Let's talk about Rex, Baby. Let's talk about you and me.

[Ripper 0]

I think it'd be fun to see Parcells roll some heads in Atlanta.

 

 

We know Deangelo Hall is a goner, and I wouldn't get too settled if I were Roddy White. Problem is, all the cancerous parts that he needs to jettison are the team's best players. I have faith that he can put a decent defense together, but it might be tricky to find a permanent fixture at QB and rebuild the offense in a non-Vick way.

 

 

I like how all these guys became Cancerous all of a sudden. DeAngelo hall said earlier this season that he didnt' feel Petrino was doing what was best for the team and it seemed like he didn't care and had quit on the team. A few months later, he quits on the team.

 

DeAngelo was never a issue under Mora, and came into this season saying the right things...then came some conversations with Petrino. Alge Crumpler never complained about anyone...but he did about Petrino. Warrick Dunn never has a bad thing to say...But he did this year. Roddy White still hasn't done anything to anyone but show he was friends with Michael Vick and now people want to get rid of him?

 

Ridiculous.

 

The problem with this team, much like it has been for the past 3 years, is playcalling, using the right personel and stability along the defensive line.

 

And a Middle Linebacker that doesn't make plays, and a Strong Safety that gives up deep plays.

[Guest My Pal, the Tortoise]

Is there anybody in pro sports who jerks teams or people around more than Parcells?

Larry Brown is the king of that, but Parcells is a giant flake too. If I recall, every departure since the Patriots back after '96 has been portrayed as his "retirement."

 

Bill Parcells runs the rap game.

[Guest RyechnaiaSobaka]

Ripper, the thing about Hall is that he got blamed personally for a loss because he "lost his composure" and got penalties, etc. I think it was against Carolina. That's when it started to spin out of control with him.

 

The thing about Petrino was that he apparently was not aware that professional football players are not student-athletes (which is a largely preposterous statement anyway for Division I football) and you can't treat them the same way, telling them (for example) that they can't talk during team dinners and that sort of thing. It rubbed a lot of the players the wrong way, and you know how ego gets with many of these guys. I'm a man, you can't tell me what to do! Nobody can!

 

I would be surprised if the DeAngelo Hall thing will continue. I think they may have made Emmitt Thomas the interim head coach to placate Hall for this season at least. It's not a typical case of a "cancerous" player where he's blowing up at other players and the coaches. Have any of the other players had a problem with Hall? He had a problem with Petrino, and Petrino's gone now. It's not like the Bengals where Chode Johnson and T.J. "Persian for Gay" Houshmandzadeh are screaming at the quarterback and the coach won't do anything about it.

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

I don't exactly have my ear to the ground in all matters Falcons, but the general perception has been that Deangelo Hall wasn't the nicest guy to be around this year, starting with the meltdown earlier this season that directly lead to his team losing a game. Whether or not he's the problem with team's attitude problems (and he may not be), he's perceived to be the problem by the media and fans and any rebuilding effort might have difficulty gaining credibility with the poster child for the disastrous season is retained.

 

Same issue with White and Crumpler. They may not be bad dudes at heart, but they are signifant links to the old Vick squad and prominent members of the embarrassing effort they've put into the 2007 season. It's not like they are so close to competing that they need to hold these talents. I say rip the whole thing down and start over. There's an entire aura of failure and dirtiness clouding that franchise right now. They need a fresh start.

 

But that's for the new man to decide, whoever that may be.

[UZI Suicide 0]

DeAngelo Hall is the first guy that needs to go. He thinks he's Deion Sanders when in reality, he sucks balls. If Atlanta wants to really build a "team" then he's the first guy the new coach/GM needs to send packing.

 

I feel REALLY bad for Atlanta, I mean shit, how much worse can it possibly get? Marty Shottenheimer would be a good hire right now and if they're going to dump Rich McKay, I'd find out who Scott Pioli's assistant or "right hand man" is in New England and offer him a contract. Just get people who know how to win.

[Guest RyechnaiaSobaka]

Rich McKay is a walking disaster.

 

I don't oppose the idea of cutting ties with all the players who have disgraced the team in one way or another. It'd be hard to get decent value for them in trades given that the other teams in the league know you'd like to get rid of those players somehow.

[Guest My Pal, the Tortoise]

Part of me feels terrible for poor Artie Blank, but on the other hand, how much of this situation is his own doing? Yes, they lost their franchise player, their coach left them high and dry, the players are assholes and asshats, and Bill Parcells just backed out of the GM job at the last minute. However, I think we're starting to find out that Blank and others knew much more about Vick than we thought, he hired a notorious careerist from the college ranks, and Parcells has a history of screwing teams over like this. Really, he made his own mess here with a bevy of stupid business moves.

 

I'll never understand the "hands-on owner" thing, especially in football, where your management types are notorious egomaniacs who think they can change the world by drawing arrows and Xs. It's best to delegate any and all football operations to these guys and just sit in your luxury box. I hate commending football coaches for anything, just because I think they're such a rotten lot (but not Ronnie Lott), but they know what they're doing better than ownership does, and should be able to do their jobs without meddling from on high. I will give them that. I get the impression that Arthur Blank wants to be friends with these guys, which I find baffling. They don't want to be his friend. They just want his money. Vick took advantage of Blank the same way the thugs from the ghetto take advantage of athletes. It all trickelates.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

30 people voted for Billick as worst..

 

Theres probably a list a mile long of why he should be fired today, but the fact is he has Steve Biscotti wrapped around his finger and has him believing that its everything else besides him as the reason for the crappy 4-10 season. For starters, although I have no statistical proof, Id wager a fair bet the Ravens are in the top 3 of penalties against this year, and have probably been the last few years. Whether its been dumb offsides penalties that plagued them to death last year killing offensive drives, or this years 15 yard flag tossing variety, it proves that Billick has lost control of his team and can't discipline them, probably because half the team has bigger egos than he does (and his ego is the size of the planet Jupiter).

 

This weekends debacle also shows that his play calling stinks worse than garbage thats been sitting out for 3 weeks. In a game that actually mattered (and maybe in Billick's head, the game vs the Dolphins mattered..) you kick the freaking FG. But in the situation that they were in, where only pride is on the line and a win would give the team some sort of confidence, you go for the TD. Would they have scored the TD? Probably not, and they would have lost the game, but thats what ended up happening anyway and it was much more embarassing to lose on a 60 yard TD pass in OT than on a heroic goal line play with just seconds left.

 

His play calling is also way too inconsistent with the exception of the fact that he's probably the most conservative coach in the NFL (see the FG at the end of the Dolphins game). Back in 2000, conservative play calling on offense could win the game because the Defense wasn't going to give up 24 points a game, they only had to score a few points and they felt like they could win. Now, they have to score points to win, and they actually DO HAVE the offensive weapons available but Billick uses them in the exact opposite situations that he should. 1rst and 10..we've got McGahee..do we run the ball..fuck no..lets try and pass the ball 7 yards! INCOMPLETE! 2nd and 10..do we give McGahee the ball and try and pick up some yardage to make 3rd down more managable..no! Lets try to throw the ball 30 yards! Incomplete! Now its 3rd and 10! We've obviously got to pass the ball 10 yards right? Wrong, screen pass for 7 and its 4th down..aww. Willis McGahee is 4th in the NFL with almost 1200 yards rushing but in this 8 game losing streak he's only had more than 21 rushing attempts times twice (vs NE and vs Miami, both very close games that the Ravens could have won, the other 6 were mostly complete blowouts with the exception of the Cleveland FG debacle).

 

The other big thing is that he is stubborn when it comes to pulling players. I know that a coach can be TOO FAST to pull the trigger to replacing a QB, but with Billick its the exact opposite. McNair was obviously hurt early on in the season, and if he had been pulled for Boller permanently after week 5 instead of allowing him to come back after the bye in week 8, maybe things would have turned out differently..maybe not..but McNair wouldn't be on national TV fumbling the ball every possession vs the Steelers, leaving them at 4-4. Only after McNair was injured so badly that it was obvious to everyone who has 2 eyes and can at least see the color purple did he pull McNair for Boller. Boller isn't the answer..and thats why the decision to go with Boller over Troy Smith pisses me off even more. Billick wants to do everything they can do to win this weekend, which according to him means starting Kyle Boller (who, by the way has the Ravens lead in most passing statistics that I can think of)..Unfortunately, at 4-10 and after just losing to the Dolphins and now on the road vs a Division winning team in Seattle..it would probably be safe to assume theres more of a chance of Jimmy Hoffa's body being found than of a Ravens victory..so why not start Troy Smith? As luck would have it, Boller's "concussion" seems to be pointing towards Smith starting..

 

Some of the blame is on an aging, injury probe defense that is still one of the best against the run but absolutely horrid vs the pass (anytime you lose both your starting former Pro Bowl CBs, that happens, but still..) But the defense has had to carry the Ravens team for the last 9 years under Billick and at some point if Billick refuses to change the offensive strategy to meet the current situation the team is in and personel that he has available, then someone else (and I have NO IDEA WHATSOEVER who Id have on a list of potential replacements) has to be hired to come in and do it. If the SB in 2000 didn't happen then he'd have been gone a couple years ago, but its time

 

 

 

 

oh, and theres no freaking way Johnathan Ogden deserved to go to the Pro Bowl this year, even as a reserve.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest My Pal, the Tortoise]

Because he's the best running back in history.

I heard on Monday night that Adrian Peterson is going to be the best running back in history, which is interesting, because I don't see that designation changing, like, ever.

[snuffbox 0]

Barry Sanders.

[Guest My Pal, the Tortoise]

I was thinking Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Barry Sanders, in that order.

[Ripper 0]

No other coach ever had a problem with Hall at all. Only Petrino.

 

In that carolina game, where his meltdown cost them the game, it was actually two HORRIBLE calls. Horrible to the point the annoucners were bitching about the calls for the next 10 minutes. Of course by the next week they were the sheep that sports casters are and said it was Halls fault, but he got a 15 yarder for jawing with steve smith(in atlantas secondary about 15-20 seconds after the play...in other words, Smith was across the line of scrimmage to get in Halls face, but only Hall was flagged) and another 15 yards for jamming Smith at the line. Thats it.

 

People who say that Hall sucks, they simply don't know anything about football. Its like saying that Terrell Owens is a bad reciever or Brett Farve is a bad QB.

 

Simply put, he is a top 5-8 Corner back in the NFL.

 

I am not sold on just getting rid of the teams top players just because. The defense has played pretty well this year, the offense has looked bad.

 

You don't just throw away players in a situation like this. Even more, you woun't find players happy to come to atlanta. You have more liklihood of getting these players to come back, pumped to prove that they are better than this record.

[Guest RyechnaiaSobaka]

They need a quarterback and to use Jerious Norwood more. That, in my opinion, would go a long way towards fixing their offensive issues. It would also be nice if they had tackles that weren't undrafted free agents or other assorted garbage because their regular guys are on injured reserve.

[UZI Suicide 0]

People who say that Hall sucks, they simply don't know anything about football. Its like saying that Terrell Owens is a bad reciever or Brett Farve is a bad QB.

 

Simply put, he is a top 5-8 Corner back in the NFL.

 

People who compare DeAngelo Hall to two guys that are among the best in NFL history at their respective positions don't know anything about football and, on top of that, are fucking morons.

 

Hall is a terrible player. The sooner they get rid of him, the better.

[UZI Suicide 0]

I take that back, partially. He's not a terrible player. He has some athletic talent. Terribly overrated, I should say. Although it seems like most fans/media have come to the conclusion that he sucks, so I don't even know if he's overrated anymore.

[Ripper 0]

No I compared him to two guys that are top 10 at their position in the game today.

 

I would love for you to try and explain how Hall is a bad CB.

 

People that think he is bad are the same ones that will watch a team play cover 2, and a guy catches a touchdown after running a slant, go and post corner and blame the CB.

 

Same people don't understand where linebackers are supposed to be.

 

But seriously, please explain to me how the guy that is top ten in INT's and Passes defended when he barely gets the ball thrown his way, Pro Bowl player is a bad CB.

 

 

 

 

[Ripper 0]

They need a quarterback and to use Jerious Norwood more. That, in my opinion, would go a long way towards fixing their offensive issues. It would also be nice if they had tackles that weren't undrafted free agents or other assorted garbage because their regular guys are on injured reserve.

 

To be fair, they lost a lineman a week for a while there. A couple of their rookies were looking good then had season ending injuries.

[UZI Suicide 0]

No I compared him to two guys that are top 10 at their position in the game today.

 

I would love for you to try and explain how Hall is a bad CB.

 

People that think he is bad are the same ones that will watch a team play cover 2, and a guy catches a touchdown after running a slant, go and post corner and blame the CB.

 

Same people don't understand where linebackers are supposed to be.

 

But seriously, please explain to me how the guy that is top ten in INT's and Passes defended when he barely gets the ball thrown his way, Pro Bowl player is a bad CB.

 

That's like the argument I hear from fellow Cowboys fans when I try to tell them Roy Williams is terrible.

 

"BUT YOU DON'T KNOW TEH RESPONSIBILITIES!111!!!!"

 

Stats for CB's are relatively useless. He gets INT's and PD's because they throw at him all the fucking time because he sucks. Like I said, he has athletic talent and sometimes he'll make a play that makes you think he's for real, but then he'll get burnt time after time after time after time after time after time and you realize, nope.. you were right the first time, he sucks.

 

Hall is perceived as being good because he's in a city where there is minimal fan interest and knowledge. If you're a flashy guy with a personality, fans will overlook the fact that you suck (see: Vick) while guys who are actually actually great players (like Joe Johnson of the Atlanta Hawks) get no love.

 

I think the defining moment of Hall's career was when he was crowned a "shutdown corner" after "blanketing" Terrell Owens to the tune of like, 120 yards on seven catches or something, on a Monday Night Football game a few years ago.

[Ripper 0]

Except he doesn't get burnt time after time after time after time. To make an argument, you need to have some truth in it.

 

ANd its not an excuse for people that know what the hell they are talking about. The Falcons play ALOT of cover 2. Deep passes that float to the middle of the field are not the cornerbacks responisbility. They are the flats and if someone gets outside of them, stay with him.

 

Because of his speed, Hall will get in the frame when guy gets open down field, so dumbasses who don't have the slightest idea what they are talking about say "SEE..HALL GOT BURNT AGAIN!!!!" when in actuality the safety bit on the play fake and got burnt.

 

And you just confirmed your football knowlege if you are trying to say that Owens had a good game that Monday night They lossened the coverage against him that game to defend the deep ball, thus he had alot of underneath catches and no touchdowns. So he had 112 yards on 7 catches, only 3 catches when he was thrown at 9 times qhwn Hall was in man coverage against him. It was a shutdown.

 

And he shuts down all over the league. You obviously don't watch many falcons games if you think people throw at Hall all the time. over the pass two years, they threw at Jason Webster, Lewis Sanders, and Chris Houston all this time because there is a big play shutdown corner on the other side.

 

 

 

[Guest]

DeAngelo Hall isn't even the best corner from his draft class.

[Guest RyechnaiaSobaka]

Wouldn't you say that the reason why Asomugha got looked over this year for the Pro Bowl is because teams didn't even bother throwing enough to his receiver for him to have gaudy INT and PD stats?

[Guest]

I can't tell whether or not you're being sarcastic. In case you're not...Hall has 20 more tackles than Asomugha. That argument is junk in regards to Hall, he's having to tackle guys because they're catching the ball against him. Plus, I don't even think Hall's good enough to be mentioned in the same sentence as Asomugha.

 

In case you are, Asomugha just didn't make the Pro Bowl because he played on a bad Western team. That's like getting hit with both fists. Plus, he put up gigantic numbers last season and didn't make the team until right before the game. People vote on reputation. I don't think they give a shit about a guy's defensive stats.

[Guest RyechnaiaSobaka]

I can't tell whether or not you're being sarcastic. In case you're not...Hall has 20 more tackles than Asomugha. That argument is junk in regards to Hall, he's having to tackle guys because they're catching the ball against him. Plus, I don't even think Hall's good enough to be mentioned in the same sentence as Asomugha.

 

In case you are, Asomugha just didn't make the Pro Bowl because he played on a bad Western team. That's like getting hit with both fists. Plus, he put up gigantic numbers last season and didn't make the team until right before the game. People vote on reputation. I don't think they give a shit about a guy's defensive stats.

 

No, I was just asking a general question. I'm a big Asomugha fan.

[Guest]

There is no real direct correlation between having a lot of interceptions and being a top corner. They're the most noticed ones, and the ones that grab all the attention, sure. But there's a few who just love to leave receivers open, or jump on the ball too quick and get burned. The latter is the case with DeAngelo Hall. As far as career interceptions go, that's different. Obviously you're a great player if you have the longevity to stick around long enough to get near that list in the first place.

 

I guess that's what I'm trying to say. Some guys try to catch the ball, others don't. Leon Hall tries to catch the ball, and the same goes for Johnathan Joseph. Just look at the pass D, and watch how many tackles they have. Oh, the humanity.

 

Some guys don't even let the ball get put near the intended receiver, like Asomugha. Ty Law's been that way this year, and KC's pass D has been solid. Safety's different. You're getting interceptions there and playing more than 4 seasons, you're doing great things. Cause if you're not reading the play correctly, you'll be out of the league, no matter how many interceptions you grab.

[Guest Tzar Lysergic]

The phrase "defensive" head coach is a fallacy, anyway. Tony Dungy's career was as a D-coordinator, and his franchise is squarely on the shoulders of a Heisman winning first pick overall superstar for ten years coach on the field hall of fame QB and pure offensive talent at every position from Left Guard on up. A head coach's job is to ensure that ALL phases of his team are winning.

 

First pick? Yes

Superstar? Yes

Coach on the field? Yes

Hall of Fame QB? Yes

6'5", Laser arm? Yes

Heisman winner? Charles Woodson.

 

Duh. I knew better than that. Good correction.

[Ripper 0]

I can't tell whether or not you're being sarcastic. In case you're not...Hall has 20 more tackles than Asomugha. That argument is junk in regards to Hall, he's having to tackle guys because they're catching the ball against him. Plus, I don't even think Hall's good enough to be mentioned in the same sentence as Asomugha.

 

In case you are, Asomugha just didn't make the Pro Bowl because he played on a bad Western team. That's like getting hit with both fists. Plus, he put up gigantic numbers last season and didn't make the team until right before the game. People vote on reputation. I don't think they give a shit about a guy's defensive stats.

 

 

I am sorry but that is a total crock of crap. Lets get this straight.

 

Asomugha puts up numbers exactly like Halls last year and its because he is a great corner. Hall puts up the exact same numbers this year and its because people keep catching the ball on him? Get the hell outta here with that.

 

Hall has more tackles because the Falcons don't just lock him on a reciver and let him go man all day. He plays alot of run support in their cover 2schemes and earlier in the year, noone was running up the middle on the falcons because 320 lb trey lewis and one ton Grady Jackson were in their. Teams just used John Abarahams aggressiveness on the pass rush, ran it right at him, which padded the Cornerbacks and outside linebackers tackling stats.

 

But even if you want to throw stats out the window, teams don't throw at Hall the same way they don't throw at Asomugha.

 

I get that people have their favorite teams and all, but seriously, some of you guys are just blatantly making up shit on Hall right now. His reputation for getting "burt" comes from two preseason games. One in his second year when Randy Moss got by him and one last year when Chad Johnson got by him in the preseason.

 

All these years later, the only other time I can remember a reciever leaving him was this year in Tampa when a team FINALLY made him pay with double move(I have been saying it since his second year and noone EVER did it) then Peyton Manning tried it the next week and got intercepted.

 

I just honeslty don't think you guys have watched him play. And then to prove he is a bad corner you are saying that INT's, Passes defended and tackles don't count. So tell me...what counts?

 

[KingPK 0]

Since this thread is focusing on the playoffs and coaches, this video is more than appropriate for the occasion:

 

[KingPK 0]

FAST WILLIE~! broke his leg on the second play from scrimmage.

 

Ruh-roh.

[TheDevilAndGodAreRagingInsideMe 0]

Yet another NFL Network game that I could have watched, but - forgot about; didn't care about; didn't bother.

 

Actually, I don't think that I have watched a single non-Giants game this year so far, outside of bits and peices.

[Kinetic 0]

So who gets Parker's spot in the Pro Bowl: Fred or Sean Taylor?

 

Also: The Steelers are fucked.