Wrestlemania IX

[King Kamala 0]

Highlight of the show for me is Bobby Heenan riding in backwards on a camel. That's very telling if that's the best part of the show.

 

 

[Kinetic 0]

The highlight for me is Giant Gonzales's weird skin-suit thing making its (I believe) one and only WrestleMania appearance.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

It's weird how they brought in Tenryu for several PPV matches, but didn't really make a big deal about him, and didn't explain who he was. I mean, he was one of the biggest stars in Japan at the time, if I'm not mistaken. They didn't really do anything to play him up, other than a quick blurb maybe in the PPV promo reports.

[cabbageboy 0]

I agree. I never, ever got the Yokozuna push. Why on earth was he just brought in, mostly unknown unless you gave a crap about late era AWA (and no one did), and then simply given the Rumble win and world title? Yoko was the sort of challenger who could have been amusing during the Hogan era, but guys like Bret Hart didn't really mesh with him.

 

Macho was about 40 years old then, he wasn't ancient or anything. Vince just buried the guy on commentary and then gets pissed when Savage left? They should have done Macho/Bret at WM IX, with Savage passing the torch. Actually it might have been better for Savage to have just kept the belt until then, with Bret getting his first title in memorable fashion.

 

WM XV is a corny and foolish show, but it's certainly not dull. At the time I thought it was garbage, but having watched it on 24/7 not too long ago I was surprisingly entertained. It's not a GOOD show or anything, but it's silly and fun. Austin/Rock as the main eliminates it from any all time worst discussion.

 

And say what you want about the Ministry angle, but you'd be surprised as to how many people have fond memories of it. It drew insane money at the time, and let's not forget it was the last major angle before the HHH Push of Death that is still ongoing. So it is perhaps remembered more fondly than it deserves.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

What if they simply ran a Jannetty/Michaels IC title match instead? Give Jannetty the big title win, it gives the fans a potential good match and a memorable moment to boot.

[bob_barron 0]

That would work but Jannetty was released at that point because of being a druggie.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

That would work but Jannetty was released at that point because of being a druggie.

How many times has that happened? 1988 due to their partying, 1993, perhaps 2005, has to be another one in there. Jannetty in a couple of years has a shot to be the first wrestler fired by Vince McMahon in four different decades!

[garfieldsnose 0]

When did Vince bury Macho Man on commentary? When Savage left the WWF, Vince was very cordial and thanked him for all the years he had given to the WWF. I fail to see that as a burial.

 

EDIT: Re-reading your post, I think you meant the act of putting Savage on commentary was a burial. My mistake.

[DrVenkman PhD 0]

I seem to recall reading old Usenet posts that said Savage was on commentary by choice due to nagging injuries.

[cabbageboy 0]

Still, once Savage was healthy again why not put him vs. Bret on PPV? Were they allergic to drawing money in 1993-94? That would have been an excellent match, maybe have Macho put Bret over and then go to WCW.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

I agree. I never, ever got the Yokozuna push. Why on earth was he just brought in, mostly unknown unless you gave a crap about late era AWA (and no one did), and then simply given the Rumble win and world title? Yoko was the sort of challenger who could have been amusing during the Hogan era, but guys like Bret Hart didn't really mesh with him.

 

In retrospect, Yoko really did do a great job in that role. He became a credible heel and performed good matches for a man his size.

[King Kamala 0]

I maintain that Yokozuna is one of the most underrated big men of all time. I'm talking about '93/'94 Yokozuna not 700 pound Yokozuna from Heroes of Wrestling and his last year or so in the WWF. I don't think his feuds were booked all that well outside of the one with Jim Duggan. Like I've said before, does anybody remember any noticable events from his feud with Bret Hart? And that main evented two WrestleManias!

[Diamonddust 0]

Still, once Savage was healthy again why not put him vs. Bret on PPV? Were they allergic to drawing money in 1993-94? That would have been an excellent match, maybe have Macho put Bret over and then go to WCW.

 

It was counter-productive to the line of thinking that typically drew them money:

 

Super-hero baby face vs. the big, giant monster.

 

 

[cabbageboy 0]

Hogan vs. Warrior....face vs. face, drew almost 70,000 people for WM 6. Bret vs. Bulldog, face vs. face...drew 80,000 to Wembley in England. I don't know if Savage was fresh enough in the WWF to draw anything on that level, but it could have worked well.

[Black Lushus 0]

Hogan/Warrior had to happen, Savage/Hart didn't.

[Guest]

There is absolutely no evidence that supports the idea that Savage could draw a crowd of that size on his own. And we already know that Bret couldn't, especially at that point in his career.

 

Not even if they had done it in Canada.

[King Kamala 0]

Let's face facts, folks- as great of a match as it would have been- Bret Hart Vs Randy Savage circa '93 probably wouldn't have drawn much better (if at all) than Yokozuna/Bret.

 

And this thread is further proof to my theory that bad WrestleManias are way more interesting to talk about than good ones. This thread may be on its way to four pages and I'm not sure if the thread we had a while back about X-7 even got to two.

 

 

[DrVenkman PhD 0]

It's also worth noting (and I did elsewhere, actually) that had we still been using the monthly discussion thread for 24/7, Mania IX discussion would have petered out around 15 comments, and that's being generous.

 

Like you said, while you certainly can generate discussion based on everyone saying "I agree that Mania X7 is great", where's the conflict? Where's the diverse opinions? Where are the apologists defending the show? Where are the haters putting it down? And so on...

[MillenniumMan831 0]

Watching it on ppv, I HATED the opening ceremonies! I was dyin for the matches to get going and instead I had to sit through elephants, donkeys, and whatever the hell else ate up seemingly (at the time) a half hour.

 

Of course now I've mellowed out to it.

[Darth Pipes 0]

I just think all of the labels are stupid.

 

Another Wrestlemania IX question: Why didn't they have Jerry Lawler wrestling on the show? That's another name that was left off that could've done something, and the poor guy still hasn't wrestled at Mania

 

Would you believe one of the Apter Magazines (I believe it was Inside Wrestling) had an article on this very subject at the time. Apparently, Lawler was wrestling with Jeff Jarrett in the main event of his USWA promotion at the very same time WM9 was going down.

[Darth Pipes 0]

I've heard that Savage's year as champ in 1988 was just as good, if not better, than 1987 when Hogan was champ. Savage was ten times more active on the house show circuit than Hogan ever was as champ.

 

Last year wwe.com made an absolutely idiotic comment about Savage and Lex Luger. They talked about Kurt Angle leaving (as part of a bigger article) and they snidly said it did "wonders" for Randy Savage and Lex Luger. Uh guys...it DID do wonders for both of them. While Luger's life in a wreck and Savage is a mental midget, going to WCW was the best move either of them could ever make. Savage went from being a broadcaster back to being a main event star. He won the WCW title four times. Luger went from being a WWF mid-carder to once again wrestling in main events. He was given the WCW title for a brief time and both him and Savage were major stars in WCW's rise. To make a comment like that was inexcuseable stupidity and blatant ignorance by the WWE.

 

Yoko did come out of nowhere. He became the first long-reigning heel champion since Superstar Graham 15 years earlier.

[StrapFinlay 0]

Hogan vs. Warrior....face vs. face, drew almost 70,000 people for WM 6. Bret vs. Bulldog, face vs. face...drew 80,000 to Wembley in England. I don't know if Savage was fresh enough in the WWF to draw anything on that level, but it could have worked well.

 

Slightly off-topic, but I would suggest Wembley would have been full no matter who was headlining SummerSlam '92.

 

 

[Lil' Bitch 0]

WM 9 would've been so much better had Hart retained instead.

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

WM 9 would've been so much better had Hart retained instead.

 

I disagree. The only thing even halfway memorable from that entire show is the Hart-Yoko-Hogan title debacle. I don't think it was good for the belt or the company, but from a historical point of view it is something unique.

 

Had Hart retained it would have been a Mania filled with bad matches, a heatless main event and no memorable moments. I'll take screwed up over boring every day of the week.

[Lil' Bitch 0]

I disagree. The only thing even halfway memorable from that entire show is the Hart-Yoko-Hogan title debacle. I don't think it was good for the belt or the company, but from a historical point of view it is something unique.

 

That may be so, but the story was could Bret Hart, the fighting champion, defeat the unstoppable Yokozuna? It was the 90s version of Hogan Vs. Andre. It was what the fans wanted to see and it would've done a big wonder for Bret's career had he been able to defeat Yokozuna. I remember being there live and marking out big time when Hart slapped on the Sharpshooter. Then of course, Hogan had to come in and steal the show and add nothing afterwards with a pointless title run.

[Black Lushus 0]

well of course you marked out, you were a 10 year old kid then.

 

And where do you get this 90s version of Andre/Hogan thing? On what planet is that the case?

 

What wonders would it have done for Bret's career? I would say Bret had a pretty wonderful WWF career regardless, Montreal aside.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Seriously. It wasn't as if he just faded away after that. He won the King of the Ring, was part of two fantastic feuds, and won the WWF Title within a year of losing to Yokozuna.

[King Kamala 0]

If anything, I think Hart came out better after the whole situation than Hogan did. Hart was thisclose to defeating Yokozuna and only lost due to getting salt thrown in his eyes. Hogan won but only cause he caught Yokozuna off guard after Yoko had just wrestled. Then Hogan proceeded to not defend the title for three months or even wrestle outside of an occassional tag match with Brutus against Money Inc.

[DrVenkman PhD 0]

I remember even as a kid (who marked for Hogan winning the title), I became really annoyed when Gene Okerlund would point out in KOTR Update segments that Hogan had been sitting on his ass with the title and Yokozuna would be his first defense. I think by the time he lost at KOTR I was surprised and thought it was odd he didn't slam Yokozuna, but I don't think I actually cared much about it - I had moved on to wanting to see Crush bodyslam Yoko.

[Darth Pipes 0]

I think that was one thing Vince wouldn't tolerate. Hogan got away with rarely defending the belt in WCW and rendered that title meaningless. But Vince wasn't going to let him sit on the WWF Championship for very long.