Group Discussion!

[super_tigris 0]

Tiers, but JJ already called me on that over AIM, so.

 

At first I was like, "Is that ghetto for, 'that's a good idea,'" and then I realized I'm just terrible at spelling.

 

*waisted 10 minutes typing that*

[Sly 0]

*wasted

[super_tigris 0]

No, waisted, like hip-check. Thrust your waist.

 

God, keep up with the slang. I hip-checked ten minutes of my time typing that.

[King Cucaracha 0]

I'm fucking lost.

[HollywoodSpikeJenkins 0]

The spot monkeys are lost? I'm surprised.

 

 

Just throw a 450 splash and a head bump in there and end it with a roll up.

[super_tigris 0]

The spot monkeys are lost? I'm surprised.

 

 

Just throw a 450 splash and a head bump in there and end it with a roll up.

 

Spike wins.

[Smartly Pretty 0]

Actually, I won that one.

[Toxxic 0]

I still remember when Spike wrestled Stryke and did the "two wrestlers run at right angles across the ring and keep bouncing off the ropes and missing each other and then one of them stops running and watches the other one still running" spot. You know the only other person I've seen use that in a match since?

 

Eugene.

[HollywoodSpikeJenkins 0]

It worked well with the story of the match, which was Spike and Stryke having similar sounding names.

[Toxxic 0]

Nicely done.

[the.weej 0]

Cross: Just think, that could've been a match you'd written there.

 

Anyway, if I could add something to what Toxx said, because I only ever seem to post when I'm replying to him, one of the biggest reason midcarders/upper midcarders haven't won the title is because most of them freak out at the idea of being in the main event. There is, for reasons I cannot functionally internalize, this crazy idea among many writers that they aren't any good and that they do not "deserve" to be in the main event. There is also the bizarre perception that the world title somehow involves more effort.

 

My advice to people is to allow their egos to start swelling and hold a disproportionate belief of how good their writing talent actually is. Kibagami, Johnny and Spike all thought this way, and hey, two out of three ain't bad.

 

-Z

[super_tigris 0]

Part of it involves an overall lack of people paying attention. From my perspective, I write a promo I felt wasn't all that bad and sort of saved a slowly dying storyline and got maybe 1 comment. Spike wrote a promo that was awesome and got 15 responces? If mine is inferior, at least tell me so I know what I'm doing wrong, instead I get 35 looks with a big old 0 next to it. That doesn't help.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

Champions can request a defense against any opponent at any time. However, they cannot dodge an opponent by requesting a match against another opponent of lower-tire status when theirs a challenger who has earned a title shot.

I wanted to speak on this real quick, and I know that probably everybody else in the fed is going to think the very idea is ridiculuous, but it actually happened to me my first year in the fed, so I want to ask in case it happens again: suppose that a champion decides that he wants to be booked against me in a title match... Why? Who knows: at the risk of sounding full of myself, maybe he wants to "cement his legacy" at my expense. For example, say Bruce Blank wins the WHC sometime in the near future: we've never been booked against each other and have no history, but WC is a well-established character, and Blank wants to "legitimize" his reign by starting off with a title defense against someone that's been booked for the past few years as a "perennial contender," so he asks CC to book him against WC in a title match... I think that I can beat Bruce, but I don't want the Heavyweight Title; I also don't want the loss on my record... do I have to accept the match? I'm asking mostly because, with the possible exception of Drea, I'm probably the only writer here who doesn't consider winning the Heavyweight Title to be an "ultimate goal," so it would probably never occur to CC if the WHC requested a match against another writer that the "challenger" might not want it.

 

As a rookie, Craven asked to be booked against me for the US Title, and I didn't want the US Title, but I didn't want the loss. Eventually, since I was a newb and had no clout, I ended up being booked for the match... and no-showed. When I bring WC back, I haven't decided what I want to do with him beyond the very short term, but I know which way I'm leaning, and don't necessarily want to be "persuaded" to do something else. What are my options in this circumstance?

 

- Dub "and it's entirely possible that I completely mis-read that entire remark in the first place" Cee

[Toxxic 0]

I actually second Zed's remark. It's not quite as true this time through because I've got the tag thing going on as well, but certainly in Toxx's last run I found that when I became World Champion the amount of matches I was booked in dropped off drastically.

[Toxxic 0]

And I'll add an agreement to Dub-Cee. Certainly with Toxxic it'd be fine, because if I'm using Toxxic then I'm in this full-time and out for anything I can win. When i was using TORU and Amy though it was more about being involved but not doing anything that took too much effort if I didn't want it.

 

Then again, with TORU and Amy I wasn't really precious about their win/loss records, so maybe it's not quite the same.

[super_tigris 0]

I never really cared about a win/loss record, and the reason I don't is the exact reason people shouldn't. Striving to be a better writer requires you to lose and learn. Of course, if you're already established, it doesn't matter, but at the same time, if you're a great writer like Toxx or Dub Cee, you shouldn't decline a match against maybe a younger, possibly better writer (not saying either of you have or would). Dub Cee basically pulled the one sentence of that entire aspect of my masterpiece of rambling - because there are other things that keep that aspect in check, you just pulled one aspect and assumed you made a valid point (look again, there are things that in itself prevent that from happening without that being put to a stop).

 

In short, because I'm rambling (and we've seen the product of such on the page before this), win/loss record shouldn't matter. I've had a similar experience as Dub Cee when I faced Landon in a cage match for what seemed like almost no reason maybe my 3rd or 4th competitive match into the fed (and hell, I don't even know that those matches WERE competitively won). I took that as a learning experience and knew I was going to lose, because four people told me the 4 days before I wrote that match that I would be losing no matter what. I still wrote, I tried my best, and I learned from it. What else can you do? It's an online fed, and no one should give two shits about their win/loss record unless they're being legitmately screwed on their record. The fed as a whole should care more about how they write.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

Uhm...

 

I'm pretty sure at this point that I misunderstood your previous post, but I'm also pretty certain that you misunderstood mine. It wasn't a question of win/loss record; it was more a matter of I don't want to be put in a position where I would no-show against a champion just because I don't want his belt, and I don't necessarily want to write myself to lose a title match against a guy I think I can beat, just because I don't want his belt, or even for storyline purposes: the last time I jobbed a title on purpose to advance a storyline, the guy I jobbed it to up and quit without dropping the belt, so I'm not going to do that anymore.

 

- Dub "not that I'm still bitter, or anything" Cee

[Toxxic 0]

Actually, Dub-Cee said something different. It wasn't about declining a match against a younger, better writer - it was about being booked as a challenger to a belt that he didn't want. So he believes he can win the match, or at least has a chance to, but doesn't want to.

 

Say there's a guy who hates writing hardcore matches, but it looks like he's being booked to challenge the Hardcore champion. Either he can write the match and potentially win a match he doesn't want to win, because he'll win the belt and then have to defend it in more hardcore matches (which as previously stated he doesn't enjoy), or he can not show/job and lose a match that then counts against him. I mean, win/loss records aren't that important, but I wouldn't want my character to lose a match unnecessarily.

 

Besides, this thread was about ENCOURAGING people to show. WC's point was that he can see a situation where even getting a title match would encourage him NOT to show.

[Smartly Pretty 0]

There is also the bizarre perception that the world title somehow involves more effort.

 

There's certainly more pressure to put on angles, though, no?

 

Yep. That's all I got out of this novel of a thread. One sentence.

[Toxxic 0]

Actually, I've tended to find that it's tricky to build angles around the World Title. Either your challenger just waltzes in with no reason for getting the match (me vs Landon) or is meant to win the contendership match and doesn't (like when Spike lost to Mak so Mak faced me for the World Title - still a good match, and he deserved it, but I was feuding with Spike at the time).

[Angel_Grace_Blue 0]

Actually, Dub-Cee said something different. It wasn't about declining a match against a younger, better writer - it was about being booked as a challenger to a belt that he didn't want. So he believes he can win the match, or at least has a chance to, but doesn't want to.

 

Say there's a guy who hates writing hardcore matches, but it looks like he's being booked to challenge the Hardcore champion. Either he can write the match and potentially win a match he doesn't want to win, because he'll win the belt and then have to defend it in more hardcore matches (which as previously stated he doesn't enjoy), or he can not show/job and lose a match that then counts against him. I mean, win/loss records aren't that important, but I wouldn't want my character to lose a match unnecessarily.

 

Besides, this thread was about ENCOURAGING people to show. WC's point was that he can see a situation where even getting a title match would encourage him NOT to show.

 

Didn't Judge do a no-hardcore stuff hardcore title reign?

 

lolz.?

[HollywoodSpikeJenkins 0]

I still think I'm the greatest.

 

 

 

Or at least better than Sly.

[Sly 0]

Being better than me isn't exactly a lot to brag about.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

Didn't Judge do a no-hardcore stuff hardcore title reign?

He did. And you can more or less say that I did, too: I basically treated the Hardcore title like a Cruiserweight title, since we didn't have one at the time. I used weapons very rarely, and pretty much no blood at all.

[King Cucaracha 0]

One serious idea here, mix up the cards a little more.

 

Maybe it's just me, but it feels like I've wrote more straight singles and straight tag matches in the past year than I have the rest of my time here. And after a while, it just becomes a drag. Infact, it gets a little fucking boring, having to come up with 'psychology busters' every show.

 

I understand we need singles and tags and I'm not saying OMGALLHOUSERULEZALLTEHTIME!, but a little more variety would be nice. Pure Rules, House Rules, 3 ways, 4 ways, 6 ways, 10 ways, whatever. It needn't be gimmick matches galore, but again, variety. Especially when you're throwing guys in the midcard onto shows for the sake of throwing them onto shows. I hate to sound like the grumpy old veteran here, because I'm not, but back in the day it wouldn't be a card full of singles. The lower level guys would have some sort of tag-on to make the matches more interesting, even if they were just multi-man matches. Multi-man matches mean more chance of someone showing too, surely. And personally, I find them more fun to write. Maybe it's just me. But maybe sometimes when CC are filling a card, they should lie back and think 'what would Thoth do?'.

 

And besides that, maybe things would be less predictable. If it's straight singles with Flesher, against 95% of the roster he's going to win as long as he writes. We all know this. Put him in a triple threat, maybe it's harder for him. Different kind of psychology. Toxxic in straight singles might keep the belt all year. Make it a Bullrope Match and he's screwed. It should be a challenge for everyone, not just the lower guys.

 

Just an idea.

[Toxxic 0]

I hate to say it, but he's got a point. However, I do have a small idea of my own on those areas, so we'll see how that works out.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

Maybe it's just me, but it feels like I've wrote more straight singles and straight tag matches in the past year than I have the rest of my time here. And after a while, it just becomes a drag. Infact, it gets a little fucking boring, having to come up with 'psychology busters' every show...

 

... And besides that, maybe things would be less predictable. If it's straight singles with Flesher, against 95% of the roster he's going to win as long as he writes. We all know this. Put him in a triple threat, maybe it's harder for him. Different kind of psychology. Toxxic in straight singles might keep the belt all year. Make it a Bullrope Match and he's screwed. It should be a challenge for everyone, not just the lower guys.

I don't know if it's "just you," but it's definitely not me.

 

I'm fine with your proposal, as long as you're putting the guys in stip matches and House Rules matches that want to be in those matches; I don't want to be stuck writing matches that I can't stand to write just for the sake of not being "boring."

 

It's a little different with titles, I'll grant you: the Champion shouldn't be able to get away with only having to write matches that favor his style but, for non-titleholders in non-title matches, we shouldn't be obligated to write goofball stuff in the name of "mixing it up." I can appreciate that you might be feeling burnt out from writing too many "regular" matches, but one of the main reasons why I've personally stuck around for four years is because of getting to write "regular" matches; I was ready to quit in '04 after it seemed like I was being booked in stip match after stip match, because I can't stand most stip matches. Even now, I think I've turned down three title shots in the last few months because I hate writing multi-mans so much.

 

Then again, nothing that we come up with is likely to make everybody happy, so somebody's probably going to end up feeling like they got screwed either way...

[Guest El XL]

Further, we lack mobility through the food chain. Bruce, who's at the top of the upper-midcarders (and as such is logically enough holding the International Title), got a World Title shot, but against Stephens, it's almost expected that he'll turn in a strong effort but get pointed. That's not a dig on Bruce, or Hawke, or Spike, or Jimmy, and the system assumes that Bruce, Hawke, Spike, and Jimmy will bring out the best in each other and lead to advancement. For whatever reason, that hasn't been happening, really, for anyone. Maybe it's just that your Stephenses are improving at a rate equal to that of the upper midcard, and that at the same time your Jay Hawkes are outpacing your Insane Luchadors.

I'm just the new guy and well I can't say much about motivation and stuff because right now I'm motivated by the fact that this is a new challenge for me so in general I think I do okay with that as my driving force. I've read this and other comments about improving, keeping in mind that I am totally new at this, I have to make one comments about writers improving. My comment is this

 

"Improvement does not happen in a vacuum"

 

In other words no one improves just by being left alone, what would personally help me improve was if I got some sort of feedback from the people in this fed, constructive comments that says a few things like "I liked so and so and so" or "You could improve on / work on this, that and the other" but frankly except from a few comments from Mike (and I thank you) I really have the feeling like I'm just writing by myself, for myself with me as the only audience. The ONLY one here who's given me any sort of helpful input on what to improve has been Bruce. I see shows pass with a "oh thats neat" or "good job" or "Damn it why did I job to the big green guy" and nothing more. If I went by the comments I have been given so for and judge silence as a way of silently saying "nothing to improve there big guy" then I can conclude a few things

 

1) Damn I rock

2) Quit holding me down

3) Mike just give me the strap now cause apparently I am near godlike in my writings

 

So to those complaining that there are no one who looks like they're improving: HELP! Give feedback, make constructive critisism, point out something you think can be improved or help someone get rid of a bad habit with their writing. Reading old matches can only go so far, I don't want to copy what other's have done, I want to take this game, improve my skills and make it my own and reading Luchador Magnifico V J.J. Johnson doesn't really tell me how I, me, Nemesis could improve as a writer and as a character.

 

Now I need 98 cents back on my dollar please.

[Mr. S£im Citrus 0]

Well, I usually try to give feedback in my comments but, due to other commitments, I only tend to comment on around one show a string, so you're not likely to find it all that helpful.

[super_tigris 0]

Nemesis nailed down the cause of my motivation temporarily being strangled. I'm writing for a win in a fed for myself, and I feel like I'm my only audience. That's a big problem, because I didn't become a better writer than I came here as, I actually lost a portion of my ability to write something that felt smart.