Christian is OVER

[Maztinho 0]

Cena is over, but this thread is about Christian and his overness. Christian has been one of my little delights for years now.

 

His humor is sort of underkeyed and goofy. Like when (the Dudleys?) jacked his gear and Jericho's and the two had to go out in towels, then the next week you see duffel bags suspended in lockers with like fifteen chains on them and all kinds of padlocks.

 

They didn't even mention the bags or if it was it was in passing, but that visual image had me roaring with laughter.

 

It's about time that people started getting in with the Christian Coalition.

[Brett Favre 0]

Hey, if he can win over those fans, good for him.

 

You mean, MOST of the fans? You make it sound like there's only a few of those fans. Try nearly everybody in the arena.

 

Compare the Eddie chants during a match to Cena's for a moment though and tell me who's more over than who. If the fans aren't routing for him during matches, they're not into his ring work. All they're into him for are the catchphrases and hang signals. And when they run out, he's got the exact same problem Rock always had...fans'll dump on him more and more until he ends up in a Lesnar/Rock situation. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Christian was the Lesnar to Cena's Rock if they meet.

 

Compare Cena's reaction on the mic to Eddie's. But heck, Cena last week was getting lets go Cena chants throughout the match. Everytime he hits his five moves of doom, the crowd pops. They pop for the sneaker pump, the pop for the five knuckle shuffle, they pop for the "You can't see me" taunts, and they pop for the FU. Fact is, he's over. That's the bottom line. Last year at around this time, people thought Cena would burnout by now. Wrong.

 

One, what difference does that make. Short match or long, surely fans should care about what he's doing in the ring? Two...similar sounds to Christian's matches. Like when they routed for him against Batista?

 

Like I said, the fans clearly care about his moves. And they rooted for him against Batista in England? What about the restholdfests with Benoit, Jericho, and any other person he's jobbed to the last few months? Clearly fans didn't care as much as they would a Cena match.

 

And three...sure, he's compared to Rock and Austin because he's over. The comparisons are pretty weak though. I'd compare him more to Dusty Rhodes, actually, for pretty obvious reasons.

 

Right now he's getting Rock/Austin level reactions, whether you ignore them or not.

[Promoter 0]

When was the last time anyone went to a televised smackdown or ppv? I went to a smackdown last year and I was shocked how sheep people were with Cena. When I saw the show on tv it didn't do it justice. I was saying to myself at the arena that Cena aint that great why the hell is he getting CENA CENA sheep chants for coming to the damn arena to promo against Booker T.

 

People aren't looking at things the other way. Batista defends his title against Christian and he isn't the popular one in the match. I still want to see if Batista will keep his heat when he's not facing Triple H. Cena the wwe KNOWS is over because they already tested him as US Champion. I think Eddie will always be ovr, but he has a stigma to him that Cena doesn't yet which was being a midcarder for so long. Cena does have to watch out for fans turning on him if he doesn't keep to promos like last week's.

 

I also think all the damn unnecessary jobbing with Christian has made him the underdog fans want to see come out on top. The guy is entertaining and much more deserving of a push than cardboard Edge.

[Dark Age 0]

Eddie is/was more over than Cena. Look no further than the 6 man tag team match a few weeks before Mania for the most glaring example of this.

[Promoter 0]

You see I think the wwe looks at the big picture and more than just a weekly thing. Cena was easily giving Eddie competition in popularity last year as US Champion. Hell, personally I think Cena has become too ridiculous with the over the top stuff since he turned face, but the guy is still very over. Cena is getting a bit of backlash now with even the general audience because of the forceful nature the wwe has pushed him since Royal Rumble with the "Chain Gang" nonsense. I bet if they try to turn Cena heel the fans will start cheering him harder. It's the lameness of Cena's character that's messing him up lately. At WrestleMania I still believe having friggin Austin's first appearance in a year and Hogan's first wrestling "action" in over a year hurt Cena and Bradshaw(not that I'm complaining). Eddie in comparison didn't seem too popular either, but those two are the biggest draws of all-time.

[King Cucaracha 0]

Hey, if he can win over those fans, good for him.

 

You mean, MOST of the fans? You make it sound like there's only a few of those fans. Try nearly everybody in the arena.

 

Compare the Eddie chants during a match to Cena's for a moment though and tell me who's more over than who. If the fans aren't routing for him during matches, they're not into his ring work. All they're into him for are the catchphrases and hang signals. And when they run out, he's got the exact same problem Rock always had...fans'll dump on him more and more until he ends up in a Lesnar/Rock situation. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Christian was the Lesnar to Cena's Rock if they meet.

 

Compare Cena's reaction on the mic to Eddie's. But heck, Cena last week was getting lets go Cena chants throughout the match. Everytime he hits his five moves of doom, the crowd pops. They pop for the sneaker pump, the pop for the five knuckle shuffle, they pop for the "You can't see me" taunts, and they pop for the FU. Fact is, he's over. That's the bottom line. Last year at around this time, people thought Cena would burnout by now. Wrong.

 

One, what difference does that make. Short match or long, surely fans should care about what he's doing in the ring? Two...similar sounds to Christian's matches. Like when they routed for him against Batista?

 

Like I said, the fans clearly care about his moves. And they rooted for him against Batista in England? What about the restholdfests with Benoit, Jericho, and any other person he's jobbed to the last few months? Clearly fans didn't care as much as they would a Cena match.

 

And three...sure, he's compared to Rock and Austin because he's over. The comparisons are pretty weak though. I'd compare him more to Dusty Rhodes, actually, for pretty obvious reasons.

 

Right now he's getting Rock/Austin level reactions, whether you ignore them or not.

 

1. You're right, they pop for the gimmicky moves and taunts. When they run out, he's flat out screwed. The fact he has to rely on them means he'll NEVER reach Austin and Rock's levels, as they were SO much better in the ring.

 

Okay, you're obviously a mark for the guy, so good for you. He's NOWHERE NEAR Rock and Austin levels though. Go watch some 99/2000 and tell me Cena is as over as them. Seriously. Putting him in Austin and Rock's category puts him in the same category as Hogan. Please don't tell me you're doing that.

[Brett Favre 0]

I never said he's at Rock or Austin's status, I said he's getting Rock/Austin level reactions, which isn't a stretch. Eddie was getting them last year.

 

And most of the Rock's popularity came on gimmicky moves and taunts. People's Elbow, people's eyebrow, a shitload of catchphrases, the just bring it taunt.

[Promoter 0]

I honestly think Cena might be like HBK in 1995, but is more mainstream. I think it's also fair to say Cena is at Austin early 1997 levels. The potential is there for him to reach their status, but it all depends on how he works to improve himself. Christian on the other hand seems like he is getting Batista's kind of heat a few months back. The potential is there for him to be the bust out player this year although Batista could still increase. Each year someone steps up. Orton WAS that guy until they ruined him post SummerSlam.

[King Cucaracha 0]

I never said he's at Rock or Austin's status, I said he's getting Rock/Austin level reactions, which isn't a stretch. Eddie was getting them last year.

 

And most of the Rock's popularity came on gimmicky moves and taunts. People's Elbow, people's eyebrow, a shitload of catchphrases, the just bring it taunt.

Nobody's getting Austin reactions. Watch Mankind/Rock for when Austin comes out, watch Austin vs. Dude at Over The Edge, watch any of the Austin/McMahon skits...nobody's close. Rock, I could maybe agree with.

 

And you're right, most of Rock's overness did come from those things. What happened when creative ran out of them though? He became staler and staler until he was asking people how their lips were. And people turned on him. Until he turned heel and became fresh again. The difference is, Rock could cut it in the ring and had that to carry him when fans turned on him. He was knowledgeable enough and talented enough to change his style when his hand was forced. We'll see if Cena can soon I guess.

[Guest JerichosHi-Lite]

Kind of off-topic here, but I've been reading through this thread and I have to say, I never understand why people compare Rock's reactions with Stone Cold's reactions. Sure, Rock was popular but not in a million years would he ever have compared to Austin. Austin was THE GUY in the company at one point. Not even one point, for years. Even now his ovations still top anything the Rock ever got.

 

No disrespect to the Rock, but I've never seen him in Austin's league where a lot of people do

[Dimensions 0]

Kind of off-topic here, but I've been reading through this thread and I have to say, I never understand why people compare Rock's reactions with Stone Cold's reactions. Sure, Rock was popular but not in a million years would he ever have compared to Austin. Austin was THE GUY in the company at one point. Not even one point, for years. Even now his ovations still top anything the Rock ever got.

 

No disrespect to the Rock, but I've never seen him in Austin's league where a lot of people do

I was always under the impression that Rock and Austin were the guys for the WWF at the time. I think at each's heights they had the same thunderous ovations but Austin got more of those ovations on a consistent basis since people had a tendency to boo Rock when I got stale depending on the opponent. While, if I remember correctly, Austin never got booed when he was face I think even after he got stale. Maybe when the crowd was split when he faced the Rock, but other than that I can't say.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

You won't find reactions in the WWE today that match reactions in 2000/1999. It was a different kind of over then. I was shocked to shit when watching matches from 2000 and how the fans reacted to the Rock compared to how they react to anyone today.

[Guest JerichosHi-Lite]

Kind of off-topic here, but I've been reading through this thread and I have to say, I never understand why people compare Rock's reactions with Stone Cold's reactions. Sure, Rock was popular but not in a million years would he ever have compared to Austin. Austin was THE GUY in the company at one point. Not even one point, for years. Even now his ovations still top anything the Rock ever got.

 

No disrespect to the Rock, but I've never seen him in Austin's league where a lot of people do

I was always under the impression that Rock and Austin were the guys for the WWF at the time. I think at each's heights they had the same thunderous ovations but Austin got more of those ovations on a consistent basis since people had a tendency to boo Rock when I got stale depending on the opponent. While, if I remember correctly, Austin never got booed when he was face I think even after he got stale. Maybe when the crowd was split when he faced the Rock, but other than that I can't say.

But I think it sums it all up that Rock v. old-age Hogan, Rock gets booed, Rock v. Lesnar, Rock gets booed, Rock leaves for films, gets booed. Austin walks out on the company, a far worse sin than anything Rock's ever committed, and still gets hero's welcomes everywhere

[Promoter 0]

Overall, Austin was always more popular. The thing with The Rock though was there were times when he had the crowd eating out of his hands that even Austin couldn't do. Anyone remember the time Rock came walking down the aisle and the crowd was heavily responding to him? I think it was the first time he did "It doesn't matter what your name is" to the camera man. The Rock was a walking promo that night and I have never seen anything like it since. Another thing is that The Rock seemed like he learned from Austin's promo style. The mannerism and catchphrase points were taken from Austin imo. The Rock's downfall was that he started to do promos where it didn't really make you want to see the match. Austin on the other hand made you want to see his matches and his promos seemed less by the numbers for the most part in 1998-2000.

 

I know some will disagree, but the way Rock was booked has something to do with his fall in popularity as well. I still think Rock being a choker when it counted made him seem inferior to Austin who always backed his talk. It's a little thing, but it wa a big thing. Rock jobbing at WM 16 was the height of his popularity and has never been there since. Austin at Backlash that year with Rock winning is the pinnacle of btoh men's face heat imo. They went downhill from there. However, for guys like Cena and Batista to get there will be very hard to say the least.