Bill Bennett:

[Special K 0]

Of course.

[Art Sandusky 0]

At least he didn't call hurricane survivors "scumbags." No one's THAT dumb, right?

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

Ripper check this out:

 

http://www.shootproject.com/thepit/index.php?showtopic=1066

 

Devil's advocate over there would be to criticize the guy.

[SuperJerk 0]

Why are we even debating the merits of his argument? If we curbed the population of Native Americans it would go down too, and they're how tiny a part of the population? Or all the Welshmen. Or all the left-handed people. Or fatties.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

http://www.fbi.gov/filelink.html?file=/ucr...xl/03tbl2-5.xls

 

Apparently the FBI doesn't keep stats on Welshmen, left-handed people, or fat people. However, it DOES keep stats on black people.

 

Bennett was not advocating aborting black babies (as originally reported). He was actually arguing the opposite. Bennett's only crime here is pointing out that a LOT of crimes are committed by black people. He did NOT say that most black people are criminals. He did NOT say that only black people are criminals.

 

 

5,729 murders were committed by African-Americans in 2003. That's a lot. Admitting this does not make you a racist.

 

 

________________

 

I find this disturbing:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/09/30/bennett.comments/

 

[Rep. Bobby] Rush called on "my friends, the responsible Republicans" to rebuke the former Cabinet official by backing a House resolution condemning his remarks as "outrageous racism of the most bigoted and ignorant kind."

 

Congress condemning a private citizen for expressing an opinion is one step away from government censorship.

 

We cannot possibly solve America's social problems if everytime someone says something honest about the state of African-Americans, they are condemned by the government for doing it.

 

________________

 

Ripper check this out:

 

http://www.shootproject.com/thepit/index.php?showtopic=1066

 

Devil's advocate over there would be to criticize the guy.

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I actually agree with Mike for once.

[Perfxion 0]

How is it that its not a bad comment when he used the word BLACK. Bringing race into it made it a racist comment. There is no way around it. No way to spin it. If he had another meaning, which he did, it fell on deaf ears when he smartly added the word black.

 

Blacks make up the most convicted group of murders in this country. And like half of that number comes from Slum New Orleans and Detroit. Blacks themselves don't make the highest number of criminals in this country, simply because there are less of us.

 

The one thing I don't understand is that whites and blacks are the big two groups, yet hispanics are not on the list. That fucks everything up. How does like 30+% of the population not get in this spread sheet?

[SuperJerk 0]

More like 14%.

 

http://www.census.gov/popest/states/asrh/SC-EST2004-04.html

 

Hey, I don't make the charts.

[Ripper 0]

Y2Jerk.

 

I know that he isn't advocating it, but it was completely pointless to bring race into the equation. That is the argument here.

 

whites commit 70 percent of the crime in this country. I under stand that 37 percent being committed by 9 percent of the population is pretty high, but you have to take into account that its poor people killing poor people. That is going to happen no matter what race, and where. Bottomline, saying that abortion cut crime rates is a truer statment. Aborting all white babies actually is a more valid point. He made a piss poor argument, pointlessly brought in race and he is being called out on it.

 

I KNOW he didn't agree or say "We should kill all the black babies" he was making a point. And did a shit job of doing it.

 

And seriously. I don't discuss anything in the CE folder at the other board. I feel sorry for Eric. You can't win a fight with racist no matter how hard you fight. They are too stupid to realize that they are losing.

[2GOLD 0]

Aborting white babies doesn't have shock value. Aborting black babies is shock value. He's probably still a racist fuck but in terms of shock value, you go with the black babies.

 

Hell, saying "kill all the white babies" might have got him some votes...what was Bill thinking?

[SuperJerk 0]

Y2Jerk.

 

I know that he isn't advocating it, but it was completely pointless to bring race into the equation. That is the argument here.

 

Bennett never said nor implied black people are responsible for all of the crime in this country.

 

The reason I'm willing to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt is that nothing he has done or said in his career until now could ever possibly be construed as racist. I don't agree with his desire to intermingle government and religion, but Bennett's heart is in the right place. Here's a man who genuinely wants to help people, but is caught in a controversy because people are too scared to be honest about the state of black America.

 

I don't agree with the mindset that says that bringing race into an equation automatically makes you a racist.

[Ripper 0]

I didn't say he was racist. I didn't say that he implied that black people are responsible for all the crime in this country. I said, that by bring blacks into the equation he turned his argument from what it was intended to do to it being about race.

 

And the state of black america is perfectly fine. You want to talk stats, 20 percent of the people that go to war and defend this country are black, and blacks still only make up 9 percent of the population while the percentage of whites that enlist and serve drops more every year.

 

but of course that doesn't matter because blacks make up 37 percent of the crime and we have to stare at that TRUTH about black america. Because that is the TRUTH.

[Toshiaki Koala 0]

Ripper check this out:

 

http://www.shootproject.com/thepit/index.php?showtopic=1066

 

Devil's advocate over there would be to criticize the guy.

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Great - four pages of Mike and Marney sucking each other's political dicks. Why would anyone go there?

[Dr. Tom 0]

whites commit 70 percent of the crime in this country.  I under stand that 37 percent being committed by 9 percent of the population is pretty high...

So 107% of the crime in America is committed by Whites or Blacks?

 

Wow, the other ethnic groups actually lower the crime rate. It must be the Jews...

[Ripper 0]

Damn you Tom and your new aged math. I meant blacks are responsible for 27 percent of the crime.

[SuperJerk 0]

I said, that by bring blacks into the equation he turned his argument from what it was intended to do to it being about race. 

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Hey, if you want to have an argument about the amount of crime committed by blacks, then let's have the argument. Don't condemn him just for bringing the subject up.

[Guest Fishyswa]

It's definitely racist, we know crime is bad, he indirectly suggests black people cause crime, we're left with black people are bad. Not saying it was his intent to suggest that or it's how he feels, but the thought itself is racist.

 

If someone asks me a great way to sell watermelon, and I bring up black people, there's some racism there. Color was irrelevant to the discussion.

[SuperJerk 0]

he indirectly suggests black people cause crime

 

But he didn't say that getting rid of blacks would hypothetically end all crime, just make the crime rate drop. And that wasn't even his point either, he was just repeating a theory someone else had proposed and saying it was inhumane and immoral to abort babies just to lower the crime rate.

 

Mathematically, if you take the amount of the crime that blacks commit, and eliminated it altogether, you end up with a lower crime rate.

[Guest Fishyswa]

It applies to any race or group of people. Why be specific to make the point when it's irrelevant?

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

It applies to any race or group of people.

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No, it doesn't. If you eliminated all white babies, the crime rate would actually go up.

[Guest Fishyswa]

Sorry for not being specific, seemed incredibly unneccesary, but if you eliminate any group or race PHYSICALLY CAPABLE of commiting a crime, the crime rate would go down.

 

Sorry for the confusion....

[Vyce 0]

Considering who Bennett is, and who he used to run with, don't you think the right-wing would be doing something more along the lines of distancing themselves from this? Instead they defend him! Which just paints the right with an even wider brush that they are all rich white bigots.

 

You know, if you want to get topical, I could point out how many liberals defend Cindy Sheehan, even though at this point it's glaringly apparent just how mentally disturbed she is, and that only serves to paint the left with a wide brush that they either are, or at least sympathize with, dangerous, irrational socialists.

 

Here's my problem with criticizing Bennett: I don't care if people want to roast his nuts over a fire for saying what he did, because as I said in the thread on the OTHER board, even if there is some statistical truth in his words, his remarks were stupid and poorly made (to make an understatement) and there was no way in hell they were going to be received any way other than they were. But for that bitch Nancy Pelosi, or for Harry Reid, to DEMAND that the White House condemn and apologize for the remark is pure lunacy.

 

That's in addition to Y2Jerk's point about how Congress shouldn't be condemning someone just for voicing an opinion. It's not the job of Congress to be silencing unpopular (even racist) speech, and it's not the White House's responsibility to apologize for every stupid move that some conservative makes.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Considering who Bennett is, and who he used to run with, don't you think the right-wing would be doing something more along the lines of distancing themselves from this? Instead they defend him! Which just paints the right with an even wider brush that they are all rich white bigots.

 

You know, if you want to get topical, I could point out how many liberals defend Cindy Sheehan, even though at this point it's glaringly apparent just how mentally disturbed she is, and that only serves to paint the left with a wide brush that they either are, or at least sympathize with, dangerous, irrational socialists.

 

Here's my problem with criticizing Bennett: I don't care if people want to roast his nuts over a fire for saying what he did, because as I said in the thread on the OTHER board, even if there is some statistical truth in his words, his remarks were stupid and poorly made (to make an understatement) and there was no way in hell they were going to be received any way other than they were. But for that bitch Nancy Pelosi, or for Harry Reid, to DEMAND that the White House condemn and apologize for the remark is pure lunacy.

 

That's in addition to Y2Jerk's point about how Congress shouldn't be condemning someone just for voicing an opinion. It's not the job of Congress to be silencing unpopular (even racist) speech, and it's not the White House's responsibility to apologize for every stupid move that some conservative makes.

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You might be surprised to hear that I agree with you on many of your points. This really isn't THAT much of a hot topic issue considering there are alot more important things to deal with these days. However, defending this dolt isn't going to make Republicans look any better in the racism department. No matter how many stats and figures right leaning people use to try and justify his talking this crap it was still a shitty thing and WRONG thing to say. Worthy of no more of a response than "You know what Bennett? You are a fucking asshole. Fuck off. Nobody is going to listen to you again." But the scary thing is there are people defending him as in that believe he is right to have said what he did. And that is just plain dumb.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

Sorry for not being specific, seemed incredibly unneccesary, but if you eliminate any group or race PHYSICALLY CAPABLE of commiting a crime, the crime rate would go down.

 

Sorry for the confusion....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm not following you...

 

I'm saying that if you physically removed all white people from the US, ceteris paribus, the crime RATE would go UP.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

The one thing I don't understand is that whites and blacks are the big two groups, yet hispanics are not on the list. That fucks everything up. How does like 30+% of the population not get in this spread sheet?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sometimes Hispanics are considered white. That's why some statistics you will see have categories like "White (Non-Hispanic). I would say that Hispanics are lumped in w/whites in this stat.

[Guest Fishyswa]

"I'm not following you...

 

I'm saying that if you physically removed all white people from the US, ceteris paribus, the crime RATE would go UP."

 

No, it would go down drastically, because the poor would no longer be poor.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

"I'm not following you...

 

I'm saying that if you physically removed all white people from the US, ceteris paribus, the crime RATE would go UP."

 

No, it would go down drastically, because the poor would no longer be poor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's why I said ceteris paribus--"all other things being equal."

 

And you make a good point. I would also suggest that poverty is an infinitely better indicator of "criminality" than race.

 

1/4 of American arrestees are black.

1/4 of America's poor population is black.

[The Czech Republic 0]

HOW CAN WE STILL BE DISCUSSING HYPOTHETICAL GENOCIDE SITUATIONS???

[SuperJerk 0]

...HYPOTHETICAL GENOCIDE...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think I just found my new username.

 

 

"I'm not following you...

 

I'm saying that if you physically removed all white people from the US, ceteris paribus, the crime RATE would go UP."

 

No, it would go down drastically, because the poor would no longer be poor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

WTF kind of logic is that?

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Yeah, everyone knows that the Asians would come in and take all the money anyways.

[SuperJerk 0]

**cough**Oprah**cough**

[The Czech Republic 0]

"I'm not following you...

 

I'm saying that if you physically removed all white people from the US, ceteris paribus, the crime RATE would go UP."

 

No, it would go down drastically, because the poor would no longer be poor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

WTF kind of logic is that?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, like this fucking thread has been a bastion of logic heretofore.