Campaign 2008

[snuffbox 0]

Joe Biden has no relevance to American presidential politics/elections...just as the Beatles have no relevance to American presidential politics/elections.

[Guest Felonies!]

Oh, okay. Good one. I thought you meant Joe Biden was bigger than Jesus.

[Dr. Zaius 0]

The guy, like Teddy, is the quintessential Senate lifer: too flawed for any legitimate chance at the White House (manslaughter: Ted :: PLAGIARISM! : Biden), but does enough good for his state that he'll always be elected. Also, never ever shuts the fuck up.

 

I know using Wikipedia as a source is frowned upon, but citations are used at the end of the passage, and the material looks legitimate to me. If this is true, then the plagarism charges are nonsense that deserve to be ignored.

 

After Biden withdrew from the race, it was learned that he had correctly credited Kinnock on other occasions but failed to do so in an Iowa speech that was recorded and distributed to reporters by aides to Michael Dukakis, the eventual nominee. Dukakis fired the senior aide responsible, but the damage had already been done to Biden. [9] [10]

 

It has also been alleged that Biden had plagiarized while in law school 20 years earlier in a first-year legal-writing class. Unaware of appropriate standards for legal briefs at the beginning of his legal training, Biden used a single footnote rather than multiple citations required to cite five pages from a legal article. Both Syracuse University Law School and the Delaware State Bar Association cleared Biden of plagiarism charges.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biden#1988_Pr...ential_Campaign

[snuffbox 0]

The planet where apes evolved from man = Delaware.

[SuperJerk 0]

The planet where apes evolved from man = Delaware.

"Its a mad house! A mad house!"

[Dr. Zaius 0]

God damn you all to hell.

[SuperJerk 0]

Get your stinking paws off me, you damn dirty ape.

[SuperJerk 0]

To clear up something from earlier...Kerry got the 2004 nomination because he was seen as the safe choice. By taking safe, ambiguous, low-profile positions, Kerry was able to look like an experienced and knowledgable moderate.

 

Also, the last page or so of arguing is pretty moot considering there's no way Biden will be the nominee. He's smart to start early and try to build up some name recognition, but I don't see any faction within the Democratic Party that would be willing to make Biden their standard bearer.

 

Here's how I see it...Feingold gets the idealists, Hillary gets the women (if she runs), and moderates will probably back Bayh or Warner. There's your fucking primary campaign right there.

[Dr. Zaius 0]

Following your logic about Bayh from earlier in the thread, Bob Graham should've been the 2004 Democratic nominee.

[SuperJerk 0]

Kerry was taller.

[Gary Floyd 0]

Lieberman to Run Regardless of Primary Results

 

From Dana Bash

CNN

 

 

Monday, July 3, 2006; Posted: 9:21 p.m. EDT (01:21 GMT)

 

 

Connecticut Democratic Sen. Joe Lieberman says he thinks he'll win his ballot spot in the primary.

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Sen. Joe Lieberman has a backup plan (1:40)

YOUR E-MAIL ALERTS

 

Joe Lieberman

Connecticut

Democratic Party

Senate

or Create Your Own

Manage Alerts | What Is This? WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Sen. Joe Lieberman, D-Connecticut, facing a tough challenge in the Democratic primary, is launching a separate petition effort to get on the November ballot as a precaution in case he does not win.

 

Lieberman campaign manager Sean Smith said Lieberman's priority is to win the Democratic nomination in the August 8 primary for the office he has held since 1989.

 

But if he loses the primary to Ned Lamont, a Greenwich businessman and former city councilman, Lieberman could still get on the ballot by petition. (Watch senator describe his backup plan to get on the ballot -- 1:40)

 

Connecticut law requires 7,500 registered voters' signatures by August 9 in order for an independent candidate to have a place on the November ballot -- and running as a petitioning Democrat is an option.

 

Lieberman denied his 'plan B' candidacy would mean breaking with the Democratic Party.

 

Lieberman told CNN he expects to win the August vote but added: "Nothing is guaranteed in politics or elections, and so I'm essentially taking out an insurance policy."

 

"I am very loyal to the Democratic Party, but I have a loyalty higher than that to my party. That is to my state and my country," he said.

 

Lamont's campaign blasted Lieberman's announcement, accusing the veteran senator of trying to "hedge his bets and game the system."

 

Lamont campaign chief Tom Swan said in a written statement: "Lieberman has done this because he recognizes the strength of our campaign and the depth of support we have built in less than four months."

 

Lieberman was on the phone Monday morning informing Senate colleagues, including Minority Leader Harry Reid and fellow Connecticut Democrat Chris Dodd.

 

A Lieberman adviser said internal polls show him with a slight lead against Lamont.

 

"This is a tight race," the adviser said. "Who knows how many Democrats are going to turn out on August 8. The entire state has elected him three times, and they should have the chance to do it again."

[Guest Felonies!]

The guy, like Teddy, is the quintessential Senate lifer: too flawed for any legitimate chance at the White House (manslaughter: Ted :: PLAGIARISM! : Biden), but does enough good for his state that he'll always be elected. Also, never ever shuts the fuck up.

 

I know using Wikipedia as a source is frowned upon, but citations are used at the end of the passage, and the material looks legitimate to me. If this is true, then the plagarism charges are nonsense that deserve to be ignored.

 

After Biden withdrew from the race, it was learned that he had correctly credited Kinnock on other occasions but failed to do so in an Iowa speech that was recorded and distributed to reporters by aides to Michael Dukakis, the eventual nominee. Dukakis fired the senior aide responsible, but the damage had already been done to Biden. [9] [10]

 

It has also been alleged that Biden had plagiarized while in law school 20 years earlier in a first-year legal-writing class. Unaware of appropriate standards for legal briefs at the beginning of his legal training, Biden used a single footnote rather than multiple citations required to cite five pages from a legal article. Both Syracuse University Law School and the Delaware State Bar Association cleared Biden of plagiarism charges.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biden#1988_Pr...ential_Campaign

Well, yeah, he's cleared his name to a certain extent, but it's one of those little Tonight Show monologue-type things that's going to keep dogging him nonetheless. For whatever it's worth, I don't think Joe Biden should be knocked out of contention because he didn't credit the British PM correctly in '88, I think he should be knocked out of contention because he's a rambling jackass. Even if I was the leftiest of leftists as I watched the Roberts and Alito hearings, I'd probably be yelling "OH JUST GET TO THE FUCKING POINT ALREADY!" at my television.

 

I'll give credit where it's due, though: when he said to Alito "you don't impress me...(clears throat)...you don't impress me as the kind of man who would say these things you've been accused of saying by some members of the committee," man, that's a rhetorical knockout punch right there. Though he distances himself from Drunken Ted and appears as a reasonable moderate, he makes sure to phrase "I don't get the impression that you're" as "you don't impress me as," so that we all remember it out of context: Biden saying that Sam Alito doesn't impress him.

 

Still: rambling jackass.

[Danville_Wrestling 0]

The Economist last year ran a good story in their Lexington section about how a good Democratic ticket would be Mark Warner and Joe Biden because Warner brings the domestic credentials and the executive experience while Biden brings the Washington insider experience and foreign policy know-how. It was an interesting read to say the least.

 

All things considered, though, Biden is at BEST a vice-presidential nominee just to appease the base if a moderate gets elected in the primary but he does bring some baggage to the table.

 

As far as the Lieberman story above goes, it doesn't matter if Joe wins the primary or runs as an independent because he's going to win that seat anyway. Polls show that his lead in a general election is much larger than the lead he currently holds in the primary. Furthermore, I don't see Lamont as a candidate who can get enough votes to unseat Lieberman because even with all the cash he's got coming in from anti-war activists it's very tough to unseat a tenured senator, especially one as prominent as Lieberman. I think this race is interesting, though, for the simple reason that it shows the internal war that is brewing in the Democratic party over its activists and higher ups because the activists want to replace any sitting Congressman who has supported Bush on almost anything while the higher ups continue to back solid candidates like Lieberman. Either way, if Lieberman somehow loses this primary the Democrats just shoot themselves in the foot because Lieberman will win the general election race and then they can't claim his seat to establish a Senate majority.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

He won't win the general if he loses the primary.

 

The Dems will split the vote and it'll be enough to give the Republican the seat.

 

That's why Dems are pissed at him.

[snuffbox 0]

Joe Lieberman needs to be informed that Al Snow was back on television last night with the mannequin head...that promotes violence against women!

[2GOLD 0]

The planet where apes evolved from man = Delaware.

 

You are giving my state way too much credit. Way too much. And if someone by the name of Ruth Ann Minner ever rises for the Democrats, eliminate her quickly. Bitch is a worthless nightmare.

[Guest Felonies!]

He's applying it to all the wrong things, but at least Joe Lieberman has some integrity. In spite of supporting the war and video game censorship, I can't really dislike him. It's weird.

[EricMM 0]

2GOLD is from DE?

 

Hell, it's a good place to buy things. But man, it's the south to the north (of MD)

[Dr. Zaius 0]

For whatever it's worth, I don't think Joe Biden should be knocked out of contention because he didn't credit the British PM correctly in '88, I think he should be knocked out of contention because he's a rambling jackass.

I'll confess that's a fair point.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Biden's candidacy can probably be defined by the overwhelming indifference that most Americans show towards him. I think my name ID is within the margin of error of his, and unfortunately, his poll numbers will probably get even worse once people actually figure out who he is.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

On the plus side, though, if Biden were to somehow beat the odds and win the presidency, we would undoubtedly win the War on Terror. After eight years of Joe Biden being the face of America, surely the rest of the world would forget we exist.

[SuperJerk 0]

So is the plan for this thread to pretty much cycle through and bash all of the possible candidates one by one?

 

 

If so, I'm in.

[Danville_Wrestling 0]

He won't win the general if he loses the primary.

 

The Dems will split the vote and it'll be enough to give the Republican the seat.

 

I have to disagree with this. More voters are registered independent in Connecticut than Republicans or Democrats and I'd have to believe that Lieberman would uniquely appeal to this group outside of the primary because they can't vote in one.

 

Also, considering that turnout in primary elections in and around Connecticut is around like 20% I don't think a defeat in the primary is a loss that would condemn the Lieberman candidacy for the Senate.

 

On another note, though, does anyone think we might see a serious third party challenge in 2008? Seems that they reach their high point when an incumbent isn't in the mix.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Actually, you're full of shit. A majority of CT voters are Independent, but their numbers are only slightly more than the number of registered Democrats, and they're definitely within the averages of voter registration throughout the country. Given the typical profile of the area and overwhelming Democratic strength in Presidential elections, there are probably a large number of people who vote straight Democrat even though they're registered as an Independent. The disparity will certainly be enough to split the vote and hand deliver the state to the Republicans.

 

http://www.sots.ct.gov/ElectionsServices/l...EnrollStats.pdf

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

And as for a third party candidate, no, not really. The only time there's a really significant third party is when there's a split within one of the existing parties (i.e. Perot leaving the Republicans, TR leaving the... Republicans, etc.)

[Quasar 0]

And as for a third party candidate, no, not really. The only time there's a really significant third party is when there's a split within one of the existing parties (i.e. Perot leaving the Republicans, TR leaving the... Republicans, etc.)

 

Didn't George Wallace take most of the South with the "Dixie-crat" party?

 

Anyway, I'm really hoping for Mark Warner to run for President, he's what the party needs now. I wouldn't mind seeing John Edwards run again either, he shouldn't have run in 2004 and instead spent all of the time building his Senate resume. I get a real Kennedy vibe from John Edwards. Edwards is a great speaker and a highly intelligent man but he may have fucked himself over by running too soon.

[Art Sandusky 0]

Wallace ran under the banner of the American Independent party. Strom Thurmond and the States' Rights party in 1948 were the Dixiecrats you're thinking of. My southern born and raised grandmother was the only person in her precinct in New York City to vote for the guy.

[Dr. Zaius 0]

And as for a third party candidate, no, not really. The only time there's a really significant third party is when there's a split within one of the existing parties (i.e. Perot leaving the Republicans, TR leaving the... Republicans, etc.)

John Anderson in 1980 would be a better example than Mr. Perot. Ross Perot didn't leave the Republican Party, because you can't leave something you were never a part of.

 

Some people, I think, assumed Perot was a Republican because he was (a) a rich business man, and (b) was from the south. Look at his platform, though. He was for radical tax increases, heavy protectionism, increased government involvement in economy, and he was pro-choice. Many of Perot's supporters fit a stereotypical demographic profile of typical Republican voters, but that's pretty much where the similarities begin and end. Polling done during the 1992 presidential campaign show that he drew almost equally from both parties.

[Guest Felonies!]

Anyway, I'm really hoping for Mark Warner to run for President, he's what the party needs now. I wouldn't mind seeing John Edwards run again either, he shouldn't have run in 2004 and instead spent all of the time building his Senate resume. I get a real Kennedy vibe from John Edwards.

God, you really jack it to handsome Democrats! Their sunny optimism and high rankings from People magazine are gonna TAKE BACK OUR WHITE HOUSE!

 

What do Kennedy and Edwards have in common beyond party affiliation and a killer smile? Edwards built himself up from practically nothing to become a successful litigator and Senator, whose political views have been shaped by his own experiences. JFK was born into his dad's bootlegging fortune, and is a liberal because that's what you do when you're a paternalistic New Englander.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Killer smiles can't win elections, but I truly do feel that sunny optimism is a big help. In fact, sunny optimism counts for at least 40% of your average "outsider" candidate. It can hold the base without ostracizing people who don't agree with every single one of your positions.

 

Dubya was a fairly sunny candidate at one point, too. The press grilled him for it, but it probably had to do with him being the son of a President while running an outsider campaign with the edge of a goofy guy image.