" in removing the tube.

 

In 1988, however, there was no such fiery rhetoric as the congressman quietly joined the sad family consensus to let his father die.

 

"There was no point to even really talking about it," Maxine DeLay, the congressman's 81-year-old widowed mother, recalled in an interview last week. "There was no way [Charles] wanted to live like that. Tom knew — we all knew — his father wouldn't have wanted to live that way."

 

Doctors advised that he would "basically be a vegetable," said the congressman's aunt, JoAnne DeLay.

 

When his father's kidneys failed, the DeLay family decided against connecting him to a dialysis machine. "Extraordinary measures to prolong life were not initiated," said his medical report, citing "agreement with the family's wishes." His bedside chart carried the instruction: "Do not resuscitate."

 

On Dec. 14, 1988, the DeLay patriarch "expired with his family in attendance."

 

"The situation faced by the congressman's family was entirely different than Terri Schiavo's," said a spokesman for the majority leader, who declined requests for an interview.

 

"The only thing keeping her alive is the food and water we all need to survive. His father was on a ventilator and other machines to sustain him," said Dan Allen, DeLay's press aide.

 

There were also these similarities: Both stricken patients were severely brain-damaged. Both were incapable of surviving without medical assistance. Both were said to have expressed a desire to be spared from being kept alive by artificial means. And neither of them had a living will.

 

This previously unpublished account of the majority leader's personal brush with life-ending decisions was assembled from court files, medical records and interviews with family members.

[SuperJerk 0]

Slickster's Burger King sig pwnz me.

 

 

That is all.

[Guest MikeSC]

I know this is sort of off topic, but I find it ironic that this small number of protestors have received more coverage then all the nationwide protesting done on the two year anniversary of Shock & Awe.

I find it ironic that it received about as much coverage as Martha Burk's protest at the Masters a few years back received --- yet has many more people involved.

 

If that helps.

 

Oh, and Jobber, there are some dramatic differences in Delay's story and this one, not least of which that the entire family wanted Delay's father, who was on a ventilator et al, to pass away while there was CONSIDERABLE disagreement as to what to do to Schiavo, who was NOT on a ventilator et al.

 

But feel free to use non-comparable stories to attack Delay. Better than having to deal with the left's almost perverse pleasure in Terri's death.

-=Mike

[Jobber of the Week 0]

the left's almost perverse pleasure in Terri's death.

Jesus, you sound like an idiot. I'm just going to wait for "Why do you guys like death so much?"

 

You have managed to take an opposing side in an issue where there is no opposing side, and there is logically no way you can take the other side. I don't see issues like that very often, but this is one and you've managed to do the impossible.

[Guest MikeSC]

the left's almost perverse pleasure in Terri's death.

Jesus, you sound like an idiot. I'm just going to wait for "Why do you guys like death so much?"

The pleasure and joy over her death eminent in people, such as yourself's, comments about it are obvious.

-=Mike

[Jobber of the Week 0]

The pleasure and joy over her death eminent in people, such as yourself's, comments about it are obvious.

-=Mike

I'm afraid of death insomuch as I don't want to die but try to not think about the depressing aspects of it enough to keep from scarring my mind for life.

 

You've simply managed to abandon fact and logic in exchange for lunacy. You've chosen prolonged death over a dignified life because it doesn't hurt or affect you personally at all.

[NYU 0]

No one is thrilled over having to see this woman die. It's more so a necessary evil than anything else.

 

You will do ANYTHING to pin an unfortunate situation on the fault of the Left.

[Guest MikeSC]

The pleasure and joy over her death eminent in people, such as yourself's, comments about it are obvious.

        -=Mike

I'm afraid of death insomuch as I don't want to die but try to not think about the depressing aspects of it enough to keep from scarring my mind for life.

 

You've simply managed to abandon fact and logic in exchange for lunacy. You've chosen prolonged death over a dignified life because it doesn't hurt or affect you personally at all.

You decided that she needs to die because, darn it, it will make those evil Bible thumpers upset.

-=Mike

[NYU 0]

You can't honestly believe that. I'd rather think you're grasping for straws at this point than feel that you've misinterpreted this debate that badly.

[Guest MikeSC]

You can't honestly believe that. I'd rather think you're grasping for straws at this point than feel that you've misinterpreted this debate that badly.

No, that is a firm belief. There is a definite joy in killing this woman --- and the blatant attempts to clean up what is happening with the use of deceptive language (we're "letting her die" ---- by starving and dehydrating her) show that the people who want her dead know how wrong they are here.

-=Mike

[Stephen Joseph 0]

Hi MikeSC,

 

I feel she should be let go from this world, but I'm not feeling any JOY about it.

 

You're really losing the ability to make a coherent argument when you resort to inferring other's emotional feelings. Doesn't work, and you should know better, since that's a strategy the Democratic party has used in the past.

 

The government should have never gotten involved in this affair to the extent that it did. To suggest it should have goes against anything that I used to believe Republicans stood for.

 

Again, perhaps its best to let the accusations just die. Because otherwise, it's just getting silly.

[EricMM 0]

Why are you even addressing Mike with this so-called REASONING.

 

He is a lunatic, as previously stated. He is the INXS of the right, as I have previously stated, and if the previous posts in this thread don't convice anyone of that, then I dunno whatever could.

 

Mike. People want this woman to die because she is GONE. She has no cerebral cortex anymore. Her heart still beats and her hands still move but she is no longer her own person. Her CC has atrophied so I mean, that's it. Thats your personality, your memories. All this other stuff in our brain isn't as important as the part that makes me, me.

 

(the part that makes you, you, is clearly not as important, it's BAD. you should probably look into a full frontal. Seriously. or like, stop posting nonsense.)